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Posted by ace on May 19, 2008, at 2:10:49
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by lady scruffe on May 16, 2008, at 16:33:14
> I have been on all psych drugs/augmented ect (seen numerous Docs, did ECT - NO ONE should do ECT. It gives new meaning to "the surgery was a success but the patient died")for the last 6 yrs (treatment resistent depression/GAD disabled from this since 2002) except MAOI's until about a month ago when I was on Parnate for 30 days. Even though I followed diet restrictions religiously - I ended up in the ER (ER Doc had no knowledge of this old class of drugs and went online in order to treat me) with high BP and my head about to explode from pain.I am starting Nardil tomorrow - please tell me
Glad to here you are on Nardil!
> Weight gain?
Yes, very possible. BUT, usually treatable with certain agents, and vigilance to diet/exercise regime.
> Other side effects?To be fair, there is a lot. However, many of these are short term, and most, if not all are manageble.
The ones I notice most, and myself experienced...
*Weight Increase
(Increased desire to eat sweet foods///? Metabolism changes)
*Anorgasmia
*Constipation (and possibly other GI probs)
*Sedation (although some get insomnia)
*Dizziness and Postural Hypotension (faded quickly)
There are more....All thes s/effecst are gone now with myself, except GI probs. I still get sedation but, which I like.I look back on the s/effects and I really love the fact I had them for some reason! It just reminds of the early days on this Gem of a medication!
> I am scared of this since my previous experience. Thanks
Try not be scared.....For hypertensive crises I have noticed far more risk with parnate.....
I would recommend nifedipine...many more some C. Channel Blockers......hope all goes well!!!!!!!!!
Ace:)
Posted by ace on May 19, 2008, at 2:13:56
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by undopaminergic on May 15, 2008, at 17:40:35
> >
> > I would suggest Nardil with a fast titration, up to a maximum of 60mg within 2 week, if you can tolerate any s/effects. On top of that i would suggest you continue with Valium (or another benzo) at a dose required. The drug TRAMADOL can also be of benefit (on a short term basis).
> >
>
> The use of tramadol under treatment with phenelzine (Nardil) or other potent MAOI should be approached with great caution, as the combination of monoamine oxidase inhibition with the serotonin reuptake inhibition of tramadol has the potential to precipitate the serotonin syndrome. If an opioid would be of use, codeine, oxycodone or any other drug free of serotonergic activity is safer.
I see what your saying here, although the combination posed no problem for myself. In addition I have seen (a few) anectodes on their combined use, and one clinical trial (which espoused the combination)
Tramadol acted extremely with with Nardil, but as you know we are all so individual with our reactions....
You caveat is warranted.
Posted by Fivefires on May 21, 2008, at 2:56:56
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... +raquo; Fivefires, posted by ace on May 19, 2008, at 1:31:30
Ace ... you click on my name. (See. It is sort of highlighted .. meaning I accept babble mail.) It is still private; not like an email or anything. When reply, be sure follow instructions there.
But hey, I think maybe it's too late re: Nardil. The side effects were too much for me and pdoc wouldn't approve for inpatient stabilization so I maybe took one yesterday. Can't remember. Awoke today very ill and I'd bet if weighed self, have lost 10lbs. Body pain hard because already have c-spine injury. Zombie feeling and no one to help w/ NADLs.
Thing is, I think I felt where you were going w/ this whole thing. There was a tapping into my own real feelings which made me recall the strong and assertive person I once was. Something was definitely happening.
So ... it's really a case of my being small, alone, no good management, and unable to tolerate the side effects.
Also there have been some things happen in my life here and here. Loved ones and friends seem to find me replaceable and my heart is broken, and I guess 'their shoulders are', so added to the difficulty.
And too, feels like health care for this illness sort of cuts down its clientele by just allowing pp to fall by the wayside, probably about $.
If I'm here and you're here, maybe we'll talk.
But, no matter, I appreciate your enthusiastic offer of support.
5f
Posted by undopaminergic on May 21, 2008, at 18:45:29
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... +raquo; undopaminergic, posted by ace on May 19, 2008, at 2:13:56
> > >
> > > I would suggest Nardil with a fast titration, up to a maximum of 60mg within 2 week, if you can tolerate any s/effects. On top of that i would suggest you continue with Valium (or another benzo) at a dose required. The drug TRAMADOL can also be of benefit (on a short term basis).
> > >
> >
> > The use of tramadol under treatment with phenelzine (Nardil) or other potent MAOI should be approached with great caution, as the combination of monoamine oxidase inhibition with the serotonin reuptake inhibition of tramadol has the potential to precipitate the serotonin syndrome. If an opioid would be of use, codeine, oxycodone or any other drug free of serotonergic activity is safer.
>
>
> I see what your saying here, although the combination posed no problem for myself. In addition I have seen (a few) anectodes on their combined use, and one clinical trial (which espoused the combination)
> Tramadol acted extremely with with Nardil, but as you know we are all so individual with our reactions....
> You caveat is warranted.
>Some people get rather severe reactions from the addition of a SSRI to selegiline at MAO-B selective doses, although I personally used the combination (with sertraline) without problems, and there have also been studies using these combinations; in other words, there is indeed a great deal of individual variation.
Posted by FredPotter on May 21, 2008, at 21:02:16
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... » lady scruffe, posted by ace on May 19, 2008, at 2:10:49
After 2 years I am still fat around the middle. What are the agents for weight loss people mention?
Posted by Phillipa on May 21, 2008, at 21:31:24
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by FredPotter on May 21, 2008, at 21:02:16
Fred where have you been? Still on nardil? love Phillipa
Posted by ace on May 21, 2008, at 23:45:10
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by FredPotter on May 21, 2008, at 21:02:16
> After 2 years I am still fat around the middle. What are the agents for weight loss people mention?
Hi mate! Topamax seems to work for a lot of people. In addition, Clonidine too.Drinking a LOT of water is also great- I tried this and it worked...
I will check out my list of meds to combat this annoying s/effect- There are quite a few....
Posted by Fivefires on May 22, 2008, at 2:49:35
In reply to Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by ace on May 5, 2008, at 23:36:34
Ace
Did I discouraged you from contacting me?
Was it because I said ...
Thing is, I think I felt where you were going w/ this whole thing. There was a tapping into my own real feelings which made me recall the strong and assertive person I once was. Something was definitely happening.
?
If you have a change of heart, pls contact.
I still have A LOT of interest in 'what it was that was happening and there is the possibility of my re-trying inpatient. I may be unable to correspond for a while, so, hope you'll see and write.
5f
Posted by FredPotter on May 22, 2008, at 21:26:19
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... » FredPotter, posted by ace on May 21, 2008, at 23:45:10
Oooo! Does mean I can drink vast quantities of beer? Thanks for the info Ace. I'll try the water. Can't it be dangerous in large quantities though? Fred
Posted by ace on May 22, 2008, at 23:53:14
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by Fivefires on May 22, 2008, at 2:49:35
> Ace
>
> Did I discouraged you from contacting me?No. not at all! I am all over the place now, so busy, loosing track of days!
I will get back to your mail ASAP- and I am sorry I did overlook it.
I am away from home now, so have limited net access, but I will absolutely answer....!
Get back real soon!
Ace
Posted by ace on May 22, 2008, at 23:56:49
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... » ace, posted by FredPotter on May 22, 2008, at 21:26:19
> Oooo! Does mean I can drink vast quantities of beer?
Ummmm....I wouldn't advise that!!!!
Thanks for the info Ace. I'll try the water. Can't it be dangerous in large quantities though?No probs Fred! It EXTREMELY large quantities it can pose risks, but I am talking about extreme amounts!!!!
Check it out on the web....just google "water and weight loss" I lost weight so easy! I was on Nardil, Zyprexa, and Remeron- all weight gainers big time! But the water helped so much....
Mother Nature does look after us!
Cheers Fred!
Ace:)
Fred
Posted by Phoenix1 on May 23, 2008, at 12:24:38
In reply to Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by ace on May 5, 2008, at 23:36:34
Hi Ace,
I've read a lot of your Nardil posts from the archives, and I really respect your opinions. I need your advice please. I failed to respond to over a dozen AD's until I tried Nardil. Then it was like a light bulb turned on and the depression and anxiety literally melted away. Everything was great for 7 months at 90mg.
Then, out of the blue, I developed severe orthostatic hypotension which quickly turned into fainting spells. Pdoc discontinued Nardil over 7 days. 1 day after my last nardil dose, I woke up blind, paralyzed, and confused. Was diagnosed with PRES, a reversible swelling of the back of the brain caused by blood pressure fluctuation.
I'm getting better neurologically now, but my depression has returned, and my pdoc will not prescribe Nardil for me ever again. He thinks it caused the PRES. I believe the quick withdrawal caused the PRES.
In any event, I want to self-treat myself with Nardil. I can easily get my hands on the meds. What are your thoughts on this? I just feel like life isn't worth living with my current level of depression, so my options are to take the Nardil at considerable risk, or to just end everything...
> Hey all......
>
> I havent been around a lot, but used to be preety regular here. I just want to repeat again my sentiments on Nardil, in the hope that this phenomenal medication could help someone in the way it helped myself.....
>
> I have been on Nardil around 7 years now. It has worked amazingly. The only time I have had problems is when I have not done the correct thing with regards to the drug.
>
> I strongly recommend the following....
>
> 1. Take Nardil at the same time(s) each day
> 2. Once you are on the right dose - STAY THERE!
> Do not go down, despite what so many uninformed say.
> 3. Do NOT STRESS about the diet! It is greatly overstated. I eat anything anytime, with no regards for the diet- I don't espouse that, but that's what I do- with no problem.
>
> IF I do have a problem, I use Nifedipine or Thorazine. Going to the hospital, I do NOT recommend, as nurses and doctors are not trained about MAOI's these days to any substanial degree.
>
>
>
> In closing, Nardil has changed my life. For so long, I had problems walking two feet out of my house without debilitating anxiety. For so long I suffered wretching depression. Nardil truly set me free to a very very high degree.
>
> When these problems have recurred at a high level, It has always been myself to blame! Not taking the drug at regular intervals...'forgetting' doses, etc etc
>
> I have also got severe OCD- Nardil DID help with this too, but, for the great part, Seroquel relieves me of these symptoms. Nardil wiped out my social phobia.
>
> One last thing- Nardil can very often create what I call a 'healthy euphoria". At such times, I would recommend one be vigilant to how much one spends, how one behaves.
>
> I used to be so socially phobic, I could not eat in front of others, I could not wear certain clothes for fear someone may disapprove, I could not approach the opposite sex.
>
> After 3 months on Nardil I was wearing anything I like, walking around, at times, with died hair and shirt off, asking literally 10 girls out on a date every day. It made, and makes me feel, happy to be alive. It seemed to also provide a sense of love for others- at times I would purposely 'bump' into others just so I could have the chance to smile, say 'sorry!
>
> I am now about to embark on my residency, with the view to being a psychiatrist (this still takes much time (and exams!)). When that time comes, I will not be on the drug. Without Nardil I don't think I would be at this level in my life.
>
> I truly hopes this might help someone....
>
> God Bless you All!
>
> Ace....
Posted by Fivefires on May 23, 2008, at 13:58:48
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... » Fivefires, posted by ace on May 22, 2008, at 23:53:14
Ace ... just lost three paragraph post.
Think in withdrawal ... agitation, rapid heart beat, labored breathing like long drawn out hyperventilating, lost weight/fluids.
No help from medical resources. o_o
Can't re-type all again now as too ill.
Will do tho'.
tks, 5f
Posted by undopaminergic on May 23, 2008, at 16:29:39
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... » FredPotter, posted by ace on May 21, 2008, at 23:45:10
> > After 2 years I am still fat around the middle. What are the agents for weight loss people mention?
>
>
> Hi mate! Topamax seems to work for a lot of people.
>Another anticonvulsant that might work is zonisamide. The anti-diabetic agent metformin can also be useful.
> In addition, Clonidine too.
I would favour guanfacine over clonidine, if possible, as clondidine tends to be rather sedating.
Posted by undopaminergic on May 24, 2008, at 14:39:24
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... » ace, posted by Phoenix1 on May 23, 2008, at 12:24:38
>
> I've read a lot of your Nardil posts from the archives, and I really respect your opinions. I need your advice please. I failed to respond to over a dozen AD's until I tried Nardil. Then it was like a light bulb turned on and the depression and anxiety literally melted away. Everything was great for 7 months at 90mg.
>
> Then, out of the blue, I developed severe orthostatic hypotension which quickly turned into fainting spells. Pdoc discontinued Nardil over 7 days. 1 day after my last nardil dose, I woke up blind, paralyzed, and confused. Was diagnosed with PRES, a reversible swelling of the back of the brain caused by blood pressure fluctuation.
>
> I'm getting better neurologically now, but my depression has returned, and my pdoc will not prescribe Nardil for me ever again. He thinks it caused the PRES. I believe the quick withdrawal caused the PRES.
>The fluctuations of blood pressure were the problem that caused PRES. A rapid elevation of blood pressure following Nardil discontinuation may have been the problem.
Taking methylphenidate with Nardil may help stabilise blood pressure, and also reduce tyramine sensitivity. However, the combination needs to be initiated with low doses and close monitoring of the blood pressure response.
Posted by simon79 on May 24, 2008, at 22:43:28
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... » Simon79, posted by ace on May 19, 2008, at 1:59:09
Dear Ace,
Thanks for responding to my posts
Your answers hit the nail right on the head they were excellent
I'm playing it safe and I'm going to continue to titrate up very slowly for reasons I won't go into right now. 2 weeks and i get to 45 yay! then i might actually feel something, although 60 is the one i'm really looking forward to, from what i've read 75 is when the side effects start to kick in a bit harder
Anyway, I'll let u know when the nardil kicks in, fingers cross (both hands)
Thanks for answering all my newbie nardil
questions
My psych wants me to stop clonazempam once the nardil kicks in, however I will oppose this as my anxiety level is 'severe'.. It's about as bad as you can get, and I need all the help I need right now
Best wishes
Simon79
Posted by ace on May 25, 2008, at 23:04:07
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by Fivefires on May 22, 2008, at 2:49:35
> Ace
>
> Did I discouraged you from contacting me?
>
> Was it because I said ...
>
> Thing is, I think I felt where you were going w/ this whole thing. There was a tapping into my own real feelings which made me recall the strong and assertive person I once was. Something was definitely happening.
>
> ?
>
> If you have a change of heart, pls contact.
>
> I still have A LOT of interest in 'what it was that was happening and there is the possibility of my re-trying inpatient. I may be unable to correspond for a while, so, hope you'll see and write.
>
> 5f
Hey there:) I am back- can you tell me which exact post You want me to answer? I looked above but could not locate it.... Or, if you have the energy, please ask again....Sorry for this confusion!
Ace:)
Posted by ace on May 25, 2008, at 23:06:40
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by Fivefires on May 23, 2008, at 13:58:48
> Ace ... just lost three paragraph post.
>
> Think in withdrawal ... agitation, rapid heart beat, labored breathing like long drawn out hyperventilating, lost weight/fluids.This is not good at all- However, and I do apologize, I have lost track of where we were at.
Is it possible, when you feel a little better, to let me know what is happening...I could not detect it from your prior posts...
Hang in there,
Ace
> No help from medical resources. o_o
>
> Can't re-type all again now as too ill.
>
> Will do tho'.
>
> tks, 5f
Posted by ace on May 25, 2008, at 23:09:24
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by undopaminergic on May 24, 2008, at 14:39:24
> >
> > I've read a lot of your Nardil posts from the archives, and I really respect your opinions. I need your advice please. I failed to respond to over a dozen AD's until I tried Nardil. Then it was like a light bulb turned on and the depression and anxiety literally melted away. Everything was great for 7 months at 90mg.
> >
> > Then, out of the blue, I developed severe orthostatic hypotension which quickly turned into fainting spells. Pdoc discontinued Nardil over 7 days. 1 day after my last nardil dose, I woke up blind, paralyzed, and confused. Was diagnosed with PRES, a reversible swelling of the back of the brain caused by blood pressure fluctuation.
> >
> > I'm getting better neurologically now, but my depression has returned, and my pdoc will not prescribe Nardil for me ever again. He thinks it caused the PRES. I believe the quick withdrawal caused the PRES.
> >
>
Hi there, was this adressed to me? Or anyone in general...I am not sure here...brain is not running too well today!
Ace
Posted by ace on May 25, 2008, at 23:19:14
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by simon79 on May 24, 2008, at 22:43:28
> Dear Ace,
> Thanks for responding to my postsNot a problem at all!
> Your answers hit the nail right on the head they were excellent
> I'm playing it safe and I'm going to continue to titrate up very slowly for reasons I won't go into right now. 2 weeks and i get to 45 yay! then i might actually feel something, although 60 is the one i'm really looking forward to, from what i've read 75 is when the side effects start to kick in a bit harderDo what feels best with you me thinks! If and when the s/effects come, I would remember you always have avenues in which to lessen, or abolish, those s/effects....I certainly would 'grit it out' too long with any s/effect!
> Anyway, I'll let u know when the nardil kicks in, fingers cross (both hands)
I feel very much it will...try and keep a positive mindset about it all...read all the success stories on it...For some reason, I never had any doubt Nardil was going to be such a great medication for me.
> Thanks for answering all my newbie nardil
> questionsNo probs at all...!
> My psych wants me to stop clonazempam once the nardil kicks in, however I will oppose this as my anxiety level is 'severe'.. It's about as bad as you can get, and I need all the help I need right now
The Nardil may provide anxiolytic relief, to the level where you may feel you don't need it....however, this is hard to say! You must feel as well and as safe as possible but- i think this is the main priority!
Just remeber- Nardil can take quite a while to kick in...please be patient!
All the very best, and here from you soon!
Ace:)
> Best wishes
> Simon79
Posted by Fivefires on May 26, 2008, at 16:28:42
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever......., posted by simon79 on May 24, 2008, at 22:43:28
Oh wow ... I'm gettin' jealous here!
I got so sick. Never should have been started out on 15mg 3x a day. Just weighed myself and 115, so lost 5 lbs. in past week and a half.
Dang! I wanted to but just couldn't. Doc wouldn't return calls. Did call EMTs one eve as heart racing and they said if we take you to an ER they're just going to send you home o_o.
Happy for you all tho'.
5f
Posted by Fivefires on May 26, 2008, at 16:52:34
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... 03 Fivefires, posted by ace on May 25, 2008, at 23:06:40
I just read my post and I didn't know where we were either Ace!
I forgot I was going to get back to u w/ specifics and now I've forgotten the specifics. Not really. Just 'RIGHT NOW' unable. Still very sickish' if sit here too long. Should have indicated have a condition or thought which I do not and been allowed care inpatient, and, NOT have fallen further into this.
Think bod' should be rid of all Nardil; w/o for 5days.
Wanted to hang on there, but just couldn't do it here alone. Almost thought of getting a hold of an 'exigent form' so cell could be 'way investigated' by police. Instructed by my cell whachamacallit to do the prior.
Am I still talking? Sorry!
I can't communicate very well, yet; ... no pooping since dc'd; maybe some still in me.(?)
U didn't ask for that much info huh?
5f
WTH? Did I already post the following?
ps: Got appt w/ a pdoc outside the county and co-pay can handle, but fear cost of meds will be the block. Am calling ins. 2moro see if can get formulary and costs.
Maybe new doc could help me w/ it. But, well, can't say something want to at this time; cell and pute acting strange. _oo_
good eve & sorry if posted same thing twice and am not going to do anything about it.
5f
Okay ... where did ur name go Ace? I mean this is kind of to all, but thought followed you here and see an 03.
TELL ME YOU ALL SEE THE 03 TOO PLS?????
sh*t
Posted by Fivefires on May 26, 2008, at 17:01:41
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... 03 undopaminergic, posted by ace on May 25, 2008, at 23:09:24
Oh my goodness ... don't know what to say, but so very sorry this happened to you.
When EMTs came here my BP was high. Asked the EMTs (There were a whole bunch of them.) if they knew what serotonin syndrome or neuroleptic malignant syndrome were and none did or seemed interested in looking into it.
Just told me what said above I believe, well I'm not sure now, ... they told me ER wouldn't admit me so why go.
Whoa .. I just was on 45mg 3-4 days, 30mg 3-2 days, then 1mg couple days. Could this be why I'm 'not well' 'cognitively'?
sincere, 5f
Posted by iforgotmypassword on May 27, 2008, at 11:05:30
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... » maoi_wowee, posted by ace on May 6, 2008, at 23:35:35
taking so long to kick in thing...
what exactly causes a drug and an maoi no less, to take so long?
Posted by iforgotmypassword on May 27, 2008, at 12:26:28
In reply to Re: Nardil- The best AD ever....... » clipper40, posted by ace on May 8, 2008, at 23:51:19
humans not established, as there is not enough research...
i don't feel great about that.
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