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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by joe schmoe on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:45
In reply to Lou's response-psumperspktv » gadchik, posted by Lou PIlder on February 25, 2013, at 16:24:46
>
> You see, benzene is a substance that can cause cancer. And it has been used in mass-murder. A lot of the drugs promoted here have s one of their chemical constituants, benzene.
> Now I think that if you knew what I know about benzene, you could make a more-informed decision as to take drugs that have benzene in their chemical composition.
Lou,Go go Wikipedia and look up serotonin, or dopamine, or norephinephrine. Look at the chemical structures for them. You will see all of them contain a benzene ring, like clonazepam. And they are made by the human body. You would die without them. They don't cause cancer.
Benzene rings are not the same thing as benzene by itself. Please stop the scare disinformation.
Posted by joe schmoe on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:46
In reply to , posted by on December 31, 1969, at 18:00:00
> > Friends,
> If you have doubts concerning chemicals in mind-altering drugs effecting one's nervous system and organs when in the chemical structure of psychotropic drugs giver by a psychiatrist/doctor, I am requesting that you read the following.
> lou
> To see this article:
> A. Bring up Google
> B. Type in:
> [FDA approves diet pill containing toxic Benzene]
>
I did.
The drug in question is Lorcaserin (Belviq).
It does not contain benzene. It has a benzene ring as part of its chemical structure, which is entirely different. Equating the two is like equating oxygen gas (essential to life) with an oxygen radical (very damaging to tissue) because O2 is made up of two O's.
Please stop the scare disinformation.
Posted by gadchik on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:46
In reply to , posted by on December 31, 1969, at 18:00:00
Thanks for clearing that up about benzene. I just cant think of more to worry about,and you helped me by giving that info:)
Posted by Lou PIlder on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:47
In reply to , posted by on December 31, 1969, at 18:00:00
> >
> > You see, benzene is a substance that can cause cancer. And it has been used in mass-murder. A lot of the drugs promoted here have s one of their chemical constituants, benzene.
> > Now I think that if you knew what I know about benzene, you could make a more-informed decision as to take drugs that have benzene in their chemical composition.
>
>
> Lou,
>
> Go go Wikipedia and look up serotonin, or dopamine, or norephinephrine. Look at the chemical structures for them. You will see all of them contain a benzene ring, like clonazepam. And they are made by the human body. You would die without them. They don't cause cancer.
>
> Benzene rings are not the same thing as benzene by itself. Please stop the scare disinformation.
>
> J_S
You wrote,[...benzene rings are not the same thing as benzene by itself...].
Really? If you could post answers to the following, then I could have the opportunity to respond accordingly.
A. Where did the benzene rings come from?
B. If they came from benzene, what is left out if the rings are different from benzene itself?
C. Is not the chemical structure of benzene in a ring configuration?
Lou
Posted by Phillipa on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:47
In reply to , posted by on December 31, 1969, at 18:00:00
Lou did you ever try klonopin? I did. But for me valium, xanax, or ativan work better. Phillipa
Posted by joe schmoe on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:47
In reply to , posted by on December 31, 1969, at 18:00:00
> > J_S
> You wrote,[...benzene rings are not the same thing as benzene by itself...].
> Really? If you could post answers to the following, then I could have the opportunity to respond accordingly.
> A. Where did the benzene rings come from?
> B. If they came from benzene, what is left out if the rings are different from benzene itself?
> C. Is not the chemical structure of benzene in a ring configuration?
> Lou
Benzene rings are very common and are found in an enormous number of chemicals, including amino acids. Serotonin for example is made from tryptophan, an amino acid. Both contain benzene rings and are synthesized by living things. They are not made from benzene.You can't look at a structure in a chemical and conclude the chemical was made using that structure as a stand alone component. Even if it was, the stand alone component would no longer be stand alone once incorporated into the larger molecule. As I pointed out, a single oxygen atom is a radical and the body has the means to quench it to prevent it from doing damage. That does not mean oxygen gas, O2, is dangerous, quite the contrary, it is necessary to life. The fact it is made from two oxygen atoms does not make it unsafe.
If you want to know how a chemical is made, you can Google for it, for example "clonazepam synthesis." You will be shown the precursor molecules and the steps of the reactions used to make it.
Many useful chemicals are used by attaching things to a benzene ring in place of one or more hydrogen atoms. So what is left out is hydrogen.
Yes a benzene ring is ring-shaped, thus the term benzene ring. It is a ring of carbons with a hydrogen sticking out at each corner. In this simple form it is dangerous. It is not dangerous when it is a component of a larger molecule.
Posted by CamW on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:48
In reply to , posted by on December 31, 1969, at 18:00:00
I thought that the idea out the board was for people with knowledge (either formal or experiential) to help others with questions that they have regarding psychotropic medication.
Offering a reply of a scientific nature, requires the offerer to have some knowledge of the science behind the information.
My daughter's Grade 12 Chemistry textbook clearly defines the differences between inorganic benzene & benzene incorporated into an organic molecule.
It is nice to want to offer help, but we must stick to the facts of science involved & not just guess or fearmonger.
Just a polite suggestion. - Cam
Posted by Lou PIlder on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:50
In reply to , posted by on December 31, 1969, at 18:00:00
> I thought that the idea out the board was for people with knowledge (either formal or experiential) to help others with questions that they have regarding psychotropic medication.
>
> Offering a reply of a scientific nature, requires the offerer to have some knowledge of the science behind the information.
>
> My daughter's Grade 12 Chemistry textbook clearly defines the differences between inorganic benzene & benzene incorporated into an organic molecule.
>
> It is nice to want to offer help, but we must stick to the facts of science involved & not just guess or fearmonger.
>
> Just a polite suggestion. - CamC_W,
You wrote,[...inorganic benzene...].
I am unsure as to what you are wanting others to think here about benzene and its chemical constituants in psychotropic drugs. If you could post answers here to the following, I could have the opportunity to respond accordingly.
A. Since benzene is an organic compound, how could there be an "inorganic benzene"?
B. If there is no such thing as an inorganic benzene, what are you wanting others to think concerning benzene and psychotropic drugs?
C. Are you aware of that there are derivatives of benzene that are made from benzene and are in many psychotropic drugs?
Lou
Posted by CamW on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:50
In reply to , posted by on December 31, 1969, at 18:00:00
> A. Since benzene is an organic compound, how could there be an "inorganic benzene"?
My bad; wrong wording. I guess I meant the differences in actions of benzene as a stand alone molecule & when it is incorporated into a therapeutic molecule.
How gracious of you to point out my mistake. Of course, I don't expect the same admission from you regarding clinical effects of benzene incorporated into medicinal molecules.
FYI, this is my last response to you, ever.
Posted by SLS on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:51
In reply to , posted by on December 31, 1969, at 18:00:00
Aspirin is a derivative of benzene. Benzene is used in its manufacture.
I'm sure your expertise in organic chemistry will allow you to appreciate the following diagram:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b0/Aspirin-skeletal.png
The body's natural chemical machinery utilizes benzene (aromatic) rings all of the time. These include amino acids and neurotransmitters.
Norepinephrine:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/73/Noradrenaline_chemical_structure.png
I do not have a degree in biochemistry, but what little I do know leads me to believe that your understanding of the chemistry of life is limited, and that most of your claims have no scientific basis. Benzene is poisonous. Compounds that include benzene rings are not necessarily poisonous, and are, in fact, critical to life.
- Scott
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 2, 2013, at 17:43:07
In reply to Re: Lou's response-psumperspktv » Lou PIlder, posted by joe schmoe on March 2, 2013, at 17:20:45
> Benzene rings are not the same thing as benzene by itself. Please stop the scare disinformation.
Hi, everyone,
I brought these posts together because they seemed to me to center on the idea that there's no need to feel scared. Drugs are safe.
I'd like to reserve this thread for those who share that feeling.
Thanks,
Bob
PS: Others may of course feel scared of drugs. That's a valid feeling, too, and I welcome posts about that. Please direct them to:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20130222/msgs/1039362.html
I've also redirected posts about feeling scared of Christians to:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20130223/msgs/1039352.html
and those about never dying to:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faith/20101230/msgs/1039356.html
Posted by CamW on March 3, 2013, at 10:28:10
In reply to Re: drugs are safe, posted by Dr. Bob on March 2, 2013, at 17:43:07
I would like to add something to Dr. Bob's comments on the safety of medications.
They are generally safe. They have been rigorously tested prior to being made available for sale and ongoing post-marketing surveillance is done. This is where problems can arise, as seen with drugs like Vioxx.
One should not be "scared" of medications, but everyone should respect them. They can cause problems in individuals due to an individual's genetic make-up and disorder that they may have.
Many different disorders present with similar symptoms. The cause of the disorder may never be known, but with trial and error, your doctor usually can find a medication or combination of medications that will allow on to be able to live a relatively "normal" life within the parameters of their disorder.
It sucks to be burdened with a psychiatric disorder, but most people are able to live a productive life with the help of medications and counselling.
Just remember to respect medication, but not to fear them. Do not make changes on your own. Always do so on the advise of your doctor. You need someone with a knowledge of the actions of the medications, and someone with an outside perspective of how the medications changes are affecting you; someone who can monitor your reactions to the changes.
I hope that this is of some help. - Cam
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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