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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by rjlockhart on August 6, 2007, at 13:28:13
Im on strattera right now, which i dont frankly like. But im taking it for ADHD right now so basically thats the only med right now my doctor wants me on, well there are other reasons.
Anyways ENSAM? is probaly the most talked about thing here on Psychobabble. What does it do, how does it make you feel? like a dopamine sensation?
I tell you strattera and Prozac is called nuerosis in 2 pills. I thought i was going to have to go to a mental, lithum treatment center it got so bad ROFL. I really feel speedy, but crazy on it.
Ok strattera so far makes you feel basically more alert, but in a agitaited way. Like right now im not in a good mood. Im in a nuerotic mood right now. Just got off work, i feel im going coo coo.
Anyway enought with this. What does ensam do?
Thanks
Rj
Posted by Phillipa on August 6, 2007, at 14:01:04
In reply to Ok im on Strattera (ugh) now what about ENSAM?, posted by rjlockhart on August 6, 2007, at 13:28:13
Google Dr. Bob's site and put in EMSAM. Love Phillipa
Posted by rjlockhart on August 6, 2007, at 15:11:05
In reply to Ok im on Strattera (ugh) now what about ENSAM?, posted by rjlockhart on August 6, 2007, at 13:28:13
Ok can you take ensam with an SSRI, and SNRI?
Or no.
Posted by saturn on August 6, 2007, at 18:12:56
In reply to Re: Ok im on Strattera (ugh) now what about ENSAM?, posted by rjlockhart on August 6, 2007, at 15:11:05
> Ok can you take ensam with an SSRI, and SNRI?
>
> Or no.Definitely cannot be taken with Prozac.
Posted by Racer on August 6, 2007, at 23:05:05
In reply to Ok im on Strattera (ugh) now what about ENSAM?, posted by rjlockhart on August 6, 2007, at 13:28:13
Posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on August 7, 2007, at 17:08:50
In reply to Ok im on Strattera (ugh) now what about ENSAM?, posted by rjlockhart on August 6, 2007, at 13:28:13
Like I said in my other post, (no, I am certainly
not a anti-drug person or a $cientologist)...I just have encountered some things about Strattera that I have concerns...(not to be alarmist..but) here are a few:
(These have turned a few heads too...as this one is referenced on psychcentral.)
--------------------------------
http://www.24-7pressrelease.com/view_press_release.php?rID=11216Press Release February 16, 2006
Eli Lilly's Strattera - 130 reports of suicidality in one month
A not released discussion paper from the British medical agency (MHRA) reveals 130 reports of suicidality in one month from treatment with Strattera. In addition the paper tells about 766 spontaneous reports of cardiac disorders and 172 of liver injury, and about 20 completed suicides./24-7PressRelease/ - SWEDEN, February 16, 2006 - Strattera is a failed antidepressant, which Eli Lilly didn't succeed to get approved. It was recycled and used as an "ADHD medication", and marketed as the first "non stimulant medication for ADHD". As many parents, despite all published lies about the "benefits" of stimulants like Ritalin, Concerta and Adderall, don't want to give dangerous narcotic drugs to their kids, Lilly saw the chance to get a good market share for Strattera.
But miracle drugs can fast turn into disasters - as proven through the whole psychiatric history.
In April 2005 the European Agency for the Evaluation of Medicinal Products (EMEA) issued warnings that Strattera could give " hostility and emotional lability" in children and in September 2005 a Black Box Warning for suicide risk was issued for Strattera.
When the truth about the actual risks was revealed, spontaneous reports also started to come in: In one month (23 September 2005 - 25 October 2005) 130 cases of suicidal and self-injurious behaviour were reported! This should be compared to the 301 cases reported in the period November 2002 - September 2005 - in 3 years. This means that 30 percent of all reports of suicidality were received in one month!
This information is revealed in a not released discussion paper from 9 December 2005, written by the British MHRA and sent to the Swedish MPA. The information is gotten as a result of FOIA-requests, and released by court order.
The main part of the information is classified - as suicide risk and other serious harmful effects of psychiatric drugs still are seen as "trade secrets" by the medical authorities. But the 130 new cases are now publicly known and can never be hidden again!
In addition to the suicides and suicide attempts reported, the paper from the MHRA also tells about 766 spontaneous reports of cardiac disorders and 172 reports of liver injury.
-------------------------Strattera gets 'black box' warning
(I know most a.d.'s out there got this as well..but take with knowledge drug companies are out to protect their interests.)
FDA Warns About ADHD Drug Strattera
The Food and Drug Administration warned doctors Thursday about reports of suicidal thinking in some children and adolescents who are taking Strattera, a drug used to treat attention deficit hyperactivity disorder.
Manufacturer Eli Lilly & Co. announced that a black-box warning will be added to the drug’s label in the United States. Such a warning is the most serious that can be added to a medication’s label, and similar warnings will be added to the drug’s labels in other countries. The company said a study showed instances of suicidal thinking were rare.
In a statement, the FDA said it “is advising health care providers and caregivers that children and adolescents being treated with Strattera should be closely monitored for clinical worsening, as well as agitation, irritability, suicidal thinking or behaviors, and unusual changes in behavior, especially during the initial few months of therapy or when the dose is changed.”
Eli Lilly said it provided the FDA results from Strattera clinical trials of 1,357 patients that found five youths taking the medication reported having suicidal thoughts, while none of 851 patients taking a placebo reported having any. One young person taking Strattera attempted suicide, but survived, company and FDA officials said.
There was no evidence of increased suicidal thoughts in adults taking Strattera, which also goes by the generic name atomoxetine, the Indianapolis-based company said.
Posted by ConfuzyQ on August 7, 2007, at 23:53:06
In reply to Maybe ditch Strattera.. » rjlockhart, posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on August 7, 2007, at 17:08:50
Amongst his Strattera discomfort did Matt mention feeling depressed in particular? Honestly don't recall but didn't think so. Otherwise, what's two months; maybe he shouldn't be discouraged. Has he ever reported feeling ok on anything yet? (Well stimulants yes, but those are apparently not feasible for him.)
> Like I said in my other post, (no, I am certainly
> not a anti-drug person or a $cientologist)...I just have encountered some things about Strattera that I have concerns...(not to be alarmist..but) here are a few:
> (These have turned a few heads too...as this one is referenced on psychcentral.)
> --------------------------------
> http://www.24-7pressrelease.com/view_press_release.php?rID=11216
>
> Press Release February 16, 2006
>
>
>
> Eli Lilly's Strattera - 130 reports of suicidality in one month
> A not released discussion paper from the British medical agency (MHRA) reveals 130 reports of suicidality in one month from treatment with Strattera. In addition the paper tells about 766 spontaneous reports of cardiac disorders and 172 of liver injury, and about 20 completed suicides.
>
>
>
> /24-7PressRelease/ - SWEDEN, February 16, 2006 - Strattera is a failed antidepressant, which Eli Lilly didn't succeed to get approved. It was recycled and used as an "ADHD medication", and marketed as the first "non stimulant medication for ADHD". As many parents, despite all published lies about the "benefits" of stimulants like Ritalin, Concerta and Adderall, don't want to give dangerous narcotic drugs to their kids, Lilly saw the chance to get a good market share for Strattera.
>
> But miracle drugs can fast turn into disasters - as proven through the whole psychiatric history.
>
> In April 2005 the European Agency for the Evaluation of Medicinal Products (EMEA) issued warnings that Strattera could give " hostility and emotional lability" in children and in September 2005 a Black Box Warning for suicide risk was issued for Strattera.
>
> When the truth about the actual risks was revealed, spontaneous reports also started to come in: In one month (23 September 2005 - 25 October 2005) 130 cases of suicidal and self-injurious behaviour were reported! This should be compared to the 301 cases reported in the period November 2002 - September 2005 - in 3 years. This means that 30 percent of all reports of suicidality were received in one month!
>
> This information is revealed in a not released discussion paper from 9 December 2005, written by the British MHRA and sent to the Swedish MPA. The information is gotten as a result of FOIA-requests, and released by court order.
>
> The main part of the information is classified - as suicide risk and other serious harmful effects of psychiatric drugs still are seen as "trade secrets" by the medical authorities. But the 130 new cases are now publicly known and can never be hidden again!
>
> In addition to the suicides and suicide attempts reported, the paper from the MHRA also tells about 766 spontaneous reports of cardiac disorders and 172 reports of liver injury.
> -------------------------
>
> Strattera gets 'black box' warning
>
> (I know most a.d.'s out there got this as well..but take with knowledge drug companies are out to protect their interests.)
>
> FDA Warns About ADHD Drug Strattera
>
> The Food and Drug Administration warned doctors Thursday about reports of suicidal thinking in some children and adolescents who are taking Strattera, a drug used to treat attention deficit hyperactivity disorder.
> Manufacturer Eli Lilly & Co. announced that a black-box warning will be added to the drug’s label in the United States. Such a warning is the most serious that can be added to a medication’s label, and similar warnings will be added to the drug’s labels in other countries. The company said a study showed instances of suicidal thinking were rare.
> In a statement, the FDA said it “is advising health care providers and caregivers that children and adolescents being treated with Strattera should be closely monitored for clinical worsening, as well as agitation, irritability, suicidal thinking or behaviors, and unusual changes in behavior, especially during the initial few months of therapy or when the dose is changed.”
> Eli Lilly said it provided the FDA results from Strattera clinical trials of 1,357 patients that found five youths taking the medication reported having suicidal thoughts, while none of 851 patients taking a placebo reported having any. One young person taking Strattera attempted suicide, but survived, company and FDA officials said.
> There was no evidence of increased suicidal thoughts in adults taking Strattera, which also goes by the generic name atomoxetine, the Indianapolis-based company said.
Posted by ConfuzyQ on August 8, 2007, at 0:07:04
In reply to Re: Maybe ditch Strattera.., posted by ConfuzyQ on August 7, 2007, at 23:53:06
> Amongst his Strattera discomfort did Matt mention feeling depressed in particular?
Ok now I see that further below he did. Oh I don't know, it's just that everyone would so like to see Matt get some relief, and I wonder about the basis of his self-reporting sometimes. I wonder if maybe a painful longing for the long-lost stimulants contributes to negative assessments.
Posted by rjlockhart on August 8, 2007, at 13:21:14
In reply to Re: Maybe ditch Strattera.., posted by ConfuzyQ on August 7, 2007, at 23:53:06
Yes you are right and thank you for being flat out honest. Adderall was a wonderful success for me for 10 years. But then the last 2 years where not so good because i abused it.
One reason i should have told the doctor i need the dose to be increased. Because i would have to take double doses because it was not working. 2nd of all i live with my mother and stepdad (ugh) but she made it a rule that there would be no stimulants in the house. Yet i take Xanax at a higher dosage which im prescribed. And she is fine with that. Just no stimulants because she is afraid it will start off a bipoler hypomanic reaction afterwards, which i could of just been on a moderate dose of Zyprexa to couter at that since it is a mood stablizer.
And ConfuzyQ lets be honest, i dont appricarte you making fun of my depression in the first place. Because i suffer bad from depression. Been in one mental hospital to only find out i got dianosed with depression and hypomania.
And im being honest the only reason im not on stimulants, and this is a fact is my mother will throw away any amphetamine stimulant down the toilet.
So please dont try to make me look bad.
Rj
Posted by Racer on August 8, 2007, at 15:45:42
In reply to Re: Maybe ditch Strattera..- ConfuzyQ, posted by rjlockhart on August 8, 2007, at 13:21:14
>
> And ConfuzyQ lets be honest, i dont appricarte you making fun of my depression in the first place. Because i suffer bad from depression.I don't think ConfuzyQ was trying to "make fun of" your depression, nor to suggest that you don't have it. I think she was asking if, in your post, you had reported increased depression. I think, in reading your post the first time, she just didn't see that you'd included that as part of your difficulty with Strattera.
> So please dont try to make me look bad.
>
> RjAgain, I don't think anyone was trying to make you "look bad." In fact, what I see is someone who cares enough about you to respond to your post.
Posted by confuzyq on August 8, 2007, at 18:49:51
In reply to Re: Maybe ditch Strattera..- ConfuzyQ, posted by rjlockhart on August 8, 2007, at 13:21:14
> And ConfuzyQ lets be honest, i dont appricarte you making fun of my depression in the first place. Because i suffer bad from depression. Been in one mental hospital to only find out i got dianosed with depression and hypomania.
>
> So please dont try to make me look bad.
>
> RjNo, absolutely no intention of that and I do think maybe you know that too, but are understandably going through a lot right now.
Specifically what I was addressing as far as depression was Jay's article referencing suicidal thinking with Strattera. And had not seen your posts further below yet about exactly how bad you do feel. In the threads I replied on I sought only to "encourage the encouraging" of you. But am not up to such a reaction myself, so will respectfully stay out of it. Best wishes.
Posted by confuzyq on August 8, 2007, at 19:04:56
In reply to Re: Maybe ditch Strattera..- ConfuzyQ » rjlockhart, posted by Racer on August 8, 2007, at 15:45:42
You're exactly right, and I really appreciate you saying it, and that it was already here when I "arrived." It's hard enough already for me to believe that whatever I have to say is worth hearing. I do think a lot of people are straightforward with him and he appreciates it, but especially since he doesn't know me I guess it would have been better to keep out of it.
> >
> > And ConfuzyQ lets be honest, i dont appricarte you making fun of my depression in the first place. Because i suffer bad from depression.
>
> I don't think ConfuzyQ was trying to "make fun of" your depression, nor to suggest that you don't have it. I think she was asking if, in your post, you had reported increased depression. I think, in reading your post the first time, she just didn't see that you'd included that as part of your difficulty with Strattera.
>
> > So please dont try to make me look bad.
> >
> > Rj
>
> Again, I don't think anyone was trying to make you "look bad." In fact, what I see is someone who cares enough about you to respond to your post.
Posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on August 9, 2007, at 8:10:05
In reply to Maybe ditch Strattera.. » rjlockhart, posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on August 7, 2007, at 17:08:50
In my quite lengthy personal and professional experience, a med that causes 'Suicidal Ideation' is just not good for that person...period. A lot of unnecessary suffering, and the risks go very high, in particular if it is 'activating' and causing agitation. THAT is certainly something to get very depressed about as well.
Jay
Posted by gardenergirl on August 9, 2007, at 12:45:28
In reply to Dump Strattera..certainly.remem 'First do no harm', posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on August 9, 2007, at 8:10:05
Correlation does not equal causation. Suicidal ideation occurring at the same time as Strattera use does not mean that the Strattera is causing the suicidal ideation.
gg
Posted by rjlockhart on August 9, 2007, at 13:15:23
In reply to Yes, but... » Jay_Bravest_Face, posted by gardenergirl on August 9, 2007, at 12:45:28
Hello im back, just got off work.
Strattrea really makes me in a bad mood. But its not an intense suicdal feeling. It just makes you feel "life is too much" because of the increased norepheinphrine which makes things seem stressful. Like i was just sarcasticly thinking while im driving, maybe someone will hit me. That is the way it makes me feel.
Im telling you strattera isnt that effective and has bad side effects and APA needs to know.
Posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on August 9, 2007, at 17:09:18
In reply to Yes, but... » Jay_Bravest_Face, posted by gardenergirl on August 9, 2007, at 12:45:28
> Correlation does not equal causation. Suicidal ideation occurring at the same time as Strattera use does not mean that the Strattera is causing the suicidal ideation.
>
> ggNo, you are right, but SI has been found in thousands of cases of Strattera use. (I.E. not there before.) Even Grohol has concerns about this drug, and in particular the number of actual suicides carried out while on this drug. Matt tried it...so why waste more time in agaony? Just find something else...no big deal.
Jay
Posted by gardenergirl on August 9, 2007, at 18:45:37
In reply to Re: Yes, but......no but's, really. » gardenergirl, posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on August 9, 2007, at 17:09:18
> No, you are right, but SI has been found in thousands of cases of Strattera use. (I.E. not there before.)
Again, that's correlation. And SI is found in thousands of cases of mental illness regardless of psychopharmacological intervention.
> Even Grohol has concerns about this drug, and in particular the number of actual suicides carried out while on this drug.
With all due respect, Dr. Grohol is not a clinical psychologist, a psychiatrist, or a pharmacologist. he's not an expert in drug effects.
But I agree that if rj cannot tolerate the med and is not benefiting from it, he should let his doctor know.
gg
Posted by rjlockhart on August 9, 2007, at 22:55:00
In reply to Re: Yes, but...... » Jay_Bravest_Face, posted by gardenergirl on August 9, 2007, at 18:45:37
Strattera is now i think labeled now as a drug that is simliar to Effexor.
I hope this message will go to the doctors that this drug is not a new good drug. It can be for some people who have the ok brain chemistry for it.
I have put in the past that i cant go back on psychostimulants for now as long i am in this house with because of my mother.
If you want to know what happened..........go down to google bar and type in "hell just hit"
Im not trying to be at all person who is trying to cause up commontion.
Strattera is not a good drug, and dont think it should be promoted it should be right now.
I know it works for some people but it can range in the same black box as Paxil.
I am one of the first people that is saying that stattera is not a drug i can even take. It is it has more side effects than stimulants and i handled stimualants much better, even though stimulants have the main side effects of, insomnia if taken in the evening, rebouding, and also abuse.
If i ever went back on a psychostimulant i definenly would not do what i did in the past with them.
Thanks.
Posted by Deputy Racer on August 10, 2007, at 14:37:14
In reply to Re: lets go over some things, posted by rjlockhart on August 9, 2007, at 22:55:00
>
>
> I hope this message will go to the doctors that this drug is not a new good drug.
>
>
> Strattera is not a good drug, and dont think it should be promoted it should be right now.
>
>Please be sensitive to others. You've made it quite clear you're not pleased with the effects Strattera is having ON YOU, but it is working well for many people. Please don't generalize or exaggerate about medications, and please be sensitive to others for whom Strattera is working well, or for whom it may work well.
If you have any questions regarding the policies on this site, please read the FAQ, at http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil Any follow ups regarding this should be directed to the Administration board, and should themselves be civil.
Dr Bob has ultimate authority over all administrative actions on this site, and may choose to revise or reverse any and all deputy actions.
Deputy Racer
Posted by alohashirt on August 11, 2007, at 18:14:37
In reply to Please be sensitive » rjlockhart, posted by Deputy Racer on August 10, 2007, at 14:37:14
My pdoc slowly titrated me oiver five months to 80mg. It hade some positive effect in my distraction, but the effect was small. He then added a stimulant which was much more effective. A year later it seemd that my boss, my colleagues and my spouse were all collasall a-holes and I was considering how it would feel to jump in front of a subway train.
Then ... Oxford, who were another ahole, didn't pay for Strattera one month so I didn't fill the prescription immediately. After five days of no Strattera I had an unexpected surge of positivity. A week later it was stronger and I didn't want to fill the prescription. My doctor was skeptical, and I conceded that perhaps it was coincidental, but I was loving feeling happy. 18 months later I am still happy.So what does this mean? I took Strattera for about a year, and I slowly became suicidal. I had no conscious understanding that this was happening - the suicidal feelings seemed like rational musings in an imperfect world. It scares me that as an educated guy with a good standard of living and excellent medical care this could sneak up on me without self-awareness.
I have no intention of taking Strattera again. For me, it doesn't work.
This is the end of the thread.
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