Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 693716

Shown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame?

Posted by adamCanada on October 10, 2006, at 22:11:08

A number of changes has occured over the past few weeks. I normally take 10mg paxil nightly with tiny dose of dexedrine 3 times daily. After stopping dexedrine I been feeling more clear headed and looking healthier. I normally have been on Paxil before by itself without dex so I believe it cannot be the cause for such a downward spiral.

And I felt better when stopping the dex... at least a day after I felt better and the next day too. Then on monday I felt so disoriented when I got up from bed (got a new firmer matress that is high up). I dont know if it was the matress but I also had huge nightmares that night and woke up in sweats at times. I felt very strange for a while that day and better in the evening.

That morning was when it all started I guess but possibly earlier. I also been taking fish oil 3-4 times a day for a few weeks. Sometimes it has made me feel hot headed but also I was under the impression that it had a mild positive effect on me. But who knows. Could fish oil or Omega 3 fatty acids and Omega 3-6-9 fatty acids sometimes cause a worsening of depression?

Also I been taking melatonin before bed. I just started those 1 and a half weeks ago. They help me sleep and fall asleep faster. Could those be doing something negative that I am not aware of?

Also I been taking 1-2mg higher dose of paxil at times instead of the usual 10mg.

I also been excersizing quite a bit. I been working on getting myself into shape and as I get all this moderate muscle on my chest and arms it's good to look good but I never felt ''good'' after excersizing. I always felt tired or exhausted or hot headed.

Could excersize be causing me to burn out the paxil? I dont know what the hell is going on but I feel like crap.


My depression is worse and I find it difficult to even talk to people anymore. Before it was bad enough but at least I could live my daily boring uneventful life but now it's like I am in pain. AND I am getting anxiety. I feel scared of my health deteriorating and my visions is darker. Everything looks darker. My room, television, night vision, JUSt everything is dark and pale and for some reason my black eyes are back. after stopping dexedrine i would no longer have black eyes and ''the druggie'' look and now black eyes are back.

I feel very low motivation, not interested in anything, tv shows were so boring to watch but I forced myself to watch them because I cant just do nothing. I always enjoyed tv and today I could not. I have no interest to do anything. No motivation to do anything. I feel awful and I cannot control any of it. Something is wrong in my head.

WHat the hell caused this? Omega 3 fatty acids? Melatonin? Excersize? Protein bars? What on earth is it?

 

Re: Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame? » adamCanada

Posted by Phillipa on October 10, 2006, at 22:43:58

In reply to Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame?, posted by adamCanada on October 10, 2006, at 22:11:08

Fish oil, excercise should all help depression. Love Phillipa

 

fish oil bad in Hypervitaminosis A patients?

Posted by adamCanada on October 10, 2006, at 22:47:04

In reply to Re: Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame? » adamCanada, posted by Phillipa on October 10, 2006, at 22:43:58

Accutane depression is caused by Hypervitaminosis A. That is what I have

I just read here that Fish oil could cause this condition to get worse due to containing vitamin A itself

http://www.prn2.usm.my/mainsite/bulletin/sun/1996/sun43.html


Maybe the fish oil is to blame in my case. I will see how I feel tomorrow and I will consider stop taking it all together

 

Re: fish oil bad in Hypervitaminosis A patients?

Posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 11, 2006, at 2:56:16

In reply to fish oil bad in Hypervitaminosis A patients?, posted by adamCanada on October 10, 2006, at 22:47:04

Hello adamcanada...

Yes you have dex withdrawal. Even through it was a tiny dose, you still have the withdrawal. After stopping many common pysch medications, you often feel fine for the first one or two or three days after -- you brain is used to receiveing these chemicals and it takes a little while to realise that its not getting the chemcials anymore - you might even feel better than on the pysch medication....but then you enter withdrawal mode....and your brain is now really crying out for the chemicals it was used to receiving..... slowly the natural levels of your chemicals try to return to normal....

>I feel very low motivation, not interested in anything, tv shows were so boring to watch but I forced myself to watch them because I cant just do nothing. I always enjoyed tv and today I could not. I have no interest to do anything. No motivation to do anything. I feel awful and I cannot control any of it. Something is wrong in my head.

Thnis sounds like classic dopamine/ noradrenline definicy syjpmtoms to me (sorry Iäm using a public terminal and the keyboard is abit funny) -- your brain was used to reciving abnormally high levels of dopamine/noradrenalin via a mechanism in the dex, and its not getting that anymore, so you have a very low ratio of dopamine/nor compared to other neurotransmitters...after a while, it will build up naturally again, to a normal (ie without dex) level or it might be sublevel, although I doubt youäll get any 'buzz' or whatever you got from the dex and you were taking it for....but sometimes no motivation/no concentration is a feature of depression....well at least with me. Iäm not sure if its caused by a chemical imabalance or just the way you 'feel' well anyway its abit like a chicken/egg thing

Sorry this post is so garbled - free feel to ask questions......

Kind regads

Meri

 

Re: Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame?

Posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 11, 2006, at 2:59:11

In reply to Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame?, posted by adamCanada on October 10, 2006, at 22:11:08

BTW fish oil prepartions usually have the vitamin A removed, well at least mine does. Vitamin A in excess is toxic...... buy a high quality one which is screened for toxins etc and its literally 'just fish oil'...the fish oil coming from say cod liver oil contains high amount of vit A, but it should say so on the label.

So are you taking the acne med, roaccutane then? BEcause that has been shown to worsen depression...

M

 

fish oil » Meri-Tuuli

Posted by pseudoname on October 11, 2006, at 9:04:37

In reply to Re: Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame?, posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 11, 2006, at 2:59:11

> BTW fish oil prepartions usually have the vitamin A removed, well at least mine does. Vitamin A in excess is toxic......

Thanks, Meri. I did't know that about fish oil. And I have to buy a refill bottle today! :-)

 

What is your fish oil brand? Thanks (nm) » Meri-Tuuli

Posted by pseudoname on October 11, 2006, at 9:08:09

In reply to Re: Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame?, posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 11, 2006, at 2:59:11

 

Melatonin (response on Alternative board) » adamCanada

Posted by Tomatheus on October 11, 2006, at 11:17:33

In reply to Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame?, posted by adamCanada on October 10, 2006, at 22:11:08

Adam,

I responded to your post on the Alternative board. Here's a link:

http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20060817/msgs/693817.html

Tomatheus

 

Re: What is your fish oil brand? Thanks » pseudoname

Posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 11, 2006, at 14:44:41

In reply to What is your fish oil brand? Thanks (nm) » Meri-Tuuli, posted by pseudoname on October 11, 2006, at 9:08:09

Hey PN --

Okay, re: fish oil, I think it depends on the type of fish oil. Or at least I assume it does -- for instance, my fish oil just says 'pure fish oil' -- if it had any vitamin A in it, it would have to carry a label - because of the fact that vitamin A is toxic in excess. Beta carotene (the vegetable form of vitamin A) is not toxic in excess (so you can eat all the carrots/mangoes you like - although you might turn slightly organgey I've heard!) because the body can convert what it needs into vitamin A.

I think the problem isn't with fish oil per se, its with fish oil from fish livers, ie/eg cod liver oil - I think that carries labels saying it contains vitamin A, do not take too much etc.

My fish oil is from higher nature:
http://www.highernature.co.uk/cgi-bin/hn.storefront
and click on omega three fish oil

There were some polar explorers who died, not because of the extreme conditions, but because they ate their dog's liver.... liver contains alot of vitamin A so they got the vitamin A toxcity thing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_A

Its abit dense, but anyway.

Larry Hoover is the prefect person to answer these questions, but alas he's not here anymore.


Kind regards

Meri

 

Thanks (replied on Alternative) » Meri-Tuuli

Posted by pseudoname on October 11, 2006, at 17:18:28

In reply to Re: What is your fish oil brand? Thanks » pseudoname, posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 11, 2006, at 14:44:41

Meri, Thanks! Lots of info.

Since I know we're going to get re-directed anyway, I replied to you on Alternative. (Re-direction always traumatizes me…) :-)

http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20060817/msgs/693902.html

 

I stopped accutane years ago

Posted by adamCanada on October 12, 2006, at 0:51:17

In reply to Re: Mental Health deteriorating. What is to blame?, posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 11, 2006, at 2:59:11

But the depression chemical inbalance it caused never went away

 

I guess I do have withdrawl then. Is it dangerous?

Posted by adamCanada on October 12, 2006, at 1:28:33

In reply to Re: fish oil bad in Hypervitaminosis A patients?, posted by Meri-Tuuli on October 11, 2006, at 2:56:16

I felt fine if not better for first few days off dexedrine and then i suddenly felt like pure garbage. Horrendous. I was motivated those first few days perhaps slightly more than usual and I had some interest in certian things like meeting women and buying myself a new 800 digital cam etc.

then i didnt want to do anything and everything appeared so dark.

Is it dangerous to withdrawl cold turkey? Should I take some dexedrine from time to time to keep some of that norepinephrine and dopamine in my system? I guess they must be pretty low right now.

My doctor sent me some recommendations---

he suggested combining the paxil with mirtazapine or
risperidone. Alternative is to add pramipexole, atomoxetine or concerta.
Finally, desipramine or imipramine can be tried as they are most similar to
valoxetine. If all else fails nardil or parnate.
Many options. When you are ready make an appointment to see me to discuss
these options.
---------

Anyway I will try to look those up and see what may be best for me.

And perhaps go back to taking dexedrine again as I am tired of being so lifeless but today was better than yesterday deffinetly.

How long should it take before I feel better usually?

 

Redirect: withdrawl

Posted by Dr. Bob on October 12, 2006, at 9:10:25

In reply to I guess I do have withdrawl then. Is it dangerous?, posted by adamCanada on October 12, 2006, at 1:28:33

> Is it dangerous to withdrawl cold turkey? Should I take some dexedrine from time to time to keep some of that norepinephrine and dopamine in my system?

Sorry to interrupt, and I hope it isn't traumatic, but I'd like to redirect follow-ups regarding withdrawal to Psycho-Babble Withdrawal. Here's a link:

http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/wdrawl/20061010/msgs/694093.html

Thanks,

Bob

 

Doesn't sound like Dex withdrawal to me » adamCanada

Posted by psychobot5000 on October 12, 2006, at 10:17:18

In reply to I guess I do have withdrawl then. Is it dangerous?, posted by adamCanada on October 12, 2006, at 1:28:33

I don't think that taking 'tiny doses' of dex for some time is likely to cause this kind of withdrawal.

I think your problem is related to melatonin or fish oil. There seems to be evidence that DHA fish oil can be bad for mood (I've been taking it the last couple of days, and feel like crap--increased anergic depression--sounded like what you described doing during the day), and the EPA, while good for mood, could potentially cause insomnia.

Melatonin also increased my depression a year ago--though it sounds like you're already stopping that. Good. I wouldn't worry about the dex. You could check your fish oil, and maybe switch to a version that's mostly or all EPA, and that might help.

I've also been on small doses of dex, and never had any problems when I stopped it.


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