![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 16 to 40 of 58. Go back in thread:
Posted by sigismund on April 5, 2011, at 13:57:42
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco » floatingbridge, posted by SLS on April 5, 2011, at 5:31:34
>Without getting too technical, withdrawal seems to be due, in part, to kindling. AEDs (anticonvulsants) would be a logical choice if this were true.
I am doubtful about the kindling theory, I suppose because it upsets the nice mathematical feel of so much pleasure given having to be paid back with precisely the same amount of pain. But you should see me stacking the dishwasher, so that's probably an OCD variant.
Nonetheless I know that gabapentin would be really useful in opiate withdrawal, just as it is so helpful for pain.
Posted by floatingbridge on April 5, 2011, at 16:03:35
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco, posted by sigismund on April 5, 2011, at 13:57:42
Sigi, its cousin, Lyrica, walked me through a pristiq/cymbalta taper. There were serious sides to the Lyrica for me, however, I think it's good to have out there in common knowledge as a tapering tool.
fb
Posted by sigismund on April 5, 2011, at 17:37:20
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on April 5, 2011, at 16:03:35
Yeah, Lyrica sounded too strong and too toxic for me.
I never used gabapentin to taper opiates, but I know enough and have read enough to know how useful that type of drug could be.
I have a mild case of shingles at the moment and that is what gabapentin is supposed to be for, isn't it? And it does help in a way that a benzo would not.
Posted by sigismund on April 5, 2011, at 18:13:07
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco » floatingbridge, posted by sigismund on April 5, 2011, at 17:37:20
The other thing I have found helpful is to see the pain as something you welcome. Since you don't welcome it, this presents problems. So you do some voodoo number on yourself where you say you do. I can do it with this pain I have now, but then it's not really bad either. I can say it is from God or like being touched by someone I love. I can say anything. It sort of helps to pass the time while it happens.
Posted by Phillipa on April 5, 2011, at 23:34:13
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco, posted by sigismund on April 5, 2011, at 18:13:07
Sigi there is a vaccine for shingles. Can't have it when active but if you had the chicken pox as you know shingles comes out after a certain unmentionable age. It could strike again and it's very painful. Hope it's starting to heal. PJ
Posted by floatingbridge on April 6, 2011, at 11:06:55
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco, posted by sigismund on April 5, 2011, at 18:13:07
Well, Sigi, sorry that you have had to learn secret methods for pain reduction whatever the reasons. Shingles can be awful from what I understand. The gabapenitin helped my MIL through a bout and isn't there evidence to suggest it helped post-hepatic nueralgia from more deeply engraving a pathway as well as give pain relief?
Thanks for the encouragement. After what happened on Lyrica (I started thinking I had stroke! Very odd thought for me), I am 2x shy about anything new. But I won't say never :|
Posted by sigismund on April 6, 2011, at 14:17:11
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco » sigismund, posted by Phillipa on April 5, 2011, at 23:34:13
>Sigi there is a vaccine for shingles
Really? I must get it when this is over. I can see it could be awful.
Posted by sigismund on April 6, 2011, at 14:21:52
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on April 6, 2011, at 11:06:55
>isn't there evidence to suggest it helped post-hepatic nueralgia from more deeply engraving a pathway as well as give pain relief?
I have heard that. A chemist was good enough to give me some Tagamet, an old heartburn antihistamine drug which helps in some way. And I actually have gabapetin.
If it is like herpes simplex, outbreaks may lead to more outbreaks too.
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 6, 2011, at 17:46:44
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco » Phillipa, posted by sigismund on April 6, 2011, at 14:17:11
I'm pretty sure there is no point in getting the vaccine if you've already had shingles.
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/shingles/vacc-need-know.htm
Posted by floatingbridge on April 6, 2011, at 19:20:19
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco, posted by mtdewcmu on April 6, 2011, at 17:46:44
Yes, I agree with mtdew. Though my MIL was told that when an outbreak occurs, minimize it with some high-powered antiviral (forget the stateside name); darn little b*gger virus travels along its favorite neural pathways in layman's terms.
So for my MIL, her outbreak was along the scalp down towards the left eye. Doc was glad it stopped at the brow and did
not affect the left ear. Her blisters were minimal. Most commonly affects the trunk. Inhabits the spinal column, yes?Sorry sigi. Is this recent?
Weighing risks and benefits of vaccine for the kid, we went for the chicken pox shot just to minimize our bub's chances of shingles later. About 85% effective, the pox shot is, I've heard.
My hubby needs to get a shingles shot....
fb
Posted by floatingbridge on April 6, 2011, at 19:37:10
In reply to sensible help needed with norco, posted by floatingbridge on April 4, 2011, at 13:42:51
Trying for 15mg today, will accept 20mg.
Physician Assistant explained 'their plan' for me. (Nice to be included.) Stay at 20mg for two weeks, drop it again to maybe ten....
Then LDN. (I felt an great and obnoxious impulse to tell the PA that LDN was something I informed the good doc about as the PA began to explain the protocol. Sigh. I like to get some credit now and again, but I also need to let others do their jobs.)
Meanwhile, I'm trying to stay upright and re-explain why I'm not on an AD.
And then the perfunctory talk about stress, emotions, pain, and counseling. Reminded me of having to endure a service in order to eat at a mission.
(Do I sound cranky?)
She asked if I'd like a referral to a pain specialist. Absolutely. So now the big health care complex wheels are churning
away creating a referral....First star to the right, and straight on till morning....
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 6, 2011, at 19:47:21
In reply to shingles » mtdewcmu, posted by floatingbridge on April 6, 2011, at 19:20:19
> Yes, I agree with mtdew. Though my MIL was told that when an outbreak occurs, minimize it with some high-powered antiviral (forget the stateside name); darn little b*gger virus travels along its favorite neural pathways in layman's terms.
Usually the antiviral is acyclovir (Zovirax) or valacyclovir (Valtrex).
Posted by floatingbridge on April 6, 2011, at 19:52:04
In reply to Re: shingles, posted by mtdewcmu on April 6, 2011, at 19:47:21
Valtrex sounds right.... Maybe....
Posted by sigismund on April 6, 2011, at 20:50:14
In reply to shingles » mtdewcmu, posted by floatingbridge on April 6, 2011, at 19:20:19
>Sorry sigi. Is this recent?
Yeah, it started a week ago and already I am starting to feel better. The pain is almost gone. I wonder if the Tagamet / cimetadine shortened the duration? Sometimes it lasts a month. I only had 3 little sores and it was quite painful. It would be terrible if it flared up.
Posted by Phillipa on April 6, 2011, at 20:55:23
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco, posted by mtdewcmu on April 6, 2011, at 17:46:44
The article you posted says it helps after shingles. My neighbor got it after having it on her face. Dangerous place to get it. Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on April 6, 2011, at 21:32:15
In reply to Re: shingles, posted by sigismund on April 6, 2011, at 20:50:14
Shingles follows nerve pathways. A Good amount of people shingles effects the nerves around the side of the trunk of body. FB didn't know it was that common in face eye area sounds like same nerve my neighbors was. I'm not getting the vaccine why? I don't want it. Phillipa I cared for so many when working with shingles and they then thought if had had the chicken pox couldn't get so no mask gloves and the patients were in isolation. So I'm not. No more vaccines don't get flu either. Phillipa
Posted by floatingbridge on April 6, 2011, at 21:53:10
In reply to Re: shingles, posted by sigismund on April 6, 2011, at 20:50:14
The tagamet is not familiar. Glad it is receding; guess it's done. The neurontin, how long for some relief? I wouldn't worry too much about flare-ups, unless you notice a shortening length between occurances. My MIL really only had the one big presentation on a sensitive neural pathway. Every so often, in certain weather, like a cold wind, she can feel the shadow of the pathway, but nothing a touch of voodoo can't handle. And you know preventive measures....
Good news that Phillipa says the vaccine can help.
I wonder what my MIL did waiting for neurontin to kick in. I'll ask. Hydrocodine doesn't quite cut it for that type of pain.
Glad you've got your voodoo working. Or your mojo.
> Yeah, it started a week ago and already I am starting to feel better. The pain is almost gone. I wonder if the Tagamet / cimetadine shortened the duration? Sometimes it lasts a month. I only had 3 little sores and it was quite painful. It would be terrible if it flared up.
Posted by Phillipa on April 6, 2011, at 22:25:48
In reply to Re: shingles, posted by floatingbridge on April 6, 2011, at 21:53:10
The posted link says it can work after having shingles as can recur. Very painful. Sigi glad just a few. Phillipa
Posted by mtdewcmu on April 6, 2011, at 23:04:20
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco » mtdewcmu, posted by Phillipa on April 6, 2011, at 20:55:23
> The article you posted says it helps after shingles. My neighbor got it after having it on her face. Dangerous place to get it. Phillipa
You are right.
Posted by Phillipa on April 6, 2011, at 23:44:57
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco, posted by mtdewcmu on April 6, 2011, at 23:04:20
Thanks usually I'm wrong to be right means a lot emotionally to me my problem but thanks Phillipa
Posted by violette on April 8, 2011, at 19:22:35
In reply to sensible help needed with norco, posted by floatingbridge on April 4, 2011, at 13:42:51
I think the feelings that lead to your search for relief would best be addressed by psychotherapy, with a relationship with another human being skilled enough to help you attain what you need. From all your posts, it seems like you are the patient of a biological-based psychiatrist, which is a lose-lose situation for so many of us.
Posted by floatingbridge on April 8, 2011, at 21:02:57
In reply to Re: sensible help needed with norco, posted by violette on April 8, 2011, at 19:22:35
Hi Violette,
Nice to see you :)
I feel and think my issues are multifaceted. Mental illness, such as first and second degree relatives with serious physically based illness only further complicated by maladaptive behaviors, etc.
For me having a pdoc who is also a therapist has lead me only so far, and in fact, is now in conflict with what I think my best interests are. So, I'm looking for a new pdoc most likely, and a therapist who can meet what I'm looking for in a therapist.
Wish me luck, and thanks for your insight. Hope you are well enough.
fb
Posted by floatingbridge on April 13, 2011, at 5:50:49
In reply to Re: shingles, posted by sigismund on April 6, 2011, at 20:50:14
sigi, how's the neurontin treating you?
Posted by floatingbridge on April 13, 2011, at 6:02:19
In reply to sensible help needed with norco, posted by floatingbridge on April 4, 2011, at 13:42:51
My gp made the step from 20mgs to 15mgs on Saturday.
Now it's rough. I'm not panicked anymore. WTF & whatever are my attitudes. However, now there is inadequate pain control. Not crazy, rebound, ER pain. Just the f*ck my day all day aches.
What bothers me, is that, besides the holy Grail of LDN, I don't see any easy answers except live with it. (Which means living less freely. I'm not a frickin meditation master. My teacher is a seven year old--quite capricious and free with the ole Zen stick :-/ )
I can see my body desensitizing to norco. That's cool. 20mgs was tolerable. Gawd, how long, if ever to feel alright on 15mg? Arrgh. Grr.
Oh, just griping.
fb
(Ouchy!)
Posted by sigismund on April 14, 2011, at 17:22:03
In reply to Re: shingles » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on April 13, 2011, at 5:50:49
>sigi, how's the neurontin treating you?
The shingles has gone away. The Tagamet shortened the whole thing.
I take 300mg gabapentin at night to help with sleep. It is OK. I don't want to take much because it's not that good for me, but it is OK.
It really would help with opiate withdrawal. A lot of the withdrawal is extreme restlessness mixed with agitation and pain.
Neurontin will get rid of the physical restlessness.
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.