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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Amandafran on August 18, 2007, at 22:55:46
Ok. sorry I have a lot on my mind tonight and am trying to get answers so any answers are very much appreciated. I have tried Ativan and Xanax..and am now on Klonopin and Valium. Ativan I enjoyed a little too much...(it made me very euphoric feeling) so I was taken off of it...Xanax made me sleepy..too sleepy...Klonopin doesnt seem to do anything...and Valium...doesnt seem to really do anything but make me calm. It is weird because in the movies when you see someone on Valium they are usually out of it..and I take up to 4mg..and it doesnt effect me that way..which is good...but is 4mg pretty low?
How come some Benzos provide a euphoric feeling of being high and others dont? I have a problem in that I like the feeling of euphoria and so it is best that I not get on a drug that might provide that feeling.... But has anyone experienced a feeling of euphoria on klonopin or valium? Im just wondering why Im not. Dont get me wrong...It is good that I am not...but do most people experience this feeling?
Just curious.
Posted by tecknohed on August 19, 2007, at 17:47:59
In reply to the low down on Benzos, posted by Amandafran on August 18, 2007, at 22:55:46
I'm pretty sure that various benzos effect other various brain chemicals too. I think many also play a role with serotonin (?). Maybe one of the more expert posters can explain a bit more.
I for one find temazepam makes me more chatty and imaginative, speedy even - and its usually given to help sleep!
Posted by twinch42085 on August 19, 2007, at 20:50:10
In reply to the low down on Benzos, posted by Amandafran on August 18, 2007, at 22:55:46
I have tried 1mg of Xanax which made me euphoric. 2mg of Ativan which made me euphoric but calmed me at the same time. 3mg of klonopin which did nothing and 10mg of valium which made me euphoric. So my say so on benzos is that they make me euphoric in the least bit but that they are better to take in my opinion than atypical psychotics. I would chooose ativan if I had to choose.
Hope this helps : )
Twinch
Posted by FredPotter on August 19, 2007, at 23:00:12
In reply to Re: the low down on Benzos » Amandafran, posted by twinch42085 on August 19, 2007, at 20:50:10
why doesn't anyone round here want to be euphoric?
Posted by Quintal on August 20, 2007, at 1:42:58
In reply to the low down on Benzos, posted by Amandafran on August 18, 2007, at 22:55:46
4mg of Valium is a sub-therapeutic dose, 6mg is usually the recommended minimum. 10-20mg is more typical, so it's small wonder you feel nothing at that dose, especially since you'll already have some tolerance from past benzo use. Are you sure you're not taking 40mg?
I've felt euphoric on all benzos at some dose. All benzos activate reward pathways in the brain, but perhaps some have greater affinity for the reward pathways than others, requiring a higher dose to achieve the same effect, and as with all drugs individual sensitivity varies.
Q
Posted by AmandaFran on August 20, 2007, at 6:55:01
In reply to Re: the low down on Benzos, posted by FredPotter on August 19, 2007, at 23:00:12
It isnt that I want to be euphoric...I just have issues with being euphoric in the past and liking it...it is my own problem that I have to deal with...
> why doesn't anyone round here want to be euphoric?
Posted by tecknohed on August 20, 2007, at 11:26:04
In reply to Re: the low down on Benzos, posted by FredPotter on August 19, 2007, at 23:00:12
The proplem I find with euphoria is that, for me, what goes up must come down. I'm looking for stability, as is the magority of people on here I imagine.
Posted by AmandaFran on August 20, 2007, at 11:35:30
In reply to Re: the low down on Benzos » FredPotter, posted by tecknohed on August 20, 2007, at 11:26:04
I agree. I am looking for something just to make me feel calm. I have in the past had an addictive personality and still do and so the euphoric feeling that I have received in the past has for me been too nice. It is something I am trying to stay away from.Im on such a low dose of valium though that it is keeping me calm so that is good enough for me. Do I miss the euphoric feeling...yes..but I am better off without it.
Posted by blueboy on August 20, 2007, at 14:40:43
In reply to the low down on Benzos, posted by Amandafran on August 18, 2007, at 22:55:46
My guess is that your experiences with effectiveness are dosage related; and your experiences with euphoria are related to both dosage and absorption/elimination rates.
I have gotten euphoria from Klonopin, taken on an empty stomach with water. Like you, I try to avoid it. I really don't need to be getting kicks from recreational drugs, much less ruining a therapeutic drug by abusing it. Still, on the rare occasion I get euphoria from Klonopin, I let myself enjoy it :) I just don't try to re-create the experience.
Xanax is extremely fast-release fast-acting. Klonopin is much slower.
Also, I think that when a benzo kills a really nasty anxiety attack, the relief may feel a bit euphoric. I wouldn't know how to tell the difference, though.
[Somewhat related tangent. Rant-mode is ON:
Did you know that the only difference between morphine and heroin is absorption rate? All heroin does is to get morphine past the blood-brain barrier faster. "No known medical use" my a**; heroin is the best drug in the world for fast relief of really severe pain. Heroin is subject to the same hysteria and lack of decent hard scientific information as electroshock therapy. It is probably, per se, the least damaging of any addictive drug. There are physical problems with long-term use, but they are a lot less than say tobacco or alcohol as used by addicts. The worst thing about heroin is probably its addictiveness, and the second worst thing is that an addict is likely to die because of drug laws that make it impossible to get pure drug at a predictable strength with a clean needle. I'm not "pro-heroin", but I'm disgusted by the illogical and hypocritical treatment it is given by governmental and "scientific" authorities.Okay, Rant-mode is now OFF.]
> I have tried Ativan and Xanax..and am now on Klonopin and Valium. Ativan I enjoyed a little too much...(it made me very euphoric feeling) so I was taken off of it...Xanax made me sleepy..too sleepy...Klonopin doesnt seem to do anything...and Valium...doesnt seem to really do anything but make me calm. It is weird because in the movies when you see someone on Valium they are usually out of it..and I take up to 4mg..and it doesnt effect me that way..which is good...but is 4mg pretty low?
>
> How come some Benzos provide a euphoric feeling of being high and others dont? I have a problem in that I like the feeling of euphoria and so it is best that I not get on a drug that might provide that feeling.... But has anyone experienced a feeling of euphoria on klonopin or valium? Im just wondering why Im not. Dont get me wrong...It is good that I am not...but do most people experience this feeling?
> Just curious.
Posted by Quintal on August 20, 2007, at 16:33:18
In reply to Re: the low down on Benzos, posted by blueboy on August 20, 2007, at 14:40:43
Well Heroin is ~8 times more potent than morphine, and this makes it possible to inject a higher dose of 'morphine' in a smaller volume, making it useful for infusion pumps. My mother was given a diamorphine infusion pump for cancer pain after she built up a high level of tolerance to morphine. I'm annoyed at the opposition to medical use of diamorphine in the US too, but many aspects of American health care seem contradictory and illogical to me, looking from afar. I don't mean to offend anyone who works in the field, in fact I know many agree and are frustrated by the 'War On Drugs' propaganda that restricts their access to useful medicines, but that's the way it seems to me looking from the outside. I'm grateful that my mother had access to diamorphine when she needed it.
The fentanyls are more potent than Heroin, and much more likely to cause accidental overdose for that reason, yet they are prescribed in the US, even in the form of lollies(!): http://www.pijnpolikliniek.info/starnet/media/lollipop.jpg
So what's the big deal with diamorphine other than it being the media's bogey man?
Q
Posted by olysi79 on August 20, 2007, at 17:02:34
In reply to Re: the low down on Benzos » Amandafran, posted by twinch42085 on August 19, 2007, at 20:50:10
I have tried Ativan, Klonopin, Xanax, and Valium.
I currently take Valium 10 MGS/day. I have never experienced any sort of euphoria on them.xanax I hate... because it wears off very suddenly and then you feel anxious. Klonopin... I'm ok with it, but it's awfully potent. Ativan, fairly gentle with a low effect of rebound anxiety.
4 MGs of Valium is a low dose, so if that works and keeps you calm, it's doing it's job and that's fantastic.
Posted by blueboy on August 21, 2007, at 11:24:45
In reply to Re: the low down on Benzos » blueboy, posted by Quintal on August 20, 2007, at 16:33:18
You can rant all you want, as far as I'm concerned. It isn't necessarily the fault of the medical profession.
http://www.cpmission.com/main/painpolitics/nelson.html
>>I don't mean to offend anyone who works in the field, in fact I know many agree and are frustrated by the 'War On Drugs' propaganda that restricts their access to useful medicines, but that's the way it seems to me looking from the outside. I'm grateful that my mother had access to diamorphine when she needed it.
Posted by Quintal on August 21, 2007, at 11:43:05
In reply to Re: the low down on Benzos, posted by blueboy on August 21, 2007, at 11:24:45
I don't think I was ranting at all. In fact, I think I went to considerable effort to show that "It isn't necessarily the fault of the medical profession." in the passage "in fact I know many agree and are frustrated by the 'War On Drugs' propaganda that restricts their access to useful medicines".
Q
Posted by blueboy on August 24, 2007, at 9:34:39
In reply to Re: the low down on Benzos » blueboy, posted by Quintal on August 21, 2007, at 11:43:05
Sorry, Q, you misunderstood. I didn't mean to imply that you were ranting; rather, I meant that, if you wanted to rant, you would be justified in doing so, IMHO. Or to say it another way, I'm more disgusted with some of the silly side-effects of the "War on Drugs" than you are.
Until the middle of the 20th century, most people considered that the US Constitution allowed residents to put anything into their bodies that they wanted. Cocaine and heroin were available from mail order catalogs. When the US decided to discourage marijuana use (I think around 1910-1920, primarily as a racially-based effort to keep blacks and Hispanics under control), it had to do so by imposing a tax scheme.
I'm not against government regulation of drugs, including criminal penalties, but I do think the pendulum has definitely swung a bit too far in the other direction.
> I don't think I was ranting at all. In fact, I think I went to considerable effort to show that "It isn't necessarily the fault of the medical profession." in the passage "in fact I know many agree and are frustrated by the 'War On Drugs' propaganda that restricts their access to useful medicines".
>
> Q
Posted by Existentialist on August 24, 2007, at 20:16:46
In reply to the low down on Benzos, posted by Amandafran on August 18, 2007, at 22:55:46
I found the state they produce mostly undesirable, dysphoric or heavy. here's my ratings.
Restoril :((
Xanax :|
Versed :)Sonata :(
Lunesta :(
Ambien :))Guys, ambien is addictive so be careful. It's not like the others at all. I used abused and depended on ambien for 2 years. I probably know more about how to use it inappropriately and it's effects than anyone else.
I still love it for sleep. I crave it at nightime. 5mg is all I need for sleep. I can tell you if you exceed 5mg nightly tolerance will build, I was up to 30mg a night and could not get what you shoud get with 5mg for a non tolerant person.
This is the end of the thread.
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