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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Sobriquet Style on May 24, 2006, at 17:58:44
In reply to ADHD testing in UK » Meri-Tuuli, posted by pseudoname on May 24, 2006, at 15:57:28
From what I've read theres over 12 million benzo's scripts given out a year in the UK and stimulant medication scripts are on the rise too, although they're not in the millions and the large majority are for children. I doubt its impossible to get either scripted, theres ways of getting what you want, but firstly, there has to be a *need* eg a therapeutic advantage for prescribing the drug and then there has to be a doctor to write the prescription. The former is most important, the latter is seeing how determined you are to forfil your need and join the milions and hundreds of thousands who currently have.
Probably easier said then done? :)
~
Posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 18:07:11
In reply to Re: ADHD testing in UK, posted by Sobriquet Style on May 24, 2006, at 17:58:44
> theres ways of getting what you want, but firstly, there has to be a *need* eg a therapeutic advantage for prescribing the drug >
> Probably easier said then done? :)
>
> ~
>
>
A F*CKING NEED?How about not being able to hold down a job, or worse, a lack of quality of like in this world?-HA?
Thats all i want, i've pretty much given up on the first one.
If
-Ritalin
-Valium
-Xanax
-Dextroamphetamine, or even (for the real f*cked up)
-Desoxyn, script MethamphetamineOr any pill can help, bring it on-OK!
Cheers
Posted by Sobriquet Style on May 24, 2006, at 18:24:05
In reply to Re: ADHD testing in UK » Sobriquet Style, posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 18:07:11
>A F*CKING NEED?
Like f*cking ADHD, or a type of depression that will respond to a stimulant, sorry if I wasn't too clear :)
>How about not being able to hold down a job, or worse, a lack of quality of like in this world?-HA?
Yeah that too, for example if its a case of not being able to hold down a job, but by taking some amphetamines you can - then by all means find a doctor to gve you a prescription to get your life back.
-Ritalin
-Valium
-Xanax
-Dextroamphetamine, or even (for the real f*cked up)
-Desoxyn, script MethamphetamineI bet *some* people without psychiatric illness would feel pretty buzzed out on all / or some of them.
>Or any pill can help, bring it on-OK!
Ok, whatever floats your boat man.
>Cheers
Peace
~
Posted by Sobriquet Style on May 24, 2006, at 18:34:37
In reply to Re: ADHD testing in UK » Sobriquet Style, posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 18:07:11
>A F*CKING NEED?
As in a condition requiring relief, what you said were good examples by the way. By your use of block capitals (shouting?) i'm assuming you thought my use of the word "need" was used perhaps alittle "losely"
Sorry if that offended you, Paul - be - well :)
~
Posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 18:44:36
In reply to Re: ADHD testing in UK » Sobriquet Style, posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 18:07:11
Thanks dude,
The meds i mentioned DO have abuse potentiol to some folk, ut allow other folk to live more normally. I'v taken them apart from Dex.
If you got ant Qs get back ok?-coolness
Cheers
Posted by alohashirt on May 24, 2006, at 21:44:03
In reply to Re: Dexedrine » Meri-Tuuli, posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 6:46:53
Paul,
I'd strongly recommend dexedrine vs ritalin, even though the side effecst can be a nuisance. Where in Oz are you? I grew up in Perth & Melbourne and I can't imagine getting treatment for ADHD there.
Posted by alohashirt on May 24, 2006, at 21:47:36
In reply to Re: Dexedrine, posted by denise1966 on May 24, 2006, at 7:03:02
Where in the UK are you? There *are* pdocs in England who prescribe dexedrine, despite the BNFs cautions, but not many.
I can give you some suggestions if you babble me.
> Hi,
>
> Thanks for the responses. Doesn't look like I'll be able to get my hands on it then as no psychiatrist over here would even consider prescribing it. Shame though as I thought it might kickstart this Cymbalta which isn't working that well.
>
> I've even tried doubling the dose of Cymbalta to 120mg but doesn't seem to be making a difference. I also tried adding 400mg of Lamictal which seems to have calmed me down a bit. I know I'm not supposed to do these things but I'm just trying to experiment a bit.
>
>
> Denise
Posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 21:56:05
In reply to Paul (Re: Dexedrine, posted by alohashirt on May 24, 2006, at 21:44:03
> Paul,
>
> I'd strongly recommend dexedrine vs ritalin, even though the side effecst can be a nuisance. Where in Oz are you? I grew up in Perth & Melbourne and I can't imagine getting treatment for ADHD there.Dude,
After reading your educated posts for SOME time now, i assumed you were a Yankey, due to the pills you mentioned (i thought many were ONLY in the US).
I'm in New Zealand, actually:( and theres probably like adults being treated with stims in the 100's here!!, kids yer thousands!
I see you strongly recommend Dex, no suprise, Why Aloha? what are the nuicence SEs?I'm making an app with my Psy and gonna do it.
I value, and respect your opions-sp?, so go ahead......
Cheers dude
Posted by Sobriquet Style on May 25, 2006, at 8:51:37
In reply to Re: ADHD testing in UK-sobriquet » Paulbwell, posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 18:44:36
>The meds i mentioned DO have abuse potentiol to some folk, ut allow other folk to live more normally.
Most definitely. I think (and I could be wrong) but some stimulants taken by the the normal population, by that I mean taken even though they have no psychiatric diagnosis - enable them to be more productive in their everyday life, job, relationships etc and use them wisely. Its kind of like a middle ground inbetween the people who need them for medical reasons and the people who simply take them to high etc.
>If you got ant Qs get back ok?
Cheers :-) ~ ~ How do you find the stims help?...with what kind of symptoms do they reduce, how do they help you basicially?
I often wondered if they'd help me, but i'm unsure how they could or if they may cause more problems than benefit. My main diagnosis is bipolar, but I do have concentration issues from time to time..
~
Posted by alohashirt on May 25, 2006, at 14:18:46
In reply to ALOHASHIRT-PAUL!! » alohashirt, posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 21:56:05
Good luck with the dexedrine. Suck it and see is my motto. I lived in Auckland for a while as kid, ended up in london, now New York. I don't really know what I am anymore, but I'm a textbook case of adult adhd combined type.
dexedrine side effects/irritations
1. erratic effectiveness cf ritalin. vitamin C, fruit juice, acids, fatty food all appear to reduce effectiveness off dexedrine inconsistently.
2. some generics have erratic absorption. the brand dexedrine spansules are more consistent
3. dexedrine can cause insomnia more than ritalin
4. excessiev talkiness
5. in < 2% of people increase in blood pressure.
6. It's an "abusable drug" so has more/different stigma than ritalin
7. pre-employment drug screens can blip if you change jobs
8. foreign travel with a narcotic requires forethought.
9. tolerance seem sto be much bigger problem than with ritalin/focalin
10. risk of mistaking euphoric effect for symptom removal.
11. can impair sport performanceAll told its smoother, and clearer sharper than Concerta Metadate CD with less of a wear-off moodieness that Ritalin IR has. Tell us how it works out.
> > Paul,
> >
> > I'd strongly recommend dexedrine vs ritalin, even though the side effecst can be a nuisance. Where in Oz are you? I grew up in Perth & Melbourne and I can't imagine getting treatment for ADHD there.
>
> Dude,
>
> After reading your educated posts for SOME time now, i assumed you were a Yankey, due to the pills you mentioned (i thought many were ONLY in the US).
>
> I'm in New Zealand, actually:( and theres probably like adults being treated with stims in the 100's here!!, kids yer thousands!
>
>
> I see you strongly recommend Dex, no suprise, Why Aloha? what are the nuicence SEs?
>
> I'm making an app with my Psy and gonna do it.
>
> I value, and respect your opions-sp?, so go ahead......
>
> Cheers dude
>
Posted by Phillipa on May 25, 2006, at 21:08:28
In reply to Re: Dexedrine » Paulbwell, posted by Meri-Tuuli on May 24, 2006, at 12:22:39
Merri Ed's friendly ha ha I know he wouldn't do anything to lose his job. Love Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on May 25, 2006, at 21:12:00
In reply to Re: Dexedrine-Stims, Benzos.... » Meri-Tuuli, posted by Paulbwell on May 24, 2006, at 15:31:22
Paulwell I E-mail with someone from Melborne and you wouldn't believe all the meds he takes and valium too. 20mg a day and his doc prescribes them. Love Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on May 25, 2006, at 21:16:08
In reply to Paul (Re: Dexedrine, posted by alohashirt on May 24, 2006, at 21:44:03
Isn't Declan from Perth? Love Phillipa
Posted by Paulbwell on May 26, 2006, at 7:35:10
In reply to Paul (Re: Dexedrine, posted by alohashirt on May 24, 2006, at 21:44:03
> Paul,
>
> I'd strongly recommend dexedrine vs ritalin, even though the side effecst can be a nuisance. Where in Oz are you? I grew up in Perth & Melbourne and I can't imagine getting treatment for ADHD there.Hi ya!!
So I KNEW YOU HAD TO BE IN THE US, DUE TO MEDS YOY HAVE MENTIONED!!
Focalin
Dex Spans....
You lived in New Zealand ha?-cool."I'd strongly recommend dexedrine vs ritalin,"
You and everyone else. Is Ritalin REALLLY that crap?.
I have been scripted the crap from 20-80mgs daily!!
I have read of folks who have safetly taken script Meth/Amphetamine, for 40+ years.
yer, for the sake of my mental health, i better stop it.I value yr threads enormously.
Cheers
Posted by pseudoname on May 26, 2006, at 8:16:09
In reply to Re: Paul (Re: Dexedrine-ALOHASHIRT » alohashirt, posted by Paulbwell on May 26, 2006, at 7:35:10
> "I'd strongly recommend dexedrine vs ritalin,"
>
> You and everyone else. Is Ritalin REALLLY that cr*p?I got *excellent* antidepressant benefit from Ritalin, but tolerance built up very quickly. I went from like 20mg to 140mg in a few weeks. Also, on the old version, the after-crash was terrible.
The new Metadate CR is a lot better that way, but I only take it once or twice a month on top of my other med.
Posted by Paulbwell on May 26, 2006, at 8:20:08
In reply to Re: Ritalin » Paulbwell, posted by pseudoname on May 26, 2006, at 8:16:09
> > "I'd strongly recommend dexedrine vs ritalin,"
> >
> > You and everyone else. Is Ritalin REALLLY that cr*p?
>
> I got *excellent* antidepressant benefit from Ritalin, but tolerance built up very quickly. I went from like 20mg to 140mg in a few weeks. Also, on the old version, the after-crash was terrible.
>
> The new Metadate CR is a lot better that way, but I only take it once or twice a month on top of my other med.Hi,
What are your other meds?, are you being treated for other than ADD/HD issues?.
Thanks
Posted by pseudoname on May 26, 2006, at 8:34:49
In reply to Re: Ritalin » pseudoname, posted by Paulbwell on May 26, 2006, at 8:20:08
> What are your other meds? are you being treated for other than ADD/HD issues?
I'm only being treated for depression. I don't think I have much attention problems. For depression I've tried 30+ meds & combos (all the biggies) and ECT. The only things that worked were Ritalin and Adderall. Ritalin led to tolerance, and Adderall only helped the worst low trough of depression.
For 5 months, I've been on the synthetic opioid buprenorphine (Subutex) for depression. It WORKS! It has gradually been changing my life. It's hard to get prescribed, though, and pdocs are almost universally misinformed about it.
I don't know if opioids have any effect on AD/HD, but some people find them stimulating, so maybe.
Posted by Paulbwell on May 26, 2006, at 8:46:13
In reply to Re: Ritalin » Paulbwell, posted by pseudoname on May 26, 2006, at 8:34:49
I hear ya!!
I have taken IR Morphine tabs, orally, Plugged, snorted. Morphine 20mg SR crushed and snorted.
Codeine, tabs orally~400mgs
60mg DHC tabs. orally and plugged.Opis do indeed relieve depression, but at what cost?
Cheers
Posted by pseudoname on May 26, 2006, at 9:15:45
In reply to Re: Ritalin_Opiods Etc » pseudoname, posted by Paulbwell on May 26, 2006, at 8:46:13
> Opis do indeed relieve depression, but at what cost?
About $60 a month for me. (Giggle. Sorry.)
Buprenorphine is a very mild opioid, and it's a partial antagonist — it blocks some opioid receptors. Its main U.S. use is in opioid addiction treatment (as Subutex & Suboxone). I never get a buzz from it; I just don't feel as depressed or upset. And I feel some “good” emotions more readily in response to events.
For me, it takes 1 or 2 hours after taking it for it to kick in, so I think the addictive part of my brain never makes the connection between feeling better and taking bupe. I never get cravings for it, even if I skip it for more than a week. I *do* start to get withdrawal symptoms like sweating & chills (mild) after about 24 hours, though.
I've never tried any other opioids, so I don't know what those experiences are like. I know opioid addiction is a serious problem, but I think there's less risk with bupe.
My sweet pdoc was only willing to prescribe the Subutex for me because, as she said, “I don't think you'll sue me if you get addicted.”
Posted by alohashirt on May 27, 2006, at 0:22:08
In reply to Re: Ritalin » Paulbwell, posted by pseudoname on May 26, 2006, at 8:16:09
> > "I'd strongly recommend dexedrine vs ritalin,"
> >
> > You and everyone else. Is Ritalin REALLLY that cr*p?Ritalin is extremely effective with kids, 70% show measurable positive response from initial dose 90% after increase. It mad eme really nasty. Metadate CD was better. Concerta was better again but ende dup feeling robotic. Focalin XR gave teh same clarity as dexedrine without the inconsistency or insomnia or high blood pressure.
> I got *excellent* antidepressant benefit from Ritalin, but tolerance built up very quickly. I went from like 20mg to 140mg in a few weeks. Also, on the old version, the after-crash was terrible.
>
> The new Metadate CR is a lot better that way, but I only take it once or twice a month on top of my other med.
Posted by linkadge on May 27, 2006, at 18:48:19
In reply to Re: Ritalin, posted by alohashirt on May 27, 2006, at 0:22:08
I had an antidepressant response to ritalin, and with a few additional supplements, I needed no dose increase.
I stopped because of ritalin's link to chromisomal abormalities.
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=20433
Although, if larger studies clarified the findings, I might be interested in trying it again.
Linkadge
Posted by notfred on May 28, 2006, at 3:06:11
In reply to Re: Ritalin, posted by linkadge on May 27, 2006, at 18:48:19
> I had an antidepressant response to ritalin, and with a few additional supplements, I needed no dose increase.
>
> I stopped because of ritalin's link to chromisomal abormalities.
>
> http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=20433
>
> Although, if larger studies clarified the findings, I might be interested in trying it again.
>
> Linkadge
>
IIRC Link, you have mentioned on this list that you are gay and male. Chromosomes are only used in reproduction; do you forsee having children the old fasioned way ?This study was not blinded and there were no controls; all done by one doc in one community.
Toxins in the community could of caused the abormalities or lots of other things. Without controls it is hard to say what really happened here.Given that ritalin has been arround for over 30 years and at least millions have taken it I think
we would of seen this link by now.
Posted by Meri-Tuuli on May 28, 2006, at 9:34:21
In reply to Re: Ritalin, posted by notfred on May 28, 2006, at 3:06:11
Hiya Notfred
I have to say that I'm far too sceptical about the drug industry. Who's going to fund a large scale study proving that ritalin (or others) is genotoxic (or whatever)?? The producers of ritalin would probably pay researchers handsomely *not* to do the research.
>Given that ritalin has been arround for over 30 years and at least millions have taken it I think
> we would of seen this link by now.Think about how many more people smoked and how long it took them to come up with the link between smoking and cancer.
I'm very skeptical about the whole drug industry, I'm sorry to say.
Kind regards
Meri
Posted by ed_uk on May 28, 2006, at 13:46:25
In reply to Re: ADHD testing in UK, posted by Sobriquet Style on May 24, 2006, at 17:58:44
Hi SS
>From what I've read theres over 12 million benzo's scripts given out a year in the UK
The majority of people who are prescribed benzos in the UK seem to be elderly women. Most of them receive 28 day prescriptions for diazepam, temazepam or nitrazepam.........which they've been taking since the 70s!
Regards
Ed
Posted by linkadge on May 29, 2006, at 17:52:27
In reply to Re: Ritalin, posted by notfred on May 28, 2006, at 3:06:11
Well then, you take it.
I agree with Meri. There is far too much going on in the background for us to know what these results imply. The fact that each of the 12 children showed a significant incease in chromosomal dammage in such a short period of time should sound a warning. From what I have read in other sources, the chromisomal changes were not insignificant changes.
The researchers also noted that of the ~55 some odd known human carcinogens, ~48 of them were detected using similar methods.
Saying that it would be 'obvious' to us by now whether or not ritalin causes cancer, is not so obvious. Sometimes studies like this only scratch the surface. In addition, the first generation of ritalin users may not be old enough for a significant change in cancer incidence to be detected.
The fact that we have heard nothing about the matter since this study is also strange. One might expect the makers of ritalin to fire back with assuring evidence. Perhaps they have known about the link for a while. As suggested, perhaps they payed this company not to conduct followup studies. All of these behaviors are not unheard of in this type of buisness.
The only way I'd be assured is when I see well designed studies suggesting the contrary.
This buisness has made me paranoid. I used to be trusting, but when I start to uncover the lies that have been presented to me, I take on a "guilty till proven innocent" stance.
Linkadge
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