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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 25. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Economist on November 27, 2010, at 1:00:21
Does Effexor help in treating anhedonia?
Posted by SLS on November 27, 2010, at 8:04:16
In reply to Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Economist on November 27, 2010, at 1:00:21
> Does Effexor help in treating anhedonia?
There are differences in the way two different people can respond to the same drug. All I can say from my personal experience with Effexor is that it has the capacity to reduce or completely irradicate anhedonia in at least some people. My advice is to approach a trial of Effexor with an open mind, and know that you might be one of those people. My positive response to Effexor was short-lived. I found that it worked better when combined with nortriptyline. I think that people with more severe depressions will need dosages of Effexor ranging from 150mg to 300mg. If you tolerate side effects, I would suggest that 300mg is a reasonable target. Some people will not respond to Effexor until they reach this dosage.
- Scott
Posted by linkadge on November 27, 2010, at 9:08:03
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor. » Economist, posted by SLS on November 27, 2010, at 8:04:16
Initially effexor helped my anhedonia, but over time, I ended up feeling just as flat as a regular SSRI.
Linkadge
Posted by Phillipa on November 27, 2010, at 10:49:40
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by linkadge on November 27, 2010, at 9:08:03
I read it doesn't cause weight gain. The ahedonia is what just not feeling? Seriously seems to come up lately a lot. Makes me afraid to try any meds. Phillipa
Posted by merpmerp on November 27, 2010, at 21:47:32
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Phillipa on November 27, 2010, at 10:49:40
Anhedonia literally means lack of pleasure. It's what I have on the Lexapro right now. I can't feel anything good in response to normally pleasurable stimuli. Everything is just blah. It's not like my old depressive symptoms but it's really bad nonetheless.
> I read it doesn't cause weight gain. The ahedonia is what just not feeling? Seriously seems to come up lately a lot. Makes me afraid to try any meds. Phillipa
Posted by Conundrum on November 28, 2010, at 15:51:09
In reply to Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Economist on November 27, 2010, at 1:00:21
> Does Effexor help in treating anhedonia?
Hi Economist,
Haven't seen you in awhile. Still searching for an anhedonia cure? Me too. Did you end up ever trying prozac or cocaine?
I've never tried effexor, but I have tried pristiq, which is the main metabolite of effexor, and it did seem to add a sense of color in the beginning, things seemed less grey. Anyway, that effect lasted about two weeks then it started to feel like an SSRI. The bad thing about Pristiq is that raising the dose doesn't make it more effective. Raising the dosage of effexor can make it more effective and increase norepinephrine more.
I think you are looking in the right area. From my own personal experience, increasing norepinephrine is key to treating my anhedonia. Perhaps in the presence of increased serotonin and/or dopamine. Drugs like lexapro or tianeptine that focus mainly on serotonin don't do much for my anhedonia. Nor do drugs that just manipulate dopamine like abilify, or L tyrosine.
Its all about balancing it seems. I know you were taking a bunch of dopaminergic drugs, I had done the same thing with supplements and some drugs, and found no help from them. You probably read a lot of articles on the web talking about how dopamine is critical for pleasure, the "pleasure chemical", etc. A couple articles come to mind. "Dopamine, serotonin's secret weapon" and pretty much everything in the "Good Drug Guide" on bltc.org and biopsychiatry.com. Or every article ever on romantic love and brain chemistry.
Norepinephrine is usually described as the "fight or flight" tranmitter and important for energy and arousal. Its way more complicated than this. Both norepinephrine and dopamine can be arousing and both can play a role in hedonia. For instance norepinephrine depleted mice show no preference for morphine, amphetamine, or saline. Well they actually show preference slightly for the saline. Normal mice choose the drugs of abuse. On the other hand a D2 blocker will cause anhedonia in animals. Personally, I feel like one of those NE depleted mice. Sex, alcohol, whatever, doesn't do anything for me.
My own research, now that I have access to Sciencedirect articles, implicates all kinds of factors into anhedonia, norepinephrine, serotonin, dopamine, neuropeptides like endorphins.
Another option to try would be some kind of opiate drug or naltrexone, that may help with some types of anhedonia, if effexor doesn't help.
Best of luck if you try effexor. Pristiq was the only psych drug that I "liked." It gave me some color, it actually had less side effects than lexapro, and increase sexual arousal. Feel free to babble mail me if you have any questions.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on November 28, 2010, at 16:40:31
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor. » Economist, posted by Conundrum on November 28, 2010, at 15:51:09
>Did you end up ever trying prozac or cocaine?
Prozac or cocaine! There's a bit of a difference!
Cocaine might make repetitive tasks much more interesting for about half an hour but it's not exactly a solution to anhedonia. Regular use will cause anhedonia and so will withdrawal.
Posted by Economist on November 28, 2010, at 23:18:03
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor. » Economist, posted by Conundrum on November 28, 2010, at 15:51:09
Hey, Conundrum. Thanks for your input. Yeah, I'm still searching for treatment for anhedonia. I haven't been around in a while because I've been busy with school. I'm not too optimistic about the Effexor, but I'm hoping it can be augmented with a TCA.
Posted by Conundrum on November 28, 2010, at 23:47:01
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor. » Conundrum, posted by Economist on November 28, 2010, at 23:18:03
> Hey, Conundrum. Thanks for your input. Yeah, I'm still searching for treatment for anhedonia. I haven't been around in a while because I've been busy with school. I'm not too optimistic about the Effexor, but I'm hoping it can be augmented with a TCA.
Did you try prozac? I know you mentioned it before.
Posted by linkadge on November 29, 2010, at 19:22:03
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Conundrum on November 28, 2010, at 23:47:01
Yeah, cocaine......
A positive response to cocaine means....... you're human (or at least a rat).
Linkadge
Posted by Conundrum on November 29, 2010, at 19:36:23
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by linkadge on November 29, 2010, at 19:22:03
> Yeah, cocaine......
>
> A positive response to cocaine means....... you're human (or at least a rat).
>
>
> LinkadgeI doubt I'd have one. Not sure I wanna find out though.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on November 30, 2010, at 14:05:29
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Conundrum on November 29, 2010, at 19:36:23
> > Yeah, cocaine......
> >
> > A positive response to cocaine means....... you're human (or at least a rat).
> >
> >
> > Linkadge
>
> I doubt I'd have one. Not sure I wanna find out though.Might have a panic attack.
Posted by conundrum on November 30, 2010, at 22:22:07
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by ed_uk2010 on November 30, 2010, at 14:05:29
> > > Yeah, cocaine......
> > >
> > > A positive response to cocaine means....... you're human (or at least a rat).
> > >
> > >
> > > Linkadge
> >
> > I doubt I'd have one. Not sure I wanna find out though.
>
> Might have a panic attack.
That would require me to have the ability to feel intense emotional anxiety. Which I'm not capable of, perhaps I would have the physical sensation of increase heart rate and stronger heart beating, but I'm doubtful I would feel any emotional kind of anxiety. Maybe the urge to get up an walk around. I think the only thing that could make me feel really strong anxiety would be riding a roller coaster.All my emotions are turned down.
Posted by Economist on December 4, 2010, at 0:23:15
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Conundrum on November 28, 2010, at 23:47:01
>
> Did you try prozac? I know you mentioned it before.I did try Prozac with Wellbutrin. Didn't do anything.
Posted by Conundrum on December 4, 2010, at 0:49:15
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Economist on December 4, 2010, at 0:23:15
>
> >
> > Did you try prozac? I know you mentioned it before.
>
> I did try Prozac with Wellbutrin. Didn't do anything.Just going off on a limb, but does your past include any abuse?
Posted by Phillipa on December 4, 2010, at 1:09:02
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Conundrum on December 4, 2010, at 0:49:15
Curious why would prozac effect someone who abused a med or drug? Phillipa
Posted by Economist on December 6, 2010, at 17:35:51
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Conundrum on December 4, 2010, at 0:49:15
>
> Just going off on a limb, but does your past include any abuse?Nope.
Posted by Conundrum on December 6, 2010, at 23:26:07
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor. » Conundrum, posted by Economist on December 6, 2010, at 17:35:51
> >
> > Just going off on a limb, but does your past include any abuse?
>
> Nope.I meant physical abuse as a child not drug abuse, although both could lead to anhedonia.
Posted by ggggg123 on December 8, 2010, at 14:42:25
In reply to Re: Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Conundrum on December 6, 2010, at 23:26:07
Conudrum, hi, although you were quite rude to me, I would like to update you on my success in recovery. My sex drive is getting very strong, also everything else is coming flooding back, Iam 100% at times dropping to 90% at other times, I have been taking LICORICE ROOT FOR A FEW MONTHS, IT TOOK ALMOST 3 MONTHS TO START TO NOTICE CHANGES. I kept telling myself I cannot be damaged these drugs are tested on millions. Also I knew it wasn't just the sex drive, I never got excited, I never got thrilled, I never got scared, goosebumps or heavy sweating. I used to be quite nervous and sweat alot, all this had gone. As we both know norepinephrine plays a massive part, its just about how do we get the adrenal glands working again. LICORICE ROOT ITS THE NEXT BEST THING TO A MIRACLE!!!!!!!!!! I am being 100% serious, thank God, I really thought I was stuck in a life of anhedonia, with no hope. just lay there with no feelings, no enjoyment. Just feeling very flat and cold. But now its back, sorry to be graphic but i feel like my testicles are alive again, i feel very sexual, its like when you are full of adrenaline the testes are filled with life and so is the brain. I think it has to do with adrenaline and noradrenaline. When I am nervous my heart now races once again, I can sleep easily through the night and love my sleep, I also enjoy exercising and being active. This is a gift a gift of the highest order. It is adrenaline and noradrenaline that drives our brains and our bodies. I couldn't not share this. Finally I am pretty sure this is the solid cure for PSSD and Anhedonia. Your brain is fine, you've got adrenal fatigue and LICORICE ROOT SUPPLEMENT is one of the only ways to heal. I'll tell you now if you start taking it you will notice effects, but don't go mad be ve3ry patient. Take no more than one 450mg capsule a day, never take 2. This will gradually ehqal your adrenal glands and you will make a full recovery. Make sure you take for at least 6 months before giving up on it. Also if you are getting anxious and feeling depressed lower the frequency to maybe 5 a week or less, but stick with it low dose, every day, I'ts taken me at least 3 months to get my sex drive back, you may have to endure some anxiety at first, but trust me its worth it. I feel normal and functional again, thank god, I really couldn't go on much longer. Please give it a try, and be very patient expect it could take months to work as its a slow healing process, to see if you will respond ask yourself: do you sweat less? do you feel your heart racing less when you are anxious? do you feel disconnected from your body? do your testes feel dead? do you lack excitement? do you like thrill? do you never feel like going on a run and releasing your energy. If so you almost certainly have some form of adrenal fatigue, that will be all and thank God for Licorice root extract. Also I have taken small quantities of kudzu root to reduce serotonin, but only a small bit, I have taken no medicine for 2 months not a single tablet, I feel sorry for people going through what I've been through. SSRI's + depression = adrenal fatigue, please go and get better. Thanks.
One last note, please ride through the ups and downs of starting licorice root, keep persevering and you will succeed!
Posted by sigismund on December 8, 2010, at 15:20:12
In reply to RECOVERED!!!!!!! from PSSD AND ANHEDONIA!!!!!! » Conundrum, posted by ggggg123 on December 8, 2010, at 14:42:25
>ICORICE ROOT ITS THE NEXT BEST THING TO A MIRACLE!!!!!!!!!!
I'm not 100% sure of this, but the licorice root in my TCM mix may be increasing my sex drive.
Posted by Dr. Bob on December 9, 2010, at 19:17:00
In reply to RECOVERED!!!!!!! from PSSD AND ANHEDONIA!!!!!! » Conundrum, posted by ggggg123 on December 8, 2010, at 14:42:25
> you were quite rude to me
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
But please don't take this personally, either, this doesn't mean I don't like you or think you're a bad person, and I'm sorry if this hurts you.
I do hope that you choose to remain a member of this community and that members of this community help you, if needed, to avoid future blocks. If you want to be proactive, you could ask another poster to be your civility buddy:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#buddies
More information about posting policies and tips on alternative ways to express yourself, including a link to a nice post by Dinah on I-statements, are in the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#enforceConundrum, I'm also sorry if you felt hurt.
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Conundrum on December 9, 2010, at 23:26:31
In reply to RECOVERED!!!!!!! from PSSD AND ANHEDONIA!!!!!! » Conundrum, posted by ggggg123 on December 8, 2010, at 14:42:25
Glad to hear you are doing better on licorice root! I have high BP, so licorice root is a not on my radar. It can really increase cortisol, so while its great that it is help, you may want to check in at the pharmacy every once and a while and get a BP reading.
I'm skeptical about herbs for my condition, I have never responded well to them. Most did nothing for me. Some herbs left me with permanent conditions. For instance I took some herbs and haven't had normal bowel movements in years. Also they can contain heavy metals, and unfortunately are regulated in the U.S.
I understand where you are coming from, because when I came off SSRIs, I was sort of the same way. I thought vitamins and herbs were the way to go, but I've gotten burned by herbs twice, so to me they're just as risky as drugs, for someone who has a body like mine, that doesn't seem to like returning to homeostasis.
Also its interesting, I had a discussion with another poster about anhedonia, and how it seems to manifest differently in different ppl. Like I have occasionally run, I have high BP, and my testes aren't numb, the other part is. Also when I am nervous my heart beats faster and I sweat, but for my anhedonia, I might have the physical part without actually feeling the anxiety. This is especially true, in drugs that have normally caused anxiety in people, like higher doses of ritalin or wellbutrin, it just causes palpatation and twitchyness in me, but I know that its not really anxiety. In someways, I feel some disconnect from my body like in having a numb peter, but also I notice more aches and pains now. Its weird how the genitals are really sensitive to drug induced desensitization. For me the lack of energy seems to come on the mental end, not a run down body. I could ride my bike for a couple miles, or maybe run around the block twice now, if I cared enough to do it.
Perhaps your testes feel better since licorice root can decrease serum testosterone, maybe production was too high.
http://medherb.com/Materia_Medica/Glycyrrhiza_-_Licorice_root_and_testosterone.htm
Licorice also root is a mild serotonin reuptake inhibitor, so it may help with some mild depression.
"Inhibition of serotonin re-uptake by licorice constituents "
http://www.springerlink.com/content/88v431662136281l/> Conudrum, hi, although you were quite rude to me, I would like to update you on my success in recovery. My sex drive is getting very strong, also everything else is coming flooding back, Iam 100% at times dropping to 90% at other times, I have been taking LICORICE ROOT FOR A FEW MONTHS, IT TOOK ALMOST 3 MONTHS TO START TO NOTICE CHANGES. I kept telling myself I cannot be damaged these drugs are tested on millions. Also I knew it wasn't just the sex drive, I never got excited, I never got thrilled, I never got scared, goosebumps or heavy sweating. I used to be quite nervous and sweat alot, all this had gone. As we both know norepinephrine plays a massive part, its just about how do we get the adrenal glands working again. LICORICE ROOT ITS THE NEXT BEST THING TO A MIRACLE!!!!!!!!!! I am being 100% serious, thank God, I really thought I was stuck in a life of anhedonia, with no hope. just lay there with no feelings, no enjoyment. Just feeling very flat and cold. But now its back, sorry to be graphic but i feel like my testicles are alive again, i feel very sexual, its like when you are full of adrenaline the testes are filled with life and so is the brain. I think it has to do with adrenaline and noradrenaline. When I am nervous my heart now races once again, I can sleep easily through the night and love my sleep, I also enjoy exercising and being active. This is a gift a gift of the highest order. It is adrenaline and noradrenaline that drives our brains and our bodies. I couldn't not share this. Finally I am pretty sure this is the solid cure for PSSD and Anhedonia. Your brain is fine, you've got adrenal fatigue and LICORICE ROOT SUPPLEMENT is one of the only ways to heal. I'll tell you now if you start taking it you will notice effects, but don't go mad be ve3ry patient. Take no more than one 450mg capsule a day, never take 2. This will gradually ehqal your adrenal glands and you will make a full recovery. Make sure you take for at least 6 months before giving up on it. Also if you are getting anxious and feeling depressed lower the frequency to maybe 5 a week or less, but stick with it low dose, every day, I'ts taken me at least 3 months to get my sex drive back, you may have to endure some anxiety at first, but trust me its worth it. I feel normal and functional again, thank god, I really couldn't go on much longer. Please give it a try, and be very patient expect it could take months to work as its a slow healing process, to see if you will respond ask yourself: do you sweat less? do you feel your heart racing less when you are anxious? do you feel disconnected from your body? do your testes feel dead? do you lack excitement? do you like thrill? do you never feel like going on a run and releasing your energy. If so you almost certainly have some form of adrenal fatigue, that will be all and thank God for Licorice root extract. Also I have taken small quantities of kudzu root to reduce serotonin, but only a small bit, I have taken no medicine for 2 months not a single tablet, I feel sorry for people going through what I've been through. SSRI's + depression = adrenal fatigue, please go and get better. Thanks.
> One last note, please ride through the ups and downs of starting licorice root, keep persevering and you will succeed!
Posted by creepy on December 17, 2010, at 15:38:44
In reply to Anhedonia and Effexor., posted by Economist on November 27, 2010, at 1:00:21
Usually I read about TCAs as a class being good on melancholic depression / anhedonia. I just started zoloft which is supposedly pretty good on that.
Posted by Dr. Bob on December 18, 2010, at 15:39:43
In reply to Re: blocked for week » ggggg123, posted by Dr. Bob on December 9, 2010, at 19:17:00
> Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration.
Here's a link:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20101201/msgs/973900.html
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by anhedonia2013 on January 9, 2013, at 3:23:59
In reply to RECOVERED!!!!!!! from PSSD AND ANHEDONIA!!!!!! » Conundrum, posted by ggggg123 on December 8, 2010, at 14:42:25
Just out of curiosity, ggggg123, was your anhedonia as a result of taking an SSRI?
This is the end of the thread.
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