![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 68 to 92 of 95. Go back in thread:
Posted by fayeroe on March 28, 2008, at 13:02:54
In reply to Re: his baby, posted by Dr. Bob on March 28, 2008, at 10:38:16
"OK, but I don't think Babble is a baby anymore, either. I think it can do a lot to care for itself. But I do also understand that it would help if I were more consistent."
I am a substitute teacher at the big prison here and the motto there is "firm, fair and consistent".
Consistency from you would really go a very long way here. An even "keel" is reassuring to anyone and particulary people with mental health issues.
Thanks for making that admission, Dr.
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 30, 2008, at 14:17:40
In reply to Re: his baby » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on March 28, 2008, at 13:02:54
> I am a substitute teacher at the big prison here and the motto there is "firm, fair and consistent".
>
> Consistency from you would really go a very long way here. An even "keel" is reassuring to anyone and particulary people with mental health issues.
>
> Thanks for making that admission, Dr.You're welcome, and I like that motto. I think the administration here is always firm, fair, and consistent, but my presence does seem to make a difference:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20080313/msgs/820304.html
I have the idea that it can be hard for substitute teachers. And the deputies here are kind of in that position.
Bob
Posted by fayeroe on March 30, 2008, at 15:42:47
In reply to Re: substitute teachers, posted by Dr. Bob on March 30, 2008, at 14:17:40
> > I am a substitute teacher at the big prison here and the motto there is "firm, fair and consistent".
> >
> > Consistency from you would really go a very long way here. An even "keel" is reassuring to anyone and particulary people with mental health issues.
> >
> > Thanks for making that admission, Dr.
>
> You're welcome, and I like that motto. I think the administration here is always firm, fair, and consistent, but my presence does seem to make a difference:
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20080313/msgs/820304.html
>
> I have the idea that it can be hard for substitute teachers. And the deputies here are kind of in that position.
>
> Bobsubstitute teaching isn't hard for me. when i walk in, i own that class. i let them know what my expectations are, up front, and let them know that if they don't meet them...i will write them a case and then they go before security.
there is structure in a prison. it is totally up to the substitute to maintain an orderly classroom. no one told me that, it's just the way i operate there.
i also make it very clear that i am there to help them learn and that it goes both ways...if they learn, so do i.
seems to me that being a deputy could be very close to being a sub. it is an individual thing here and in a prison.
one major difference is that a deputy will never be taken hostage and there is a very good chance that someone might try that there. :-) (i took self defense classes before i would agree to be in the classrooms) :-)
Posted by Dinah on March 30, 2008, at 16:04:31
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on March 30, 2008, at 15:42:47
> substitute teaching isn't hard for me. when i walk in, i own that class. i let them know what my expectations are, up front, and let them know that if they don't meet them...i will write them a case and then they go before security.
Is that what people would like here?
Dr. Bob's idea is moving in the other direction. Deputies are to ignore anything they see unless something is reported to them.
So expectations can be set, but posters know that if they don't meet them, absolutely nothing will be done unless they themselves complain.
Posted by fayeroe on March 30, 2008, at 16:09:42
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » fayeroe, posted by Dinah on March 30, 2008, at 16:04:31
"substitute teaching isn't hard for me. when i walk in, i own that class. i let them know what my expectations are, up front, and let them know that if they don't meet them...i will write them a case and then they go before security."
i was talking to Bob.
Posted by Dinah on March 30, 2008, at 16:11:16
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » Dinah, posted by fayeroe on March 30, 2008, at 16:09:42
Posted by 10derHeart on March 30, 2008, at 23:20:19
In reply to ok (nm) » fayeroe, posted by Dinah on March 30, 2008, at 16:11:16
Posted by muffled on March 30, 2008, at 23:45:56
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » fayeroe, posted by Dinah on March 30, 2008, at 16:04:31
> > substitute teaching isn't hard for me. when i walk in, i own that class. i let them know what my expectations are, up front, and let them know that if they don't meet them...i will write them a case and then they go before security.
*wow thats good!!! Not all subs are good at that. I remember in HS we sent many a sub away crying :-(
Also, in some schools, you can lay down the law, and send problems to admin(principal) but not a whole lot happens.....they just come back.....and act up again....and again, and again...
Sigh. Its good you got good back up at the jail.
> Is that what people would like here?*well...clarity is good...
But its hard to be clear here I am discovering...
> Dr. Bob's idea is moving in the other direction. Deputies are to ignore anything they see unless something is reported to them.*Even if it blatant ? Well, I guess thats where we babblers need to step in.....
> So expectations can be set, but posters know that if they don't meet them, absolutely nothing will be done unless they themselves complain.*again, I don't mind this so much in that it gives it time to sort itself out first.
And then I guess what babblers then need to do is learn to really think before they report a post....think to themselves...have I tried to help? or is it not possible? Is someone getting hurt here? Am I going to stand and watch or call for help?
Etc.
Good questions dinah. Brings forth discussion, and I for one (apparently?!?!I been spewing forth my opinion all over....) like to discuss to better understand whats happening here...
I have always felt that when I post on the board its open to all to reply to my post. I hope all feel free to do so as I am eager to learn.
I think I must be annoying the hoo hoo outta everyone. I do this from time to time. I allasudden realize I been so freakin riddiculous and full of myself and then I shut up.
I will soon, promise.
Take care babblers,
M
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 31, 2008, at 18:52:42
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on March 30, 2008, at 15:42:47
> substitute teaching isn't hard for me. when i walk in, i own that class. i let them know what my expectations are, up front, and let them know that if they don't meet them...i will write them a case and then they go before security.
>
> there is structure in a prison. it is totally up to the substitute to maintain an orderly classroom. no one told me that, it's just the way i operate there.
>
> seems to me that being a deputy could be very close to being a sub. it is an individual thing here and in a prison.
>
> one major difference is that a deputy will never be taken hostage and there is a very good chance that someone might try that there. :-)Another difference is that posters are free to go.
I do see it as up to me to maintain an orderly board. I often find it hard. How do you think I would do in prison?
Bob
Posted by fayeroe on March 31, 2008, at 19:03:41
In reply to Re: substitute teachers, posted by Dr. Bob on March 31, 2008, at 18:52:42
> > substitute teaching isn't hard for me. when i walk in, i own that class. i let them know what my expectations are, up front, and let them know that if they don't meet them...i will write them a case and then they go before security.
> >
> > there is structure in a prison. it is totally up to the substitute to maintain an orderly classroom. no one told me that, it's just the way i operate there.
> >
> > seems to me that being a deputy could be very close to being a sub. it is an individual thing here and in a prison.
> >
> > one major difference is that a deputy will never be taken hostage and there is a very good chance that someone might try that there. :-)
>
> Another difference is that posters are free to go.
>
> I do see it as up to me to maintain an orderly board. I often find it hard. How do you think I would do in prison?
>
> Bob
I don't think that you would be as good at it as I am.It takes every sense that I have to operate in a classroom. I listen, I mirror back what the offender says and I then talk with them about finding a solution for their problems.
I watch them every minute I am with them.
I speak when I see that I need to and I always let them know when they have accomplished something positive.
I never let anyone get behind me. I've never had to call for "back-up". (officers)
I don't write as many cases as there are PBCs here.
And I've never banned an offender from my class. I don't believe in throwing someone out unless they are threatening to another offender or myself. How will they learn if they are back in their cell?
The offender is free to go in two years, if they behave themselves. That is different from Babble. Here we can stay around, unless we get blocked for a year.
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 2, 2008, at 1:09:19
In reply to Re: substitute teachers, posted by fayeroe on March 31, 2008, at 19:03:41
> I don't think that you would be as good at it as I am.
I don't think so, either!
> It takes every sense that I have to operate in a classroom. I listen, I mirror back what the offender says and I then talk with them about finding a solution for their problems.
>
> I speak when I see that I need to and I always let them know when they have accomplished something positive.I think approaches like those could be useful here, too.
> The offender is free to go in two years, if they behave themselves. That is different from Babble. Here we can stay around, unless we get blocked for a year.
And even then, you can come back.
Bob
Posted by fayeroe on April 2, 2008, at 12:17:44
In reply to Re: substitute teachers, posted by Dr. Bob on April 2, 2008, at 1:09:19
> > I don't think that you would be as good at it as I am.
>
> I don't think so, either!
>
> > It takes every sense that I have to operate in a classroom. I listen, I mirror back what the offender says and I then talk with them about finding a solution for their problems.
> >
> > I speak when I see that I need to and I always let them know when they have accomplished something positive.
>
> I think approaches like those could be useful here, too.Yes, I think the posters would like positive feedback frequently.
>
> > The offender is free to go in two years, if they behave themselves. That is different from Babble. Here we can stay around, unless we get blocked for a year.
>
> And even then, you can come back.In the case of the offenders, they can come back too. :-) The recidivism rate for men is 80% and for women it is 30%. The women usually have more incentive to stay clean.
This prison is minimal security and they are on their last two years.....when they do go back, it isn't to a minimal system, it is Huntsville or Gatesville. (bad, bad places)
I just thought of something, there is something at the prison called "ad seg" (administrative segregation) and it is solitary. So, they do get blocked and banned. Sometimes up to 14 days if they are really bad.
These are FELONS, if they are only punished for such a short length of time, how about considering that for posters here? The warden told me that nothing is accomplished after two weeks with an offender..except they come out angrier than before.
As for "coming back here", some posters are too hurt and angry to come back.
>
> Bob
Posted by muffled on April 2, 2008, at 16:06:32
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on April 2, 2008, at 12:17:44
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 3, 2008, at 9:03:38
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on April 2, 2008, at 12:17:44
> I just thought of something, there is something at the prison called "ad seg" (administrative segregation) and it is solitary. So, they do get blocked and banned. Sometimes up to 14 days if they are really bad.
>
> These are FELONS, if they are only punished for such a short length of time, how about considering that for posters here? The warden told me that nothing is accomplished after two weeks with an offender..except they come out angrier than before.I think that one day online is different than one day in real life. And of course that being blocked here is different than being in solitary.
What does someone have to do to get ad seg? And what happens if they come out after 14 days and do the same thing again?
> As for "coming back here", some posters are too hurt and angry to come back.
I understand, ag seg is no fun. That's why I'm glad we're discussing suggestions and solutions.
Bob
Posted by fayeroe on April 3, 2008, at 10:52:53
In reply to Re: substitute teachers, posted by Dr. Bob on April 3, 2008, at 9:03:38
> > I just thought of something, there is something at the prison called "ad seg" (administrative segregation) and it is solitary. So, they do get blocked and banned. Sometimes up to 14 days if they are really bad.
> >
> > These are FELONS, if they are only punished for such a short length of time, how about considering that for posters here? The warden told me that nothing is accomplished after two weeks with an offender..except they come out angrier than before.
>
> I think that one day online is different than one day in real life. And of course that being blocked here is different than being in solitary.How is one day online different than one day in real life? Sorrow, pain, confused, happy, angry, acting out, feeling lost, success, celebration, rejection, acceptance,fighting, stealing, etc. etc. It's all there.
>
> What does someone have to do to get ad seg? And what happens if they come out after 14 days and do the same thing again?I have a book that is divided into sections and each section deals with different infractions. For instance 25.1 (a) is refusing to come to class. The rules for the offenders are very clear cut and everyone gets a copy of "offender conduct"...
To get into "ad seg", the prisoner could be caught trafficking and trading (trading stamps, food, paper and other things that aren't suitable to describe in a "family friendly forum"), fighting, disobeying rules,stealing, lying, passing kites, etc.
However, the rules have to be broken several times before they go to solitary.
The male side is always full but the female side generally only has one or two offenders in ad seg cells. (The males fight more because there are 7 gangs in their units...crips, mexican mafia, aryan brothers, bloods, etc.) Only two gangs on the female side and they are aryan sisters and mexican mafia.
Trafficking and trading can also involve gambling on sports.
Back to ad seg, it takes alot to get in there. There are disciplinary actions such as extra work duty, no library privileges, cell isolation and no visitation with friends or relatives. Going to seg is a very serious thing. The prisoner's record (in this unit) is always taken into consideration and a Captain makes the decision.
Of course some prisoners get into trouble again after being in ad seg. There are, in every pod, people who are troubled and they act out alot. There are four units and five pods in each unit. 25 cells in each pod, with two offenders in every cell. 1000 offenders in this unit.
After three times in seg, they are shipped out to a heavy duty prison and they lose their good time that they had accumulated to get to this facility.
As I've already said, I think your blocks are too long and punish people when they don't deserve it. It isn't fair to have a block forumla that the majority of the posters doesn't understand because I think it causes mistrust and confusion here.
Just as the offenders have to trust me before we can make any headway in our relationships, the posters have to trust administration. If a prisoner is always looking at me thinking, "I wonder what she is going to pull next", I am not going to have a very happy and productive student.
AND in no way, do I consider the posters here in the same light as offenders. Being in prison and being part of Babble is definitely very different. > >
As for "coming back here", some posters are too hurt and angry to come back.
>
> I understand, ag seg is no fun. That's why I'm glad we're discussing suggestions and solutions.Just as ad seg is no fun, neither is being blocked from your "family" here. When an offender is removed from the general population, they are losing their support system .
>
> Bob
Posted by muffled on April 4, 2008, at 14:23:02
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on April 3, 2008, at 10:52:53
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 6, 2008, at 19:42:05
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on April 3, 2008, at 10:52:53
> > I think that one day online is different than one day in real life.
What I was thinking was, people only spend part of each day here, and maybe not even part of every day, so being blocked from Babble for a day wouldn't affect them like being in solitary for a day.
> I have a book that is divided into sections and each section deals with different infractions. For instance 25.1 (a) is refusing to come to class. The rules for the offenders are very clear cut and everyone gets a copy of "offender conduct"...
So everyone agrees with how infractions are handled?
> To get into "ad seg", the prisoner could be caught trafficking and trading (trading stamps, food, paper and other things that aren't suitable to describe in a "family friendly forum"), fighting, disobeying rules,stealing, lying, passing kites, etc.
>
> However, the rules have to be broken several times before they go to solitary.
>
> The male side is always full but the female side generally only has one or two offenders in ad seg cells. (The males fight more because there are 7 gangs in their units...crips, mexican mafia, aryan brothers, bloods, etc.) Only two gangs on the female side and they are aryan sisters and mexican mafia.
>
> Back to ad seg, it takes alot to get in there. There are disciplinary actions such as extra work duty, no library privileges, cell isolation and no visitation with friends or relatives. Going to seg is a very serious thing. The prisoner's record (in this unit) is always taken into consideration and a Captain makes the decision.
>
> Of course some prisoners get into trouble again after being in ad seg. There are, in every pod, people who are troubled and they act out alot.
>
> After three times in seg, they are shipped out to a heavy duty prison and they lose their good time that they had accumulated to get to this facility.Thanks for the glimpse into your world. There seem to be some similarities. And thankfully lots of differences. Including being free of gangs!
> Just as the offenders have to trust me before we can make any headway in our relationships, the posters have to trust administration. If a prisoner is always looking at me thinking, "I wonder what she is going to pull next", I am not going to have a very happy and productive student.
But some offenders do feel mistrustful of you no matter what?
> Just as ad seg is no fun, neither is being blocked from your "family" here. When an offender is removed from the general population, they are losing their support system .
I understand. Do offenders ever try to help each other stay out of ad seg? That would be a form of support.
Bob
Posted by fayeroe on April 6, 2008, at 20:46:31
In reply to Re: substitute teachers, posted by Dr. Bob on April 6, 2008, at 19:42:05
> > > I think that one day online is different than one day in real life.
>
> What I was thinking was, people only spend part of each day here, and maybe not even part of every day, so being blocked from Babble for a day wouldn't affect them like being in solitary for a day.Are you kidding me? We have no idea how different people here are affected by being blocked.But I have had some hints from people later and at times I've very sad regarding their feelings about being banned.
When was the last time you blocked someone for a day? The first time I was blocked, I was devastated and I didn't even understand the block.
This site was the ONLY support that I had to help me come off of EffexorXR....I had no one IRL that ever taken that med and they couldn't talk about it with me. The doc that prescribed it for me is the kind of person who is never wrong..you do not disagree with this fool about anything....he refused to help me taper. My pharmacist and I opened the capsules and counted the little balls. He was furious with me. I needed Babble......
In solitary, you're in a darkened cell, a steel bed and a blanket, one shower a day, one hour rec (if you aren't too dangerous)and if you are too hard to control, you get the "loaf".....everyting in the kitchen blended and then baked.....
>
> > I have a book that is divided into sections and each section deals with different infractions. For instance 25.1 (a) is refusing to come to class. The rules for the offenders are very clear cut and everyone gets a copy of "offender conduct"...
>
> So everyone agrees with how infractions are handled?They have to. Texas Department of Justice and Corrections wrote the Penal Code. I agree with the code.
>
> > To get into "ad seg", the prisoner could be caught trafficking and trading (trading stamps, food, paper and other things that aren't suitable to describe in a "family friendly forum"), fighting, disobeying rules,stealing, lying, passing kites, etc.
> >
> > However, the rules have to be broken several times before they go to solitary.
> >
> > The male side is always full but the female side generally only has one or two offenders in ad seg cells. (The males fight more because there are 7 gangs in their units...crips, mexican mafia, aryan brothers, bloods, etc.) Only two gangs on the female side and they are aryan sisters and mexican mafia.
> >
> > Back to ad seg, it takes alot to get in there. There are disciplinary actions such as extra work duty, no library privileges, cell isolation and no visitation with friends or relatives. Going to seg is a very serious thing. The prisoner's record (in this unit) is always taken into consideration and a Captain makes the decision.
> >
> > Of course some prisoners get into trouble again after being in ad seg. There are, in every pod, people who are troubled and they act out alot.
> >
> > After three times in seg, they are shipped out to a heavy duty prison and they lose their good time that they had accumulated to get to this facility.
>
> Thanks for the glimpse into your world. There seem to be some similarities. And thankfully lots of differences. Including being free of gangs!
>
> > Just as the offenders have to trust me before we can make any headway in our relationships, the posters have to trust administration. If a prisoner is always looking at me thinking, "I wonder what she is going to pull next", I am not going to have a very happy and productive student.
>
> But some offenders do feel mistrustful of you no matter what?As soon as an offender gets where I am coming from (remember firm, fair and consistent)they respect me and their attitude changes drastically.
I had a young man Friday that scared the bejesus out of me with his stare. I finally had to confront him and get him focused on his work. He wasn't upset with me, he was probably a very angry and screwed kid who would have been mad at the Pope. He is angry with himself and doesn't know how to deal with it except to act out.
>
> > Just as ad seg is no fun, neither is being blocked from your "family" here. When an offender is removed from the general population, they are losing their support system .
>
> I understand. Do offenders ever try to help each other stay out of ad seg? That would be a form of support.Again, are you kidding me? If they do cover, that is trouble for them, and usually it is only the women who do that......relationships. I am sure that the gang members help one another out when they can.
>
> Bob
Posted by muffled on April 6, 2008, at 20:47:41
In reply to Re: substitute teachers, posted by Dr. Bob on April 6, 2008, at 19:42:05
What I was thinking was, people only spend part of each day here, and maybe not even part of every day, so being blocked from Babble for a day wouldn't affect them like being in solitary for a day.
*depends on how involved one is here. If very involved it can royally f with a persons head to be blocked. SPECIALLY when they jump up in length so fast. :-( Usu blocks are 1 WEEK minimum not 1 day.
M
Posted by fayeroe on April 6, 2008, at 20:52:59
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on April 6, 2008, at 20:46:31
I've exhausted my "knowledge" about private prisons in Texas now....
I start a new job as a therapist in a town west of here on April 21....in a vocational training school.
NO MORE FELONS FOR ME!!!
Thanks for your interest in the subject of discipline (firm, fair and consistent) and being open to go along with my comparisons regarding the problems in both Babble and GEO.
I still disagree with your blocks and attitude towards posters who slip up. Hope this helps you to lighten up and move forward with the posters..........
Pat
Posted by muffled on April 7, 2008, at 20:55:35
In reply to Re: substitute teachers » fayeroe, posted by fayeroe on April 6, 2008, at 20:52:59
Was it that bad? That you had to delete it? The first one wasn't.
Why do you delete?
Why do you hurt?
Why do you ostracise?
:-(
:-(
:-(
I don't understand.
:-(
:-(
:-(
I don't understand.
My heart hurts.
M
Posted by Phillipa on April 7, 2008, at 21:14:25
In reply to I didn't get to read second post 'poof' gone :(, posted by muffled on April 7, 2008, at 20:55:35
Muffled read them both and poof gone. Maybe a blocked poster don't know. Love Phillipa
Posted by muffled on April 7, 2008, at 22:00:19
In reply to Re: I didn't get to read second post 'poof' gone :( » muffled, posted by Phillipa on April 7, 2008, at 21:14:25
still makes me sad.
Posted by fayeroe on April 8, 2008, at 5:27:24
In reply to I didn't get to read second post 'poof' gone :(, posted by muffled on April 7, 2008, at 20:55:35
> Was it that bad? That you had to delete it? The first one wasn't.
> Why do you delete?
> Why do you hurt?
> Why do you ostracise?
> :-(
> :-(
> :-(
> I don't understand.
> :-(
> :-(
> :-(
> I don't understand.
> My heart hurts.
> M
>Muffled, I got an email notification and got two error pages:
Error:
Couldn't find post 822105, sorry! Please go "back" and try again. and 07.Scratching head......
Bob, did you say something that was so shocking and tittilating (sp??, it is 5:26 a.m.a) that you dashed back and deleted it? :-)
Posted by fayeroe on April 8, 2008, at 5:29:21
In reply to Re: I didn't get to read second post 'poof' gone :( » muffled, posted by Phillipa on April 7, 2008, at 21:14:25
> Muffled read them both and poof gone. Maybe a blocked poster don't know. Love Phillipa
Let me know if I am blocked, okay? :-)
Pat
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Administration | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.