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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 24 of 24. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Christ_empowered on May 4, 2012, at 20:31:50
Here's my situation: 7 years ago, when I was 20, I was hospitalized. I was told it was ADD and minor depression--definitely not bipolar I--and put on lots of meds. I quit the meds once I moved out of my parents' home. The "professionals" also diagnosed narcissism, broke confidentiality, and basically ruined my reputation in a small, southern town.
Fast forward a few years. I committed a violent crime. I was given a second chance--rehab of the Christian variety for 1 year, the community service--and all the charges were dismissed, then the record was expunged. I have a squeaky clean criminal record.
I moved away, moved back to my hometown. Sent off some admittedly angry emails to an ex-shrink whom I had filed a medical board complaint against. I made some angry phone calls to another shrink's office. Suddenly, this "narcissist" with a low-IQ who "wanted to be special" was facing involuntary commitment. Luckily, the shrink who did the examination sent me home with free Abilify.
I just think its so ironic--for 2 years, I was the Village Idiot, supposedly "narcissistic," wanting to bipolar, etc. Now, those same shrinks tried to commit me. Oh, and I apparently don't have a low IQ anymore. I don't know when that happened, but I'm glad it did. I overheard someone at my mental health place say I had a "high IQ" while I was doing the whole check out thing.
Is it possible to get smarter, "Flowers for Algernon" style? I certainly don't *feel* as dull as I once did. As for the narcissism....I don't think I am/have NPD. Maybe I never did. Who knows?
This situation is great for me (except for the whole attempt at committment...that was kind of scary), but the irony is so intense, I just had to share.
Posted by rjlockhart04-08 on May 5, 2012, at 0:06:38
In reply to Irony, posted by Christ_empowered on May 4, 2012, at 20:31:50
Your not narcisstic, you discuss these issues and are aware of them and that is a good thing. Doctors are not like the shining good moral pastors you will meet sometime in life, they do lie and do bad things...it's just they know how to put it under the carpet and act like their right. You have to be smart with them, learn their own philophophy and be able to reason with them. Psychiatrists are not always understanding kindergarden teachers that will be sweet, and will be your encouragement. My doctor is the one of the most arrogant, self willed, high minded in her own terms that I have to kiss her *ss, and try to explain things on her terms. I mean really, if had my own income...i would ditch her and move on but my mother pays for my doctor visits and i have to stay with her. You do have charasterics of having a above average IQ..the way you post...and relate others, I can't do it well. I got put with an IQ of 86 which is ... anyways, and my doctor recorded it, and told me she couldnt do anything. Of course, she just sits their and thinks the best her opinion is. Ugh...these kind of people will believe in a false light until the day they die.
Anyways, you hang in there!
Posted by SLS on May 5, 2012, at 4:24:20
In reply to Re: Irony, posted by rjlockhart04-08 on May 5, 2012, at 0:06:38
> I got put with an IQ of 86
There is nothing wrong with being what God made you to be. However, to me, you appear to have more intelligence than that score would indicate. All I can say is that if you are truly below average in IQ, you certainly use it in an above average way.
Some people are better test takers than others. There are also cultural biases built into many of the questions. Also, people have different strategies for learning that are not accounted for by these IQ tests. Who knows why you scored 86. I don't think that you should be so quick to internalize the idea that you are unintelligent.
- Scott
Posted by AlexanderDenmark on May 5, 2012, at 10:02:29
In reply to Re: Irony » rjlockhart04-08, posted by SLS on May 5, 2012, at 4:24:20
> > I got put with an IQ of 86
>
> There is nothing wrong with being what God made you to be. However, to me, you appear to have more intelligence than that score would indicate. All I can say is that if you are truly below average in IQ, you certainly use it in an above average way.
>
> Some people are better test takers than others. There are also cultural biases built into many of the questions. Also, people have different strategies for learning that are not accounted for by these IQ tests. Who knows why you scored 86. I don't think that you should be so quick to internalize the idea that you are unintelligent.
>
>
> - Scott
>I took a IQ test when I was at my lowest lvl of function. It was 98. I take a IQ test again a week ago after I have regained a bit of energy and slighty better cognitive function, and I got 130.
It's hardly a fixed rating.
Posted by Phillipa on May 5, 2012, at 10:33:20
In reply to Re: Irony, posted by AlexanderDenmark on May 5, 2012, at 10:02:29
CE you surely have been through a lot how are things now better and still on the abilify as this seems to be your best med. Phillipa
Posted by Alexei on May 5, 2012, at 11:11:30
In reply to Irony, posted by Christ_empowered on May 4, 2012, at 20:31:50
Thanks for that story. Quite a few things I can relate to. So many wrong diagnoses, and the broken confidentiality... that one really pissed me off. You are an inspiration to me.
Since you are an expert with abilify, maybe you can give me some encouragement. I'm taking it to augment my AD at 2.5mg, but it's making me anxious and restless .. yet stoned at the same time. Will all of this pass? Would 5mg be a better dose? My doc wants me on 10mg or less. It is already interfering with my vyvanse.
Love to hear your thoughts... Alexei
> Here's my situation: 7 years ago, when I was 20, I was hospitalized. I was told it was ADD and minor depression--definitely not bipolar I--and put on lots of meds. I quit the meds once I moved out of my parents' home. The "professionals" also diagnosed narcissism, broke confidentiality, and basically ruined my reputation in a small, southern town.
>
> Fast forward a few years. I committed a violent crime. I was given a second chance--rehab of the Christian variety for 1 year, the community service--and all the charges were dismissed, then the record was expunged. I have a squeaky clean criminal record.
>
> I moved away, moved back to my hometown. Sent off some admittedly angry emails to an ex-shrink whom I had filed a medical board complaint against. I made some angry phone calls to another shrink's office. Suddenly, this "narcissist" with a low-IQ who "wanted to be special" was facing involuntary commitment. Luckily, the shrink who did the examination sent me home with free Abilify.
>
> I just think its so ironic--for 2 years, I was the Village Idiot, supposedly "narcissistic," wanting to bipolar, etc. Now, those same shrinks tried to commit me. Oh, and I apparently don't have a low IQ anymore. I don't know when that happened, but I'm glad it did. I overheard someone at my mental health place say I had a "high IQ" while I was doing the whole check out thing.
>
> Is it possible to get smarter, "Flowers for Algernon" style? I certainly don't *feel* as dull as I once did. As for the narcissism....I don't think I am/have NPD. Maybe I never did. Who knows?
>
> This situation is great for me (except for the whole attempt at committment...that was kind of scary), but the irony is so intense, I just had to share.
Posted by Christ_empowered on May 5, 2012, at 14:53:06
In reply to Re: Irony » Christ_empowered, posted by Alexei on May 5, 2012, at 11:11:30
Phillipa--I'm doing *so* much better now! To be fair, my life was much more chaotic and disordered when I was younger, and I lacked character. So, now, with a bit of maturity and insight and a tad of hard earned wisdom, I'm doing much better. The Abilify @ 30 is good for me, but my new doc says we can go to around 15-20 w/o losing control over my problems, as long as I take the low-dose (300mgs) trileptal.
Alexei--I am sorry you're having problems with Abilify. With the anxiety and restlessness, my first thought would be a benzo for 2 weeks (or so...), kind of like some more thoughtful docs do with antidepressant start up. After two weeks or so, you could discontinue the benzo and see if the Abilify is helpful, or just an expensive waste for you.
Higher doses do tend to be more calming (I guess the tranquilizing aspect overshadows the stimulating part; I dunno...I'm just basing this on experience and what shrinks have told me). However, I have read that sometimes, the lower you can go with Abilify for depression, the better. I read that some docs will give 2ish mgs every 3 days, for instance.
That said, "depression" covers a lot of ground. If you have intense anxiety anyway, agitation, psychotic or near psychotic problems, I'd think a higher dose would be better. If your problem is lack of energy and motivation, lethargy, etc., I'd think you'd want to either low dose it or consider something else, such as an MAOI or stimulating TCA.
Abilify DEFINITELY interferes with amphetamines. When I took Abilify (10-15)+ Adderall, my adderall had to be upped to 60. When I dropped the Abilify, I suddenly developed psychosis caused in part (but not completely) by the adderall. If you up the dose, I would assume that you'd get even less mileage out of your amphetamine. On the other hand, the restless feeling may pass.
What symptoms are you targeting with Abilify? I kind of wonder if maybe you'd benefit from a good ole Tofranil (now available in once-nightly PM formula) + amphetamine. That combo served me well, although since I have Bipolar I w/psychotic features, it also made me angry. Rough situation. Since the Tofranil increases amphetamine concentrations in the brain and somehow does other stuff to make it work better (here comes one of my favorite phrases: adds a bit of oomph), you could possibly do that and keep a lowish dose of Abilify to smooth things over. Just a thought based on personal experience--clearly, I'm not your prescriber.
Thanks, everyone!
Posted by Raisinb on May 5, 2012, at 15:45:35
In reply to Irony, posted by Christ_empowered on May 4, 2012, at 20:31:50
Yeah, isn't it grand when we have to trust people who do this kind of thing with our mental health?
Glad you can recognize the irony in your situation instead of listening to those people.
Posted by Alexei on May 6, 2012, at 10:35:05
In reply to phillipa, alexei, posted by Christ_empowered on May 5, 2012, at 14:53:06
Hi Christ .. Thank you for your response... Very helpful.
I'm taking a little klonopin to help with the abilify anxiety. It does seem to help.My depression is unipolar, low energy, lack of motivation, with some OCD and anxiety/insomnia. So your, and my pdoc's advice 4 low dose makes sense. The effexor is not cutting it .. My doc is thinking of trying zoloft + desipramine. This stoned drugged feeling from abilify is not helping.
The interaction with vyvanse is really causing me trouble. That alone may drive me off abilify. 70mg vyvanse feels more like 50mg ... not good. How do you deal with your abilify/adderall interaction? Take more? Do you take any other meds?
May I ask what time of day you take abilify, and if it makes you sleepy? Ive been taking seroquel 100mg to sleep, but I don't really like taking both quel and abilify.
Thanks for your thoughts, and glad you're doing so well!
Alexei
> Alexei--I am sorry you're having problems with Abilify. With the anxiety and restlessness, my first thought would be a benzo for 2 weeks (or so...), kind of like some more thoughtful docs do with antidepressant start up. After two weeks or so, you could discontinue the benzo and see if the Abilify is helpful, or just an expensive waste for you.
>
> Higher doses do tend to be more calming (I guess the tranquilizing aspect overshadows the stimulating part; I dunno...I'm just basing this on experience and what shrinks have told me). However, I have read that sometimes, the lower you can go with Abilify for depression, the better. I read that some docs will give 2ish mgs every 3 days, for instance.
>
> That said, "depression" covers a lot of ground. If you have intense anxiety anyway, agitation, psychotic or near psychotic problems, I'd think a higher dose would be better. If your problem is lack of energy and motivation, lethargy, etc., I'd think you'd want to either low dose it or consider something else, such as an MAOI or stimulating TCA.
>
> Abilify DEFINITELY interferes with amphetamines. When I took Abilify (10-15)+ Adderall, my adderall had to be upped to 60. When I dropped the Abilify, I suddenly developed psychosis caused in part (but not completely) by the adderall. If you up the dose, I would assume that you'd get even less mileage out of your amphetamine. On the other hand, the restless feeling may pass.
>
> What symptoms are you targeting with Abilify? I kind of wonder if maybe you'd benefit from a good ole Tofranil (now available in once-nightly PM formula) + amphetamine. That combo served me well, although since I have Bipolar I w/psychotic features, it also made me angry. Rough situation. Since the Tofranil increases amphetamine concentrations in the brain and somehow does other stuff to make it work better (here comes one of my favorite phrases: adds a bit of oomph), you could possibly do that and keep a lowish dose of Abilify to smooth things over. Just a thought based on personal experience--clearly, I'm not your prescriber.
>
> Thanks, everyone!
Posted by Phil on May 6, 2012, at 11:22:24
In reply to Re: Irony, posted by AlexanderDenmark on May 5, 2012, at 10:02:29
This is fun and difficult but it's a blast to take.
May even be more accurate, who knows?
Posted by Phillipa on May 6, 2012, at 20:59:24
In reply to try a different iq test. Danish, posted by Phil on May 6, 2012, at 11:22:24
Made no sense. I took it only 92. But magna c*m laude go figure? Phillipa
Posted by Phil on May 7, 2012, at 5:49:11
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish » Phil, posted by Phillipa on May 6, 2012, at 20:59:24
103. That was with Vyvanse help.
Posted by zazenducke on May 7, 2012, at 5:49:30
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish » Phil, posted by Phillipa on May 6, 2012, at 20:59:24
I see the royal asterisk machine is still protecting Babble. I'm sure we all feel safer reading posts now.
> Made no sense. I took it only 92. But magna c*m laude go figure? Phillipa
Posted by zazenducke on May 7, 2012, at 5:56:02
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish, posted by Phil on May 7, 2012, at 5:49:11
The Danes have shown me to be stoopid. I have found another test more suited to my gifts.
http://www.memory-improvement-tips.com/idiot-test.html
I was stunned at how low my score was. I'm thinking about signing up for lumosity.
Posted by Phil on May 7, 2012, at 6:45:10
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish, posted by zazenducke on May 7, 2012, at 5:49:30
OMG, I missed that. HAHA!
Posted by Phil on May 7, 2012, at 6:52:59
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Duckish, posted by zazenducke on May 7, 2012, at 5:56:02
Awesome, a new thing to try. I posted that first test on a drumming forum and a lot of people took it. A lot who I figured were pretty smart didn't do that well.
I went to the Mensa site and took a sample test. Well, not really. I read a few questions and had no clue what they meant.
I bought a book on improving your memory several years ago. One Sunday morning I was reading it. I had to go to the grocery store and, with my improving memory, thought, I don't need a list.
When the lady started checking me out I reached for my wallet. I forgot it at home.
Posted by AlexanderDenmark on May 7, 2012, at 13:12:22
In reply to try a different iq test. Danish, posted by Phil on May 6, 2012, at 11:22:24
> This is fun and difficult but it's a blast to take.
> May even be more accurate, who knows?
>
> http://www.iqtest.dk/main.swfI might give it a go tomorrow. I've had two pints of beer right now, so I'd rather do it while sober.
Want to do it on a fairly good day though, because getting low scores make me depressed.
Posted by Phil on May 7, 2012, at 13:29:34
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish, posted by AlexanderDenmark on May 7, 2012, at 13:12:22
I was really focused the day I took it...didn't help. Clue...most people run out of time with 5-7 questions left so guess quickly. : )
Posted by Phillipa on May 7, 2012, at 20:51:04
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish » AlexanderDenmark, posted by Phil on May 7, 2012, at 13:29:34
I just clicked on answers as they all looked dumb to me and didn't know it had a time limit. Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on May 7, 2012, at 20:59:04
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Duckish, posted by zazenducke on May 7, 2012, at 5:56:02
Posted it on facebook Thanks Zanduckie oh so duckie you are!!!! Phillipa
Posted by Phil on May 7, 2012, at 21:23:23
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish » Phil, posted by Phillipa on May 7, 2012, at 20:51:04
The test looked dumb? How can a test be dumb?
Posted by Phillipa on May 8, 2012, at 0:07:46
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish » Phillipa, posted by Phil on May 7, 2012, at 21:23:23
Why couldn't a test look dumb. It made no sense to me so it's the test or me. Oh oh it must be me if the test can't be dumb. Phillipa
Posted by Phil on May 8, 2012, at 6:55:28
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish » Phil, posted by Phillipa on May 8, 2012, at 0:07:46
I wasn't saying you were dumb, Phillipa. That's obviously not true. I was commenting on how you perceived the test.
I've talked to maybe 15 people that took the test. Nobody said the test was dumb, everyone was challenged by it. But several thought it was useless as far as any IQ barometer. And a few just didn't like it at all.
My only point was that a test can't be smart or dumb but it can be useless or pointless.
Posted by Phillipa on May 8, 2012, at 18:59:29
In reply to Re: try a different iq test. Danish » Phillipa, posted by Phil on May 8, 2012, at 6:55:28
Phil thanks for clarification. I sure failed. Phillipa
This is the end of the thread.
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