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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by 4WD on May 5, 2008, at 13:48:05
I don't know what happened. I was doing okay on 1.5 mg of Klonopin and 10-15 mg of Valium. When I first went on Nardil, after about 2-3 weeks, I noticed a definite decrease in anxiety and was able to lower my benzo dosage. Then, about two weeks ago (after 7 weeks on Nardil) I started to have days where I more not just scared but panicky. Then on April 29, I started being panicky and terribly scared all day. I had to increase the Valium to up to 25-30mg and was still scared all the time. I went to my family doctor and he gave me some Xanax, which helps a lot.
My husband has noticed that since I've been on that much Valium I have become more depressed. So I am trying to decrease the Valium and went back up to 2mg of Klonopin a day. I started that today. I still had to take a Xanax this morning because I got very scared again about 4 hours after taking my morning Valium/Klonopin.
What is going on? Why did I suddenly get so scared?
Meds: 45mg Nardil
2mg Klonopin
Valium - we'll see
Geodon 60mg Ilowered it from 80 because I
thought that might be the
trouble
trazadone 100mg
Xanax 1mg as needed maybe one a dayMarsha
Posted by kezia on May 5, 2008, at 16:19:47
In reply to What could be causing this scaredness, posted by 4WD on May 5, 2008, at 13:48:05
Have you had your blood sugar checked recently? Perhaps what you are experiencing is a drop in blood sugar. I am hypoglycemic and when my blood sugar gets low, I experience the same symptoms as you are (feeling scared and anxious for no reason). It's very unpleasant, so I sympathize with you. I now Chromium three times a day and it has helped me.
Just a thought.
> I don't know what happened. I was doing okay on 1.5 mg of Klonopin and 10-15 mg of Valium. When I first went on Nardil, after about 2-3 weeks, I noticed a definite decrease in anxiety and was able to lower my benzo dosage. Then, about two weeks ago (after 7 weeks on Nardil) I started to have days where I more not just scared but panicky. Then on April 29, I started being panicky and terribly scared all day. I had to increase the Valium to up to 25-30mg and was still scared all the time. I went to my family doctor and he gave me some Xanax, which helps a lot.
>
> My husband has noticed that since I've been on that much Valium I have become more depressed. So I am trying to decrease the Valium and went back up to 2mg of Klonopin a day. I started that today. I still had to take a Xanax this morning because I got very scared again about 4 hours after taking my morning Valium/Klonopin.
>
> What is going on? Why did I suddenly get so scared?
>
> Meds: 45mg Nardil
> 2mg Klonopin
> Valium - we'll see
> Geodon 60mg Ilowered it from 80 because I
> thought that might be the
> trouble
> trazadone 100mg
> Xanax 1mg as needed maybe one a day
>
> Marsha
Posted by Phillipa on May 5, 2008, at 17:01:28
In reply to Re: What could be causing this scaredness » 4WD, posted by kezia on May 5, 2008, at 16:19:47
Marsha good point do you eat breakfast with some protein that is allowed? You do need breakfast. Love Phillipa
Posted by 4WD on May 5, 2008, at 18:25:47
In reply to Re: What could be causing this scaredness » 4WD, posted by kezia on May 5, 2008, at 16:19:47
> Have you had your blood sugar checked recently? Perhaps what you are experiencing is a drop in blood sugar. I am hypoglycemic and when my blood sugar gets low, I experience the same symptoms as you are (feeling scared and anxious for no reason). It's very unpleasant, so I sympathize with you. I now Chromium three times a day and it has helped me.
>
> Just a thought.Hi Kezia,
yes, my blood sugar has been checked recently and it was okay. But it may be falling during the day and was only okay while I was the doctor's for the test. I will try to eat more protein in the mornings and through the day. I dont ususally eat breakfast, just several glasses of milk. But that's not when I'm most scared - it's usually in the afternoons and evenings and I always have a very big, thick, peanut butter and strawberry preserve sandwich about 1. I usually eat a banana or two when I get back from my walk also. So I don't know.
Thanks for responding
Marsha
>
>
> > I don't know what happened. I was doing okay on 1.5 mg of Klonopin and 10-15 mg of Valium. When I first went on Nardil, after about 2-3 weeks, I noticed a definite decrease in anxiety and was able to lower my benzo dosage. Then, about two weeks ago (after 7 weeks on Nardil) I started to have days where I more not just scared but panicky. Then on April 29, I started being panicky and terribly scared all day. I had to increase the Valium to up to 25-30mg and was still scared all the time. I went to my family doctor and he gave me some Xanax, which helps a lot.
> >
> > My husband has noticed that since I've been on that much Valium I have become more depressed. So I am trying to decrease the Valium and went back up to 2mg of Klonopin a day. I started that today. I still had to take a Xanax this morning because I got very scared again about 4 hours after taking my morning Valium/Klonopin.
> >
> > What is going on? Why did I suddenly get so scared?
> >
> > Meds: 45mg Nardil
> > 2mg Klonopin
> > Valium - we'll see
> > Geodon 60mg Ilowered it from 80 because I
> > thought that might be the
> > trouble
> > trazadone 100mg
> > Xanax 1mg as needed maybe one a day
> >
> > Marsha
>
>
Posted by bleauberry on May 5, 2008, at 18:32:18
In reply to What could be causing this scaredness, posted by 4WD on May 5, 2008, at 13:48:05
No idea 4WD. If you did not have these problems before, then clearly one of the drugs is causing it. Or not necessarily one of the drugs, but maybe some quirky interaction. My pure gut instincts point the finger, in descending order, at either Geodon, Trazodone, or Nardil. Since your primary goal is go with Nardil, you might have to get off the others one at a time and see. You could possibly substitute in a straight across trade zyprexa for geodon, or seroquel for geodon.
The only other thing I could think of is that if you are predisposed to some kind of mania or psychosis or something like that, some strange permutation of the bipolar spectrum, nardil may be setting it off.
Really really frustrating and scary when we get off to a decent start with something and then a few weeks later it's out of control with no clue what's going on. I wish I had some better ideas for you. I mean, in the short term playing around with the benzos is about all you can do and is what I would be doing too, but past the short term I have no idea. Something in those meds isn't right.
Blood sugar was mentioned. Yeah, that is something to check easily with a glucose meter from walmart. Just to rule it out if nothing else.
Posted by 4WD on May 5, 2008, at 20:33:57
In reply to Re: What could be causing this scaredness, posted by bleauberry on May 5, 2008, at 18:32:18
> No idea 4WD. If you did not have these problems before, then clearly one of the drugs is causing it. Or not necessarily one of the drugs, but maybe some quirky interaction. My pure gut instincts point the finger, in descending order, at either Geodon, Trazodone, or Nardil. Since your primary goal is go with Nardil, you might have to get off the others one at a time and see. You could possibly substitute in a straight across trade zyprexa for geodon, or seroquel for geodon.
I kind of thought the same thing. That's why i've lowered the Geodon from 80 to 60. After a week or so I'll try lowering it more. I don't think it's the Trazadone at least I hope not. It's my sleep med and keeps me from waking up scared in the morning. I skipped it one night and woke up scared when I don't ususally get scared for an hour or two. Can't take Zyprexa or Seroquel. I'm a recovering bulimic and both those drugs return me to active bulimia within a a day or two.
>
> The only other thing I could think of is that if you are predisposed to some kind of mania or psychosis or something like that, some strange permutation of the bipolar spectrum, nardil may be setting it off.I hope it's not the Nardil setting it off. I don't think it is, because I had a period like this long before I ever started Nardil. I was at one time a few months ago taking 6-8mg of Klonopin a day because I could not get rid of the fear no matter how much I took.
>
> Really really frustrating and scary when we get off to a decent start with something and then a few weeks later it's out of control with no clue what's going on. I wish I had some better ideas for you. I mean, in the short term playing around with the benzos is about all you can do and is what I would be doing too, but past the short term I have no idea. Something in those meds isn't right.
>
I am truly playing around with benzos. I was taking as much as 30mg a day of Valium along with 1mg of Klonopin. Today and for the next week I am going to increase the Klonopin back up to 2mg a day, take only 10mg of Valium and use Xanax 1mg as needed. My husband pointed out to me that since I have been on Valium I have been more depressed. I was tapering the Klonopin with idea of just being on Valium alone and at first it was working. Then this starting happening. The Xanax seems to work really well. I went to the urgent care clinic and the doc there gave me a few for emergencies. I am going to ask my pdoc to let me try a one week trial of Xanax instead of Valium when I talk to him on Thursday.> Blood sugar was mentioned. Yeah, that is something to check easily with a glucose meter from walmart. Just to rule it out if nothing else.
I guess I could buy a monitor but I really don't think it's blood sugar. Why would my blood sugar suddenly go out of whack? And Idon't think a spell of hypoglycemia could possibly cause the level of fear I feel.
Thanks for responding
Marsha
Posted by Jeroen on May 6, 2008, at 7:28:00
In reply to What could be causing this scaredness, posted by 4WD on May 5, 2008, at 13:48:05
GEODON is evil
had it, it evil ways
theres your 90% propability answer
good day!
Posted by upsndowns on May 6, 2008, at 10:32:21
In reply to GEODON, posted by Jeroen on May 6, 2008, at 7:28:00
I found that Klonopin does that to me, so that might be the reason for the fear. Just a thought.
Posted by 4WD on May 6, 2008, at 16:41:26
In reply to GEODON, posted by Jeroen on May 6, 2008, at 7:28:00
> GEODON is evil
>
> had it, it evil ways
>
> theres your 90% propability answer
>
> good day!
What did it do to you?It was a magic drug for me when i first started taking it. All my depression and anxiety went away. I had to keep raising the dose but for about 5 months I was well. Then it pooped out.
I am trying to see if Geodon is the culprit in the anxiety. I have already reduced it from 80mg to 60mg. AFter a week or so, I will try reducing it from 60 to 40. And so on.
Marsha
Posted by Jeroen on May 6, 2008, at 16:43:31
In reply to Re: GEODON » Jeroen, posted by 4WD on May 6, 2008, at 16:41:26
4WD - sorry good thing it works for you but ...
i had all the oposite effects
Posted by 4WD on May 6, 2008, at 16:46:36
In reply to 4WD - sorry good thing it works for you but ..., posted by Jeroen on May 6, 2008, at 16:43:31
> 4WD - sorry good thing it works for you but ...
>
> i had all the oposite effectsIt used to work. I don't know if it's helping or hurting at this point. All I can do is experiment and see what happens. So far no ill effects from lowering it from 80 to 60. Except I am not sleeping as long. Woke up after 6 hours this morning. Ususally sleep 8.
No particularly good effects either.
Posted by Phillipa on May 6, 2008, at 19:04:36
In reply to Re: 4WD - sorry good thing it works for you but .. » Jeroen, posted by 4WD on May 6, 2008, at 16:46:36
Marsha finally did the drug checker thing and no contraindications with any of the meds. Love Phillipa
Posted by 4WD on May 7, 2008, at 11:19:59
In reply to Re: 4WD - sorry good thing it works for you but .. » 4WD, posted by Phillipa on May 6, 2008, at 19:04:36
> Marsha finally did the drug checker thing and no contraindications with any of the meds. Love Phillipa
Thanks, Phillipa, that was sweet of you.
Marsha
Posted by Phillipa on May 7, 2008, at 19:21:14
In reply to Re: 4WD - sorry good thing it works for you but .. » Phillipa, posted by 4WD on May 7, 2008, at 11:19:59
Marsha now if you could get to the bottom of the issue all would be well. Love Phillipa
Posted by chiron on May 12, 2008, at 23:07:45
In reply to What could be causing this scaredness, posted by 4WD on May 5, 2008, at 13:48:05
No advice, just that the body is weird :)
I never had intense anxiety until a year ago after an Emsam trial, about a week off meds, and then a 2 day trial with Neurontin. Then holy sh**! Weird nerve body sensations & nervous adrenaline running through my body for no reason. I'd automatically wake up @ 5:30 freaked out every day. I'd usually go running, but that didn't really help. ER once, one time feeling less motor control. A lot of weird zoned feelings (depersonalization).
Long acting xanax much better for me than the short acting. And actually, I think starting birth control hormones helped the most (though I was scared to try them based on past experiences). I don't feel like I have anxiety anymore, but do get occassional "zoned" feelings that seem to be related to my hormones.
Posted by 4WD on May 13, 2008, at 8:07:10
In reply to Re: What could be causing this scaredness, posted by chiron on May 12, 2008, at 23:07:45
Hi Chiron,
Yes, the body is weird. That adrenaline feeling is horrible. Like there's 100 times too much adrenaline circulating through your body. For me, it centers in my chest in stomach.
Never had any of the zoned, depersonalization feelings though. I guess I can count my blessings. There have been days I was so scared I took in the course of one day : 2mg Klonopin, 30mg Valium and 2mg Xanax. I had forgotten about the long acting Xanax. Xanax works better for me for the scaredness than Valium does but it wears off too quick.
I see my pdoc on Thursday. Maybe I'll ask him for a trial of Xanax XR and try using that and cut the Valium completely out. Too much Valium makes me depressed but the Xanax doesn't seem to do that.
Thanks for the idea.
Marsha
No advice, just that the body is weird :)
> I never had intense anxiety until a year ago after an Emsam trial, about a week off meds, and then a 2 day trial with Neurontin. Then holy sh**! Weird nerve body sensations & nervous adrenaline running through my body for no reason. I'd automatically wake up @ 5:30 freaked out every day. I'd usually go running, but that didn't really help. ER once, one time feeling less motor control. A lot of weird zoned feelings (depersonalization).
> Long acting xanax much better for me than the short acting. And actually, I think starting birth control hormones helped the most (though I was scared to try them based on past experiences). I don't feel like I have anxiety anymore, but do get occassional "zoned" feelings that seem to be related to my hormones.
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