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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 34. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 4:18:43
I have an old school friend who has never been quite normal, even as kids he was something of a hypochondriac, and since we left school in 1988, he has been in paid employment for about a months, always having some physical ailment that has prevented him from working.
In the last 2 years it has gotten worse, he has developed bizarre neurological symptoms which have suggested MS, myasthenia gravitas and a heap of other diseases, and atm, he is having his wife push him around in a wheel chair, and speaks like he is mentally retarded.
Thing is, he has seen 5 neurologists, including the professor of neurology at our main university medical school, had CT, MRI and PET scans and every imaginable test, and none of them can find anything wrong with him physically. (Its actually rather like the prodromal phase of the girls illness in The Exorcist!)
None of tem have suggested conversion hysteria (although they have all suggested that he needs psychiatric treatment), but I'm wondering whether I should suggest it to his wife (who is an RN)
He seems to have taken every antidepressant and anxiolytic drug on the market over the years, and none have gotten him better
Any thoughts?
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 4:26:24
In reply to Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 4:18:43
Oh, I think his wife is some sort of enabeler (surely an RN cant have been totally fooled by all of this)
Also, he has seen all 5 neuros independent of one another - when one tells him there is nothing wrong,and that he needs psychiatric advice, he stops going and finds another one to go to.
Posted by vbs on January 12, 2014, at 4:52:12
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 4:26:24
Sounds like he needs to be hospitalized.
Posted by SLS on January 12, 2014, at 5:15:59
In reply to Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 4:18:43
Somatization?
This thing tends to get worse over time. It is quite real and not simply an excuse to see a doctor.
I wish I could remember the name of a former poster who had somatization. He was very well informed and did a great job of describing his symptoms and treatment.
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on January 12, 2014, at 9:10:32
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now) » jono_in_adelaide, posted by SLS on January 12, 2014, at 5:15:59
Scott was it Jay? xibow sp? He said OCD but sounded a bit like this. And Jono how did you know I'd been thinking of you? There is a thread on nardil that I thought you could answer. Phillipa
Posted by SLS on January 12, 2014, at 12:45:07
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now) » SLS, posted by Phillipa on January 12, 2014, at 9:10:32
> Scott was it Jay? xibow sp? He said OCD but sounded a bit like this. And Jono how did you know I'd been thinking of you? There is a thread on nardil that I thought you could answer. Phillipa
Thanks, Phillipa. I think it was xibow.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on January 12, 2014, at 12:56:06
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now) » Phillipa, posted by SLS on January 12, 2014, at 12:45:07
> > Scott was it Jay? xibow sp? He said OCD but sounded a bit like this. And Jono how did you know I'd been thinking of you? There is a thread on nardil that I thought you could answer. Phillipa
>
> Thanks, Phillipa. I think it was xibow.
Poster: yxibow
- Scott
Posted by alexandra_k on January 12, 2014, at 13:46:41
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 4:26:24
maybe she needs someone to look after.
personally... i wouldn't mention it to them, no.
when neurology can't find an answer the standard thing for them to think is 'well then, it must be psychiatric'. i'd be fairly sure (i'd be almost certain) that it would have been suggested to them that it is psychiatric and that they would have been given psychiatric referral whether they chose to follow it up... or not...
to the best of my knowledge nobody went 'oh it is psychiatric' and was thereby cured. or even helped particularly much.
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 17:12:30
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by alexandra_k on January 12, 2014, at 13:46:41
I guess my hope is/was that if he could be convinced that doesnt have an organic disease, and started to work hard with a psychiatrist, he might eventually get to the bottom of why he is like this, and begin t live the life ha has wasted for the past 2 decades - maybe thats a forlorn hope?
Posted by alexandra_k on January 12, 2014, at 19:23:58
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 17:12:30
> I guess my hope is/was that if he could be convinced that doesnt have an organic disease, and started to work hard with a psychiatrist, he might eventually get to the bottom of why he is like this, and begin t live the life ha has wasted for the past 2 decades - maybe thats a forlorn hope?
I guess the first step is for one or the other (or probably both) of them to take that step to see a psychiatrist.
The thing is... I'd be fairly sure (almost certain) that this would have been something that a neurologist (at the very least) would have suggested and tried to encourage them to do.
Depending on how well you know them etc etc... You probably could introduce the idea subtly... Something about how it must be really distressing to be so unwell. How sometimes talking to a psychiatrist (or a psychologist or whatever) can help.
This isn't to suggest that the cause of the physical problem is psychiatric, you see, but rather to suggest that some suffering could be alleviated by talking to someone...
But then the issue becomes... Is this true? Sometimes psychiatrists / psychologists / whatever can indeed be helpful. But really, in my own personal experience, the significant majority are actually harmful. The opposite of helpful. So... Really... Without being able to reccommend a particular person who might actually be helpful for one or the other or both of them to talk to...
It is unclear to me how helpful the suggestion would be.
It seems to me.
fwiw.
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 21:13:55
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by alexandra_k on January 12, 2014, at 19:23:58
Oh, yes, all of the 5 neuros have ended up suggesting he seeks psychatric treatment - thats generaly when he leaves, finds a new one, and starts another round of CT's, MRI's, nerve conduction studys, complete blood pictures etc
I was thinking that if i could introduct the idea of conversion hysteria, and that he and/or his wife could both read it, and se how closely it fits him, it might give them more reason to actualy see a psychiatrist and stick with him, and work hard at what he suggests.
I dont hold out much hope - I think he has spend so long in the role of an invalid, using this non existant illness as an excuse for his every failiure in life, that the pattern would be extremely hard to break.
I think a good start would be some tought love - sit him in a chair, with food and water on the other side of the room, alone, and instead of his wife pushing him to the table in a wheelchair, let him get hungry enough that he gets there under his own locomotion.
I should porbably just give up, but he's my oldest friend, and its damned hard to see him like this
Posted by Phillipa on January 12, 2014, at 21:41:35
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by SLS on January 12, 2014, at 12:56:06
Scott I do hope he's doing well now. We used to write. Jay if you are lurking please reply. Phillipa
Posted by alexandra_k on January 13, 2014, at 4:12:01
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 21:13:55
I don't know if a good talking to ever managed to cure a case of conversion hysteria any more than it ever managed to cure a case of depression...
It is possible that the issue lies more with her than with him, too.
I don't know... If I had a friend in this sort of a position I guess I'd just try and be a friend to them as best I can. Let them know I'm there if they want to talk or whatever. I don't know.
Posted by SLS on January 13, 2014, at 5:27:00
In reply to Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 4:18:43
It is probably best to remove the word "hysteria"? It is too sexist. If one adheres to DSM IV nomenclature, "conversion disorder" is used to describe this. I understand that the DSM V has removed this diagnosis and those of the other somatoform disorders in favor of "Somatic Symptom Disorder" (SSD)
Hypochondriasis?
It is probably best to suggest that you are concerned that your friend might have a "somatoform disorder" of some sort. Conversion disorder is a type of somatoform disorder which presents as a loss of one or more senses (blindness, hearing loss, numbness, etc.), and even paralysis. I don't know much about the etiology of somatization except that it is very real to the sufferer. I wouldn't be surprised if it is found that the origin of the somatic sensations is actually a brain dysfunction that develops over time as a function of psychological or physical stress.
I agree with Alexandra_K's suggestion that someone with a somatoform disorder be given unconditional emotional support. Sometimes, the most that can be done is to have a professional help the patient to acknowledge and manage symptoms.
- Scott
Posted by alexandra_k on January 13, 2014, at 14:00:51
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now) » jono_in_adelaide, posted by SLS on January 13, 2014, at 5:27:00
sometimes religion works. miracle cures and all that.
Posted by HomelyCygnet on January 13, 2014, at 14:10:21
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 12, 2014, at 21:13:55
Sounds like SLS. Do you think if they took away his "disability" and subsidised apt he would get off his butt and get a job?
Actually it sounds like Alex too. Would tough love work for her?
I suppose it's partly society's fault but it's sad to see these two settle for a life as parasite.
>
> I dont hold out much hope - I think he has spend so long in the role of an invalid, using this non existant illness as an excuse for his every failiure in life, that the pattern would be extremely hard to break.
>
> I think a good start would be some tought love - sit him in a chair, with food and water on the other side of the room, alone, and instead of his wife pushing him to the table in a wheelchair, let him get hungry enough that he gets there under his own locomotion.
>
> I should porbably just give up, but he's my oldest friend, and its damned hard to see him like this
Posted by SLS on January 13, 2014, at 15:10:40
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by HomelyCygnet on January 13, 2014, at 14:10:21
> Sounds like SLS. Do you think if they took away his "disability" and subsidised apt he would get off his butt and get a job?
> Actually it sounds like Alex too. Would tough love work for her?
> I suppose it's partly society's fault but it's sad to see these two settle for a life as parasite.
I'm sorry, HomelyCygnet. I don't know how do react to these comments in words, as I am conflicted. You are becoming a very pitiable character. Your words betray your increasing mental instability. Some would call it a meltdown. Others would call it decompensation. I don't know what to call it. How do you refer to your sickness? It would help people to understand the pathology that impels you to say such things.
You really do need to be here... And you are! Yay! :-)
How can the Psycho-Babble community help you to feel better about yourself?
- Scott
Posted by HomelyCygnet on January 13, 2014, at 15:15:24
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now) » HomelyCygnet, posted by SLS on January 13, 2014, at 15:10:40
Your new personality is funnier that the last one. It's sad that you see all the pain and passion in the world as illness. I don't like you but I pity you.
Posted by SLS on January 13, 2014, at 15:41:24
In reply to LOL Scottie I predicted that response! » SLS, posted by HomelyCygnet on January 13, 2014, at 15:15:24
Posted by SLS on January 13, 2014, at 16:04:44
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now) » HomelyCygnet, posted by SLS on January 13, 2014, at 15:10:40
> > Sounds like SLS.
"You are becoming a very pitiable character."
This is an uncivil statement, and I apologize for writing it.
And I'm not just saying that.
- Scott
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 13, 2014, at 16:51:22
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by SLS on January 13, 2014, at 16:04:44
Thanks for the input guys!
Posted by Phillipa on January 13, 2014, at 21:18:31
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 13, 2014, at 16:51:22
Jono is it possible that my loss of taste & smell could be conversion disorder too? Phillipa
Posted by HomelyCygnet on January 14, 2014, at 10:22:09
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now) » jono_in_adelaide, posted by Phillipa on January 13, 2014, at 21:18:31
> Jono is it possible that my loss of taste & smell could be conversion disorder too? Phillipa
Have you ever tried hypnosis for your loss of taste and smell? They used that for conversion disorders back in the 19th century. I'd say the odds were against it tho.
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 15, 2014, at 0:21:35
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now) » Phillipa, posted by HomelyCygnet on January 14, 2014, at 10:22:09
Phillipa, I dont think so, you seem to have way too much insignt into your illness for it to be that
Have you ever tried a course of zinc supplements (Twinlab make a good zinc picolinate supplement that sells for less than $10 for 100 on Vitacost)
I know its a long shot, but it might be worth a try
Posted by Phillipa on January 15, 2014, at 21:11:03
In reply to Re: Conversion Hysteria (or whatever they call it now), posted by jono_in_adelaide on January 15, 2014, at 0:21:35
Jono that is what my dentist said. Evidently now there are a form of Dentists that can also deal with this which is new. Dentist said l00mg twice a day? Would you? Phillipa
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