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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dinah on March 11, 2003, at 7:57:37
I have followed the Levitical dietary restrictions for some time now, but have sadly lapsed in the last few months. I like the idea of remembering my love and connection with God each time I eat or choose to eat. I love the idea of making each meal a holy experience. And it's something that I do just for the love of God, since unlike most of God's laws there are no ethical reasons (that I can see anyway) for them. God just said it was displeasing to him, so I chose not to do it.
And I can't help wondering what it means that I'm eating these foods again. True, they taste good, but I don't really enjoy them because I'm constantly aware of what I'm doing.
This doesn't make sense to most fellow Christians, but it is important to me. And I just can't figure out why I'm choosing momentary sensory pleasure (which isn't even all that pleasurable) over my free commitment to God.
Posted by Dena on March 12, 2003, at 10:11:26
In reply to I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too., posted by Dinah on March 11, 2003, at 7:57:37
Hi Dinah -
I admire your desire to please God in how you eat. It's my desire too, but I've been led to do things a bit differently. I'll share mine, but I urge you to follow your own conscience in obeying Him as He's led you.
In the book of Acts, Chapter 10, verses 9 - 16, it reads: "The next day, as they went on their journey and drew near the city, Peter went up on the housetop to pray, about the sixth hour. 10Then he became very hungry and wanted to eat; but while they made ready, he fell into a trance 11and saw heaven opened and an object like a great sheet bound at the four corners, descending to him and let down to the earth. 12In it were all kinds of four-footed animals of the earth, wild beasts, creeping things, and birds of the air. 13And a voice came to him, "Rise, Peter; kill and eat."
14But Peter said, "Not so, Lord! For I have never eaten anything common or unclean."
15And a voice spoke to him again the second time, "What God has cleansed you must not call common." 16This was done three times. And the object was taken up into heaven again. "The Church has traditionally understood two meanings here. The literal interpretation is that God has done a new thing through Jesus Christ. He has fulfilled the Levitical law by cleansing us internally, by the Spirit, so that we no longer have to maintain our own cleanliness through outward means (i.e., dietary restrictions). Through Jesus & the New Covenant, all food has been cleansed & is permitted for use by Christians.
The symbolic interpretation is that the Gentiles (who were converting to Christianity during this time) were no longer to be considered "unclean", or outside of God's favor; they were to be included into the Body of Christ - the Church, along with the Jews who had accepted Jesus as the Messiah. In other words, the gospel was not intended for the Jews only, but for the whole world.
But as I said, if you feel convicted to adhere to the Levitical dietary restrictions, then you should listen to your conscience, unless God leads you otherwise.
Shalom, Dena
Posted by Dinah on March 12, 2003, at 19:39:26
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » Dinah, posted by Dena on March 12, 2003, at 10:11:26
Well, I'm more of a Jamesian Christian than a Pauline one, and I have a great respect for The Law. But I'm upset that I have lapsed so lately. And not just in that. I'm not keeping the Sabbath holy. I'm not being overly respectful towards my parents. I am not bringing the Holy and Sacred to my life right now. I am not bringing God into my world. And while I feel guilty, I obviously don't feel guilty enough to mend my ways. And I'm wondering what's changed to make that so.
Posted by Dena on March 13, 2003, at 13:35:28
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » Dena, posted by Dinah on March 12, 2003, at 19:39:26
I understand that "middle ground" of being upset with ourselves for lapsing, but not quite convicted enough to repent & do something about it. I've been there. A lot.
What's helped me lately is to pray for conviction. I ask God to show me my sins. I've also prayed for Godly sorrow for my sins. Like faith, I think conviction is a gift.
I've been focusing on the "Jesus Prayer" lately, as part of Lent.
It goes, "Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner." The historic Church recommended that it be repeated 25, 50, 100, or 150 times at once, while meditating on our need for a savior.
It seems to be softening me.
I'll pray that the Lord draws you near to Him.
Shalom, Dena
Posted by WorryGirl on March 18, 2003, at 19:19:41
In reply to I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too., posted by Dinah on March 11, 2003, at 7:57:37
Hi Dinah,
I hope you don't mind me asking but what are your religious beliefs? I was raised SDA (if you're not familiar with it, they are similar to Baptists, but go to church on the Sabbath, Saturday; also sort of similar to Messianic Judaism).
My parents still practice and go to church weekly. It's a good religion but I often felt that I didn't measure up for one reason or another. My mother has very high standards and expected nothing less than perfection. The sad part is she doesn't realize she's that way. I love her very much but our relationship is sometimes strained.
I fell off the SDA wagon some time ago and wouldn't mind getting back into the swing of things. I just feel that I've messed up my life so much.
Thanks,
Worry
Posted by Dinah on March 23, 2003, at 8:43:21
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » Dinah, posted by WorryGirl on March 18, 2003, at 19:19:41
Hi Worrygirl,
Sorry not to answer. I haven't visited this board for a while. My actual denomination is a mainstream Protestant one, I was raised in two non-Protestant churches.
It was in reading the bible and various and sundry books on church history during my search for "the" truth, although I ended up finding only "my" truth, that I read Leviticus and the books written by Jewish scholars on the "why" of dietary restrictions. I was impressed by the idea of bringing holiness to our everyday activities, including eating, and decided to do the same as an expression of my love of God.
I consider my own personal faith to be Jamesian rather than Pauline Christianity because I try always to keep in mind the Jewish roots of Christianity, and I try to evaluate church doctrine that arose after the death of Jesus and after Paul brought the religion to the Hellenic community in light of what the historical Jesus said and would, as a Jew, have probably meant by what he said.
I don't in any way believe I have a lock on the right path to God, and this is just what works for me.
If you feel that spirituality would enrich your life (as it usually enriches mine) I think it would be great to do as you suggested. It has been my experience that even churches that demand a lot from their congregants also leave a lot of room for human frailty. Perfection is usually not required. :) I'm impressed that you can separate the pain caused by your mom's perfectionism from your church and from God.
The good news is that I haven't eaten pig lately. Or shrimp. I've again started asking for my meals to be prepared without them. But darn, bacon and ham are so hard to live without! Sorry. My human frailty is showing. And today I work on keeping the Sabbath holy.
Posted by WorryGirl on March 27, 2003, at 13:00:42
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » WorryGirl, posted by Dinah on March 23, 2003, at 8:43:21
> It was in reading the bible and various and sundry books on church history during my search for "the" truth, although I ended up finding only "my" truth, that I read Leviticus and the books written by Jewish scholars on the "why" of dietary restrictions. I was impressed by the idea of bringing holiness to our everyday activities, including eating, and decided to do the same as an expression of my love of God.
> The good news is that I haven't eaten pig lately. Or shrimp. I've again started asking for my meals to be prepared without them. But darn, bacon and ham are so hard to live without! Sorry. My human frailty is showing. And today I work on keeping the Sabbath holy.
Dinah, I commend your decision to practice the dietary laws in the Old Testament. I choose to think that God didn't give the children of Israel those laws merely to show them who's boss. He knew that those foods were unhealthy for various reasons and knew they needed to stay strong. I was raised not eating pork and shrimp, but these days I occasionally indulge in shrimp and snow crab, those scavengers of the sea, so I understand how hard it is to refrain from eating them. Keeping the Sabbath holy is important to me, too, but it can be hard with so many secular activities readily available, and sometimes so much more appealing when I'm vulnerable. Why does it sometimes seem so hard to devote a few hours each week to God (at least for me)?> I consider my own personal faith to be Jamesian rather than Pauline Christianity because I try always to keep in mind the Jewish roots of Christianity, and I try to evaluate church doctrine that arose after the death of Jesus and after Paul brought the religion to the Hellenic community in light of what the historical Jesus said and would, as a Jew, have probably meant by what he said.
>
In light of your faith, have you ever gone to a Messianic Jewish temple? There seem to be some similarities. If so, I'd love to hear your views on it.>I don't in any way believe I have a lock on the right path to God, and this is just what works for me.
>Ditto, although I am still searching for what works for me.
> If you feel that spirituality would enrich your life (as it usually enriches mine) I think it would be great to do as you suggested. It has been my experience that even churches that demand a lot from their congregants also leave a lot of room for human frailty. Perfection is usually not required. :) I'm impressed that you can separate the pain caused by your mom's perfectionism from your church and from God.
>
I like the way you worded that. The only reason I'm able to separate the perfectionist issues is because I love my mother so much and know in my heart that she means well; she apparently doesn't know any other way. I didn't always feel this way. There was a time when I was a bit resentful and felt more like my siblings, one of who is quite bitter against the church and "the establishment" in general. The other is currently drowning her sorrows in drugs and alcohol, but deep down is crying for fulfillment. As for the church itself, yes, there are some self-righteous, but those are in every church. If anyone finds the "perfect" church I'd like to hear about it, because it would seem that the people would have to be perfect to be members, too (lol).Thanks so much for sharing your faith
Posted by Dinah on March 27, 2003, at 17:53:59
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » Dinah, posted by WorryGirl on March 27, 2003, at 13:00:42
My husband converted to the Protestant denomination I now belong to and I think this is as far as he is willing to go. This church tolerates (although certainly doesn't agree with) my unorthodox views. And we are able to attend services as a family. A Rabbi once told me that peace in the family matters more than what building you go to to worship God. And so I will probably remain in this denomination as long as they'll take me. :)
Posted by bobby on March 28, 2003, at 9:46:46
In reply to I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too., posted by Dinah on March 11, 2003, at 7:57:37
This post has really interested me to the point interupting the dialogue. I live in the deep south(u.s.a.) and our diets (or at least my diet) do not come close to the Kosher or biblical(old testament) diet. I am a slim person with a high metabolism--so I guess you could say that I'm built like a shrimp and eat like a pig. I typically eat pork(bar-b-qued ribs,Bacon,ect..) on a weekly basis and every night I end the day with a large bowl of haagen-das vanilla ice cream with chocolate milk poured on top. I love Shrimp and crab legs. However, On my last Dr. visit, my cholesterol was 316!! He wants to put me on medication but i was wondering if a biblical would have that much of an influence as far as cholesterol. Any suggestions?
Bobby
Posted by Dinah on March 28, 2003, at 11:14:27
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » Dinah, posted by bobby on March 28, 2003, at 9:46:46
I'm not sure, Bobby. Pork probably has some, but the ice cream sounds like a likely culprit as well.
I knew a man whose Mom cooked great fried chicken, and so did his wife. It was just about all he would eat. Said he'd rather die than give it up. Then he got his cholesterol figures. Now he only can have it once a month. I have so much respect for him for changing something that probably meant a lot more than just food to him. But I don't think I could do it.
What changes to your died did your doctor recommend. (You might also want to post on Social or the meds board. Beardy has a new diet that she's pretty happy with.)
Posted by Bobby on March 29, 2003, at 10:23:08
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » bobby, posted by Dinah on March 28, 2003, at 11:14:27
Hi Dinah, I can always count on you to reply to a post and I truly appreciate that..I really do! I must admit that after I posted, I had a craving for pork and ice cream---And gave in. Poor me! Thanks, Bobby
Posted by noa on April 10, 2003, at 19:23:44
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » Dinah, posted by Bobby on March 29, 2003, at 10:23:08
As someone raised on Kosher food only, I don't think keeping to the dietary laws necessarily means one's diet is healthy.
There might have been health benefits, especially given the conditions of the time that those laws were given, but probably the best way to deal with cholesterol would be through dietary advice from your doctor and the American Heart Association.
Also, if you are trying to make permanent change, then trying to radically alter your diet would be very difficult. Introduce smaller changes one at a time, I think.
Posted by noa on April 10, 2003, at 19:25:40
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » WorryGirl, posted by Dinah on March 23, 2003, at 8:43:21
I think it is easier to keep the Sabbath holy when you have others to do that with. It is, afterall a social/family oriented institution, the Sabbath.
Posted by Jonathan on April 12, 2003, at 18:25:52
In reply to Re: I've been eating pig lately. And shrimp too. » WorryGirl, posted by Dinah on March 23, 2003, at 8:43:21
"Leviticus as Literature" by Mary Douglas.
Posted by Dena on April 13, 2003, at 10:32:49
In reply to Interesting book, posted by Jonathan on April 12, 2003, at 18:25:52
Hi Jonathan! This does look like an interesting book. Have you read it?
How have you & "She Who Must Be Obeyed" been during this Lenten season? I've remembered the two of you in my prayers lately. Not sure why, I just felt prompted to pray for you & your family. So I did. Everything ok w/ you & yours?
It's been an interesting Lent for me. I was led to ask the Lord to free me from my need for control. I was warned that this would be a painful journey. I can attest to that! Seeking control runs so very deep in me... So far, I've been experiencing one situation after another in which I'm forced to face that I have no control over them. In every situation, I've had the choice to resist or to surrender. I have to confess that I've discovered I'm still quite spiritually immature; I seem to need to rant & rave a bit before surrendering. I wish I could more easily grasp that everything which comes my way is by the hand of God. His sovereignty is something I grasp with my intellect, but I seem to be in the infancy of accepting it in the mind of my heart. I'm so grateful for His mercy & His patience with me!
God bless you, Jonathan, & write back when you can.
Shalom, Dena
Posted by Dinah on April 17, 2003, at 11:23:46
In reply to Interesting book, posted by Jonathan on April 12, 2003, at 18:25:52
I'm always interested in books that place biblical teachings in context, and I have a great fondness for Leviticus.
This is the end of the thread.
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