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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Bryn B. on May 2, 2012, at 17:52:37
Hi-
I'm new to the site and would love some feedback. I'm currently taking 20 mg of Dexedrine, which I've been on for only a week. Previously I was on 20-30 mg of Adderall for just two weeks.
The only other med I take is 20 mg of Lexapro. I get these rx's through my GP and don't currently see a Pdoc (I haven't in awhile as my depression has been under control). Unfortunately, I've been really tired and unmotivated lately, thus the stimulants. I've used Adderall in the past (though prior to this it's been a little over a year) and never had a problem with withdrawals.
A few days before beginning the Dexedrine, I ran out of the Adderall in only 2 weeks. (They started me at a very low dose and I used more than I needed to.) The withdrawal was horrible--I was severely, severely depressed for a few days; this prompted me to ask for Dex as I wanted to zap the depression and heard it was "smoother" than Adderall, but after a week of taking Dex, I realize I don't want to take any stimulants at all and would like to get off of the dex ASAP.
Suggestions?? I've heard eating a lot of alkaline foods (ie: apples, fruit) and apple cider vinegar help.
Please do not lecture about addiction, etc. I'm well-versed in this area (though not specifically stimulants). I've been on Adderall before, but don't remember experiencing such horrible depression and exhaustion as I did this time when stopping. Help! I'm soo scared to get off the Dex as I fear the same crippling depression that I felt from the Adderall. All in all, I've only been on stims now for less than a month--why should I feel so horrible so soon from stopping them?? Suggestions?? Should I taper the dose (and how?), do one every other day, take supplements, etc.? Thanks!
Posted by Shes_Initforthemoney on May 2, 2012, at 20:13:17
In reply to Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by Bryn B. on May 2, 2012, at 17:52:37
> Hi-
>
> I'm new to the site and would love some feedback. I'm currently taking 20 mg of Dexedrine, which I've been on for only a week. Previously I was on 20-30 mg of Adderall for just two weeks.
>
> The only other med I take is 20 mg of Lexapro. I get these rx's through my GP and don't currently see a Pdoc (I haven't in awhile as my depression has been under control). Unfortunately, I've been really tired and unmotivated lately, thus the stimulants. I've used Adderall in the past (though prior to this it's been a little over a year) and never had a problem with withdrawals.
>
> A few days before beginning the Dexedrine, I ran out of the Adderall in only 2 weeks. (They started me at a very low dose and I used more than I needed to.) The withdrawal was horrible--I was severely, severely depressed for a few days; this prompted me to ask for Dex as I wanted to zap the depression and heard it was "smoother" than Adderall, but after a week of taking Dex, I realize I don't want to take any stimulants at all and would like to get off of the dex ASAP.
>
> Suggestions?? I've heard eating a lot of alkaline foods (ie: apples, fruit) and apple cider vinegar help.
>
> Please do not lecture about addiction, etc. I'm well-versed in this area (though not specifically stimulants). I've been on Adderall before, but don't remember experiencing such horrible depression and exhaustion as I did this time when stopping. Help! I'm soo scared to get off the Dex as I fear the same crippling depression that I felt from the Adderall. All in all, I've only been on stims now for less than a month--why should I feel so horrible so soon from stopping them?? Suggestions?? Should I taper the dose (and how?), do one every other day, take supplements, etc.? Thanks!------
Hi...
I am sorry you are going through such a rough time. I'd say taper the dose. But..if they do help you...you may want to go down to taking a smaller dose. Do you take 10mg 2x a day..or 20mg all at once? That 20 mg would be a hefty dose all at once. I've even taken 2x 10mg Dexedrine spansules (extended release) at I was worked up. There is nothing *completely* wrong with taking this medication even for years...30 years...a lifetime. As a social worker..I will say that true addiction usually only involves needing to increase the dose constantly or if someone abuses it for a 'high'.(Even in depression..I would even never blame someone for abusing them. I too have known depression for much of my life..and the desperate need for relief.)
So..I'd suggest maybe halving your pills/dose and see how you feel. If you don't feel better..then taper. Best of wishes...
Jay
Posted by Bryn B. on May 2, 2012, at 21:25:19
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!! » Bryn B., posted by Shes_Initforthemoney on May 2, 2012, at 20:13:17
Thanks for the reply, Jay. Unfortunately, I started at 10 once daily (extended release), and made my way up to 20mg once daily pretty quickly. I do have a problem w/ addiction, so I really never should have started w/ these in the first place. The thing is, how do I taper if I have the ER capsules? I think I'll open some up and dump half out, thus creating 5 mg capsules. I'll go to 10 tomorrow, then five, then...ugh! Honestly, I'm best sticking to Lexapro and exercise. I messed up.
>
> ------
>
> Hi...
>
> I am sorry you are going through such a rough time. I'd say taper the dose. But..if they do help you...you may want to go down to taking a smaller dose. Do you take 10mg 2x a day..or 20mg all at once? That 20 mg would be a hefty dose all at once. I've even taken 2x 10mg Dexedrine spansules (extended release) at I was worked up. There is nothing *completely* wrong with taking this medication even for years...30 years...a lifetime. As a social worker..I will say that true addiction usually only involves needing to increase the dose constantly or if someone abuses it for a 'high'.(Even in depression..I would even never blame someone for abusing them. I too have known depression for much of my life..and the desperate need for relief.)
>
> So..I'd suggest maybe halving your pills/dose and see how you feel. If you don't feel better..then taper. Best of wishes...
>
> Jay
>
>
Posted by Shes_Initforthemoney on May 3, 2012, at 16:22:03
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!! » Shes_Initforthemoney, posted by Bryn B. on May 2, 2012, at 21:25:19
> Thanks for the reply, Jay. Unfortunately, I started at 10 once daily (extended release), and made my way up to 20mg once daily pretty quickly. I do have a problem w/ addiction, so I really never should have started w/ these in the first place. The thing is, how do I taper if I have the ER capsules? I think I'll open some up and dump half out, thus creating 5 mg capsules. I'll go to 10 tomorrow, then five, then...ugh! Honestly, I'm best sticking to Lexapro and exercise. I messed up.
>
----
Hi...no problem. I just worry about people being called 'addicts' in such a hostile way, that it just makes them feel worse.If you happen to be able to get ahold of empty clear gelatin capsules (you can usually find them at a health food store in quantities of 50-100 and they are cheap) you can measure and compare in two of the clear gelatin capsules, and make a decent equal 5mg dose from the 10mg spansules. Then you can even taper further from there, adding less each day to one clear gelatin capsule. If you do find a small dose does help, you can stick with it, or taper off as you wish.
There are other alternatives to add to your Lexapro and get a bit of a 'boost', but if you find exercise really helpful, than stick with it for sure.Hope that helps...
Best,
Jay
> > ------
> >
> > Hi...
> >
> > I am sorry you are going through such a rough time. I'd say taper the dose. But..if they do help you...you may want to go down to taking a smaller dose. Do you take 10mg 2x a day..or 20mg all at once? That 20 mg would be a hefty dose all at once. I've even taken 2x 10mg Dexedrine spansules (extended release) at I was worked up. There is nothing *completely* wrong with taking this medication even for years...30 years...a lifetime. As a social worker..I will say that true addiction usually only involves needing to increase the dose constantly or if someone abuses it for a 'high'.(Even in depression..I would even never blame someone for abusing them. I too have known depression for much of my life..and the desperate need for relief.)
> >
> > So..I'd suggest maybe halving your pills/dose and see how you feel. If you don't feel better..then taper. Best of wishes...
> >
> > Jay
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by bleauberry on May 3, 2012, at 17:45:52
In reply to Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by Bryn B. on May 2, 2012, at 17:52:37
Several ideas here.
Ok so if someone wanted to treat the symptoms you have and they wanted to do it without meds, there are many substances that can target that chemistry. Dexidrine helps, and that's cool, it's just that a lifetime of that is almost always a bad outcome. But since we now know what chemistry to focus on, cool, let's do it. Such as DLPA. Tyrosine. Glutamine. In the herbal category I would favor rhodiola rosea, but an array of other herbs can be remarkably helpful as well. Rhodiola is just more specific for depression.
In studying or surfing on the web maybe look at herbal connections with dopamine, norepinephrine, and endorphins.
I don't know, probably not helpful just some ideas. You pretty much know at this point you are dealing with some kind of NE/DA thing so it just makes sense to me to discover everything possible that impacts those chemistries in hopes of not just replacing dex but getting a better outcome all around.
Posted by Bryn B. on May 3, 2012, at 19:02:52
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by bleauberry on May 3, 2012, at 17:45:52
> Several ideas here.
>
> Ok so if someone wanted to treat the symptoms you have and they wanted to do it without meds, there are many substances that can target that chemistry. Dexidrine helps, and that's cool, it's just that a lifetime of that is almost always a bad outcome. But since we now know what chemistry to focus on, cool, let's do it. Such as DLPA. Tyrosine. Glutamine. In the herbal category I would favor rhodiola rosea, but an array of other herbs can be remarkably helpful as well. Rhodiola is just more specific for depression.
>
> In studying or surfing on the web maybe look at herbal connections with dopamine, norepinephrine, and endorphins.
>
> I don't know, probably not helpful just some ideas. You pretty much know at this point you are dealing with some kind of NE/DA thing so it just makes sense to me to discover everything possible that impacts those chemistries in hopes of not just replacing dex but getting a better outcome all around.
This is very helpful, thanks. I actually bought high quality Omega-3's today along with L-tyrosine.Going to at least taper while adding these in. I tried speaking to the pharmacist and the doc, but these guys are pretty clueless, really. Thanks so much...
Posted by Bryn B. on May 3, 2012, at 19:06:59
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!! » Bryn B., posted by Shes_Initforthemoney on May 3, 2012, at 16:22:03
> > Thanks for the reply, Jay. Unfortunately, I started at 10 once daily (extended release), and made my way up to 20mg once daily pretty quickly. I do have a problem w/ addiction, so I really never should have started w/ these in the first place. The thing is, how do I taper if I have the ER capsules? I think I'll open some up and dump half out, thus creating 5 mg capsules. I'll go to 10 tomorrow, then five, then...ugh! Honestly, I'm best sticking to Lexapro and exercise. I messed up.
> >
> ----
> Hi...no problem. I just worry about people being called 'addicts' in such a hostile way, that it just makes them feel worse.
>
> If you happen to be able to get ahold of empty clear gelatin capsules (you can usually find them at a health food store in quantities of 50-100 and they are cheap) you can measure and compare in two of the clear gelatin capsules, and make a decent equal 5mg dose from the 10mg spansules. Then you can even taper further from there, adding less each day to one clear gelatin capsule. If you do find a small dose does help, you can stick with it, or taper off as you wish.
> There are other alternatives to add to your Lexapro and get a bit of a 'boost', but if you find exercise really helpful, than stick with it for sure.
>
> Hope that helps...
> Best,
> Jay
>
>
> > > ------
> > >
> > >
Thanks again, Jay, good advice. Think I'm going to try to taper off this way...Curious...what would be a good add on to the Lex? Wellbutrin (for its "pep")? I've honestly tried so many different meds, and I've found that the more streamlined I keep it, the better off I am...
Thanks again!
Posted by psychobot5000 on May 4, 2012, at 18:04:14
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by Bryn B. on May 3, 2012, at 19:06:59
> > > Thanks for the reply, Jay. Unfortunately, I started at 10 once daily (extended release), and made my way up to 20mg once daily pretty quickly. I do have a problem w/ addiction, so I really never should have started w/ these in the first place. The thing is, how do I taper if I have the ER capsules? I think I'll open some up and dump half out, thus creating 5 mg capsules. I'll go to 10 tomorrow, then five, then...ugh! Honestly, I'm best sticking to Lexapro and exercise. I messed up.
> > >
> > ----
> > Hi...no problem. I just worry about people being called 'addicts' in such a hostile way, that it just makes them feel worse.
> >
> > If you happen to be able to get ahold of empty clear gelatin capsules (you can usually find them at a health food store in quantities of 50-100 and they are cheap) you can measure and compare in two of the clear gelatin capsules, and make a decent equal 5mg dose from the 10mg spansules. Then you can even taper further from there, adding less each day to one clear gelatin capsule. If you do find a small dose does help, you can stick with it, or taper off as you wish.
> > There are other alternatives to add to your Lexapro and get a bit of a 'boost', but if you find exercise really helpful, than stick with it for sure.
> >
> > Hope that helps...
> > Best,
> > Jay
> >
> >
> > > > ------
> > > >
> > > >
> Thanks again, Jay, good advice. Think I'm going to try to taper off this way...
>
> Curious...what would be a good add on to the Lex? Wellbutrin (for its "pep")? I've honestly tried so many different meds, and I've found that the more streamlined I keep it, the better off I am...
>
> Thanks again!If you ever want to go back to meds again, wellbutrin is a good choice. Other catecholeminergic meds to consider are two of the old tricyclic antidepressants: desipramine and protriptyline. The latter, especially, is supposed to be activating, and there should be no addiction risk, there.
Posted by Shes_Initforthemoney on May 5, 2012, at 9:03:29
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by bleauberry on May 3, 2012, at 17:45:52
> Several ideas here.
>
> Ok so if someone wanted to treat the symptoms you have and they wanted to do it without meds, there are many substances that can target that chemistry. Dexidrine helps, and that's cool, it's just that a lifetime of that is almost always a bad outcome.
---
Well, as I read on a board a few days ago, many psychiatrists agree that the only meds that seem to work in the long run are stims. They talk about people having been on them for 30+ years, with much better luck than any other medication. I wish I could find the source, but I can't. BUT....if you do a small survey on here, a sort-of meta-analysis, I am positive the only two meds that seem to help, consistently and for the long run, are stims and benzos. More with stims, though.Jay
Posted by bleauberry on May 5, 2012, at 10:51:24
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!! » bleauberry, posted by Shes_Initforthemoney on May 5, 2012, at 9:03:29
Well, that's an interesting observation. Makes sense and I would not doubt it if it were true. Could probably include the milder opiates such as vicodan and tramadol along with the stims and benzos. ]
> ---
> Well, as I read on a board a few days ago, many psychiatrists agree that the only meds that seem to work in the long run are stims. They talk about people having been on them for 30+ years, with much better luck than any other medication. I wish I could find the source, but I can't. BUT....if you do a small survey on here, a sort-of meta-analysis, I am positive the only two meds that seem to help, consistently and for the long run, are stims and benzos. More with stims, though.
>
> Jay
Posted by Bryn B. on May 5, 2012, at 14:50:35
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by bleauberry on May 5, 2012, at 10:51:24
That is interesting. For sure, benzos, stims and opiates are the best all around for immediate relief, though I've had a lot of problems in the past with maintaining the same dose on these in order to get the same therapeutic benefits. (I have a high tolerance coupled w/ an addictive personality, and I've always had to raise the dose quickly, becoming resistant and dependent, fast.)
I used benzos with ssri's for over ten years to treat anxiety and depression, and they worked great, until my addictive ways got the better of me and I was both addicted and dependent on them. Benzo detox/withdrawal is pure hell--probably worse than kicking most other drugs (and I've been addicted to many substances, unfortunately!). I'm finally off benzos (which I've become an expert in), and I'm quite happy about that!
Jay, I like your suggestion of adding in a TCA such as Protriptyline--it might be perfect for adding some energy, and I read it treats chronic headaches, which I suffer from as well.
Thanks all around.
-B
Posted by Novelagent on May 7, 2012, at 6:49:02
In reply to Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by Bryn B. on May 2, 2012, at 17:52:37
CDP Choline 1 mg in 2 divided doses daily for 2 months st least- good luck. It will restore things back to normal. Also: tyrosine.
> Hi-
>
> I'm new to the site and would love some feedback. I'm currently taking 20 mg of Dexedrine, which I've been on for only a week. Previously I was on 20-30 mg of Adderall for just two weeks.
>
> The only other med I take is 20 mg of Lexapro. I get these rx's through my GP and don't currently see a Pdoc (I haven't in awhile as my depression has been under control). Unfortunately, I've been really tired and unmotivated lately, thus the stimulants. I've used Adderall in the past (though prior to this it's been a little over a year) and never had a problem with withdrawals.
>
> A few days before beginning the Dexedrine, I ran out of the Adderall in only 2 weeks. (They started me at a very low dose and I used more than I needed to.) The withdrawal was horrible--I was severely, severely depressed for a few days; this prompted me to ask for Dex as I wanted to zap the depression and heard it was "smoother" than Adderall, but after a week of taking Dex, I realize I don't want to take any stimulants at all and would like to get off of the dex ASAP.
>
> Suggestions?? I've heard eating a lot of alkaline foods (ie: apples, fruit) and apple cider vinegar help.
>
> Please do not lecture about addiction, etc. I'm well-versed in this area (though not specifically stimulants). I've been on Adderall before, but don't remember experiencing such horrible depression and exhaustion as I did this time when stopping. Help! I'm soo scared to get off the Dex as I fear the same crippling depression that I felt from the Adderall. All in all, I've only been on stims now for less than a month--why should I feel so horrible so soon from stopping them?? Suggestions?? Should I taper the dose (and how?), do one every other day, take supplements, etc.? Thanks!
Posted by Novelagent on May 7, 2012, at 15:19:43
In reply to Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by Bryn B. on May 2, 2012, at 17:52:37
Try Provigil. At the right dose (100mg-600mg, as it varies widely) it does the same thing, but it is non-habit forming.
Enjoy. : )
Hi-
>
> I'm new to the site and would love some feedback. I'm currently taking 20 mg of Dexedrine, which I've been on for only a week. Previously I was on 20-30 mg of Adderall for just two weeks.
>
> The only other med I take is 20 mg of Lexapro. I get these rx's through my GP and don't currently see a Pdoc (I haven't in awhile as my depression has been under control). Unfortunately, I've been really tired and unmotivated lately, thus the stimulants. I've used Adderall in the past (though prior to this it's been a little over a year) and never had a problem with withdrawals.
>
> A few days before beginning the Dexedrine, I ran out of the Adderall in only 2 weeks. (They started me at a very low dose and I used more than I needed to.) The withdrawal was horrible--I was severely, severely depressed for a few days; this prompted me to ask for Dex as I wanted to zap the depression and heard it was "smoother" than Adderall, but after a week of taking Dex, I realize I don't want to take any stimulants at all and would like to get off of the dex ASAP.
>
> Suggestions?? I've heard eating a lot of alkaline foods (ie: apples, fruit) and apple cider vinegar help.
>
> Please do not lecture about addiction, etc. I'm well-versed in this area (though not specifically stimulants). I've been on Adderall before, but don't remember experiencing such horrible depression and exhaustion as I did this time when stopping. Help! I'm soo scared to get off the Dex as I fear the same crippling depression that I felt from the Adderall. All in all, I've only been on stims now for less than a month--why should I feel so horrible so soon from stopping them?? Suggestions?? Should I taper the dose (and how?), do one every other day, take supplements, etc.? Thanks!
Posted by Bryn B. on May 7, 2012, at 17:46:33
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by Novelagent on May 7, 2012, at 15:19:43
Thanks everyone for the helpful suggestions thus far. I really appreciate it.
I stocked up on L-tyrosine, omega 3s and choline, and placed a call w/ my doc re: some of the old TCA's. I'm also going to ask about Wellbutrin, Straterra and Provigil. (I've taken all three in the past, but don't remember anything about Provigil and Straterra-- anything above 150 mg of Wellbutrin, however, made me super agitated and irritable.) Now I just have to try to make it through the next few days as I get off the Dex. Wish I could take off work for a few days and stay in bed...
Now if you have any questions on anything benzo and GABA receptor related, I'm your girl, and happy to dole out advice! (I learned the hard way, trust!)
Posted by Novelagent on May 8, 2012, at 16:26:30
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by Bryn B. on May 7, 2012, at 17:46:33
CDP choline, aka citicholine, is different from regular choline. Regular choline won't pass the blood-brain barrier.
>
Thanks everyone for the helpful suggestions thus far. I really appreciate it.
>
> I stocked up on L-tyrosine, omega 3s and choline, and placed a call w/ my doc re: some of the old TCA's. I'm also going to ask about Wellbutrin, Straterra and Provigil. (I've taken all three in the past, but don't remember anything about Provigil and Straterra-- anything above 150 mg of Wellbutrin, however, made me super agitated and irritable.) Now I just have to try to make it through the next few days as I get off the Dex. Wish I could take off work for a few days and stay in bed...
>
> Now if you have any questions on anything benzo and GABA receptor related, I'm your girl, and happy to dole out advice! (I learned the hard way, trust!)
Posted by Bryn B. on May 8, 2012, at 18:10:15
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by Novelagent on May 8, 2012, at 16:26:30
thanks--i actually meant cdp choline, that's what i got...
Posted by Novelagent on May 8, 2012, at 20:35:04
In reply to Re: Help getting off Dexedrine/Adderall!!, posted by Bryn B. on May 8, 2012, at 18:10:15
> thanks--i actually meant cdp choline, that's what i got...
Good luck. You can reaearch studies of patients addicted to methamphetamine receiving Provigil and print those out for your doc if you have a tough time with being off Dexedrine.
Keep in mind Provigil's dosing widely varies; I don't feel the speedy feeling unless I take 600mg, which is still within the normal range. It's like speed, but not addictive. : )
This is the end of the thread.
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