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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 31. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by SLS on March 3, 2009, at 8:44:44
1. What side effects would you be willing to suffer if it meant you could emerge out of depression?
2. What side effects would you NOT be willing to suffer?
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on March 3, 2009, at 10:46:18
In reply to What would you trade for remission of depression?, posted by SLS on March 3, 2009, at 8:44:44
Scott for me don't think it's side effects. When someone asks me what I want my reply is to be who I was. That's a happy productive person. Just a simple life that is enjoyable. Phillipa
Posted by myco on March 3, 2009, at 11:23:23
In reply to What would you trade for remission of depression?, posted by SLS on March 3, 2009, at 8:44:44
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1) ACCEPTABLE: mild-moderate weight gain, insomnia, headaches, dizzyness, anorgasmia, some cognitive & memory disturbance2) DEAL-BREAKER: tardive dyskinesia, nausea, impotence, severe anxiety increase, severe weight gain, extreme cognitive & memory disturbance
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> 1. What side effects would you be willing to suffer if it meant you could emerge out of depression?
>
> 2. What side effects would you NOT be willing to suffer?
>
>
> - Scott
Posted by mav27 on March 3, 2009, at 13:52:14
In reply to What would you trade for remission of depression?, posted by SLS on March 3, 2009, at 8:44:44
> 1. What side effects would you be willing to suffer if it meant you could emerge out of depression?
>
> 2. What side effects would you NOT be willing to suffer?
>
>
> - ScottAll the imipramine ones thhat i currently have i can deal with, dry mouth, constipation, urinary hesitance, very slight sexual dysfunction and a little drowsiness (which is actually helping me sleep) and a bit of hypotension.
The only 2 i won't put up with is SSRI type complete sexual dysfunction, and feeling like an emotionless zombie.
Posted by seldomseen on March 3, 2009, at 14:06:15
In reply to What would you trade for remission of depression?, posted by SLS on March 3, 2009, at 8:44:44
When I first read your post I thought "What would I give up to never feel hopeless and worthless again?" Just about anything.
But this is about side effects so,
I could happily tolerate tremor, bruxism, anorgasmia, nausea, some cognitive problems, moderate weight gain, stuffy nose, sleepiness, migraine, other superficial things.
I would have to draw the line at life-threating complications like diabetes, cardiac problems, liver function.
Seldom.
Posted by sam K on March 3, 2009, at 15:05:58
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depression? » SLS, posted by seldomseen on March 3, 2009, at 14:06:15
anorgasma is such a downer...... bah. i dont have it right now though.
Posted by fayeroe on March 3, 2009, at 17:45:10
In reply to What would you trade for remission of depression?, posted by SLS on March 3, 2009, at 8:44:44
1. headaches
2. insomnia
3. dry mouth
4. ringing in ears
5. memory loss (cause if i'm not depressed it won't bother me)
1. weight gain
2. tremors
3. damage to liver, kidneys, etc.
4. speedy feeling
Posted by Incubusfan on March 3, 2009, at 18:47:32
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depression? » SLS, posted by fayeroe on March 3, 2009, at 17:45:10
I'd give up 20 years of actual life. Hell, I'd give up 20 years of my youth, not just at the tail end of my life if it meant remission.
Posted by yxibow on March 3, 2009, at 23:30:25
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depression? » SLS, posted by Phillipa on March 3, 2009, at 10:46:18
> Scott for me don't think it's side effects. When someone asks me what I want my reply is to be who I was. That's a happy productive person. Just a simple life that is enjoyable. Phillipa
And I'd also say I'd like to be who I was. But since we can't go back in time and we live in the here and now, the best success is constructing a new, happy, and productive person who through medication and therapy has learned to overcome their... grmm... its a clinical term "limitations"... that is, whatever may not be able to be controlled completely, because nothing is perfect.
Its one I wrestle with all the time. But mine is a complex set of things that has evolved and changed over the past seven years.I've already traded side effects for improvement at times -- there are neurological things that have occurred, things that couldn't have been predicted but are things I just don't recognize as the real me.
Its really a genie in the bottle question, and a fantasy -- a "phantasy"... because of course there are numerous things people would trade to be "normal". But nobody and I mean nobody out there is 'normal', whatever that is supposed to mean. If people somehow appear to be peachy, there's assuredly something in their life that bothers or hinders them in some way.
There's really no end of thoughts of what I would trade to not have an orphan disorder -- and I'm sure they'd be pretty hideous thoughts like a partially missing finger with a prosthetic or, I don't know... this is getting way off topic, but it does show that yes, I am desperate to be free from myself, I guess.It opens up Pandora's box.
So I can't say because things have already been traded by a twist of biochemicals and science and nature.
-- just a take on things
-- Jay
Posted by g_g_g_unit on March 4, 2009, at 5:36:18
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depression? » SLS, posted by seldomseen on March 3, 2009, at 14:06:15
It would depend on whether the side effects were short term or long term. In the long term anything except cognitive, sleep, or social functioning disturbances
Posted by Phillipa on March 4, 2009, at 20:09:29
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depression? » Phillipa, posted by yxibow on March 3, 2009, at 23:30:25
Jay lots of posters report on feeling their old self when their meds works. Not asking for time lost as it's gone but feeling good is the goal of meds isn't it? Love Phillipa
Posted by HyperFocus on March 5, 2009, at 5:29:22
In reply to What would you trade for remission of depression?, posted by SLS on March 3, 2009, at 8:44:44
Not willing: cognitive and memory impairment, neurological degenerative disease, damage to major organs and systems, development of chronic diseases like diabetes or hypertension
Willing: pretty much anything except the ones above.
> 1. What side effects would you be willing to suffer if it meant you could emerge out of depression?
>
> 2. What side effects would you NOT be willing to suffer?
>
>
> - Scott
Posted by SLS on March 5, 2009, at 5:56:28
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi, posted by HyperFocus on March 5, 2009, at 5:29:22
> Not willing: cognitive and memory impairment, neurological degenerative disease, damage to major organs and systems, development of chronic diseases like diabetes or hypertension
>
> Willing: pretty much anything except the ones above.
Me too.
- Scott
Posted by desolationrower on March 5, 2009, at 6:18:44
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi, posted by HyperFocus on March 5, 2009, at 5:29:22
I haven't entered the 'bargaining' stage yet, scott.
-d/r
Posted by SLS on March 5, 2009, at 6:57:48
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi, posted by desolationrower on March 5, 2009, at 6:18:44
> I haven't entered the 'bargaining' stage yet, scott.
>
> -d/rKübler-Ross model?
Anger?
One can flip flop and travel among the different stages of grief. I stayed in the anger stage the longest. I might still be there from time to time, I don't really know. Depression is supposed to be the longest stage. I have become depressed over my condition episodically, but infrequently. I felt it was important not to allow depression to take hold, so I worked actively to process the loss. I have definitely reached a level of acceptance, but that doesn't abolish the frustration of trying to function while impaired and the anger that can come of it. I always prayed to God for my healing, but I never bargained with Him. I felt that the ways of the Universe were his alone and not mine to question. If it was meant to be, then I would eventually be healed. I think this kind of spirituality helped me get through some very dark times.
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on March 5, 2009, at 19:21:38
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi, posted by SLS on March 5, 2009, at 6:57:48
Scott this may sound very dumb. Did you ever go without any meds at all? Love Phillipa
Posted by SLS on March 6, 2009, at 6:22:09
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi » SLS, posted by Phillipa on March 5, 2009, at 19:21:38
> Scott this may sound very dumb. Did you ever go without any meds at all? Love Phillipa
When I was in my 20's, and SSRIs had not come out yet, I would sometimes go many months without taking anything. At the time, there was nothing left to take.
- Scott
Posted by Meltingpot on March 6, 2009, at 13:02:16
In reply to What would you trade for remission of depression?, posted by SLS on March 3, 2009, at 8:44:44
Hi,
I'd accept Diarraeh (not sure how to spell it though and I know it sounds yukky but I had it when I first ever took Seroxat, when it worked and I could have lived with the stomach upsets because my mood was so good).
I'd accept constipation.
I'd accept high blood pressure.
I'd accept weight gain (I could do with it anyway) but then I probably would try and get rid of it somehow.
I'd accept some memory problems.
I'd accept headaches (now and again).
I might accept reduced sex drive (as I don't currently have one anyway so wouldn't make much difference)
I'd accept outbreaks of spots and pimples.
I wouldn't accept:-
Increased anxiety
InsommniaDenise
Posted by Meltingpot on March 6, 2009, at 13:06:27
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depression?, posted by Meltingpot on March 6, 2009, at 13:02:16
I forgot to mention, I would probably accept some form of twitch as well (at least I think I would).
I would happily give 20 years of my life (i'm not enjoying it anyway) for just 5 years of being depression free. So if somebody said I could trade and have five good years but would die at the end of it, I would go for it.
Denise
Posted by Phillipa on March 6, 2009, at 20:25:20
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi » Phillipa, posted by SLS on March 6, 2009, at 6:22:09
Seriously were you severly depressed when on no meds? I'm sorry. Love Phillipa
Posted by SLS on March 7, 2009, at 5:58:16
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi » SLS, posted by Phillipa on March 6, 2009, at 20:25:20
> Seriously were you severly depressed when on no meds? I'm sorry. Love Phillipa
I spent entire days staring at the wall and could barely get myself off the couch to eat. In fact, while eating, I often had to pause while bringing the fork to my mouth just to regain enough energy to make it the rest of the way. Depression is such a hideous illness.
- Scott
Posted by meltingpot on March 7, 2009, at 13:28:54
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi » Phillipa, posted by SLS on March 7, 2009, at 5:58:16
Scott,
My God, I never realised you were that bad. What goes through your mind when you are in that state?
How did you manage to get yourself to any appointments?
Denise
Posted by yxibow on March 8, 2009, at 0:54:32
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depression? » yxibow, posted by Phillipa on March 4, 2009, at 20:09:29
> Jay lots of posters report on feeling their old self when their meds works. Not asking for time lost as it's gone but feeling good is the goal of meds isn't it? Love Phillipa
Of course it is -- but its not the only part of progress, as I have mentioned. Medicine can only go so far, rehabilitation really should include psychological work as well.
Unfortunately my personal disorder is an orphan disorder and there is no one medication, or 6 or 7 of them for that matter that addresses it. It has no name for it and its origin is idiopathic.
For a while Seroquel was great for me, now it holds me just together for ordinary functionality.
I don't remember what it was like to feel 'normal', before Nov 17, 2001 any more.
My case though, and I'm trying not to get deeper into my depression I guess by talking in the third person, is probably unique to this board.
Hence, I am glad that people feel "their old self", but it is hard for me to identify that way.
Hopefully some day I will have overcome most of it through medication -and- psychological help.
I won't be the same person because its impossible to be 26 again. If this sounds odd, it is perhaps, but I have to come to terms with some things.
At any rate I'm rambling.
I guess my point is that remission of symptoms unless biologically and genetically based brain chemistry has shifted for the better, remission of symptoms by medicine is always going to be a palliative.That is, though you feel better, once you remove the medication, and things haven't shifted in the meantime, it is likely that the symptoms will come back.
I'm not trying to be maudlin, its just the way that those of us, call it mental illness, I prefer biochemical imbalance or something less stigmatic -- NAMI calls those who use doctors "consumers" now.
-- tidings-- Jay
Posted by SLS on March 8, 2009, at 8:49:28
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi, posted by meltingpot on March 7, 2009, at 13:28:54
> Scott,
>
> My God, I never realised you were that bad. What goes through your mind when you are in that state?Survival. The acceptance of pain.
> How did you manage to get yourself to any appointments?I don't know. Automatic pilot, I guess.
I don't usually describe exactly what my personal experiences were with severe depression in the way I did here. The NIMH considered me to be about the worst case they had ever seen. They actually took a few risks with me because "You are very sick." One risk they took landed me in bed and delirious for days. When I finally came out of it, I couldn't account for where I had lost so much time.
I guess I don't like to play "can you beat this" regarding severity of depression. I did meet one person whose depression was worse than mine. I had never seen so severe psychomotor retardation. Unfortunately, she took her own life several months later.
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on March 8, 2009, at 19:29:22
In reply to Re: What would you trade for remission of depressi » meltingpot, posted by SLS on March 8, 2009, at 8:49:28
Scott that must have frightened you horribly. I do remember a man who slept for two weeks woke up and acted "normal". Said to me that's what he always did. So sorry you went through this. You're a very strong Man and to be commended. Love Phillipa
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