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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by falconman on January 24, 2007, at 4:17:44
Hi,
I've read that benzo's affect your sleep cycle. Typically stage 2 is increased whilst the deep sleep of stages 3 and 4 are decreased. Not good. However I've got the impression from somewhere that clonazepam does not behave like the other benzo's in this regard? Isn't it the benzo of choice for insomnia? Does it affect deep sleep?
Can somebody help me out here?
Thanks
Posted by laima on January 24, 2007, at 8:54:22
In reply to Klonopin/sleep, posted by falconman on January 24, 2007, at 4:17:44
I understand it DOES act like the other benzos in terms of sleep. Another thing about it, it lasts all night. As an anticonvulsant, it can calm restless legs, stuff like that- but the trade off is sleep cycles are messed up. I had a couple of sleep studies while on klonopin, and showed very, very, very little stage 3 or 4.
> Hi,
> I've read that benzo's affect your sleep cycle. Typically stage 2 is increased whilst the deep sleep of stages 3 and 4 are decreased. Not good. However I've got the impression from somewhere that clonazepam does not behave like the other benzo's in this regard? Isn't it the benzo of choice for insomnia? Does it affect deep sleep?
> Can somebody help me out here?
> Thanks
Posted by falconman on January 24, 2007, at 9:59:51
In reply to Re: Klonopin/sleep » falconman, posted by laima on January 24, 2007, at 8:54:22
> Thanks loads for helping me. I thought it must mess with cycles 3+4 as essentially it is a benzo. Because it seems to be used more than most other benzo's for sleep(probably due to anticonvulsant properties as you said), I thought maybe it didn't mess with sleep architecture quite as much. Now I want to work out what I might be missing out on. In other words, what the purpose of cycle 3+4 are.
Thanks again> I understand it DOES act like the other benzos in terms of sleep. Another thing about it, it lasts all night. As an anticonvulsant, it can calm restless legs, stuff like that- but the trade off is sleep cycles are messed up. I had a couple of sleep studies while on klonopin, and showed very, very, very little stage 3 or 4.
>
>
> > Hi,
> > I've read that benzo's affect your sleep cycle. Typically stage 2 is increased whilst the deep sleep of stages 3 and 4 are decreased. Not good. However I've got the impression from somewhere that clonazepam does not behave like the other benzo's in this regard? Isn't it the benzo of choice for insomnia? Does it affect deep sleep?
> > Can somebody help me out here?
> > Thanks
>
>
Posted by laima on January 24, 2007, at 10:41:02
In reply to Re: Klonopin/sleep » laima, posted by falconman on January 24, 2007, at 9:59:51
Roughly speaking, I've been told by both sleep doctor and psychiatrist that stages 3-4 are the very resorative stages of sleep, crucial for good mental health. Psychiatrist even quipped, "If you want to make someone go totally insane, just deprive them of stage 4 for awhile". That said, I am bewildered why benzos are so commonly used for sleep. Sure, they make a person sleepy and fall asleep...it's just the QUALITY of sleep that is suspect. For daytime tiredness, the sleep doctor I saw actualy advocated stimulants by day rather than benzos by night. She wasn't even a fan of ambien or that sort of medication, on grounds that long term they were no good due to this very same sleep architecture problem. Oh, by the way, I used short acting benzos like ativan for sleep before (sleep architecture problems and all), buit the problem was I'd bolt awake in the wee hours of the morning when they wore off. Klonopin lasts through the night. Overall, a frustrating situation.
> > Thanks loads for helping me. I thought it must mess with cycles 3+4 as essentially it is a benzo. Because it seems to be used more than most other benzo's for sleep(probably due to anticonvulsant properties as you said), I thought maybe it didn't mess with sleep architecture quite as much. Now I want to work out what I might be missing out on. In other words, what the purpose of cycle 3+4 are.
> Thanks again
>
> > I understand it DOES act like the other benzos in terms of sleep. Another thing about it, it lasts all night. As an anticonvulsant, it can calm restless legs, stuff like that- but the trade off is sleep cycles are messed up. I had a couple of sleep studies while on klonopin, and showed very, very, very little stage 3 or 4.
> >
> >
> > > Hi,
> > > I've read that benzo's affect your sleep cycle. Typically stage 2 is increased whilst the deep sleep of stages 3 and 4 are decreased. Not good. However I've got the impression from somewhere that clonazepam does not behave like the other benzo's in this regard? Isn't it the benzo of choice for insomnia? Does it affect deep sleep?
> > > Can somebody help me out here?
> > > Thanks
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by Phillipa on January 24, 2007, at 11:16:31
In reply to Re: Klonopin/sleep » falconman, posted by laima on January 24, 2007, at 10:41:02
I've taken benzos for years for sleep now lunesta with them. So I don't get the sleep I need? Sleep deeply for about 4-6hours. Love Phillipa
Posted by falconman on January 24, 2007, at 11:37:03
In reply to Re: Klonopin/sleep » falconman, posted by laima on January 24, 2007, at 10:41:02
> Thanks for the follow up. Its really interesting to hear what your psychiatrist said about stage 4. Been taking 2mg of clonazepam at night for about 6 years now. I reckon i'm pretty deprived.
> Roughly speaking, I've been told by both sleep doctor and psychiatrist that stages 3-4 are the very resorative stages of sleep, crucial for good mental health. Psychiatrist even quipped, "If you want to make someone go totally insane, just deprive them of stage 4 for awhile". That said, I am bewildered why benzos are so commonly used for sleep. Sure, they make a person sleepy and fall asleep...it's just the QUALITY of sleep that is suspect. For daytime tiredness, the sleep doctor I saw actualy advocated stimulants by day rather than benzos by night. She wasn't even a fan of ambien or that sort of medication, on grounds that long term they were no good due to this very same sleep architecture problem. Oh, by the way, I used short acting benzos like ativan for sleep before (sleep architecture problems and all), buit the problem was I'd bolt awake in the wee hours of the morning when they wore off. Klonopin lasts through the night. Overall, a frustrating situation.
>
>
> > > Thanks loads for helping me. I thought it must mess with cycles 3+4 as essentially it is a benzo. Because it seems to be used more than most other benzo's for sleep(probably due to anticonvulsant properties as you said), I thought maybe it didn't mess with sleep architecture quite as much. Now I want to work out what I might be missing out on. In other words, what the purpose of cycle 3+4 are.
> > Thanks again
> >
> > > I understand it DOES act like the other benzos in terms of sleep. Another thing about it, it lasts all night. As an anticonvulsant, it can calm restless legs, stuff like that- but the trade off is sleep cycles are messed up. I had a couple of sleep studies while on klonopin, and showed very, very, very little stage 3 or 4.
> > >
> > >
> > > > Hi,
> > > > I've read that benzo's affect your sleep cycle. Typically stage 2 is increased whilst the deep sleep of stages 3 and 4 are decreased. Not good. However I've got the impression from somewhere that clonazepam does not behave like the other benzo's in this regard? Isn't it the benzo of choice for insomnia? Does it affect deep sleep?
> > > > Can somebody help me out here?
> > > > Thanks
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by laima on January 24, 2007, at 17:01:01
In reply to Re: Klonopin/sleep » laima, posted by Phillipa on January 24, 2007, at 11:16:31
We're almost talking about apples and oranges...
> I've taken benzos for years for sleep now lunesta with them. So I don't get the sleep I need? Sleep deeply for about 4-6hours. Love Phillipa
Posted by laima on January 24, 2007, at 17:03:41
In reply to Re: Klonopin/sleep » laima, posted by falconman on January 24, 2007, at 11:37:03
I slept with klonopin for close to 5 years myself. I do have to say, my sleep gets pretty restless sometimes, but still feels more "authentic" somehow, in that I am overall more rested and also a considerably less anxious person. No more feeling like I'm about to step off some 'edge'.
Posted by Greif on January 25, 2007, at 20:03:54
In reply to Re: Klonopin/sleep, posted by laima on January 24, 2007, at 17:03:41
I have been taking Klon for 2 years. 2 mg at night. I really dont even feel the Klon any more but I do get an extra hour of sleep. I have decided to taper off and see how it goes without. I haave tapered of Zanax and dont have the problems some do. Its incomfortable but the side effects are minimal if done slowly.
This is the end of the thread.
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