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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 27. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 1:01:55
I have a question, I am going to see my pysch on Tuesday as an emergency, I normally see him every month along with an addiction counsellor every two weeks in the same department on other days which I opted for myself as the so called psychotherapist who only turned out to be a social worker and caused me great stress in my first session so I ended up reporting him .
They work as a team, this has been going on for the last year, I have told them both that I have abused my meds in the past and that I have also had an alcohol problem of which I was clean and sober for 5 years.
I did state at one session last year with doc that I didn't want any benzos because it was likely I could abuse them but now my life is so bad I need them.
This is where my problem lies as they don't seem to want to medicate me properly for my severe anxiety and seem to just say it's my addiction.
I have done anti anxiety classes for weeks, been to NA and AA for years, working 12 step programs, you name it I've tried it but all to no avail.
I've told the psych before about my suicidal tendency's.
I started self medicating with codeine "Neurofen plus tabs" to relieve the anxiety and ended up withdrawing in the psych unit for three days but I seriously think my anxiety was not codeine related as It was as bad before I took them as It is 8months clean, it just builds and builds and I'm frightened that I will drink again or do something stupid.
I'm so confused, even when I was actively drinking or using I have never felt so bad with anxiety and depression.
They have me on Lexapro 30mgs and zimovane 7.5mgs a day and as you can see from earlier posts my anxiety has levelled off after I stopped using zopiclone and started on Dalmapam 30mg which i got from a friend but I still may need something to get me to sleep at night.
The doc did try me on Valdoxan which escalated my depression although it did help me to sleep a little better but it proved to be a no go as it done nothing for my anxiety.
Is it possible that they will ever give me something like Dalmane which seems to work for me. I feel that by me telling them the truth about my addictions has caused them to let me suffer on.
Are psychs not allowed to medicate you properly if you have told them in the past about your addictions?
I've tried several other ssri's but they have always had a worse affect on me.
I am really worn out from the constant anxiety and losing so much weight that my clothe don't fit me any more and worse still been brushed off as an addict looking for a fix each time I visit them.
I just fall to pieces each time I see him and can't seem to tell how severe this anxiety is and that it will be the cause of me ending it all as I can't face a future with this.
Even a phone call sends shivers up my spine, somebody calling to the door, driving. etc
I wonder which is worse being hooked on tranquillisers or suicide.
Sorry for being so morbid but I really don't know who else to turn to for advice.
Thank you,
theconfusedone
Posted by ed_uk2010 on May 30, 2010, at 3:15:56
In reply to Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 1:01:55
Hi there,
I'm sorry to hear that you're feeling so awful. I hope your appointment goes well on Tuesday.
>Are psychs not allowed to medicate you properly if you have told them in the past about your addictions?
They are, but they will probably be very cautious. Here in the UK, chlordiazepoxide (Librium) tends to be the preferred benzo for those with a history of drug misuse because it has a relatively low abuse potential. It's particularly used for alcohol withdrawal symptoms. Diazepam (Valium) is used for withdrawal from benzos and sleeping pills. Not sure whether this is the same in Ireland.
Posted by manic666 on May 30, 2010, at 3:45:09
In reply to Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 1:01:55
you are doing the classic to many med changes//be it alchol, shrink meds, doc meds. over the counter meds/// i was that man //still can be, its easy to panic in the middle of panic//open you mouth a stick anything in//a little brandy ooooooopps its now a bottle///2 ativan ooooopps it now 12//i will set meself a limit i will be cool at that//oooooooooopps im over the limit what now///down im afraid is the only place to go before getting better//self medication is for short term//so people can go on a bender for a week an come out the right side ..very rare im afraid// you need help bad with this one but you will suffer ther is no other way//if you could be sedated say in hospital an monitored in withdralw over a time that would be cool //but the chances of that treatment are very slim//your cast as a self medicator so its you fault no matter how ill you are//its a bummer//unless you take that onboard an admit it//the help wont come/its down to you to level at what you can achieve//its not easy ,but i did it
Posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 4:54:45
In reply to Re: Suicidal!! » theconfusedone, posted by ed_uk2010 on May 30, 2010, at 3:15:56
> Hi there,
>
> I'm sorry to hear that you're feeling so awful. I hope your appointment goes well on Tuesday.
>
> >Are psychs not allowed to medicate you properly if you have told them in the past about your addictions?
>
> They are, but they will probably be very cautious. Here in the UK, chlordiazepoxide (Librium) tends to be the preferred benzo for those with a history of drug misuse because it has a relatively low abuse potential. It's particularly used for alcohol withdrawal symptoms. Diazepam (Valium) is used for withdrawal from benzos and sleeping pills. Not sure whether this is the same in Ireland.
>
>
> Thank you Ed, I hope so too, I have taken Librium in the past and done so with daily prescriptions just in case and it worked well.
Posted by Phillipa on May 30, 2010, at 10:48:59
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 4:54:45
So the librium does help you also? Keep posting here for support til Tuesday. Hoping that your doctors listen to you. And please open up to them. Do they work as a team. Three heads are sometimes better than one. Hoping you get some relief from the anxiety. Love Phillipa
Posted by manic666 on May 30, 2010, at 11:08:54
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 4:54:45
if you were an heroin addict ,,you would get all the help you need//but benzo addiction nobody knows what to do with you//you can get off heroin in a week in hospital with backup after//it can take years for benzo,s//they put you on them an panick when addicted an try to push the blaim on you///you can ring a crisis team an they say //its bad i no, but you will have to stick it out//there probably sat at home on the couch whatching britians got talent an your climbing the walls/// night nurse helps you sleep but you will get addicted to that //they only sell you 1 bottle its a smackhead favorit //at least you see someone ,i had weeks without p doc help in england, they up an leave all the time as most are locoms chaseing the money///i had to go into hospital , but i dont recomend that only has a last resort //there is no help in there only makes you more depressed//you dont seem to have a withdrawl prob more anxierty from not being able to get help//if you keep abuseing meds then they think less about you//you no the score ,we carnt help you if you dont help yourself//my wife has my meds hidden i carnt touch them //that was the hospital an gp ruleing or i got nothing
Posted by floatingbridge on May 30, 2010, at 14:48:01
In reply to Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 1:01:55
Hey there--. Are you in Ireland (don't know the laws there)? Do you have limited doctor choices?
Do you have access to librium now, or are you waiting until Tuesday? (Too many questions in a row--sorry.) It seems outrageous that no one has regarded your weight loss as symptom of under or improper medication.
I hope you get the treatment you need asap. Do you have an idea of the medication you would like to have or what would work?
What are you doing to keep yourself together in the meantime? Have anyone with you or calling/emailing folks? Sometimes lots of mindless t.v. helped me get through.
Keep posting!
fb
Posted by floatingbridge on May 30, 2010, at 14:56:14
In reply to Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 1:01:55
Do you have a na or aa sponsor, or some friends from there? You are not the only one dealing w/ anxiety. I'm wondering if they have info for you and access to other healthcare providers. NA where I live is very open-minded. Lots of folks need psych meds. That's why they had addiction issues to begin with.
Any allies there?
Also, a bit extreme, but could you get better treatment in a psych ward or day hospital? I personally did not. Just a thought--though maybe a bad one. If there was a GOOD hospital near you....
Best to you!
fb
Posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 15:24:51
In reply to Re: Suicidal!! » theconfusedone, posted by Phillipa on May 30, 2010, at 10:48:59
> So the librium does help you also? Keep posting here for support til Tuesday. Hoping that your doctors listen to you. And please open up to them. Do they work as a team. Three heads are sometimes better than one. Hoping you get some relief from the anxiety. Love Phillipa
Hi Phillipa, the librium does help me a little but I just dread asking for it again but I think I will after all the sleeping meds that I was put on were supposed to be non-addictive so the psych said.
He just doesn't seem to understand withdrawals, not too long ago he cut me straight off lexapro 30mg with no tapering process and the withdrawals were so horrific.
My mum gave me some dalmane 15mgs to get me through till Tuesday but I don't know whether or not I should tell him this as I'm afraid he'll just give me the boot.
Thank you for your well wishes Phillipa, it means so much to me at this time.
theconfusedone
Posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 15:38:58
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by manic666 on May 30, 2010, at 11:08:54
> if you were an heroin addict ,,you would get all the help you need//but benzo addiction nobody knows what to do with you//you can get off heroin in a week in hospital with backup after//it can take years for benzo,s//they put you on them an panick when addicted an try to push the blaim on you///you can ring a crisis team an they say //its bad i no, but you will have to stick it out//there probably sat at home on the couch whatching britians got talent an your climbing the walls/// night nurse helps you sleep but you will get addicted to that //they only sell you 1 bottle its a smackhead favorit //at least you see someone ,i had weeks without p doc help in england, they up an leave all the time as most are locoms chaseing the money///i had to go into hospital , but i dont recomend that only has a last resort //there is no help in there only makes you more depressed//you dont seem to have a withdrawl prob more anxierty from not being able to get help//if you keep abuseing meds then they think less about you//you no the score ,we carnt help you if you dont help yourself//my wife has my meds hidden i carnt touch them //that was the hospital an gp ruleing or i got nothing
Hi Manic,
I wish I could sit still enough to watch television but I find it quite hard to concentrate on anything and I cant sit still for a minute.
My wife is watching me all the time in case I try run and do something stupid but she still wants me to battle it out without anything.
I don't think she will take the responsibility of having my meds though..
I wish it was as easy as that, even my last trip to the psych ward when I was leaving they gave me daily scripts for librium but never once said anything to her about hiding them from me.
I do agree though the psych ward can make you even more depressed and I so much do not want to end up back in there. I have a few dalmane 15mg tabs which my mum gave me to tide me over till Tuesday but I don't know whether to be straight up an honest to the psych about them as it seems to be frowned upon.
Posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 15:51:48
In reply to Re: Suicidal!! » theconfusedone, posted by floatingbridge on May 30, 2010, at 14:48:01
> Hey there--. Are you in Ireland (don't know the laws there)? Do you have limited doctor choices?
> yes I'm in Ireland and I have only one psych in my town.
> Do you have access to librium now, or are you waiting until Tuesday?
> I don't have access to Librium but I do have a few Dalmane 15mgs to get me through till Tuesday, I will only take them if things get really worse.(Too many questions in a row--sorry.) It seems outrageous that no one has regarded your weight loss as symptom of under or improper medication.
> Yes I've told them the way I feel and how I can't and dont have the desire to eat.
> I hope you get the treatment you need asap. Do you have an idea of the medication you would like to have or what would work?>I haven't a clue maybe Librium .
> What are you doing to keep yourself together in the meantime? Have anyone with you or calling/emailing folks?>I have my wife here but I'm not great company to be around at the mo and the thoughts of anyone calling just frightens me.
Sometimes lots of mindless t.v. helped me get through.
>
> Keep posting!
>
> fb>Thanks FB
theconfusedone
Posted by Phillipa on May 30, 2010, at 19:40:46
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 15:24:51
So lexapro at 30mg helped you and they pulled you off it just like that? Why? Are SSRI's considered bad so to speak in Ireland. Could this horrific anxiety be related to the lexapro withdrawal? Just a though. Phillipa
Posted by manic666 on May 31, 2010, at 3:33:23
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 15:51:48
i didnt say whatch tv/i no thats off the scope at this moment //nothing register,s, get out walking i walked for miles ,when i could //just mindless walking, it at least makes you sleep when you get back///but dont do as i did an forget where an what i was doing some times an have to be rescued by my family //i had to take 2 mobile phones for back up if i got lost ///grazy days
Posted by ed_uk2010 on May 31, 2010, at 4:10:06
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 30, 2010, at 15:24:51
>My mum gave me some Dalmane 15mgs to get me through till Tuesday but I don't know whether or not I should tell him this as I'm afraid he'll just give me the boot.
I think he might react badly if he knew you were taking someone else's meds.
I think it would be best to tell him that you feel you might be having withdrawal symptoms from Zimovane during the day, which match the symptoms listed in the Irish Medicines Compendium. Because Zimovane is a short acting drug, withdrawal symptoms can occur between doses, not just when stopping treatment.
Here is a link to the Irish Medicines Compendium (which clearly explains the risk of dependence and withdrawal symptoms)......
http://www.medicines.ie/medicine/12555/SPC/Zimovane+7.5mg+Film-coated+Tablets/
Withdrawal symptoms such as 'headaches, muscle pain, extreme anxiety, tension, restlessness, confusion and irritability etc'
'Treatment should be as short as possible. Generally the duration of treatment varies from a few days to two weeks with a maximum, including tapering off of four weeks.'
You could ask you doctor for help coming of Zimovane, in which case he might recommend a short course of a benzodiazepine at a low dose, since you anxiety is severe.
Posted by manic666 on May 31, 2010, at 4:30:23
In reply to Re: Suicidal!! » theconfusedone, posted by ed_uk2010 on May 31, 2010, at 4:10:06
i wanted to say that ed but with his past med probs//they may no give him them///if meds have been abused benzos are the last thing you get///have you an a an e they may give you a ativan shot if they see your really bad//but that will only help abot 4 hours//ask them if they will give a script //its worth a try//but dont abuse them if they do//its tempting to over dose a little on med //then you run out an have none
Posted by theconfusedone on May 31, 2010, at 15:17:00
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by manic666 on May 31, 2010, at 3:33:23
Hi Folks,
just to let you all know I'm doing fine today, just headaches and aching joints but I have no anxiety, it is def the zopiclone that was causing it.
I haven't touched it now in three or four days and just take one dalmane 15mgs at night time which i plan to stop 2morrow and go it alone.
I have a nice bit of work lined up for at least a week and and half so I plan to work hard to tire myself out in the evenings. If I don't sleep 2morrow night than maybe I will the next but I'm not touching those zopiclone or dalmane.
I have cancelled my emergency appointment with the psych for 2morrow as I will be seeing him again anyway in a week.
Thank you all for the advice and kind support it was much appreciated and I def. plan to have a word with my psych about the meds.
theconfusedone
Posted by theconfusedone on May 31, 2010, at 15:40:31
In reply to Re: Suicidal!! » theconfusedone, posted by ed_uk2010 on May 31, 2010, at 4:10:06
>
> I think it would be best to tell him that you feel you might be having withdrawal symptoms from Zimovane during the day, which match the symptoms listed in the Irish Medicines Compendium. Because Zimovane is a short acting drug, withdrawal symptoms can occur between doses, not just when stopping treatment.
>
> Here is a link to the Irish Medicines Compendium (which clearly explains the risk of dependence and withdrawal symptoms)......
>
> http://www.medicines.ie/medicine/12555/SPC/Zimovane+7.5mg+Film-coated+Tablets/
>
> Withdrawal symptoms such as 'headaches, muscle pain, extreme anxiety, tension, restlessness, confusion and irritability etc'
>
> 'Treatment should be as short as possible. Generally the duration of treatment varies from a few days to two weeks with a maximum, including tapering off of four weeks.'
>
> You could ask you doctor for help coming of Zimovane, in which case he might recommend a short course of a benzodiazepine at a low dose, since you anxiety is severe.
I really am struggling to believe what I'm reading, my doc is a bloody "quack"
I am going to print this off and stick it in his face when I see him next..
Thank you so much..
>
>
>
>
>
>
Posted by Phillipa on May 31, 2010, at 20:16:59
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 31, 2010, at 15:40:31
So glad to read your're doing so much better. Phillipa
Posted by theconfusedone on June 1, 2010, at 12:08:08
In reply to Re: Suicidal!! » theconfusedone, posted by Phillipa on May 31, 2010, at 20:16:59
> So glad to read your're doing so much better. Phillipa
Thank you phillipa, today has been another good day with minimum anxiety, still zopiclone free.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on June 1, 2010, at 13:29:25
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on May 31, 2010, at 15:40:31
>I really am struggling to believe what I'm reading....
Glad you're feeling much better. I think you'll probably be fine once you stop the Dalmane but if you're not, you will probably benefit from a few days treatment with a long-acting benzo. Dalmane is very long-acting but it's not ideal for tapering because it's not available in sufficiently low strength capsules. Diazepam 2mg tablets are helpful because they can be used to reduce the dose gradually.
Posted by Phillipa on June 1, 2010, at 19:50:29
In reply to Re: Suicidal!! » Phillipa, posted by theconfusedone on June 1, 2010, at 12:08:08
Glad you let us know. So now meds since cancelled appointment? Phillipa
Posted by theconfusedone on June 4, 2010, at 13:27:34
In reply to Re: Suicidal!! » theconfusedone, posted by Phillipa on June 1, 2010, at 19:50:29
> Glad you let us know. So now meds since cancelled appointment? Phillipa
>
Hi Phillipa, sorry for delay getting back, I'm taking sleepeaze at the mo at night but they are coming to an end so I'll be going it alone after that. I have taking the odd dalmane 15mg also on the bad nights but anxiety and depression has lifted considerably.
I'll be back at psych on the 11th so I will explain all except the dalmane part maybe.
All is going very good at the mo just so glad to know it was the zopiclone that was escalating my anxiety.
Is there any safer sleeping med I could suggest that doesn't have those side affects??? I cant buy sleepeaze over the counter here as they can only be bought in Boots in England..
theconfusedone
Posted by Phillipa on June 4, 2010, at 20:37:53
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on June 4, 2010, at 13:27:34
No problem glad your're feeling better. Do you feel that the reaction to the med was the opposite of what it should have been? No suggestions no idea what's availble there. Phillipa
Posted by theconfusedone on June 5, 2010, at 1:06:19
In reply to Re: Suicidal!! » theconfusedone, posted by Phillipa on June 4, 2010, at 20:37:53
> No problem glad your're feeling better. Do you feel that the reaction to the med was the opposite of what it should have been? No suggestions no idea what's availble there. Phillipa
> Well I felt that the zopiclone dependence was the root of it all.
I was on it far too long and I experienced all the symptoms that that were suggested to me here. I never thought for a minute it was that because I believed both my doctor and psych when they both said they were safe to take.
I did however reduce the Lexapro 30mg back to 20mgs but I don't think my problem was that as I was put on 40mgs before to try and ease anxiety and it made no difference how much I was taking.
It is great now however that when I wake during the night I dont have to take another zopiclone to get back to sleep. I can simply drift back without anything.
I'm still not fully out of the water though but I'm a hell of a lot better than I was for the the last year. I can eat and enjoy my food again although I still do have slight depression and a little anxiety.
I may still need something milder for sleep but if there's nothing safe there I'll suffer on as I can't risk going back to that awful place I was in. It's just to dangerous for me with my other addictions, alcohol, codeine, benzos etc.
Thanks again for being there for me and pointing me in the right direction.
I will definitely be posting here more and let you know of any changes made to my meds as feel you the are the people who know best as you've been there.
My psych. is retiring very soon so I hope I'll get a younger more reliable one in his place.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on June 7, 2010, at 14:43:04
In reply to Re: Suicidal!!, posted by theconfusedone on June 5, 2010, at 1:06:19
Hi again,
A variety of sedating antihistamines can be bought from a pharmacy without a prescription. I'm not sure which ones are available in Ireland....probably diphenhydramine under a different brand name. A pharmacist will be able to advise you. Sedating antihistamines are recommended for intermittent use. If you take them every night they won't work very well.
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