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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by kiddo on May 22, 2002, at 13:15:58
I know we decided on June 8 as the 'official' start date, but since we seem to have a discussion already started, how about doing a couple of threads for it now?
We could do the first one for discussion while we're reading, and the second for those that have finished so the ending or whatever isn't given away.
Any thoughts?
Kiddo
Posted by Ritch on May 22, 2002, at 15:05:54
In reply to Owen Meany Discussion, posted by kiddo on May 22, 2002, at 13:15:58
> I know we decided on June 8 as the 'official' start date, but since we seem to have a discussion already started, how about doing a couple of threads for it now?
>
> We could do the first one for discussion while we're reading, and the second for those that have finished so the ending or whatever isn't given away.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
>
> KiddoYeah, sounds cool to me. I am ready to pick back up on it after reading "The Foul Ball" and "The Armadillo". I don't know if anybody made this connection, but, what do you think about the concept of a crucifix as a physical, emotional, and a theatrical "prop"? I know it sounds a little silly and yes, there are some double meanings there... I just picked up on that when Needham brings in the armadillo and mentions it as a prop. Also, the armadillo is stuffed, and then later it loses its legs, eyes, etc., until only the shell is left. Kinda of like Christianity has lost all of its "flesh" and is a shell of what it once was.??
Mitch
Posted by susan C on May 22, 2002, at 17:47:04
In reply to Re: Owen Meany Discussion, posted by Ritch on May 22, 2002, at 15:05:54
Hi,
Hey Rich, do you see how appropriate the comments you made above were about the book? I had finished it then, and thought your summary was so clear. And now, your connection to the cross. You are really good. I hadn't seen that. I am not a symbol reader in books. Things are pretty literal for me. For me, the best part, or one of the best parts of the whole book, was the VW on the stage scene, with the Dean careening down the steps, oh my oh my. That will stick with me for a long time.Mouse holding on to her hat.
Posted by Ritch on May 22, 2002, at 21:23:33
In reply to Re: Owen Meany Discussion-finished book, posted by susan C on May 22, 2002, at 17:47:04
> Hi,
> Hey Rich, do you see how appropriate the comments you made above were about the book? I had finished it then, and thought your summary was so clear. And now, your connection to the cross. You are really good. I hadn't seen that. I am not a symbol reader in books. Things are pretty literal for me. For me, the best part, or one of the best parts of the whole book, was the VW on the stage scene, with the Dean careening down the steps, oh my oh my. That will stick with me for a long time.
>
> Mouse holding on to her hat.
Hi Susan,Don't tell me too much about how this thing goes :)! I read to the part where it shifts gears to 1987 and starts talking about all of this political stuff and it dissapointed me, because I really enjoyed all of the roughhousing with the cousins (so I stopped there). I am sure it will straighten out and get good and smooth again. I will pick up on it tomorrow (after I trim my hedges). Oh, I am a symbol freak, unfortunately it often gets in the way of the details of the story (history, names, dialogue, etc.). I just got back from Oklahoma and I saw five dead armadillo road-kill carcasses in this one stretch of highway. They were all on the south-side, so they all must have been migrating north. Phil's vision of the big northward armadillo migration might be quite accurate.
Mitch
Posted by NikkiT2 on May 23, 2002, at 15:57:45
In reply to Re: Owen Meany Discussion-finished book » susan C, posted by Ritch on May 22, 2002, at 21:23:33
hi,
the book switches back and forth between then and 1987.. The '87 parts never last too long - you;ll be back to family life before you know it!!
nikki
Posted by Ritch on May 23, 2002, at 21:39:03
In reply to Re: Owen Meany Discussion-finished book » Ritch, posted by NikkiT2 on May 23, 2002, at 15:57:45
> hi,
>
> the book switches back and forth between then and 1987.. The '87 parts never last too long - you;ll be back to family life before you know it!!
>
> nikki
Hi Nikki,I am off work this week and finally sat down for a marathon read of about six hours today and almost finished up through
"The Ghost of the Future". So I am nearly half finished. Yes, I noticed the brevity of the time-flipping. I was concerned about that. I also noticed he is flipping without putting stuff like this :::: in there to give you warning. So, the *seams* are starting to get a little tougher to distinguish. I don't know where that is going to lead :-) I couldn't read more than a few paragraphs at a time (generally) without having to scribble a note. There is one thing for sure the publisher (and Irving) could do that would really make this a total scream (if it isn't already) would be to MAKE ALL OF OWEN MEANY'S QUOTES IN RED LETTERS. Just like a Bible with Christ's sayings in red. I was fixing to ask a question (to grammar freaks) about Owen's sentence structure. It seems unique and peculiar, but I can't put my finger on it! Well, the author finally gives some answer when he says (through John the character), "Owen meant everything literally". Very matter-of-fact. Also, at the end of the first chapter "The Foul Ball", Owen is going up the hill on his bicycle and his baseball uniform's number is #3, but it almost looked like a number#2. The Holy Trinity? Is Owen like Christ, but really is the Holy Ghost? WEIRD. Another thing about the baseball game.. He hits a foul ball at the end of the game that stops the GAME (with a death). You could stand there and hit foul ball after foul ball after foul ball and the game would still play and play and play (into infinity). Someone is going to either have to die or *lie* to make it stop. Also foul balls often are the result of great *power*, but you can't predict the *direction* they will take. Also, later on Owen mentions something about the reaction the audience will have to the nativity play:...."LAUGH I'M OUT. SCARED I'M IN. What has more power? The ability to cause others to laugh, or the abilty to frighen? Also, Owen mentions that Christ wasn't SAVED, he was USED. Too much to digest!Mitch
Posted by mair on May 24, 2002, at 7:37:25
In reply to Re: Owen Meany Discussion-finished book » NikkiT2, posted by Ritch on May 23, 2002, at 21:39:03
Mitch
I tried to post a message last night but it disappeared into cyber-space. I think the idea of the red-lettering in REALLY clever. Actually I also think Irving's use of all caps is also very clever - how else could we be as cognizant of Owen's unique voice, although I still have trouble imagining what he might have sounded like.
What do you think the deal is with his parents?
Mair
Posted by susan C on May 24, 2002, at 10:51:14
In reply to Re: Owen Meany Discussion-finished book » NikkiT2, posted by Ritch on May 23, 2002, at 21:39:03
I think this is why i count it on one of the books I have re read. There are so many perspectives and considerations and things to contemplate.
thanks for putting these things all in one place R
Posted by Ritch on May 24, 2002, at 15:40:22
In reply to Great Idea! » Ritch, posted by mair on May 24, 2002, at 7:37:25
> Mitch
>
> I tried to post a message last night but it disappeared into cyber-space. I think the idea of the red-lettering in REALLY clever. Actually I also think Irving's use of all caps is also very clever - how else could we be as cognizant of Owen's unique voice, although I still have trouble imagining what he might have sounded like.
>
> What do you think the deal is with his parents?
>
> Mair
Hi Mair,As far as his voice goes, I was starting to hear (while I was reading) that kid's voice (in my head) from "The Shining" talking: "REDRUM"! But, his voice is supposed to be thin and high from what I remember. What *is* weird about the voice (that stuck in my head) was how his grandmother (after being quite senile), instantly recognized it.
The parents? It sounds like a Jenny Fields type of thing like he did in Garp. Perhaps the *secret* of his father is revealed later? That will be interesting.
Mitch
Posted by Ritch on May 24, 2002, at 15:48:44
In reply to Re: Owen Meany Discussion-finished book, posted by susan C on May 24, 2002, at 10:51:14
> I think this is why i count it on one of the books I have re read. There are so many perspectives and considerations and things to contemplate.
> thanks for putting these things all in one place R
Susan,I just looked at some more notes. I noticed he talked about the kid that walked before Owen was up to bat as a "walker". Later on, he talks about the new maid Germaine as a "stumbler"! ??
Also, he mentioned something about the Christ child as being "kidnapped". During the pageant rehearsals you see all of the different interpretations of how it should all *play* out. Also, the author talks about how the Congregationalists were less "miracle-oriented" than the Episcopalians. It starts to look like the author views denominational differences in Christianity as well-meaning folks with major copyright violations! :0
Mitch
Posted by mair on May 24, 2002, at 15:59:01
In reply to Re: Great Idea! » mair, posted by Ritch on May 24, 2002, at 15:40:22
Posted by Ritch on May 24, 2002, at 23:52:42
In reply to No Mitch, I meant Owen's parents (nm) » Ritch, posted by mair on May 24, 2002, at 15:59:01
Hi Mair,
I realized this after I resumed reading (after about an hour or so) late this afternoon! DUH.
I dunno. His Dad is always ready to get to movin' with the granite truck. His Mom is a mystery except for what the author mentions about her always being "in profile" to the outside world. She never speaks, except *once* to John (that I have read thus far). IF you accept Owen Meaney as a Christ character then obviously his mother would be Mary. I haven't read enough to describe (or figure out) THE UNSPEAKABLE OUTRAGE that happened to his parents. OH, yeah, the Christmas scene at the Meaney's *lacked* a baby Jesus in the manger. That is important, somehow. Owen does the gravestone thing (a "vision"). I remember at the beginning of the book how the author describes Owen as an "embryonic fox". Eeek-that sticks in my mind-like some sort of biological consteallation in the sky or something.
Mitch
Posted by NikkiT2 on May 25, 2002, at 7:06:09
In reply to Great Idea! » Ritch, posted by mair on May 24, 2002, at 7:37:25
It wazs described in the book as a "permanent scream"... I think it was quite a good way to describe it as thats how I "hear" it when reading those capitals...
Really not enjoying the way it jumps around though... Though it has now explained more as to where his parents are coming from.. sort of anyway!!
nikki
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