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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Shawn. T. on July 4, 2005, at 13:24:04
In reply to Re: Saredutant looks like a winner, posted by ravenstorm on July 4, 2005, at 10:56:38
According to Schoor et al. (1998) in a study involving 12 mild asthmatics, "Saredutant was biologically and clinically well tolerated and no serious events were noted. Two non serious events were noted: patients number 7 and 11 both experienced mild frontal headache on the active treatment day; in both cases it subsided spontaneously until complete recovery." That's not much information, but I strongly doubt that saredutant will have more side effects than SSRIs. I don't know enough about SR 58611 to speculate about it.
Shawn
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=9701408
Posted by ravenstorm on July 4, 2005, at 14:34:13
In reply to Saredutant looks like a winner, posted by Shawn. T. on July 3, 2005, at 23:07:47
How would you find out about where they are doing clinical trials on this drug?
In clinical trials, do you get to take the drug for more than four to six weeks? Or are you shoved out the door at that point?
Posted by linkadge on July 4, 2005, at 15:23:04
In reply to Saredutant looks like a winner, posted by Shawn. T. on July 3, 2005, at 23:07:47
Researchers have found that NK2 receptor antagonists such as saredutant can reduce the CRF-induced release of norepinephrine in the prefrontal cortex and acetylcholine in the hippocampus (see the two links below).
----------------------------------------------Depressing as these actions may be. I'm not sure if I'd want to be taking this drug before a school exam.
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on July 4, 2005, at 15:25:11
In reply to Re: Saredutant looks like a winner, posted by linkadge on July 4, 2005, at 15:23:04
Ie. The stress induced increase in frontal cortex norepinephrine, and hippocampal acetylcholine sounds like its putting your brain into a "taking care of buisness" mode.
Linkadge
Posted by Shawn. T. on July 5, 2005, at 0:27:06
In reply to Re: Saredutant looks like a winner, trials?, posted by ravenstorm on July 4, 2005, at 14:34:13
>How would you find out about where they are >doing clinical trials on this drug?
I don't know. Maybe you could e-mail someone at Sanofi-Aventis.
>In clinical trials, do you get to take the drug >for more than four to six weeks? Or are you >shoved out the door at that point?
Sometimes you do; sometimes you don't. I believe that long-term studies are more commonly performed after a drug has been launched.
Shawn
Posted by Shawn. T. on July 5, 2005, at 0:58:20
In reply to Re: Saredutant looks like a winner, posted by linkadge on July 4, 2005, at 15:25:11
In general, the brain can best take care of business when extracellular neurotransmitter levels are neither too low nor too high. An increase in the activation of alpha-1-adrenoceptors by norepinephrine in the prefrontal cortex can result in stress-induced cognitive deficits.
An article in Science by Amy Arnsten (1998) called "The Biology of Being Frazzled" addressed this point:
"These studies emphasize the importance of dopamine D1 receptor actions in taking the prefrontal cortex 'off line' during stress. Other neuromodulators may contribute as well [for example, norepinephrine via a1-adrenoceptors (14)], ensuring rapid yet reversible loss of prefrontal cortical control over behavior.
This bimodal reaction to stress likely had survival value in evolution: Under stress, the faster, habitual, or instinctual mechanisms regulated by the amygdala, hippocampus, striatum, and posterior cortices would control behavior, and long-lasting memories of aversive stimuli would be enhanced in order to avoid such stimuli in the future. However, in modern human society these brain actions may often be maladaptive; now we need prefrontal cortex regulation to act appropriately."
I wouldn't use the same language to describe this phenomenon, but she is basically explaining why excess neurotransmitter levels are not always a good thing.
Shawn
Posted by ravenstorm on July 5, 2005, at 8:52:34
In reply to Re: Saredutant looks like a winner » linkadge, posted by Shawn. T. on July 5, 2005, at 0:58:20
Posted by linkadge on July 5, 2005, at 15:37:03
In reply to Re: Saredutant looks like a winner » linkadge, posted by Shawn. T. on July 5, 2005, at 0:58:20
I suppose "excess" is not a good thing. THe problem is that feeling comfortable, is not aways the most adaptive state of mind.
Linkadge
Posted by Denise1966 on July 6, 2005, at 7:33:20
In reply to Re: How many years until these hit the market? (nm), posted by ravenstorm on July 4, 2005, at 10:55:29
.
Posted by ravenstorm on July 6, 2005, at 9:52:48
In reply to Ravenstorm,You make me smile,like me so impatient, posted by Denise1966 on July 6, 2005, at 7:33:20
Posted by Denise1966 on July 6, 2005, at 12:11:30
In reply to Re: Denise, did you ever contact nemifitimide? (nm), posted by ravenstorm on July 6, 2005, at 9:52:48
Hi Ravenstorm.
I've added the update to our original discussion on Nemifitide.
Denise
Posted by utopizen on July 6, 2005, at 14:43:40
In reply to Saredutant looks like a winner, posted by Shawn. T. on July 3, 2005, at 23:07:47
I remember Phil Donahue a couple of years ago on MSNBC talking with Magic Johnson, and mentioning something about "It's gotten much better since back when they only had those terrible Substance P drugs with all those side effects, hasn't it?" and Magic concurred.
How is this different?
Posted by Shawn. T. on July 6, 2005, at 15:31:28
In reply to Substance P's: poorly-tolerated HIV drugs?, posted by utopizen on July 6, 2005, at 14:43:40
Saredutant does not block the high affinity receptor for substance P.
Shawn
Posted by cncgordon on September 4, 2005, at 1:30:30
In reply to Re: Substance P's: poorly-tolerated HIV drugs?, posted by Shawn. T. on July 6, 2005, at 15:31:28
I am taking part in the Saredutant study. I have so many questions and the only information you can find is how a rat reacts to having their neck rubbed or when they are exposed to a cat. I feel like such a lab rat it isn't funny. Will let you know how things go.
Posted by cncgordon on September 4, 2005, at 1:36:41
I am in the phase3 study of saredutant. I am hoping to find others that are participating in the study as well. I figure it will be like finding a needle in a hay stack but worth a try.
If anyone has any other information besides how mice react to having thier necks scatched or how a rat reacts to being put face to face with a cat then please feel free to e-mail me.
Posted by Phillipa on September 4, 2005, at 19:03:40
In reply to saredutant study, posted by cncgordon on September 4, 2005, at 1:36:41
What in the world is it? Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by cncgordon on September 5, 2005, at 9:16:05
In reply to Re: saredutant study, posted by Phillipa on September 4, 2005, at 19:03:40
It is a new drug to treat depression.
Posted by Phillipa on September 5, 2005, at 16:09:40
In reply to Re: saredutant study, posted by cncgordon on September 5, 2005, at 9:16:05
Thanks so much. What country is it in? Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by cncgordon on September 6, 2005, at 9:21:33
In reply to Re: saredutant study » cncgordon, posted by Phillipa on September 5, 2005, at 16:09:40
It's a world wide study. I believe there are only 250 people in this phase of the study but I could be wrong.
Posted by ravenstorm on September 8, 2005, at 13:48:50
In reply to Saredutant study, posted by cncgordon on September 4, 2005, at 1:30:30
Where are you taking part in this study? Have you had any side effects, or do you think you've been given the placebo. Any information would be great!
Posted by ravenstorm on September 8, 2005, at 14:12:32
In reply to Re: saredutant study, posted by cncgordon on September 6, 2005, at 9:21:33
Where are you participating in this study? Have you started taking the drug or placebo yet? Can you tell which one you are getting by side effects or benefits etc?
How did you find out about the study. I may be interested in this as well.
Have they given you any further information about the drug, like when they think they will be done with phase III, if the drug has any withdrawal effects etc etc?
Thanks, K
Posted by cncgordon on September 9, 2005, at 0:59:26
In reply to Re: saredutant study, posted by ravenstorm on September 8, 2005, at 14:12:32
Well Ravenstorm, before I visited the doctor doing the study I had never heard of Saredutant and it wasn't until I did a search on google that I found this forum and I believe it was a post by you or a follow up that made me decide to join.
It's a very limited study. I am in Canada and there are 2 Doctors doing the study here with about 30 patients. It is a double blind study and you either get Saredutant 100mg, Paxil 50mg?, or placebo.
It was very easy for me to figure out that I am on the saredutant because of the sideffects. Keep in mind I have never taken an antidepressant before in my life and I haven't done any drugs for well over a decade making me the perfect giniepig (sp).
When I take the pill after about 45 minutes I get this really fuzzy dreamy kind of feeling and it knocks me onto the couch. Sucks because I am supose to take the pill in the morning. There is also a mild headache that goes along with it but that fades quick.
Other sideffects are: Gas, cramps, dizzyness, dry mouth, vertigo and the list goes on. I dont get any of these but I have always had gas so it's hard to tell :)
I really dont like the feeling of apprehensivness as it kicks in (when I go fuzzy) and the best way to desribe it is (if you have ever tried it) like the feeling you get when you take XTC but really really mild but only when it is setting in. You dont walk around wanting to kiss everyone and actually I haven't really noticed any difference in my mood.
I'm afraid you would have a really hard time getting into this study because I dont think there are to many doctors worldwide taking part and you have to be in the same city as them because they monitor you like a hawk for adverse effects.
The best I can do is keep you up on my progress and hope to meet others in the study via this BBS.
Posted by ravenstorm on September 9, 2005, at 8:14:45
In reply to Re: saredutant study, posted by cncgordon on September 9, 2005, at 0:59:26
Yes, based on the side effects, you are definitely not getting the placebo. However, you could be getting paxil, not saredutant because paxil also has some pretty harsh start up side effects. (It also has some pretty harsh withdrawal symptoms for some)
Please keep us posted. If you are on paxil, will you get to try saredutant later in the study or not? Also, if you are on saredutant and it works for you, do you get to keep taking it, or do you have to stop taking it at the end of the study?
Thanks for the update, R
Posted by cncgordon on September 9, 2005, at 11:35:21
In reply to Re: saredutant study, posted by ravenstorm on September 9, 2005, at 8:14:45
It looks like 99% that I am on the saredutant because of the sideffects and the lack of Paxil like sideffects. I have the option of leaving the study at any time during the 44 weeks and then would be taken off it. DOnt know if there are withdrawl symtoms will have to wait and see.
Posted by ravenstorm on September 10, 2005, at 8:31:05
In reply to Re: saredutant study, posted by cncgordon on September 9, 2005, at 11:35:21
Interesting. Well, at least you get to stay on whatever drug you are on for a long time. Some of these studies only last 10-12 weeks.
I am curious, though, how do you know that you aren't having paxil side effects if you've never taken it before? Have they indicated that the saredutant side effects are significantly different than what paxil's would be? Also, each person reacts differently to each medication, so I would imagine it would be difficult to tell.
How long have you been taking the medication?
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