![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 544 to 568 of 795. Go back in thread:
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 14, 2014, at 7:41:57
In reply to Lou's response to 10derheart-deluz, posted by Lou Pilder on June 13, 2014, at 13:58:59
> > > > > ...that you sure are amazingly consistent, Lou Pilder. You never waver from your habit of periodically posting vile things about Dr. Bob and me and other former deputies revolving around imagined anti-Semitism.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks for being so reliable in never stopping your thinly veiled, outrageous accusations...which really aren't veiled at all, come to think of it. It just makes me feel so comfy, warm and at home here. So very supported and respected, too.
> > > > >
> > > > > Do you think prefacing your unfounded, evil, nastiness with some sort of disclaimers like, "A subset of readers could see..." or "...can give readers the idea..." fools anyone? please.
> > > > >
> > > > > It's sad that Dr. Bob allows this. Really disappointing to the nth degree.
> > > > >
> > > > > The only difference between the two statements:
> > > > >
> > > > > "I feel Dr. Bob has gone too far" (standard example of a non-I-statement) in the FAQ
> > > > >
> > > > > and
> > > > >
> > > > > "a subset of readers could see that the allowing of statements that could induce hatred toward the Jews and others is a calculated plan with you and your deputies of record acting in concert"
> > > > >
> > > > > is that the former is a mild, mild, statement - technically uncivil under the "old" rules but hardly very offensive to Dr. Bob - and the latter is a false, libelous allegation of the worst kind. Your allegations of this type make you the poster man for incivility.
> > > > >
> > > > > And **you** worry about being defamed or scapegoated here? That's damn funny.
> > > > >
> > > > > Have you submitted your "evidence" of our dangerous conspiracies against Jewish people on PB to the ADL yet? Why haven't they gone to the media about these horrible things "Dr. Bob and his deputies" did here? When will you get them to expose our awful crimes?
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, I could go on and on, but I'd better get back to my nefarious doings before some Jewish posters on Babble feel that one day has gone by without Dr. Bob and me/us fomenting racial hatred against them...
> > > > >
> > > > > ...oh, wait...ALL the days, EVERY SINGLE DAY BABBLE HAS EVER EXISTED has already gone by without Dr. Bob, me, or any other former or current deputies doing that.
> > > > >
> > > > > Did you know it begins to hurt the muscles in the back of the eyeballs when one has to roll their eyes so often?
> > > > >
> > > > > Lou = A. Piece. Of. Work.
> > > > >
> > > > > Friends,
> > > > It is written here,[...You never waiver..posting..revolving around imagined anti-Semitism...].
> > > > A subset of readers could see what is plainly visible here. This is because the rule here is not until one sees it can they know it.
> > > > Lou
> > > > .
> > > > Friends,
> > > It is written here by the former deputy, [...*imagined* anti-Semitism...] (stars mine)
> > > Let there be no misunderstanding here. I would like for readers to bring up this post that I will use in my response to the former deputy here. To see this post,
> > > A. Go to the search box at the bottom of this page and type in:
> > > [ admin, 678224 ]
> > > Look for the 678224 in the colored strip URL, not in the subject line.
> > > Lou
> > >
> > > Friends,
> > Let there be no misunderstanding here. The former deputy writes here, [...fomenting racial hatred..every single day that babble has existed has already gone by without (Mr. Hsiung), me or any other former deputies doing that...].
> > But how is racial hatred fomented? One way is for the deputies here and/or Mr. Hsiung to incite or direct hatred toward the Jews. They could do this by being deliberately indifferent to my pleas to sanction statements that are antisemitc, or they could encourage others to post anti-Semitism by showing that they validate or ratify anti-Semitic statements, or they could leave anti-Semitic statements unsanctioned which conveys to readers that those statements are not against Mr. Hsiung's rules. And even worse, Mr. Hsiung says that he will give himself the option of not responding to my requests so that others may not respond to me.
> > Here is Mr. Hsiung's encouragement to post what puts down Jews in relation to what is known as {replacement theology} that can stoke the furnace of hatred toward the Jews by saying what a subset of readers could think that he thinks that it is good for the member to post such.
> > Lou
> > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faith/20060614/msgs/735373.html
> >
> > Friends and 10derheart,
> The aspect of the allowing posts with statements that could arouse anti-Semitic feelings or put down Jews is what I am invited by Mr. Hsiung to submit to him here. I am responding to his invitation to submit individual posts for his review in which I am asking for him to purge the statements submitted to him by me by posting to the post that has the statements in question in the thread where they appear to show that the statement is not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare of this community and is not in accordance with the rules here. This is a great responsibility and I am taking Mr. Hsiung at his word as of his invitation to me here. For I intend to show readers how hatred toward the Jews is woven into the fabric here and how it can be corrected. I realize that those that had a hand in allowing anti-Semitic hate to flourish here could want to use tactics to stop me from exposing the posts that put down Jews and insult Judaism and are disrespectful to Jews that are allowed to stand here.
> Here is another post as to how it could arouse hatred toward me and Judaism. To understand this, a background of much of this could be needed so you may or may not be in the subset of readers that could understand the following.
> In this post, the poster uses the concept of what I am posting about to be {delusional}. And without a citation of a post by me to substantiate the claim, I could not post my response to the poster. And worse, readers could speculate as to what the delusional solutions are stated to be here by the poster since they are not identified.
> But readers could know that I have been writing here from a Jewish perspective as revealed to me, so that what the poster is saying is delusional by me could be those posts concerning how Judaism could lead one out of the trouble sea of depression and addiction, tossed to and fro in mire and dirt, and to be on a sea of glass without torment and in a state of calm. So the statement by the poster about me could be an antisemitic statement allowed to stand which could induce hatred toward the Jews and me as a Jew since it could be thought to be against Judaism.
> You see, Mr. Hsiung gives himself the option of responding to me, and I do not think that allowing statements of this nature will be good for this community as a whole just because he says that what he does in his thinking will be good for this community as a whole.Many greater than him had said the same thing and history proved them to be liars. And for up to 6 deputies all also not responding to my plea to this post coming, a subset of readers could think that there is some type of complicity among Mr. Hsiung and his deputies to allow the statement to stand.
> Here is the post in question and it stands today un repudiated by Mr. Hsiung and all of his deputies of record then.
> Lou
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20130702/msgs/1048569.html
> >
> Friends,
The poster writes about {dangerous conspiracies against the Jewish people} and when this site will be exposed and that the former deputy here claims that all days have passed without Mr. Hsiung and the former deputies fomenting hatred toward the Jews.
One of the ways that hatred toward the Jews could be fomented here is by allowing {replacement theology} to be seen as supportive and that by allowing the statements that promulgate replacement theology to stand, readers could think that it is not against the rules here and that the administration is validating what puts down Judaism in direct opposition to the rule to not post what could put down the faiths of others.
Let us have no misunderstanding about how anti-Semitism can be fostered here by the administration of this site as that they can control the content by allowing to be seen as supportive what is not sanctioned. And the policy that Mr. Hsiung has made for himself to allow him to ignore my notifications to him leaves me powerless to use what others have here to have that administration redress my concerns that anti-Semitic hate is standing out here as that it will be good for this community as a whole to ignore my pleas to have the anti-Semitic statements here sanctioned. A subset of readers could see that there is a plan or design to allow statements that insult the Jewish people and allow what could put down Judaism and Jews. You may not be in that subset of people because one may not understand how hatred toward the Jews is promulgated by allowing what is known as {replacement theology} to be posted here unsanctioned. A subset of readers could think that by the deputies and Mr Hsiung allowing replacement theology to be posted here, that anti-Semitism could be thought to be a continuous and deliberate policy of Mr. Hsiung carried out by all of his deputies in concert with him, for the deputies, according to the TOS here, could sanction those statements if they wanted to.
The policy of Mr. Hsiung that prevents me from posting my repudiation to the statements is a discriminatory policy against me as a Jew, for I can not post from a Jewish perspective as revealed to me, but Christiandom members can post from a Christian perspective that puts down the Jewish faith as in posting {replacement theology}. The avowed purpose of mr. Hsiung is that by him posting prohibitions to me that prevent me from posting from a Jewish perspective as revealed to me is that by him making those rules to me it will be good for this community as a whole. History says otherwise.
A subset of readers could have difficulty to believe that in this century a community could inflict such hatred toward the Jews and defend discrimination on the basis that it will be good for this community to prohibit a Jew from posting from a Jewish perspective as revealed to him, while allowing replacement theology to be posted without prohibition here. In {No non-Christian will enter heaven} being allowed to be seen as supportive and will be good for this community as a whole to not have a repudiation by Mr. Hsiung or a deputy posted to the statement in the thread where it appears, a subset of readers could think that anti-Semitism is an official plan here to lead readers to think of Jews as inferior people.
And as long as these statements in question are allowed to stand, not a day goes by that hatred toward the Jews could be fomented here.
Lou
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20041218/msgs/431168.html
>
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 14, 2014, at 8:18:09
In reply to Lou's response to 10derheart-notehydehygauzby, posted by Lou Pilder on June 14, 2014, at 7:41:57
> > > > > > ...that you sure are amazingly consistent, Lou Pilder. You never waver from your habit of periodically posting vile things about Dr. Bob and me and other former deputies revolving around imagined anti-Semitism.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks for being so reliable in never stopping your thinly veiled, outrageous accusations...which really aren't veiled at all, come to think of it. It just makes me feel so comfy, warm and at home here. So very supported and respected, too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Do you think prefacing your unfounded, evil, nastiness with some sort of disclaimers like, "A subset of readers could see..." or "...can give readers the idea..." fools anyone? please.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It's sad that Dr. Bob allows this. Really disappointing to the nth degree.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The only difference between the two statements:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "I feel Dr. Bob has gone too far" (standard example of a non-I-statement) in the FAQ
> > > > > >
> > > > > > and
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "a subset of readers could see that the allowing of statements that could induce hatred toward the Jews and others is a calculated plan with you and your deputies of record acting in concert"
> > > > > >
> > > > > > is that the former is a mild, mild, statement - technically uncivil under the "old" rules but hardly very offensive to Dr. Bob - and the latter is a false, libelous allegation of the worst kind. Your allegations of this type make you the poster man for incivility.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > And **you** worry about being defamed or scapegoated here? That's damn funny.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Have you submitted your "evidence" of our dangerous conspiracies against Jewish people on PB to the ADL yet? Why haven't they gone to the media about these horrible things "Dr. Bob and his deputies" did here? When will you get them to expose our awful crimes?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Well, I could go on and on, but I'd better get back to my nefarious doings before some Jewish posters on Babble feel that one day has gone by without Dr. Bob and me/us fomenting racial hatred against them...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ...oh, wait...ALL the days, EVERY SINGLE DAY BABBLE HAS EVER EXISTED has already gone by without Dr. Bob, me, or any other former or current deputies doing that.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Did you know it begins to hurt the muscles in the back of the eyeballs when one has to roll their eyes so often?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Lou = A. Piece. Of. Work.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > It is written here,[...You never waiver..posting..revolving around imagined anti-Semitism...].
> > > > > A subset of readers could see what is plainly visible here. This is because the rule here is not until one sees it can they know it.
> > > > > Lou
> > > > > .
> > > > > Friends,
> > > > It is written here by the former deputy, [...*imagined* anti-Semitism...] (stars mine)
> > > > Let there be no misunderstanding here. I would like for readers to bring up this post that I will use in my response to the former deputy here. To see this post,
> > > > A. Go to the search box at the bottom of this page and type in:
> > > > [ admin, 678224 ]
> > > > Look for the 678224 in the colored strip URL, not in the subject line.
> > > > Lou
> > > >
> > > > Friends,
> > > Let there be no misunderstanding here. The former deputy writes here, [...fomenting racial hatred..every single day that babble has existed has already gone by without (Mr. Hsiung), me or any other former deputies doing that...].
> > > But how is racial hatred fomented? One way is for the deputies here and/or Mr. Hsiung to incite or direct hatred toward the Jews. They could do this by being deliberately indifferent to my pleas to sanction statements that are antisemitc, or they could encourage others to post anti-Semitism by showing that they validate or ratify anti-Semitic statements, or they could leave anti-Semitic statements unsanctioned which conveys to readers that those statements are not against Mr. Hsiung's rules. And even worse, Mr. Hsiung says that he will give himself the option of not responding to my requests so that others may not respond to me.
> > > Here is Mr. Hsiung's encouragement to post what puts down Jews in relation to what is known as {replacement theology} that can stoke the furnace of hatred toward the Jews by saying what a subset of readers could think that he thinks that it is good for the member to post such.
> > > Lou
> > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faith/20060614/msgs/735373.html
> > >
> > > Friends and 10derheart,
> > The aspect of the allowing posts with statements that could arouse anti-Semitic feelings or put down Jews is what I am invited by Mr. Hsiung to submit to him here. I am responding to his invitation to submit individual posts for his review in which I am asking for him to purge the statements submitted to him by me by posting to the post that has the statements in question in the thread where they appear to show that the statement is not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare of this community and is not in accordance with the rules here. This is a great responsibility and I am taking Mr. Hsiung at his word as of his invitation to me here. For I intend to show readers how hatred toward the Jews is woven into the fabric here and how it can be corrected. I realize that those that had a hand in allowing anti-Semitic hate to flourish here could want to use tactics to stop me from exposing the posts that put down Jews and insult Judaism and are disrespectful to Jews that are allowed to stand here.
> > Here is another post as to how it could arouse hatred toward me and Judaism. To understand this, a background of much of this could be needed so you may or may not be in the subset of readers that could understand the following.
> > In this post, the poster uses the concept of what I am posting about to be {delusional}. And without a citation of a post by me to substantiate the claim, I could not post my response to the poster. And worse, readers could speculate as to what the delusional solutions are stated to be here by the poster since they are not identified.
> > But readers could know that I have been writing here from a Jewish perspective as revealed to me, so that what the poster is saying is delusional by me could be those posts concerning how Judaism could lead one out of the trouble sea of depression and addiction, tossed to and fro in mire and dirt, and to be on a sea of glass without torment and in a state of calm. So the statement by the poster about me could be an antisemitic statement allowed to stand which could induce hatred toward the Jews and me as a Jew since it could be thought to be against Judaism.
> > You see, Mr. Hsiung gives himself the option of responding to me, and I do not think that allowing statements of this nature will be good for this community as a whole just because he says that what he does in his thinking will be good for this community as a whole.Many greater than him had said the same thing and history proved them to be liars. And for up to 6 deputies all also not responding to my plea to this post coming, a subset of readers could think that there is some type of complicity among Mr. Hsiung and his deputies to allow the statement to stand.
> > Here is the post in question and it stands today un repudiated by Mr. Hsiung and all of his deputies of record then.
> > Lou
> > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20130702/msgs/1048569.html
> > >
> > Friends,
> The poster writes about {dangerous conspiracies against the Jewish people} and when this site will be exposed and that the former deputy here claims that all days have passed without Mr. Hsiung and the former deputies fomenting hatred toward the Jews.
> One of the ways that hatred toward the Jews could be fomented here is by allowing {replacement theology} to be seen as supportive and that by allowing the statements that promulgate replacement theology to stand, readers could think that it is not against the rules here and that the administration is validating what puts down Judaism in direct opposition to the rule to not post what could put down the faiths of others.
> Let us have no misunderstanding about how anti-Semitism can be fostered here by the administration of this site as that they can control the content by allowing to be seen as supportive what is not sanctioned. And the policy that Mr. Hsiung has made for himself to allow him to ignore my notifications to him leaves me powerless to use what others have here to have that administration redress my concerns that anti-Semitic hate is standing out here as that it will be good for this community as a whole to ignore my pleas to have the anti-Semitic statements here sanctioned. A subset of readers could see that there is a plan or design to allow statements that insult the Jewish people and allow what could put down Judaism and Jews. You may not be in that subset of people because one may not understand how hatred toward the Jews is promulgated by allowing what is known as {replacement theology} to be posted here unsanctioned. A subset of readers could think that by the deputies and Mr Hsiung allowing replacement theology to be posted here, that anti-Semitism could be thought to be a continuous and deliberate policy of Mr. Hsiung carried out by all of his deputies in concert with him, for the deputies, according to the TOS here, could sanction those statements if they wanted to.
> The policy of Mr. Hsiung that prevents me from posting my repudiation to the statements is a discriminatory policy against me as a Jew, for I can not post from a Jewish perspective as revealed to me, but Christiandom members can post from a Christian perspective that puts down the Jewish faith as in posting {replacement theology}. The avowed purpose of mr. Hsiung is that by him posting prohibitions to me that prevent me from posting from a Jewish perspective as revealed to me is that by him making those rules to me it will be good for this community as a whole. History says otherwise.
> A subset of readers could have difficulty to believe that in this century a community could inflict such hatred toward the Jews and defend discrimination on the basis that it will be good for this community to prohibit a Jew from posting from a Jewish perspective as revealed to him, while allowing replacement theology to be posted without prohibition here. In {No non-Christian will enter heaven} being allowed to be seen as supportive and will be good for this community as a whole to not have a repudiation by Mr. Hsiung or a deputy posted to the statement in the thread where it appears, a subset of readers could think that anti-Semitism is an official plan here to lead readers to think of Jews as inferior people.
> And as long as these statements in question are allowed to stand, not a day goes by that hatred toward the Jews could be fomented here.
> Lou
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20041218/msgs/431168.html
> >
> Friends,
The poster here contends that not a day goes by that there is anything that shows that the former deputies and Mr. Hsiung doing anything that foments racial hatred against the Jews.
As long as there is not a repudiation by Mr Hsiung posted to the following statement in the thread where it appears, not a day could go by that what shows dehumanizing of the Jews can take hold of the minds of a subset of readers to think of Jews as inferior people and foment hatred toward them.
[ faith, 428781 ]
Lou
>
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 14, 2014, at 17:56:31
In reply to A subset of readers could see.... » Lou Pilder, posted by 10derheart on June 12, 2014, at 20:10:20
> Thanks for being so reliable in never stopping your thinly veiled, outrageous accusations...
>
> Do you think prefacing your unfounded, evil, nastiness with some sort of disclaimers like, "A subset of readers could see..." or "...can give readers the idea..." fools anyone? please.I see them as signs of anxiety rather than accusations. Having anxiety when you fly is different than accusing the pilot of not knowing how to fly the plane.
And I appreciate the disclaimers, because they explicitly allow for other points of view.
Bob
Posted by 10derheart on June 14, 2014, at 19:11:06
In reply to Re: accusations and disclaimers, posted by Dr. Bob on June 14, 2014, at 17:56:31
I see.
A subset of readers could completely disagree with you. I am in that subset.
Thanks for making ** crystal** clear your nonrules.
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 15, 2014, at 8:47:18
In reply to Re: accusations and disclaimers » Dr. Bob, posted by 10derheart on June 14, 2014, at 19:11:06
> A subset of readers could completely disagree with you. I am in that subset.
OK, I accept that. A subset of copilots could feel accused when passengers have anxiety flying.
Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 15, 2014, at 9:41:20
In reply to Lou's reply-The Hsiung-Pilder discussion-scpgt » Dr. Bob, posted by Lou Pilder on June 11, 2014, at 6:35:53
> The privilege of posting here the statements that have gone un responded by you and your deputies of record imposes a grave responsibility.
I can see that. Almost like it's up to you to prevent another Holocaust:
> A subset of readers could see that there is a continuous plan and design that allows anti-Semitism here to be seen as being promoted by you and your deputies of record that could result in mass- violence toward Jews.
--
> And here is the first post that you ask for. It brings out the allowing of the humiliating tactic of "scapegoating" as I am the subject person in the post. And I say with shame, that a community here allows me to be progressively devalued and seen in open ridicule as a scapegoat for the person's real or imagined ills. The use of scapegoating in a mental-health community being allowed turns my stomach. By such means, defamation could be incited and directed against me.
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20120228/msgs/1031618.htmlThanks for choosing a post. The above is your reply to:
> > Lou is causing me to take a benzo
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20120228/msgs/1029672.html
1. True, she could've expressed that in a less personal way (and not led you to feel accused or put down). You obviously didn't force a pill down her throat. Maybe it would've been more civil to say:
> > Interacting with Lou is making me upset. I'm going to take a benzo.
Would you have felt scapegoated by that?
2. I appreciate you bringing up feeling humiliated. Maybe that could go both ways. Your "ill" could be anxiety about another Holocaust, and a subset of deputies could feel scapegoated for it, and humiliated.
Bob
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 16, 2014, at 8:18:06
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 15, 2014, at 9:41:20
> > The privilege of posting here the statements that have gone un responded by you and your deputies of record imposes a grave responsibility.
>
> I can see that. Almost like it's up to you to prevent another Holocaust:
>
> > A subset of readers could see that there is a continuous plan and design that allows anti-Semitism here to be seen as being promoted by you and your deputies of record that could result in mass- violence toward Jews.
>
> --
>
> > And here is the first post that you ask for. It brings out the allowing of the humiliating tactic of "scapegoating" as I am the subject person in the post. And I say with shame, that a community here allows me to be progressively devalued and seen in open ridicule as a scapegoat for the person's real or imagined ills. The use of scapegoating in a mental-health community being allowed turns my stomach. By such means, defamation could be incited and directed against me.
> >
> > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20120228/msgs/1031618.html
>
> Thanks for choosing a post. The above is your reply to:
>
> > > Lou is causing me to take a benzo
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20120228/msgs/1029672.html
>
> 1. True, she could've expressed that in a less personal way (and not led you to feel accused or put down). You obviously didn't force a pill down her throat. Maybe it would've been more civil to say:
>
> > > Interacting with Lou is making me upset. I'm going to take a benzo.
>
> Would you have felt scapegoated by that?
>
> 2. I appreciate you bringing up feeling humiliated. Maybe that could go both ways. Your "ill" could be anxiety about another Holocaust, and a subset of deputies could feel scapegoated for it, and humiliated.
>
> Bob
Mr. Hsiung,
I wrote,[...A subset of readers could see that there is a continuous plan and design that allows anti-Semitism to be seen as promoted by you and your deputies of record...].
Then you replied,[...True, (the fact that what she wrote about me could constitute scapegoating because it is obvious that I did not force a benzo down her throat)...].
The design that a subset of readers could see is that the statement that uses me as a scapegoat is standing to be seen as supportive by you by the nature that unsanctioned posts could be thought by readers to be not against your rules here.
But it is much more than that. For by the libel against me being allowed to stand, even to this day, readers could think that you are ratifying the libel that could decrease the respect and regard and confidence in which I am held because a subset of readers could think that you are validating the hatred posted toward me.
This is further reinforced by the following also being allowed to stand. In the following, the poster uses the derogatory and slanderous portrayal of me as being a {disturbed person}. This could encourage others to post more hate toward me as it is allowed to stand. And the fact that the poster is from the administrative team that has allowed hatred toward the Jews to be posted here, when they have the function to implement your rules and did not, a design could be seen by a subset of readers as that you and your deputies of record encouraging and promoting hatred toward the Jews and me as a Jew here, for your statement that unsanctioned posts have content that is not against your rules speaks the rational basis for that thought to be entertained by them.
Here is the post that is the second of my posts that have statements that I am responding to your invitation to give you to post in the thread where the statement appears as to that it is not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare of this community and is not in accordance with a specific rue of yours.
Lou Pilder
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20130930/msgs/1055869.html
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 16, 2014, at 11:39:17
In reply to A subset of readers could see.... » Lou Pilder, posted by 10derheart on June 12, 2014, at 20:10:20
> ...that you sure are amazingly consistent, Lou Pilder. You never waver from your habit of periodically posting vile things about Dr. Bob and me and other former deputies revolving around imagined anti-Semitism.
>
> Thanks for being so reliable in never stopping your thinly veiled, outrageous accusations...which really aren't veiled at all, come to think of it. It just makes me feel so comfy, warm and at home here. So very supported and respected, too.
>
> Do you think prefacing your unfounded, evil, nastiness with some sort of disclaimers like, "A subset of readers could see..." or "...can give readers the idea..." fools anyone? please.
>
> It's sad that Dr. Bob allows this. Really disappointing to the nth degree.
>
> The only difference between the two statements:
>
> "I feel Dr. Bob has gone too far" (standard example of a non-I-statement) in the FAQ
>
> and
>
> "a subset of readers could see that the allowing of statements that could induce hatred toward the Jews and others is a calculated plan with you and your deputies of record acting in concert"
>
> is that the former is a mild, mild, statement - technically uncivil under the "old" rules but hardly very offensive to Dr. Bob - and the latter is a false, libelous allegation of the worst kind. Your allegations of this type make you the poster man for incivility.
>
> And **you** worry about being defamed or scapegoated here? That's damn funny.
>
> Have you submitted your "evidence" of our dangerous conspiracies against Jewish people on PB to the ADL yet? Why haven't they gone to the media about these horrible things "Dr. Bob and his deputies" did here? When will you get them to expose our awful crimes?
>
> Well, I could go on and on, but I'd better get back to my nefarious doings before some Jewish posters on Babble feel that one day has gone by without Dr. Bob and me/us fomenting racial hatred against them...
>
> ...oh, wait...ALL the days, EVERY SINGLE DAY BABBLE HAS EVER EXISTED has already gone by without Dr. Bob, me, or any other former or current deputies doing that.
>
> Did you know it begins to hurt the muscles in the back of the eyeballs when one has to roll their eyes so often?
>
> Lou = A. Piece. Of. Work.
>
> 10,
You wrote,[...Lou= A. piece. (redacted by respondent)]
A subset of readers could think that what I have been posting here concerning that there are years of outstanding notifications from me which could cause a subset of readers to think that what those that had the ability to sanction the statements that could arouse anti-Semitic feelings and didn't, is supported by that the statement in question could dehumanize me and subject me to humiliation and ridicule.
I have a great task ahead of me to have these statements that put down Jews and others to be notated in the thread where they appear by Mr. Hsiung as being not in accordance with his rules and not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare of this community. And I say with shame, as long as your statement here about my character is allowed to stand in this community which I am a member of, you could get others to join you in decreasing the respect, regard and confidence in which I am held and induce hostile and disagreeable feelings and opinions about me.
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 16, 2014, at 11:58:27
In reply to Lou's reply- moarhey » 10derheart, posted by Lou Pilder on June 16, 2014, at 11:39:17
> > ...that you sure are amazingly consistent, Lou Pilder. You never waver from your habit of periodically posting vile things about Dr. Bob and me and other former deputies revolving around imagined anti-Semitism.
> >
> > Thanks for being so reliable in never stopping your thinly veiled, outrageous accusations...which really aren't veiled at all, come to think of it. It just makes me feel so comfy, warm and at home here. So very supported and respected, too.
> >
> > Do you think prefacing your unfounded, evil, nastiness with some sort of disclaimers like, "A subset of readers could see..." or "...can give readers the idea..." fools anyone? please.
> >
> > It's sad that Dr. Bob allows this. Really disappointing to the nth degree.
> >
> > The only difference between the two statements:
> >
> > "I feel Dr. Bob has gone too far" (standard example of a non-I-statement) in the FAQ
> >
> > and
> >
> > "a subset of readers could see that the allowing of statements that could induce hatred toward the Jews and others is a calculated plan with you and your deputies of record acting in concert"
> >
> > is that the former is a mild, mild, statement - technically uncivil under the "old" rules but hardly very offensive to Dr. Bob - and the latter is a false, libelous allegation of the worst kind. Your allegations of this type make you the poster man for incivility.
> >
> > And **you** worry about being defamed or scapegoated here? That's damn funny.
> >
> > Have you submitted your "evidence" of our dangerous conspiracies against Jewish people on PB to the ADL yet? Why haven't they gone to the media about these horrible things "Dr. Bob and his deputies" did here? When will you get them to expose our awful crimes?
> >
> > Well, I could go on and on, but I'd better get back to my nefarious doings before some Jewish posters on Babble feel that one day has gone by without Dr. Bob and me/us fomenting racial hatred against them...
> >
> > ...oh, wait...ALL the days, EVERY SINGLE DAY BABBLE HAS EVER EXISTED has already gone by without Dr. Bob, me, or any other former or current deputies doing that.
> >
> > Did you know it begins to hurt the muscles in the back of the eyeballs when one has to roll their eyes so often?
> >
> > Lou = A. Piece. Of. Work.
> >
> > 10,
> You wrote,[...Lou= A. piece. (redacted by respondent)]
> A subset of readers could think that what I have been posting here concerning that there are years of outstanding notifications from me which could cause a subset of readers to think that what those that had the ability to sanction the statements that could arouse anti-Semitic feelings and didn't, is supported by that the statement in question could dehumanize me and subject me to humiliation and ridicule.
> I have a great task ahead of me to have these statements that put down Jews and others to be notated in the thread where they appear by Mr. Hsiung as being not in accordance with his rules and not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare of this community. And I say with shame, as long as your statement here about my character is allowed to stand in this community which I am a member of, you could get others to join you in decreasing the respect, regard and confidence in which I am held and induce hostile and disagreeable feelings and opinions about me.
> Lou
>
> 10,
You wrote, [...our dangerous conspiracies...].
The "our" could be thought that the people in that set are you an the other deputies and Mr. Hsiung. And anyone that thinks that has a rational basis to think that because Mr. Hsiung states that any reply "comes from all of us".
But it is much more than that. For others could be persuaded by the fact that the statement in question here that attacks me in a derogatory manner, as seen as supportive, could be an attractive means for others to join the group that is in the "our", for if you can have immunity to post hate toward me here, then those that think that they can also could join you and post even more hate. This could play out in their lives to the murder of Jews and others and even themselves. For when anti-Semitism can be seen by even a small subset of readers here as supportive, and then also see hatred posted toward me being allowed to stand, then there could be a subset of readers to think that hatred toward me and Jews is state-sponsored here.
Never again.
Lou
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 17, 2014, at 3:59:42
In reply to Lou's reply-The Hsiung-Pilder discussion » Dr. Bob, posted by Lou Pilder on June 16, 2014, at 8:18:06
> In the following, the poster uses the derogatory and slanderous portrayal of me as being a {disturbed person}.
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20130930/msgs/1055869.htmlI agree, that was uncivil. And I posted later in that thread that on a sh*t-slinging board, I wanted posters not to sling it back.
Did you consider the possibility that she might have felt jealous of you? Since she saw me as giving you protection I wasn't giving others? (Granted, you may not see the situation the same way.)
Bob
Posted by SLS on June 17, 2014, at 8:08:12
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 17, 2014, at 3:59:42
> > In the following, the poster uses the derogatory and slanderous portrayal of me as being a {disturbed person}.
> > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20130930/msgs/1055869.html
>
> I agree, that was uncivil. And I posted later in that thread that on a sh*t-slinging board, I wanted posters not to sling it back.
>
> Did you consider the possibility that she might have felt jealous of you? Since she saw me as giving you protection I wasn't giving others? (Granted, you may not see the situation the same way.)She might not be jealous at all. Perhaps she felt indignant at the inequity of your selective protection and support bias. Without further clarification, we can't know this for sure.
- Scott
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 17, 2014, at 23:30:09
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by SLS on June 17, 2014, at 8:08:12
> > Did you consider the possibility that she might have felt jealous of you? Since she saw me as giving you protection I wasn't giving others?
>
> She might not be jealous at all. Perhaps she felt indignant at the inequity of your selective protection and support bias. Without further clarification, we can't know this for sure.I agree, we can't know for sure.
I also want to make clear that I don't see feeling jealous, or indignant, as justifying incivility.
Bob
Posted by 10derheart on June 18, 2014, at 0:01:38
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 17, 2014, at 23:30:09
But your pronouncement of alleged "anxiety" in a poster justifies boatloads of it.
>> Dr. Bob, protecting XXX with selective bias since 20??.
Posted by SLS on June 18, 2014, at 11:22:28
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 17, 2014, at 23:30:09
> > > Did you consider the possibility that she might have felt jealous of you? Since she saw me as giving you protection I wasn't giving others?
> >
> > She might not be jealous at all. Perhaps she felt indignant at the inequity of your selective protection and support bias. Without further clarification, we can't know this for sure.
>
> I agree, we can't know for sure.
>
> I also want to make clear that I don't see feeling jealous, or indignant, as justifying incivility.Agreed.
- Scott
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 20, 2014, at 5:46:16
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 17, 2014, at 3:59:42
> > In the following, the poster uses the derogatory and slanderous portrayal of me as being a {disturbed person}.
> > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20130930/msgs/1055869.html
>
> I agree, that was uncivil. And I posted later in that thread that on a sh*t-slinging board, I wanted posters not to sling it back.
>
> Did you consider the possibility that she might have felt jealous of you? Since she saw me as giving you protection I wasn't giving others? (Granted, you may not see the situation the same way.)
>
> BobMr. Hsiung,
You wrote,[...you may not see the situation the same way...].
No, Mr. Hsiung. I do not see the situation the same way. I see what is plainly visible.
I see your former deputy writing about my character as can be seen. And it can be seen that there is not a post by you to the post by her to say that it is not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare of the community and that what she wrote about me is not in accordance with a rule here. And because of that, a subset of readers could think that it is not against your rules to post such that could decrease the respect and regard that I am held and induce hostile and disagreeable feelings and opinions about me. There is a rational basis for those to think that because those readers could think that you are validating what she wrote about my character because your rule to post a warning to the poster of such to the statement in question first, and then block the person the next time. Your listing of options could not be seen as a sanction at all by those in that subset because the list is not directed to her in particular for what she wrote about me. A subset of readers now could think that readers need to be mind-readers to jump to such a conclusion that what you posted in the list of options is a sanction to the slander of my character and could think even now, after you posted this here that you are validating the hatred posted by her toward me which could arouse anti-Semitic feelings toward me because I am trying to stop you and your deputies of record from leaving anti-Semitic statement to stand here.
I have the following concerns:
A. Will you post to the defamatory statement about me here in the thread where it appears that it is not in accordance with your rules and not civil?
B. If not, why not, so I can post my response to you here?
Lou PIlder
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 20, 2014, at 17:23:00
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion » Dr. Bob, posted by 10derheart on June 18, 2014, at 0:01:38
> Perhaps she felt indignant at the inequity of your selective protection and support bias.
I didn't mean to discount that theory. Bias can make me indignant, too. Like when a friend is discriminated against because of their sexual orientation.
Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 20, 2014, at 17:38:59
In reply to Lou's reply-The Hsiung-Pilder discussion-discrm » Dr. Bob, posted by Lou Pilder on June 20, 2014, at 5:46:16
> it can be seen that there is not a post by you to the post by her to say that it is not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare of the community and that what she wrote about me is not in accordance with a rule here.
A subset of readers could feel indignant at the inequity of my selective enforcement of the rules here.
> A. Will you post to the defamatory statement about me here in the thread where it appears that it is not in accordance with your rules and not civil?
No. Unless I change my mind.
> B. If not, why not, so I can post my response to you here?
Because I posted that in this thread.
Bob
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 22, 2014, at 10:07:20
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 20, 2014, at 17:38:59
> > it can be seen that there is not a post by you to the post by her to say that it is not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare of the community and that what she wrote about me is not in accordance with a rule here.
>
> A subset of readers could feel indignant at the inequity of my selective enforcement of the rules here.
>
> > A. Will you post to the defamatory statement about me here in the thread where it appears that it is not in accordance with your rules and not civil?
>
> No. Unless I change my mind.
>
> > B. If not, why not, so I can post my response to you here?
>
> Because I posted that in this thread.
>
> BobMr. Hsiung,
You wrote,[...because I posted in this thread (that the defamation posted toward you, Lou, is not civil)...].
That only tells those readers that come to this board that the defamation is considered by you to be uncivil. The readers of the post where the defamation toward me is posted in the thread where it appears can not see that, and not until one sees it can they know it according to you.
What I am trying to accomplish here is to stop you and your deputies of record from allowing statements that put down Jews and arouse anti-Semitic feelings and those statements that defame me from being seen as civil by you and supportive by you and that by you allowing them to stand it will be good for this community as a whole. The remedy available to me now is to respond to your invitation to me to bring posts to you here for you to take remedial action to show that you do not ratify the anti-Semitism or defamation or validate it by leaving those statements to stand and post that they are not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare of this community and that they are not in accordance with a particular rule of yours in the thread where they appear. As long as you allow the statements to stand, a subset of readers could think that hate is supportive by you and your deputies of record because you state that support takes precedence and you do not wait to sanction uncivil posts because they could start a fire of hate and stoke the furnace of hatred toward the Jews because even small fire or even a match has the potential to start a forest fire.
But it is much more than that. For as the fire of hate burns, and you agree that the defamation is uncivil, a subset of readers could think that you are encouraging the hatred toward the Jews and me and to be further developing that here by you not applying your own rules and that up to six deputies also have not posted to what is plainly visible that could arouse antisemitic feelings and lead others to think poorly of me because the defamation toward me is allowed to stand by you and any deputy of record. The defamation toward me has effects of emotional/psychological consequences to me as of anyone else that are well-documented in the psychological literature. I have a better chance of escaping the emotional/psychological consequences of hatred and defamation posted toward me and ridicule and belittlement and the statements that decrease the respect toward me and can induce hostility toward me if you were to stop them now, for as long as they appear in the thread where they are posted, readers could think that you are encouraging more of the same hate to be posted here toward me.
Here is another one that you are leaving to be seen as supportive that defames me. The poster writes,[...Lou= A, Piece. Of. Work...].
I have the following concers.
A. Are you going to leave that statement to be seen as that it will good for this community as a whole outstanding without your tag-line, "Please be civil" posted to it in the thread where it appears?
B. If not , why not?
Lou Pilder
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20140304/msgs/1066855.html
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 24, 2014, at 1:15:08
In reply to Lou's reply-The Hsiung-Pilder discussion- » Dr. Bob, posted by Lou Pilder on June 22, 2014, at 10:07:20
> > > A. Will you post to the defamatory statement about me here in the thread where it appears that it is not in accordance with your rules and not civil?
> >
> > > B. If not, why not, so I can post my response to you here?
> >
> > Because I posted that in this thread.
>
> That only tells those readers that come to this board that the defamation is considered by you to be uncivil. The readers of the post where the defamation toward me is posted in the thread where it appears can not see that, and not until one sees it can they know it according to you.True. If you'd like to post to that thread a link to this thread, you're welcome to.
> The defamation toward me has effects of emotional/psychological consequences to me as of anyone else that are well-documented in the psychological literature. I have a better chance of escaping the emotional/psychological consequences of hatred and defamation posted toward me and ridicule and belittlement and the statements that decrease the respect toward me and can induce hostility toward me if you were to stop them now
I wouldn't want to feel ridiculed or belittled or disrespected, either.
> Here is another one that you are leaving to be seen as supportive that defames me.
> I have the following concers.
> A. Are you going to leave that statement to be seen as that it will good for this community as a whole outstanding without your tag-line, "Please be civil" posted to it in the thread where it appears?
> B. If not , why not?
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20140304/msgs/1066855.html> > Lou = A. Piece. Of. Work.
= a complicated, difficult, or eccentric person
I have to agree, that could lead you to feel accused or put down, so I'd consider it uncivil.
Again, I'm just going to post that in this thread.
Bob
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 24, 2014, at 11:09:34
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 24, 2014, at 1:15:08
> > > > A. Will you post to the defamatory statement about me here in the thread where it appears that it is not in accordance with your rules and not civil?
> > >
> > > > B. If not, why not, so I can post my response to you here?
> > >
> > > Because I posted that in this thread.
> >
> > That only tells those readers that come to this board that the defamation is considered by you to be uncivil. The readers of the post where the defamation toward me is posted in the thread where it appears can not see that, and not until one sees it can they know it according to you.
>
> True. If you'd like to post to that thread a link to this thread, you're welcome to.
>
> > The defamation toward me has effects of emotional/psychological consequences to me as of anyone else that are well-documented in the psychological literature. I have a better chance of escaping the emotional/psychological consequences of hatred and defamation posted toward me and ridicule and belittlement and the statements that decrease the respect toward me and can induce hostility toward me if you were to stop them now
>
> I wouldn't want to feel ridiculed or belittled or disrespected, either.
>
> > Here is another one that you are leaving to be seen as supportive that defames me.
> > I have the following concers.
> > A. Are you going to leave that statement to be seen as that it will good for this community as a whole outstanding without your tag-line, "Please be civil" posted to it in the thread where it appears?
> > B. If not , why not?
> >
> > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20140304/msgs/1066855.html
>
> > > Lou = A. Piece. Of. Work.
>
> = a complicated, difficult, or eccentric person
>
> I have to agree, that could lead you to feel accused or put down, so I'd consider it uncivil.
>
> Again, I'm just going to post that in this thread.
>
> Bob
Mr. Hsiung,
You wrote,[...I have to agree..I'd consider it uncivil...I'm just going to post that in this thread (I am not going to post my tag-line, "Please be civil" to the statement where it is posted, Lou}...you can post a link to it here in this thread...].
Your TOS states that you will post a warning at the first instance of something being uncivil by a poster, and then block the poster on the next instance with your formula in your TOS. Here you are not doing that and ask me to link to it. If I was to do that by linking your statement here to the post where it is posted,
A. Would that also constitute a warning to the poster?
B. If it was after a previous warning, would you issue a block to that poster now?
C. If not, why not?
Lou Pilder
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 26, 2014, at 0:12:02
In reply to Lou's reply- The Hsiung-Pilder discussion-tupstn » Dr. Bob, posted by Lou Pilder on June 24, 2014, at 11:09:34
> Your TOS states that you will post a warning at the first instance of something being uncivil by a poster, and then block the poster on the next instance with your formula in your TOS. Here you are not doing that and ask me to link to it. If I was to do that by linking your statement here to the post where it is posted,
> A. Would that also constitute a warning to the poster?Sure, I can't think of a reason not to.
> B. If it was after a previous warning, would you issue a block to that poster now?
I might or might not. It would depend. Was it after a previous warning?
Bob
Posted by 10derheart on June 26, 2014, at 0:50:24
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 26, 2014, at 0:12:02
>> > B. If it was after a previous warning, would you issue a block to that poster now?
>>I might or might not. It would depend. Was it after a previous warning?
Oh don't keep me in suspense, Dr. Bob. Do it. What's a little more hypocrisy at this point? Your pet will be so pleased at how his puppet performed for him.
Lou = The Perfect Deputy
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 26, 2014, at 9:26:51
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion » Dr. Bob, posted by 10derheart on June 26, 2014, at 0:50:24
> >> > B. If it was after a previous warning, would you issue a block to that poster now?
>
> >>I might or might not. It would depend. Was it after a previous warning?
>
> Oh don't keep me in suspense, Dr. Bob. Do it. What's a little more hypocrisy at this point? Your pet will be so pleased at how his puppet performed for him.
>
> Lou = The Perfect DeputyFriends,
It is written here,[...Lou=...]
The statement could lead readers to think that I am the subject person. The subject then could be hypocrisy, pets and puppets.
But is that really what is in discussion here?
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 26, 2014, at 15:17:26
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 26, 2014, at 0:12:02
> > Your TOS states that you will post a warning at the first instance of something being uncivil by a poster, and then block the poster on the next instance with your formula in your TOS. Here you are not doing that and ask me to link to it. If I was to do that by linking your statement here to the post where it is posted,
> > A. Would that also constitute a warning to the poster?
>
> Sure, I can't think of a reason not to.
>
> > B. If it was after a previous warning, would you issue a block to that poster now?
>
> I might or might not. It would depend. Was it after a previous warning?
>
> Bob
Would it count as a warning, or go to a block, if I did not post a link to your post that said that it was uncivil? If not:
A. Would you agree that by you not counting it, a subset of readers could have a rationale basis for thinking that you are encouraging and/or developing statements that put me down or accuse me?
B. Would you agree that you are not abiding by your own rule that says that you do not wait to sanction uncivil posts because one match could start a forest fire?
Lou Pilder
Posted by Lou Pilder on June 26, 2014, at 16:11:41
In reply to Re: The Hsiung-Pilder discussion, posted by Dr. Bob on June 24, 2014, at 1:15:08
> > > > A. Will you post to the defamatory statement about me here in the thread where it appears that it is not in accordance with your rules and not civil?
> > >
> > > > B. If not, why not, so I can post my response to you here?
> > >
> > > Because I posted that in this thread.
> >
> > That only tells those readers that come to this board that the defamation is considered by you to be uncivil. The readers of the post where the defamation toward me is posted in the thread where it appears can not see that, and not until one sees it can they know it according to you.
>
> True. If you'd like to post to that thread a link to this thread, you're welcome to.
>
> > The defamation toward me has effects of emotional/psychological consequences to me as of anyone else that are well-documented in the psychological literature. I have a better chance of escaping the emotional/psychological consequences of hatred and defamation posted toward me and ridicule and belittlement and the statements that decrease the respect toward me and can induce hostility toward me if you were to stop them now
>
> I wouldn't want to feel ridiculed or belittled or disrespected, either.
>
> > Here is another one that you are leaving to be seen as supportive that defames me.
> > I have the following concers.
> > A. Are you going to leave that statement to be seen as that it will good for this community as a whole outstanding without your tag-line, "Please be civil" posted to it in the thread where it appears?
> > B. If not , why not?
> >
> > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20140304/msgs/1066855.html
>
> > > Lou = A. Piece. Of. Work.
>
> = a complicated, difficult, or eccentric person
>
> I have to agree, that could lead you to feel accused or put down, so I'd consider it uncivil.
>
> Again, I'm just going to post that in this thread.
>
> BobMr. Hsiung,
Now there are two people that posted what you agree is uncivil toward me and you have not posted your tag-line to where the post is posted in the thread to "Please be civil".
I am unsure as to what your intent is here by you not applying your formula for sanctioning uncivil statements even though you agree that the statements are uncivil.
Would you agree that:
A. That the longer you do not post your tag-line to be civil to those two statements, that hostility could be encouraged toward me?
B. That since I am trying to stop you and your deputies of record from allowing anti-Semitic statements to stand, and you agree that readers could see the statements in discussion now that you admit are uncivil but also will not post your tag-line to be civil to the statement where it is posted ,that if statements that put me down or accuse me, by being allowed to be seen as supportive by you, could have the effect of advancing anti-Semitic hate? I base this on psychological concepts that are too comprehensive to post here now.
Lou Pilder
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Administration | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.