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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 7902 to 7926 of 10407. Go back in thread:
Posted by dancingstar on December 23, 2004, at 12:34:52
In reply to Re: Side Effects- Lethargic, Skin Rash?, posted by Gia on December 23, 2004, at 8:51:55
...let's take the other side for a minute in fairness to the people that have been yelling at me, like my best friend who says that I am being irresponsible in wanting this drug off the market. Staying at home being happy is better than wanting to kill yourself or running all over town being miserable. But, that said,...only each of us knows how far this can go before you have to wonder if this, too, is the wrong answer.
There is an article in this month's O Magazine about jogging and other exercise, about approaching it very slowly so as not to overload your body and burnout, but the article does explain metabolic changes that it makes in the brain in order to bring about physical changes in people with depression and anxiety. It also makes the point that this is the most difficult thing to get people to do. This is not in any way to say that anyone should stop taking drugs, just that the article is a worthwhile read.
Posted by dancingstar on December 23, 2004, at 14:13:43
In reply to Re: Side Effects- Lethargic, Skin Rash? » S. Bartel, posted by Cindy S. G. on December 23, 2004, at 8:25:33
Hi Cindy,
I never had any skin problems from Effexor until after I stopped taking it, but we all react differently to chemicals.
I could not wake up while I was taking it, especially while on 150 mg., probably even if there were a fire in the house. I slept through jury duty ;-). Nothing could keep me awake.
Posted by not2late4u on December 24, 2004, at 3:50:56
In reply to Re: Side Effects- Lethargic, Skin Rash? » Cindy S. G., posted by dancingstar on December 23, 2004, at 14:13:43
PROS and CONS
Hello, first time posting. I just spent 45 minutes reading over some past posts. Wow. I have been taking Effexor xr for about 2 yrs. Recently increased to 225mg. I was on Paxil, but gained weight and it really didnt address depression, just anxiety for me. Nice to know that the "electric" feeling in back of head and cant seem to get out of bed in the morning, is not just me. Other things, lack of sex drive, some increased headaches with exercise (anyone else experience this?) I do want to get off, eventually, hopefully sooner than later. I have to wonder how many of you and others are actually being MONITORED by a PSYCHIATRIST who is much more knowledgable about these types of medications. I see my psychiatrist about every 2 months just to check in and see how its going. It takes about 10 minutes. Why would anyone ever just stop taking the medication? Doesnt the pharmacy give information about not stopping the drug without consulting your doctor? I had a hard time with Paxil, whooo, it was HELL when I just missed a day. When I transferred over to Effexor I was wheened off at the same time I was starting Effexor and it was seemless. I dont know what to expect when I SLOWLY withdraw from Effexor, but I am not sorry I took it, it got me where I am today, much more functional and in a place where I can work on things so I can get off it. Just hope its not chemical imbalances that will keep me from getting off and I am afraid to go off not because of side effects, I think dont think much can top the 24/7 anxiety I had for several months straight, its the fear of experiencing that constant anxiety again. Well I've got an appt with a counselor to help me sort this through along with some PSTD. I will get will be free from medications some day! I've decided to put my trust in my Lord God and go from there. REMEMBER, you CANT just stop taking ANY anti-depressants!!!! You really need to have a psychiatrist help you along. Not a family doctor. Sorry, just my point of view. I pray all of us are able to overcome our hardships.
Posted by jubilee on December 24, 2004, at 8:56:32
In reply to Re: Side Effects- Lethargic, Skin Rash?, posted by not2late4u on December 24, 2004, at 3:50:56
I have tried ove and ove to read the posts , but effexor has totally meesed with my ability to read and consentrate, so I might not be following any particuar subject. I get 2 or 3 pages read in a book daily and I was an avid reader. Been off effexoe , after going slow 5 months for about a week now ( one small dose 4 days ago. My mind is in a fog and I get real emotional, and I definatly have had a personality change , but then I am going through some other heavy stuff also. Most my issues , like effexor blackouts I stull suffer with , still have severe memory lloss , which is a side affect of effexor, anxiety, emotional, nervous( and why they would give effexor for anxioty when thats one of its ver yside astounds me as I have been "hypermanic since I was put on it 4 tears ago, Fekt like I was going to jum out of my skin , when they called it Bi Polar. Got to close and a happy holiday to you all , Jubilee
Posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 11:13:16
In reply to Re: Side Effects- Lethargic, Skin Rash?, posted by Gia on December 23, 2004, at 8:51:55
Gia,
If you want to be happy on Effexor, you shouldn't be reading this board. There are many of us who will tell you the negative effects of a drug that is one of the most prescribed drugs on the market...until I do my best to have that changed because I believe that the horrendous side effects have been largely under-reported.
Posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 11:14:52
In reply to Re: Side Effects- Lethargic, Skin Rash?, posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 11:13:16
I didn't mean that to be as harsh as it sounded. I only said it cause I know that you recently started taking Effexor and wanted to give it a fair try.
Posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 13:45:25
In reply to Re: Side Effects- Lethargic, Skin Rash?, posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 11:14:52
I just wanted to add another perspective here. Effexor helped me more than any other antidepressant to date (and that includes MANY years of trials). I also tolerated it unusually well. I couldn't even tell I was taking anything except for the muted sexual desire and anorgasmia. Unfortunately, despite being better than anything else I've taken to date, Effexor still only gave me limited help. (I used to think that maybe I had 20% mood lift from it but now that I'm off of it I realize that the number is probably more like 40-50%.) I recently went off of it to search for a more comprehensive solution - one that would help provide some energy and motivation.
My experience going off of Effexor wasn't all that bad either thanks to the advice I received on this board. I decreased my dosage very slowly and then substituted a longer acting SSRI at the very end. Without that strategy it probably would have been a nightmare. I think it's criminal that most pdocs don't know enough to utilize this method of withdrawal with their patients. I don't know if this method would end the withdrawal problems completely but it sure can't hurt (and in my case it DID take care of the problem completely).
I would not hesitate to go back on Effexor and try to augment it with other medications in the future. I am not trying to discredit other people's experiences here. I'm just giving you my experience. YMMV.
Kara
Posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 14:42:11
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience, posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 13:45:25
Hi Kara,
Actually, I wish that we had a more diverse population from which to draw our conclusions. I think that what happens is that when we are having a dramatic reaction to withdrawal with or without a tapered withdrawal and with or without the addition of Prozac as is indicated in one of the links that I posted (but was previously posted by someone before me - to whom I am very grateful) we do an internet search and end up here.
Admittedly, this is not an unbiased group, yet the fact so many people are predisposed to experiencing a negative reaction leads me to believe that the reported rate of 2 percent is underestimated by Wyeth and the fact that Effexor is prescribed by so many general as opposed to P doctors should perhaps be something that needs to be seriously reviewed. As it stands, there is no cure for those of us with serious reactions to Effexor. That alone is to me unacceptable, and there is no way to tell whether or not any of us will be one of those people as far as I can tell.
As far as modifying the level of depression that you have, I am not in the least being condescending when I ask whether you have added exercise into your daily regimen, only because it has in many cases proven to be as effective as drugs.
In any event, thanks for your perspective, and I hope you are feeling better soon.
Bebe
Posted by not2late4u on December 24, 2004, at 14:44:35
In reply to Re: Side Effects- finally off effexor, posted by jubilee on December 24, 2004, at 8:56:32
Hi Jubilee, if you are bi-polar, not sure effexor is/was the best for you. Im not an expert but I have family members who have it and they've told me that effexor isnt one they normally use for bi-polar. Hope you find whats works for you.
Posted by not2late4u on December 24, 2004, at 14:53:19
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience, posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 13:45:25
I am new to this site, got here because I did a search and saw, is effexor working for you? I didnt realize I was on a site that "hated" effexor and that my experience wouldnt be welcome. I actually learned some things from this site, why I cant sleep until 3-4am and dont want to get up until after noon and have to force myself to get up. Thats been a HUGE issue for me and thought it was a bad habit or still had depression or whatever. Anyways, I do think there are pros and cons to medication in general. Everyones pros and cons are different with each medication. I think the FDA can do a better job with ALL meds, not just effexor. I do plan on talking to my psych and weening myself off after the first of the new year. I want to see if I've made enough changes to be free of anxiety/depression without meds. God Bless. Renee
Posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 15:14:34
In reply to Re: Side Effects- Lethargic, Skin Rash?, posted by not2late4u on December 24, 2004, at 3:50:56
You're lucky that you know that you can't just stop taking antidepressants.
Yesterday I had an appointment with my internist. When I mentioned that Effexor is being prescribed for the symptoms of menopause, he acknowledged that I was right; that it is one of the four top prescribed drugs in the country. Considering this, it is my opinion that there should be no misinformation, no lack of clarity, no question whatsoever in the minds of the public about what they are taking as most of the public is not seeing a pschiatrist and is not informed about all of the side effects of Effexor. Because it is so widely prescribed, that makes it particularly unacceptable that so many of us know so little about what can happen to us if we take E, at least to me.
Posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 15:16:17
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience, posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 14:42:11
> Hi Kara,
>
> Actually, I wish that we had a more diverse population from which to draw our conclusions. I think that what happens is that when we are having a dramatic reaction to withdrawal with or without a tapered withdrawal and with or without the addition of Prozac as is indicated in one of the links that I posted (but was previously posted by someone before me - to whom I am very grateful) we do an internet search and end up here.
>
> Admittedly, this is not an unbiased group, yet the fact so many people are predisposed to experiencing a negative reaction leads me to believe that the reported rate of 2 percent is underestimated by Wyeth and the fact that Effexor is prescribed by so many general as opposed to P doctors should perhaps be something that needs to be seriously reviewed. As it stands, there is no cure for those of us with serious reactions to Effexor. That alone is to me unacceptable, and there is no way to tell whether or not any of us will be one of those people as far as I can tell.
>
> As far as modifying the level of depression that you have, I am not in the least being condescending when I ask whether you have added exercise into your daily regimen, only because it has in many cases proven to be as effective as drugs.
>
> In any event, thanks for your perspective, and I hope you are feeling better soon.
>
> BebeBebe,
That's all true and, again, I am not downplaying the negative experiences that others have had. I agree that there is no way to tell who will have a really bad experience on it. OTOH, can't the same be said about all other psychotropic medications? They're all somewhat risky. I think that with all of them we have to do a personal cost/benefit analysis. Perhaps Effexor is more risky than many others. I don't know. If I were one of the people who had a horrible reaction, then I'm sure I'd feel the same way you do about it.
I have tried exercise and natural supplements. Exercise has helped me some in the past but it did not take care of the whole problem - not by a longshot. I think it should be a part of everyone's daily routine for many health reasons but it's not enough of an antidepressant for me to allow me to function well in the world.
I prefer and continue to try natural supplements. I'm a regular on the Alternative Board. I'm definitely not biased against nonmedication methods. (I'm currently using niacinamide (Vit. B3) for anxiety control. It works like a natural benzo.) But, I'm also serously depressed and feel that I need more at this time. If that means medication, then I'll take it and assume some risk.
Take care,
Kara
Posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 15:22:40
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience, posted by not2late4u on December 24, 2004, at 14:53:19
> I am new to this site, got here because I did a search and saw, is effexor working for you? I didnt realize I was on a site that "hated" effexor and that my experience wouldnt be welcome. I actually learned some things from this site, why I cant sleep until 3-4am and dont want to get up until after noon and have to force myself to get up. Thats been a HUGE issue for me and thought it was a bad habit or still had depression or whatever. Anyways, I do think there are pros and cons to medication in general. Everyones pros and cons are different with each medication. I think the FDA can do a better job with ALL meds, not just effexor. I do plan on talking to my psych and weening myself off after the first of the new year. I want to see if I've made enough changes to be free of anxiety/depression without meds. God Bless. Renee
Renee,
I don't think it's fair to say that this whole site hates Effexor - though there is a considerable amount of anger towards it among a large vocal group. There are also members here who are on it now or have been on it in the past and have had better experiences on it (including myself). At any rate, I hope that you are successful in going of it and operating without medication.Good luck and definitely follow the advice you find on here about how to withdraw from it!
Kara
Posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 15:25:45
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience » dancingstar, posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 15:16:17
Hi Kara,
I have less of an issue with E as being prescribed with full knowledge and consent, by a p doctor, than for those of us -- and the group is large and growing -- that were given it by family practitioners, internists, gynos, etc. with no warning of what we were getting ourselves into. Especially with all the television advertising, a little fluffy pillow dude wandering around telling people they will feel better if they take this little pill.
These doctors don't know the full (possible) repurcussions of the dangers of these prescriptions and the meds are being oversold by the drug reps. Sure, I was damaged badly, and I am angry about it, and I don't want thousands? millions? of others to go through the same thing because Wyeth prevents this knowledge from getting to the people that need to know that this is a potentially dangerous drug that is being over-prescribed.
You obviously know well how to handle your healthcare and are doing a good job of it. Most of the people on Effexor are not in the psychiatric-care system IF it is one of the four most highly prescribed meds because there are simply not that many people seeing shrinks.
Bebe
Posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 15:36:27
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience » not2late4u, posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 15:22:40
Kara,
The only reason that this little loud and vocal group is so loud and vocal is because we have been through hell...and we don't want anyone else to have to be there quite by accident.
I am so very glad that you didn't have any problems when you tapered your withdrawal from Effexor, but from reading hours and hours of documented research and people's posts on websites in the United States and the UK, it seems that you may be in the minority, not the rest of us. But who really knows for sure? Not me. The addition of Prozac to the regimen may or may not help people get off of E more easily. There is no sure way to guarantee a smooth ride off the drug. The best thing that we can do is to try to yell as loudly as we can to others to not take it in the first place so that they won't have to risk being in the pain that we are now. And no, no one should ever, ever quit cold turkey!!! I did it, and I can safely say that no one else should ever do that :-).
We aren't doing this to upset anyone, quite the contrary.
Blessings.
Posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 20:41:48
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience, posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 15:25:45
Posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 20:57:19
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience, posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 15:36:27
> Kara,
>
> The only reason that this little loud and vocal group is so loud and vocal is because we have been through hell...and we don't want anyone else to have to be there quite by accident.
>
> I am so very glad that you didn't have any problems when you tapered your withdrawal from Effexor, but from reading hours and hours of documented research and people's posts on websites in the United States and the UK, it seems that you may be in the minority, not the rest of us. But who really knows for sure? Not me. The addition of Prozac to the regimen may or may not help people get off of E more easily. There is no sure way to guarantee a smooth ride off the drug. The best thing that we can do is to try to yell as loudly as we can to others to not take it in the first place so that they won't have to risk being in the pain that we are now. And no, no one should ever, ever quit cold turkey!!! I did it, and I can safely say that no one else should ever do that :-).
>
> We aren't doing this to upset anyone, quite the contrary.
>
> Blessings.Bebe,
I understand. My mother was given Effexor by her
gp. She was never told anything about its withdrawal effects. (Actually, my pdoc also downplays the withdrawal effects so going to a specialist in this case doesn't assure you'll get the full scoop either.) I have told her that it's difficult to get off of and it has to be done slowly. She doesn't want to hear it. She has full faith in her doctor and feels that he would have told her about the issue if it were that much of a problem. I worry about her because she is so naive and uninformed. Someday she will probably be begging for my advice. I hope she won't need it though.Kara
Posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 21:16:58
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience » dancingstar, posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 20:57:19
Hopefully you guys have the same type of chemistry so that if she ever needs to stop taking it, she won't have any more difficult a time than you did.
Yesterday I walked into my appointment at my internist's office with a stack of papers, showing some of my research on the problems that people have with withdrawal being more serious than I suspect he believes in spite of the fact that he acknowledges that he has heard it can be difficult.
It's my impression that the increase in prescriptions by the general medical community is somewhat recent, though I don't yet know exactly what I mean by "recent," and the increase in people that will have to stop taking Effexor will increase sometime soon. (I am estimating that this increase by gp's, etc. has been going on for the last three or so, but I haven't got any facts to back me up.) If that is true, it is also possible that the people that will want to come off the drug because of things like weight gain and fatigue, perhaps pain, even arthritis (see wyeth.com) problems that we had no idea were side effects of Effexor is going to flood the market sometime in the near future along with the people that are freaking out cause their bodies won't let them off the drug.
As for your mom, how can she be blamed for listening to her doctor? Aren't we supposed to be able to trust them? It is a difficult situation for all of us. I guess the most annoying thing is why are so many doctors prescribing Effexor to so many people in the first place? "Here, honey, take a pill."
Merry Christmas....
Posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 21:27:41
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience » KaraS, posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 21:16:58
> Hopefully you guys have the same type of chemistry so that if she ever needs to stop taking it, she won't have any more difficult a time than you did.
>
> Yesterday I walked into my appointment at my internist's office with a stack of papers, showing some of my research on the problems that people have with withdrawal being more serious than I suspect he believes in spite of the fact that he acknowledges that he has heard it can be difficult.
>
> It's my impression that the increase in prescriptions by the general medical community is somewhat recent, though I don't yet know exactly what I mean by "recent," and the increase in people that will have to stop taking Effexor will increase sometime soon. (I am estimating that this increase by gp's, etc. has been going on for the last three or so, but I haven't got any facts to back me up.) If that is true, it is also possible that the people that will want to come off the drug because of things like weight gain and fatigue, perhaps pain, even arthritis (see wyeth.com) problems that we had no idea were side effects of Effexor is going to flood the market sometime in the near future along with the people that are freaking out cause their bodies won't let them off the drug.
>
> As for your mom, how can she be blamed for listening to her doctor? Aren't we supposed to be able to trust them? It is a difficult situation for all of us. I guess the most annoying thing is why are so many doctors prescribing Effexor to so many people in the first place? "Here, honey, take a pill."
>
> Merry Christmas....
How did you doctor react to your research? Did he or she listen to you or just blow you off as a crackpot?The only good part about more people taking Effexor is that eventually word of mouth will get around about the withdrawals. I would think that would be inevitable and will make for a more educated group of patients. It's unfortunate that people will have to learn the hard way though.
Merry Christmas to you too!
K
Posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 21:36:46
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience, posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 21:27:41
From what I understand, after my doctor saw what happened to me, he stopped prescribing it (new prescriptions). He wasn't the original prescribing doctor anyway and is a really good guy. Didn't blow me off at all. He was very upset when he read people's reactions and the list of unreported responses to withdrawal. I told him how I get email everyday from someone new who has had some serious problem with Effexor/EffexorXR. As it happens, my doc is one of the good guys. He will do anything he can to help me/us.
Posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 21:46:03
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience » KaraS, posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 21:36:46
Also...well, he had taken my blood last month when I was still in the throes of feeling crappy. I've lost 9 pounds on his scale. My blood pressure has been all over the map and normal again as of yesterday. And my last blood results were a bit whacked. It's clear that I wasn't doing well. I've seen him every month for the three months that I've stopped taking Effexor since day 5 or 6.
Fortunately for me I am able to have what would be subjective symptoms documented and tested so that they can be labeled a little more clearly as objective, especially since I believe that my liver and kidney tests weren't fabulous for the first time last month, though I believe -- hope --think these problems will resolve in time.
Posted by KaraS on December 24, 2004, at 23:29:02
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience, posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 21:46:03
> Also...well, he had taken my blood last month when I was still in the throes of feeling crappy. I've lost 9 pounds on his scale. My blood pressure has been all over the map and normal again as of yesterday. And my last blood results were a bit whacked. It's clear that I wasn't doing well. I've seen him every month for the three months that I've stopped taking Effexor since day 5 or 6.
>
> Fortunately for me I am able to have what would be subjective symptoms documented and tested so that they can be labeled a little more clearly as objective, especially since I believe that my liver and kidney tests weren't fabulous for the first time last month, though I believe -- hope --think these problems will resolve in time.
It's good a thing to have that documentation.
I'm glad you have such a good doctor. Wish I had one like that! I hope your health problems will resolve also ... I bet they will. Keep us posted.Take care,
Kara
Posted by Dr. Bob on December 25, 2004, at 10:32:21
In reply to Re: my Effexor experience, posted by dancingstar on December 24, 2004, at 15:36:27
> you may be in the minority, not the rest of us.
Please be sensitive to the feelings of, and don't jump to conclusions about, others.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by not2late4u on December 25, 2004, at 15:35:15
In reply to Re: please be civil » dancingstar, posted by Dr. Bob on December 25, 2004, at 10:32:21
Hello all,
I will post to let you all know how I do coming off of Effexor. Please keep in mind that those who have had some success with Effexor can also provide helpful advise. Is Effexor worse than any other drug? I dont know. Do I think that the FDA, medical community, drug companies and whoever else should do a better job researching the effects,risks of medications and making them known to the medical field AND patient with no uncertainty? ABSOLUTELY. Do I think the general population is over medicated, yes. Especially the elderly. Do I think that exercise and diet plays a MAJOR role in our mental and physcial health, UNDOUBTEDLY. And the only reason I stated that I thought this was a site that "hated" effexor was because I read a couple posts that stated we are on the wrong site if we have had positive results, maybe I shouldnt have taken that literally. Sorry. Im glad this site is up for informational purposes and if the patients dont speak out the chances of things changing are slim to none. So, I commend all who are speaking out on both the positive and negative experiences, thats how we all can learn and help others. Hope you all have a wonderful christmas. God Bless, Renee.
Posted by dancingstar on December 25, 2004, at 16:53:53
In reply to Re: please be civil, posted by not2late4u on December 25, 2004, at 15:35:15
For what it is worth, Renee -- this isn't my Renee is it? -- I can now get out of bed easily in the morning; and while I was beginning to wonder if I didn't have depression, it's safe to say that since I stopped taking EffexorXR, I no longer have any symptoms of depression whatsover. Whether that is because I have had to add the supplements: Omega 3s, the SAMe, and the St. John's Wort in order to ward off the withdrawal symptoms or because I never suffered from physical depression in the first place is hard to know for sure as I was never prescribed the antidepressant EffexorXR for depression :-), but the symptoms went away nonetheless when I stopped taking 150mg of EffexorXR after having taken it for three years.
I hope that you are one of the ones that has an easy time of it easy if and when you stop taking E, but in any event; go slowly just to be sure that you stay comfortable and try to gather all the things around you that we have mentioned, including the Benadryl, if you can tolerate it, just in case you need it...though you might not need it; and even when you cut back for the first time, have a little extra food in the house in case you don't feel well. Forewarned is forearmed. It is true that some people don't have any trouble at all, but it can't hurt to be prepared just in case you don't feel terrific. Then again...you may think that I'm completely whacked because you have such an easy time of it. I really hope that this is true for you!!! Please write and let us know how you're doing either way.
Merry Christmas!
Bebe
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