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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 60 to 84 of 129. Go back in thread:
Posted by ShelliR on March 24, 2001, at 23:33:08
In reply to foundation grants, posted by allisonm on March 24, 2001, at 22:26:53
Hi Allison. Thanks for all the work you are putting into this. There's one thing (big thing) that I don't understand. Dr. Bob said it cost him $275 a month to pay hosting. So that's 3,300 per year. What is the $66,000 dollars referring to?
Sorry if this is a really dumb question, but I got lost. shelli
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 25, 2001, at 0:50:50
In reply to Re: advertising, posted by pat123 on March 24, 2001, at 20:32:42
> Running a list takes time but I found it hard to remember everything I did to decide what I could farm out to the list assistants. So for one week I kept a list of everything I did. This really helped ID where my time was spent and what things only I could do and what others could help me with.
And what was it others could help you with, do you remember?
Bob
Posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 1:34:34
In reply to Re: advertising, posted by Dr. Bob on March 22, 2001, at 2:53:39
That was interesting, thanks. I did a search, and for 800 MB, I found 25 less expensive services. Has anyone heard of any of these?
DommelNetsolutions ($22.00)
Superior Hosting
HostGenie
1-877-Site.Com
Saturn Services
Zapgold.com
Century-Host
< snip >
wantsomegetsome.net (!)
WestHost
Computer Solutions International
IIC Internet Services
Addr.com
Christian Site Hosting.com ($273.28)James here.....
OK. I will come out of deep lurkdom to give my .02
on this one. Presently Dr Bob is on Viero, they are my first choice, they are the best USA hosting people with their own backbone. This costs. So I like the idea of moving to a cheaper
host but not the cheapest. Take a look at http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/scams/bhcom.htm
The San Fernando Valley Folklore Society's
Urban Legends Reference Pages, the da facto plaace to go to debug internet bs. Their experiences with a cheapie hosting service are
true for most. At $22.00 they say you get unlimited bandwidth but they have to cram so many
sites on one server to make money it does not happen.I would like to help by doing an analysis on some of these providers. The new job has new toys, one of them runs every min. 24/7 checking a statewide network. There is no reason I cannot also get stats on these provides, over a weeks time. I can check to see if they are up and if services like http, ftp, and dns are up. With some other toys and can do random checks of the server load. The other consideration is how well connected the host is to the internet. Veiro rocks and you pay for it. They have their own backbone and are directly connected to mea-west and mea-east. It is easy to figure out who is better connected. It also helps to host in the country you serve the most pages to. Why make your pages cross the ocean to get to most viewers ?
So, would it be possible to cut that list down some ? Off the top of my head, the $50-100 range
is reasonable; this would offer big savings
and reasonable performance. I can also ask around
about these hosting services; I would also sugest
asking several people who host with the service what they think. Some stats that I did not see on your page that would be helpful to know are total hits and bandwidth (megabytes/gigabytes a month)
for the last 3 months. (if the all time high is not in the last 3 months, that number is helpful).So, if you would like, send me a list to work from. My e-mail addy is the same.
James
Posted by allisonm on March 25, 2001, at 7:31:39
In reply to Re: foundation grants » allisonm, posted by ShelliR on March 24, 2001, at 23:33:08
Hi Shelli,
There are no dumb questions. The $66,000 would be the base that Bob would use. Call it a nest egg instead of an endowment. The nest egg is put into an account and Bob uses PART of the interest from that account to pay for his hosting costs. At the university where I work, they don't usually spend more than 6% of the interest that comes off an endowment. The rest of the interest is folded back into the endowment so that it grows. Hence, the interest grows, so even if you keep taking 6%, say, the 6% over time becomes a larger sum too. Does that make sense?Allison
Posted by allisonm on March 25, 2001, at 7:38:17
In reply to Re: advertising, posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 1:34:34
James,
This is SO cool! Thank you!
I won't say "welcome back" because I don't know what your plans are. Please know that I'm really glad to see your post.
Sincerely,
Allison
Posted by Lorraine on March 25, 2001, at 11:18:31
In reply to Re: advertising, posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 1:34:34
James: I would like to email you the spreadsheet that I did on the different low budget host providers, but I don't know your email address. My list came out different than Bob's--though I'm not sure why. One reason may be that he only included site offering 800 MG while I included site offering less if the additional charge for more space seemed reasonable. I'm leaving on vacation tonight (at midnight) and would like to send this to you before I go.
I checked out TaPir by the way and their server costs are $1100 a year--I wonder who they are using? http://www.algy.com/anxiety/VOTE/tf2001.html
Posted by Lorraine on March 25, 2001, at 11:20:28
In reply to Re: foundation grants -- Shelli, posted by allisonm on March 25, 2001, at 7:31:39
> Allison: This is great work!
Posted by Lorraine on March 25, 2001, at 11:23:03
In reply to Re: advertising, posted by Lorraine on March 24, 2001, at 19:45:03
> Take a look at TaPir's site info:
Server Costs: $1100
Total Costs: $1500They have an annual giving drive to support these costs
Posted by pat123 on March 25, 2001, at 12:09:55
In reply to Re: what others could help me with, posted by Dr. Bob on March 25, 2001, at 0:50:50
> And what was it others could help you with, do you remember?
>
> BobAnswering e-mail, questions, questions, questions
from list people. This was a list serv to there were unsub/sub problems and bounced mail. I let the list assistants remind folks about the subjects we did not dscuss, per the FAQ, this was a constant battle as we did not discuss religion. converting docs to HTML and doing basic web work. It was nice to have a group of people who I could ger support from and bounce ideas off of. I could leave the list in their hands and take a holiday.
\Pat
Posted by Cam W. on March 25, 2001, at 12:42:43
In reply to Re: advertising, posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 1:34:34
Welcome back, dude!
Posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 12:50:57
In reply to Re: advertising James, posted by Lorraine on March 25, 2001, at 11:18:31
> James: I would like to email you the spreadsheet that I did on the different low budget host providers, but I don't know your email address.
Send the list if you would like. I do not have time to research long lists, as I said if I can get a shorter list I will be glad to research. I cannot decide if a hosting service meets dr bobs needs, I don't know his needs and stats. Once I get a list of hosts dr bob (or whoever) wants me to research I can start but work is not going to be happy if I spent too much time using their equipment, time they pay me for, and bandwidth they pay for looking at lots of hosts. Please review what snopes has to say about cheap hosts.
James
Posted by ShelliR on March 25, 2001, at 13:23:01
In reply to Re: foundation grants -- Shelli, posted by allisonm on March 25, 2001, at 7:31:39
Thanks Allison. Yes, it does make sense. I'm used to gov't research grants and they are totally spelled out for you in terms of how the money gets spent and how long the contract is. This is much better. Shelli
Posted by Lorraine on March 25, 2001, at 16:25:34
In reply to Re: advertising James, posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 12:50:57
{Send the list if you would like. I do not have time to research long lists, as I said if I can get a shorter list I will be glad to research.}
James: I'm leaving on vacation tonight at midnight so I can't really do anymore on this until I am back. I wonder if there is someone on the board who can "eye-ball" the list (which has 23 vendors on it) and say ok let's look at these 5. At any rate, better for you to have the list than not and if it doesn't more while I'm on vacation then I can turn my attention to trying to narrow it down to a more manageable list. I'm not the best person for the job as I have no expertise here, but to a certain extent research is research. I'll be back in two weeks. Meanwhile, I'll send you the list so you have it.
{I cannot decide if a hosting service meets dr bobs needs, I don't know his needs and stats. }
I've emailed the list to dr. bob as well with all the footnotes indicating the services provided. Perhaps he can take a look at the list first and weed out those that don't meet his needs.
Once I get a list of hosts dr bob (or whoever) wants me to research I can start but work is not going to be happy if I spent too much time using their equipment, time they pay me for, and bandwidth they pay for looking at lots of hosts.
I hear you. I have time but no expertise. I'll be back in two weeks.
{Please review what snopes has to say about cheap hosts.}
I'll be happy to do this when I get back. If someone else with more experience in host providers on the board is willing to jump into the frey in my absence, that would be great. (They could get the list from you or dr. bob.).
>
>
>
> James
Posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 17:49:15
In reply to Re: advertising James, posted by Lorraine on March 25, 2001, at 16:25:34
James: I'm leaving on vacation tonight at midnight so I can't really do anymore on this until I am back. I wonder if there is someone on the board who can "eye-ball" the list (which has 23 vendors on it) and say ok let's look at these 5. At any rate, better for you to have the list than not and if it doesn't more while I'm on vacation then I can turn my attention to trying to narrow it down to a more manageable list. I'm not the best person for the job as I have no expertise here, but to a certain extent research is research. I'll be back in two weeks. Meanwhile, I'll send you the list so you have it.
I would be happy with a list of 10-15. I really think it is important not to go with the cheapest
as these people will not serve a busy web page well. If you get a hundered or less hits a day they are a bargin. Again, the $50-100 a month is
a good place to start. I think it is better to decide what the needs are and what you can afford. Using this critera making a list is a no brainer, then go shopping for a host that can meet these needs and cost. From there I can provide y'all info on how busy and stable these hosts are.I also wait to see what Dr Bob has to say.
James
Posted by Lorraine on March 25, 2001, at 19:10:26
In reply to Re: advertising James, posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 17:49:15
James:
Thought about what you wrote and revisited the list. Eliminated those that had hit or access charges. Then there were 11. Eliminated those with unlimited access. Then there were 3. Eliminated the cheapest. Then there were 2. Only Saturn Services and Host Genie were left standing at the end of the day. So forget the list I sent you and dr. bob earlier--only the two left standing deserve consideration.
The other thought would be to identify quality vendors that provide a discount to non-profits. Budgetweb.com allows you to specify "discount for non-profits" in your search. This would yield a different list from which a higher end host provider could be selected that offers a discount.
Posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 20:36:30
In reply to Re: advertising Dr. Bob; James, posted by Lorraine on March 25, 2001, at 19:10:26
Then there were 2. Only Saturn Services and Host Genie were left standing at the end of the day. So forget the list I sent you and dr. bob earlier--only the two left standing deserve consideration.
>Great, i will start looking into these Monday straight away.
james
Posted by pat123 on March 26, 2001, at 10:51:04
In reply to Re: advertising Dr. Bob; James, posted by Lorraine on March 25, 2001, at 19:10:26
> James:
>
> Thought about what you wrote and revisited the list. Eliminated those that had hit or access charges. Then there were 11.OK, new plan. My Jeep is fixed so I can get home
where I can work. I have not been home in a month.
So I can offer to do more in the help to find a host. I will try to come up with a list of hosts
I think will work and then we can discuss.James, a/k/a Pat123
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 27, 2001, at 0:39:26
In reply to Re: advertising, posted by stjames on March 25, 2001, at 1:34:34
> I would like to help by doing an analysis on some of these providers.
That would be great, thanks!
> So, would it be possible to cut that list down some ? Off the top of my head, the $50-100 range
> is reasonable; this would offer big savings
> and reasonable performance. I can also ask around
> about these hosting services; I would also sugest
> asking several people who host with the service what they think.Here's my list again, with prices for each one. You can decide better than I which ones to look into:
DommelNetsolutions 22
Superior Hosting 35
HostGenie 48
1-877-Site.Com 52
Saturn Services 56
Zapgold.com 56
Century-Host 56
OChosting.com 57
1 Web Please 80
Digitalsea.net 110
DTS-NET 159
Jumpline 165
Hostview.com 167
Our Virtual Mall And Web Hosting 170
WebWrite Productions 171
Schogini Systems 178
Maikon 180
HiChina.com 199
Dreamhost Strictly Business 213
wantsomegetsome.net (!) 217
WestHost 223
Computer Solutions International 230
IIC Internet Services 239
Addr.com 266
Christian Site Hosting.com 273Please, however, take into account, if you can, the quality of their support. I can call Verio, I can email Verio, Verio has a ton of help on their site:
http://vps.verio.com/support/virtual/freebsd.html
And they make installing a statistics program as easy as:
% vinstall webalizer
% rehash> Some stats that I did not see on your page that would be helpful to know are total hits and bandwidth (megabytes/gigabytes a month) for the last 3 months.
Guess what? I have this new statistics program! :-) You can click on the month to get details:
So far this month (ie, up until 25-Mar-2001 05:51 CST):
Total Hits: 1,528,225
Total KBytes: 20,770,392It's probably bad luck, but since this has come up, I'm hoping Psycho-Babble will hit a million pages served this month. :-)
Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 27, 2001, at 1:06:30
In reply to Re: what others could help me with, posted by pat123 on March 25, 2001, at 12:09:55
> > And what was it others could help you with, do you remember?
>
> Answering e-mail, questions, questions, questions from list people. This was a list serv to there were unsub/sub problems and bounced mail.The registration questions that involve passwords and unposted email addresses I think I'm going to need to keep taking care of myself. The rest I suppose I could ask to be posted here. But it's not like there's tons of either. But every little bit would help.
> I let the list assistants remind folks about the subjects we did not dscuss, per the FAQ, this was a constant battle as we did not discuss religion.
I'm not sure I could delegate being the civility cop, either...
> converting docs to HTML and doing basic web work.
I'm not sure what you mean by "basic web work", but the really basic work here is all handled automatically by scripts. Thank goodness!
> It was nice to have a group of people who I could ger support from and bounce ideas off of. I could leave the list in their hands and take a holiday.
I get a lot of support right here, and ideas bouncing back to me, too. :-) But I take a laptop with me on holidays...
Bob
Posted by stjames on March 27, 2001, at 12:43:48
In reply to Re: what others could help me with, posted by Dr. Bob on March 27, 2001, at 1:06:30
> > I let the list assistants remind folks about the subjects we did not dscuss, per the FAQ, this was a constant battle as we did not discuss religion.
>
> I'm not sure I could delegate being the civility cop, either...Correct, I just had assistants inform folks that
the FAQ says we do not discuss. I was the only one who was a "civility cop". The assistants also
helped people who did things like post the entire
original in their reply or other nubie things. The key words for the assistants were be nice and friendly, if someone was being unreasonable I delt with this. Only I took and gave the heat; the assistants really liked this !James
Posted by stjames on March 27, 2001, at 21:33:14
In reply to Re: evaluating web hosting options, posted by Dr. Bob on March 27, 2001, at 0:39:26
> So far this month (ie, up until 25-Mar-2001 05:51 CST):
>
> Total Hits: 1,528,225
> Total KBytes: 20,770,392
>James here....
Wow ! Just to make sure, is this really 20.77 gigabytes ?
james
Posted by jb on March 29, 2001, at 1:23:36
In reply to Re: what others could help me with, posted by Dr. Bob on March 27, 2001, at 1:06:30
General advertising dollars are down, definitely, but I targeted dollars are actually up. Fewer advertisers are willing to pay Yahoo to host their site, as the click-through rate is horendously low, not to mention subsequent purchase rate. The problem is mainly with the general appeal websites, not a targeted site, such as this. Actually, Psychobabble is actually a very, very targeted site and, therefore, a marketers dream. Further, there is a potential to offer genuine benefit to users, as well as generate income for site maintenance and Dr. Bob's services. Some things which come to mind might be United States mail-order pharmacists (not the overseas stuff). A number already have websites, but they don't market themselves very well. Many PsychoBabble users could receive substantial benefit from lower cost prescription meds which their health insurers may not cover. Bookstores, such as Amazon, Borders, and Barnes & Noble are all other great ideas others have mentioned. Pharmaceutical companies may also be interested, somewhat in the same vein (excuse the pun)as their radio and tv dollars directed at the general public. Just think of the ad dollars we've all seen spent on Paxil. Also, I think there are ways to accomplish this while showing good taste and not detracting from users' experiences. That is, we should look for synergism among PsychoBabble and commercial interests.
I think the bottom line (another pun) is none of us should expect this excellent service to continue, indefinitely, without compensation from either ourselves, the users, or, something which I think we prefer, someone else. I think that someone else could be commercial interests or the government. And, I don't believe the Bush government is likely to ante up anytime soon.
JB
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 29, 2001, at 11:03:52
In reply to Re: A thought from a career Marketer, posted by jb on March 29, 2001, at 1:23:36
> Some things which come to mind might be United States mail-order pharmacists (not the overseas stuff). A number already have websites, but they don't market themselves very well. Many PsychoBabble users could receive substantial benefit from lower cost prescription meds which their health insurers may not cover.
> we should look for synergism among PsychoBabble and commercial interests.
There's an idea! I had thought about drug companies, but not pharmacies... Is this something you could look into for me? :-)
Bob
Posted by ShelliR on March 29, 2001, at 11:46:15
In reply to Re: mail-order pharmacies, posted by Dr. Bob on March 29, 2001, at 11:03:52
I know this probably is not the final answer, but until something else is in place, why not try a pledge week. Pick a week in April (not Easter week) and announce, perhaps in red, that this is pledge week.
Make membership $25, but all donations are accepted. If you are able to set up a credit card service to pay, that would be great. If not have people sign up and then send a check. Spell out how for a $25 pledge, it is only costing about 14 cents a day for a membership.Each day, change the number of days left to pledge--i.e. six more days to pledge.....and announce how many people have pledged--the announcement of pledges seems to stimulate new pledges. You might even set up a goal--I think it gets everyone united to try to reach a goal.I think it whould bring in some money now, so why not try?
Shelli
Posted by stjames on March 29, 2001, at 12:34:53
In reply to Re: mail-order pharmacies, posted by Dr. Bob on March 29, 2001, at 11:03:52
> There's an idea! I had thought about drug companies, but not pharmacies... Is this something you could look into for me? :-)
>
> BobJames here....
Hmm... the overseas pharmacies that don't require a script are of questionable legality (for the user). This would open liability issues, what happ-ens if someone is busted ? Is Br. Bob also on the hook for this. Even if you do have a script
and go overseas it is a grey legal area.How about US mail order pharmacies ? This would be legal (100%) and offer a savings to us.
Contacting the drug companies is a great idea; they are already advertising to users and this board is very targeted for them.
james
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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