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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by B2chica on September 2, 2008, at 8:51:31
In reply to N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 7:02:08
i can't seem to find it. do you look in a normal drug store (with vitamins) or do you have to go to some place that specializes in supplements??
b2c.
Posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 10:38:45
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » SLS, posted by B2chica on September 2, 2008, at 8:51:31
> i can't seem to find it. do you look in a normal drug store (with vitamins) or do you have to go to some place that specializes in supplements??
>
> b2c.I got mine from Vitamin Shoppe. If you go with the store brand, it costs about $23 for a few months worth. At the moment, I am taking 1200mg (600mg b.i.d.).
- Scott
Posted by Justherself54 on September 2, 2008, at 11:23:12
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 10:38:45
Keep us updated please! My depression is what we can't get under control.
Posted by Phillipa on September 2, 2008, at 12:13:25
In reply to N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 7:02:08
Scott only bipolar and what subthreshold? Thanks Phillipa
Posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 14:14:51
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » SLS, posted by Phillipa on September 2, 2008, at 12:13:25
> Scott only bipolar and what subthreshold? Thanks Phillipa
So far, I doubt NAC has been studied well enough to be able to exclude its utility in unipolar depression. I'm not sure, but the word "subthreshold" could be used as a term similar to "subsyndromal"; the residual depression that exists after treatment that may not qualify for the DSM diagnosis of Major Depressive Disorder.
- Scott
Posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on September 2, 2008, at 15:03:18
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 14:14:51
I will let you guys know how things are going in a few weeks-month or so. Jay :)
Posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 16:19:08
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine..Just picked up some today.. » SLS, posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on September 2, 2008, at 15:03:18
> I will let you guys know how things are going in a few weeks-month or so. Jay :)
Good luck!
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on September 2, 2008, at 20:27:10
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 14:14:51
Like dysthymia? Love Phillipa
Posted by Jimmyboy on September 6, 2008, at 23:04:59
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » SLS, posted by Phillipa on September 2, 2008, at 20:27:10
I think this is really interesting because I have found that whey protein has been somewhat helpful with my depression and whey protein has large amounts of the amino acid cysteine in it which later which in turn raises your supply of NAC.
NAC is very helpful for haywire immune systems - and I really believe many cases of biploar depression are caused by inflammation in the nervous system - chronic low grade inflammation in the nervous system would deplete your natural supply of NAC thus supplementing with it could be very helpful ( just my opinion)
Posted by desolationrower on September 6, 2008, at 23:59:08
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 14:14:51
I think its just as likely it is the glutamate-regulating ability of NAC that is responsible. Would be interested in reading the full text if anyone has it, I wonder if the authors discuss that.
-D/R
Posted by Kath on September 18, 2008, at 21:12:29
In reply to N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 7:02:08
Wow! That's about all I can say.
I guess I can also say, "Wonder how many doctors suggest it?"
thx for posting that , luv, Kath
Posted by Kath on September 18, 2008, at 21:16:22
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by SLS on September 2, 2008, at 14:14:51
> > Scott only bipolar and what subthreshold? Thanks Phillipa
>
> So far, I doubt NAC has been studied well enough to be able to exclude its utility in unipolar depression. I'm not sure, but the word "subthreshold" could be used as a term similar to "subsyndromal"; the residual depression that exists after treatment that may not qualify for the DSM diagnosis of Major Depressive Disorder.
>
>
> - Scott
*********Hi Scott - sorry to be dense. Just too tired to follow much. Basically - do you think it would help just 'regular' depression?I've certainly found that 5HTP & St. John's Wort helps me. Wondering if I should add this also. Do you know if it affects seratonin, as I guess using the above 2, one has to be careful regarding seratonin.
thx Kath
Posted by Kath on September 18, 2008, at 21:17:11
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine..Just picked up some today.. » SLS, posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on September 2, 2008, at 15:03:18
> I will let you guys know how things are going in a few weeks-month or so. Jay :)
**Thx Jay - please do & good luck. Kath
Posted by Kath on September 18, 2008, at 21:18:26
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by Jimmyboy on September 6, 2008, at 23:04:59
*****Wow - so interesting! Kath****
> I think this is really interesting because I have found that whey protein has been somewhat helpful with my depression and whey protein has large amounts of the amino acid cysteine in it which later which in turn raises your supply of NAC.
>
> NAC is very helpful for haywire immune systems - and I really believe many cases of biploar depression are caused by inflammation in the nervous system - chronic low grade inflammation in the nervous system would deplete your natural supply of NAC thus supplementing with it could be very helpful ( just my opinion)
>
>
Posted by desolationrower on September 18, 2008, at 22:59:21
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » SLS, posted by Kath on September 18, 2008, at 21:16:22
HEy Kath, it does not affect Serotonin, I think it is safe with those.
D/R
Posted by SLS on September 19, 2008, at 6:19:06
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » SLS, posted by Kath on September 18, 2008, at 21:16:22
> > > Scott only bipolar and what subthreshold? Thanks Phillipa
> >
> > So far, I doubt NAC has been studied well enough to be able to exclude its utility in unipolar depression. I'm not sure, but the word "subthreshold" could be used as a term similar to "subsyndromal"; the residual depression that exists after treatment that may not qualify for the DSM diagnosis of Major Depressive Disorder.
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
>
> *********Hi Scott - sorry to be dense. Just too tired to follow much. Basically - do you think it would help just 'regular' depression?
>
> I've certainly found that 5HTP & St. John's Wort helps me. Wondering if I should add this also. Do you know if it affects seratonin, as I guess using the above 2, one has to be careful regarding seratonin.I wouldn't want to venture a guess at how effective NAC would be for pure unipolar depression. However, in moderate amounts, it is advantageous to use NAC as an antioxidant and neuroprotector. There is even some speculation that it may foster the recovery of atrophied tissue and reverse the process of apoptosis. People with mood illness often have a deficit of glutathione, which is a by product of NAC metabolism. With this fact in mind, it is possible that NAC would indeed help treat unipolar depression. So much for not venturing a guess...
All in all, 600-1200mg of NAC taken daily in divided doses is a good thing for just about anyone.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on September 19, 2008, at 6:22:48
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » Kath, posted by desolationrower on September 18, 2008, at 22:59:21
> HEy Kath, it does not affect Serotonin, I think it is safe with those.
> D/RI agree with this. In fact, I am taking NAC in combination with Nardil (an MAOI) and nortriptyline (a mild 5-HT reuptake inhibitor). I haven't detected the least bit of serotonin syndrome.
- Scott
Posted by chiron on September 20, 2008, at 1:23:44
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by SLS on September 19, 2008, at 6:22:48
My pdoc suggested it:
am: 600mg 2-3
pm: 600mg 2-3
This looks like a lot, but I guess they did studies for schizophrenia up to 6000mg a day.
btw - I take Lamictal, Wellbutrin, Celexa, Xanax, Synthroid.
I haven't taken it very regularly and for very long to report on results.
Posted by SLS on September 20, 2008, at 8:24:00
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression, posted by chiron on September 20, 2008, at 1:23:44
> My pdoc suggested it:
> am: 600mg 2-3
> pm: 600mg 2-3
> This looks like a lot, but I guess they did studies for schizophrenia up to 6000mg a day.
> btw - I take Lamictal, Wellbutrin, Celexa, Xanax, Synthroid.
> I haven't taken it very regularly and for very long to report on results.Good luck. I hope to hear good things.
I don't know what kind of data was considered when establishing the study doages of NAC treatment for bipolar disorder. I doubt NAC has been studied in such a fashion as to determine a therapeutic range appropriate for treatment of mood disorders.
Theoretically, one would not want to take too much NAC, as it might prevent apoptosis (cell death) of cancer cells. If you do respond to 2400mg per day, a dosage not much higher than that used in the Berk study, you might at some point want to adjust the dosage downward to establish the minimum effective dosage for you.
- Scott
Posted by Kath on September 20, 2008, at 9:39:12
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » Kath, posted by SLS on September 19, 2008, at 6:19:06
***Thx DR & Scott, for your feedback***
>However, in moderate amounts, it is advantageous to use NAC as an antioxidant and neuroprotector.
***Scott, what does neuroprotector mean?***
There is even some speculation that it may foster the recovery of atrophied tissue and reverse the process of apoptosis.
***Would that be atrophied tissue anywhere in our body, do you think? What does apoptosis mean?
I'm going to start taking it!! Thanks for the information Scott.
love, kath
Posted by Kath on September 20, 2008, at 9:43:23
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » chiron, posted by SLS on September 20, 2008, at 8:24:00
Scott - I just read what that word means!
So it sounds as though only if you had cancer, you might want to be careful about taking NAC?
K
Posted by SLS on September 20, 2008, at 11:07:18
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » SLS, posted by Kath on September 20, 2008, at 9:43:23
> Scott - I just read what that word means!
>
> So it sounds as though only if you had cancer, you might want to be careful about taking NAC?
>
> KI should think that an oncologist would know more about it. After poking around a bit, though, I found that it seems to be advantageous to take N-acetylcysteine while treating various cancers.
At this point, I can't think of any reason to avoid NAC.
- Scott
Posted by desolationrower on September 20, 2008, at 12:41:07
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » Kath, posted by SLS on September 20, 2008, at 11:07:18
WEll there was that one study that gave rats a very large amount and it caused pulmonary artery hypertension. However the intereaction is complex. Overall i think it is neutral for mortality rate.
-D/R
Posted by Kath on September 21, 2008, at 12:29:05
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » Kath, posted by SLS on September 20, 2008, at 11:07:18
Hi Scott,
Unfortunately, my experience has been that alopathic doctors (the ones I've talked to) know less about 'alternative' type stuff than I do!!
I was just generally wondering about cancer. I wasn't worrying about myself in that regard.
I've started taking NAC & so has my husband!
cheers, Kath
Posted by paulk on June 20, 2009, at 23:08:10
In reply to Re: N-acetylcysteine and bipolar depression » SLS, posted by Kath on September 21, 2008, at 12:29:05
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&pubmedid=17786245
This makes taking it longterm, at a dose that works scary.
This is the end of the thread.
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