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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Chris O on February 28, 2014, at 12:18:28
http://www.telegram.com/article/20140221/NEWS/302219769/1052/rss01&source=rss
This article floored me. It basically says that entire generic drug market has been untested until the last year. It's one thing to read this sort of thing on websites like mercola.com, but it's another when the FDA openly admits "before this year, we didn't have the money for that [testing generics]." So, let me get this straight: Millions of us have been using generic drugs for the past 15 years, and the FDA has not even tested these drugs? To boot, many of the drugs are made in China and India, whose "quality control" standards certainly redefine the meaning of that phrase. The information regarding "widespread impurities" in the Lipitor made "outside the US," the heart failure drug made in India that didn't work, and the Wellbutrin XL generic that "didn't work as well as the original," are incredibly worrying. It certainly makes me ponder the period of my life from 2008-2012, when I took successive SSRI and SNRI drugs, all in high doses, none of which seemed to have any effect on me, including side effects. This compares to the period 1998-2000, when I took non-generic Prozac, Celexa, and Wellbutrin, all of which worked (though not as well as I would have liked) and had easily determinable side effects. I know there a lot of babblers who are getting effective relief with their meds. But even if you are, isn't it incredibly disturbing to think that many of the drugs we take are not tested in any way, that pure profit (not medical altruism) is the primary motivation for their production, and that our government essentially admits that they have done little or nothing about it. I could go on, but what do others think about this? And were people here aware that most generics were not tested?
Chris
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on February 28, 2014, at 16:18:34
In reply to Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs', posted by Chris O on February 28, 2014, at 12:18:28
India has built supersonic jet fighters, a thermonuclear bomb, and sent a rocket to the moon - do you really beleive that they cant formulate 50mg of substance x into a pill and package it?
Posted by Chris O on February 28, 2014, at 16:50:50
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs', posted by jono_in_adelaide on February 28, 2014, at 16:18:34
Well, when you put it that way, it makes me feel that it is my anxiety disorder talking when I react to articles like this. On the other hand, I don't think it's unreasonable (despite my anxiety disorder) to be disturbed by the fact that the FDA has basically allowed the generic drug industry to be run totally by the market. I do not have faith that corporations will always err in favor of public safety when their only motive is profit. If that were the case, most drugs would be produced in the United States, at well monitored facilities, where all employees were paid a decent wage.
Posted by Phillipa on February 28, 2014, at 17:24:42
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs' » jono_in_adelaide, posted by Chris O on February 28, 2014, at 16:50:50
Chris isn't this why it's advised not to import any meds from foreign countries as they are not FDA approved. I bet that is why the meds I take do nothing. I do buy brand Lexapro but never ventured past 5mg? Always depended on the luvox (fluvoxamine). It sure worked when it was made by Solvay. I had gotten a similar article in my RN newsletter a while back. Now I need to read the FDA one. And thanks for posting this as applies to all generics for all conditions correct? Phillipa
Posted by Willful on February 28, 2014, at 17:29:44
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs' » jono_in_adelaide, posted by Chris O on February 28, 2014, at 16:50:50
I don't think it's unreasonable at all-- and it's very clear that despite their other technological advances neither of these countries has meaningful quality control or regulaton of factories.
How else do you explain the terrible fires in several Indian factories that killed many workers, the milk from China that poisoned babies-- before that the bad melatonin, that killed a couple of people?
I personally think many of the generics are substandard. For one thing, you can't cut them correctly into pieces, as you could the original drug. They often crumble or are so hard that the force required to cut them can only be used for relatively larger cuts. Since I cut several pills into quarters, and the generic pill is very small and hard, this is a big problem for me. I object to having to take twice as much of a drug, in one case an atypical anti-psychotic, as I need.
So no, unfortunately, I don't think this is your anxiety disorder. There is clearly reason to be concerned. I hope the FDA does real, fullscale testing and imposes greater regulations on the generic market, particularly since many insurance companies, mine included, have a significant penalty for buying non-generics.
Posted by Phillipa on February 28, 2014, at 18:20:04
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs', posted by Willful on February 28, 2014, at 17:29:44
Can you just pay cash and not go through them? Medicaire did give me a lower rate on the Lexapro brand?
Posted by Chris O on February 28, 2014, at 19:30:01
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs', posted by Willful on February 28, 2014, at 17:29:44
Willful:
Thanks for the support, Willful! I really appreciate it. I think what confuses me the most is that no one around me seems disturbed or outraged by this information. And, I'm glad of that in a way, because I am so codependent that it is only others' stability that keeps me in tact on many days. I am always looking at the behavior and reactions of others to determine whether or not everything is "okay in the world." But how can the whole country not be up in arms over the fact that millions of drugs they take everyday are produced in countries that have little, if any, quality control? It shocks me that people who are far more functional than I am are not protesting at the Capitol over this issue. It has definitely motivated me to write one of my (no doubt) form=letter-answered emails to the White House and my state representatives. But what of this world of global capitalism we currently live in? It appears that those with the most unfathomable levels of money and power (under the guise of corporate personhood) can get away with the worst types of unethical practices with no consequences at all. I know that sounds like a broken record, but to see it happening so rankly, and our government admitting it so shamelessly, that just takes it to a whole another level.
Chris
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on March 1, 2014, at 4:46:23
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs' » Willful, posted by Chris O on February 28, 2014, at 19:30:01
If yoiu buy some drugs off of a market barrow in Calcutta, then yes, I'd be suspicious of the quality, if you brought drugs in the US that have come from one of Ciplas export plants, I think its as safe as a generic drug made in (God Bless) America
I have never had a problem with Indian generics, Indian antibiotics cured my tonsillitis, Indian tylenol got rid of my headache and Indian risperidone helps me feel all round better
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 1, 2014, at 10:50:44
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs', posted by jono_in_adelaide on March 1, 2014, at 4:46:23
>I have never had a problem with Indian generics, Indian antibiotics cured my tonsillitis, Indian tylenol got rid of my headache and Indian risperidone helps me feel all round better.
Most problems (recalls etc) of Indian generics are repeatedly from the same few manufacturers. Ranbaxy is the worst offender here. Wockhardt have also had numerous recalls. There are many other Indian manufacturers that have few or no recalls. Where there is a choice, I would avoid Ranbaxy.
Interestingly, some branded pharmaceutical companies have their products produced by Indian contract manufacturers.
Posted by Chris O on March 1, 2014, at 11:51:07
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs' » jono_in_adelaide, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 1, 2014, at 10:50:44
Hey, Ed:
Thanks for that information. Really interesting. Do you have any idea which antidepressants (or other psychopharmaceuticals) Ranbaxy and Wockhardt produce? Just curious. I wasn't even aware that many generics were produced in India or China until reading this article.
Thanks,
Chris
Posted by bleauberry on March 1, 2014, at 11:52:50
In reply to Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs', posted by Chris O on February 28, 2014, at 12:18:28
I've been screaming about this from the roof tops for quite a while.
Don't get too excited with testing though. That's because the requirements generics must satisfy are less strict than brand, and somewhere in there is hidden the reason we often hear of people saying their generic did not work as well, or at all, compared to brand. Testing won't change those loose standards. It will only verify that they are within the loose guidelines.
Not to bash generics, once in a while they are better than brand. Usually the complaints are the opposite though.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 1, 2014, at 12:40:35
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs' » ed_uk2010, posted by Chris O on March 1, 2014, at 11:51:07
>Do you have any idea which antidepressants (or other psychopharmaceuticals) Ranbaxy and Wockhardt produce?
I don't know about the US. In the UK, psycho-pharmaceuticals sold be Wockhardt are amitriptyline, diazepam, fluoxetine, risperidone and venlafaxine, although some of these products are currently unavailable following a recall. Ranbaxy do not sell many psych drugs here, they mainly supply cardiovascular drugs and antibiotics.
Posted by Chris O on March 1, 2014, at 15:00:04
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs' » Chris O, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 1, 2014, at 12:40:35
Ed:
Wow, that's quite the list. I hadn't realized Elavil, Valium, Prozac, Risperdal, and Effexor had been recalled. I was looking at the FDA website (and all over the Internet), and it's hard to find information about any of this. How comforting. I love being a lab rat.
Chris
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 2, 2014, at 4:44:33
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs' » ed_uk2010, posted by Chris O on March 1, 2014, at 15:00:04
>Wow, that's quite the list. I hadn't realized Elavil, Valium, Prozac, Risperdal,and Effexor had been recalled. I was looking at the FDA website (and all over the Internet), and it's hard to find information about any of this.
Hi Chris. They haven't all been recalled, that was just a list of the psych meds sold by Wockhardt in the UK. Out of that list, only risperidone (Wockhardt) was recalled. The recall also included a variety of non-psych meds produced at the same facility. You might not find information about it on the FDA website because the recall was carried out by the MHRA in the UK. Different ranges of generics are sold in different countries.
It was a precautionary recall. Testing of the risperidone tablets did not demonstrate any problems, but the factory where they were produced had some failings in good manufacturing practice standards. I believe an issue was identified with ventilation and air flow in the manufacturing areas.
The risperidone was recalled from wholesalers and pharmacies, but not from patients, since the MHRA's analysis of the tablets met specifications.
Branded drugs also get recalled from time to time. For example, Pfizer's Ativan injections were recently recalled in the UK due to glass fragments in some of the vials.
Posted by Chris O on March 2, 2014, at 12:07:21
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs' » Chris O, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 2, 2014, at 4:44:33
"Glass fragments"? Good lord!
Thanks, Ed! You're awesome.
Chris
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 2, 2014, at 12:41:20
In reply to Re: Article on FDA's 'first testing of generic drugs' » ed_uk2010, posted by Chris O on March 2, 2014, at 12:07:21
> "Glass fragments"? Good lord!
>
> Thanks, Ed! You're awesome.
>
> ChrisYeah, there were some reports of nurses finding tiny glass fragments in the vials. There weren't many reports but it was enough to lead to a massive recall, which created a shortage since there are no generic versions of lorazepam injection in the UK. Other benzodiazepine injections had to be prescribed instead.
This is the end of the thread.
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