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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 23 of 23. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 15:26:24
I have been suffering from severe PTSD and anxiety and depression for the past 6 years. I've been in therapy, am still in therapy and am now on Effexor 225mg, I am still having severe anxiety attacks. Since I was raped and brutalized by my ex for 2 years I have been a basket case. I happened to be at my Prim. care physicians office for my asthma and was having an intense anxiety attack when I asked if she could prescribe something to helpme. She gave me a 1 month supply of Xanax .25 mg and I have to say that it has been so great for me, the anxiety attacks were far less severe and I actually went clothes shopping for the first time in 2 years. I have been a recluse for about 2 years since I left my abusive ex and I am afraid to leave my house and basically only go out for therapy sesssions and grocery shopping. So I saw the nurse who prescribes my Effexor to me and asked her for Xanax and that it seemed to really help me alot. She refuses to give me xanax stating that because I used to drink heavily 6 years ago that I would get addicted to it and that EVERYONE who takes Xanax is addicted to it! So she gives me Gabitril, it does NOTHING for me and I just don't know what to do! I am so frustrated with the fact that everyone else I go to therapy with is on Ativan or Xanax except me, I am suffering, my quality of life is crap, my anxiety is to much to bear anymore and I don't know what else to do. Please if anyone has some advice let me know...thank you so much.
Sincerely, Lauren
Posted by jlbl2l on September 26, 2004, at 15:54:51
In reply to They wont give me Xanax, posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 15:26:24
order it online, its not hard to find...
Posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 16:19:27
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax, posted by jlbl2l on September 26, 2004, at 15:54:51
> order it online, its not hard to find...
Could you tell me how to order it online, and how is that possible without a prescription? Thank you for responding!
Posted by mcp on September 26, 2004, at 19:14:08
In reply to They wont give me Xanax, posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 15:26:24
This just engrages me. I really feel for you. They are so willing to hand out stuff like Effexor with it's "discontinuation syndrome", yet reticent to go with a benzo. There are far less side effects and in my opinion are safer. ANyways, you hit it on the head. It is all about quality of life. You must make this clear in the strictest terms when seeing your doc. If they don't budge, suggest another benzo. Maybe Klonopin. There doesn't seem to be the hysteria over it like there is over Xanax. If it is still a no go, try a new doc and don't mention anything about prior substance abuse. I am an alcoholic and take Ativan without abusing it. Be insistent. This is your body and you know what you are going through. I wish you the best of luck and I will be saying a prayer for you.
> I have been suffering from severe PTSD and anxiety and depression for the past 6 years. I've been in therapy, am still in therapy and am now on Effexor 225mg, I am still having severe anxiety attacks. Since I was raped and brutalized by my ex for 2 years I have been a basket case. I happened to be at my Prim. care physicians office for my asthma and was having an intense anxiety attack when I asked if she could prescribe something to helpme. She gave me a 1 month supply of Xanax .25 mg and I have to say that it has been so great for me, the anxiety attacks were far less severe and I actually went clothes shopping for the first time in 2 years. I have been a recluse for about 2 years since I left my abusive ex and I am afraid to leave my house and basically only go out for therapy sesssions and grocery shopping. So I saw the nurse who prescribes my Effexor to me and asked her for Xanax and that it seemed to really help me alot. She refuses to give me xanax stating that because I used to drink heavily 6 years ago that I would get addicted to it and that EVERYONE who takes Xanax is addicted to it! So she gives me Gabitril, it does NOTHING for me and I just don't know what to do! I am so frustrated with the fact that everyone else I go to therapy with is on Ativan or Xanax except me, I am suffering, my quality of life is crap, my anxiety is to much to bear anymore and I don't know what else to do. Please if anyone has some advice let me know...thank you so much.
> Sincerely, Lauren
>
Posted by jerrympls on September 26, 2004, at 19:44:53
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax, posted by mcp on September 26, 2004, at 19:14:08
This kind of behavior from a nurse or any other doctor INFURIATES me to no end. I would start by asking for Klonopin - as others have already suggested. Doctors aren't as phobic about it. Perhaps remind the nurse to look up "compassion." Go see a real psychiatrist and not a nurse - if at all possible. No offense to any nurses - but my mom's in the profession and she's seen too many nurses become too jaded too quickly for whatever reason. You'd think they'd have picked a different line of work to go into. The nurse/doctor works for YOU. Be as assertive as you can.
Why isn't there a campaign to stop such inhumane treatment from doctors and nurses like this?? It's already enough we have to deal with the stigma of a mental illness.
Jerry
Posted by yznhymer on September 26, 2004, at 19:54:23
In reply to They wont give me Xanax, posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 15:26:24
> I have been suffering from severe PTSD and anxiety and depression for the past 6 years. I've been in therapy, am still in therapy and am now on Effexor 225mg, I am still having severe anxiety attacks. Since I was raped and brutalized by my ex for 2 years I have been a basket case. I happened to be at my Prim. care physicians office for my asthma and was having an intense anxiety attack when I asked if she could prescribe something to helpme. She gave me a 1 month supply of Xanax .25 mg and I have to say that it has been so great for me, the anxiety attacks were far less severe and I actually went clothes shopping for the first time in 2 years. I have been a recluse for about 2 years since I left my abusive ex and I am afraid to leave my house and basically only go out for therapy sesssions and grocery shopping. So I saw the nurse who prescribes my Effexor to me and asked her for Xanax and that it seemed to really help me alot. She refuses to give me xanax stating that because I used to drink heavily 6 years ago that I would get addicted to it and that EVERYONE who takes Xanax is addicted to it! So she gives me Gabitril, it does NOTHING for me and I just don't know what to do! I am so frustrated with the fact that everyone else I go to therapy with is on Ativan or Xanax except me, I am suffering, my quality of life is crap, my anxiety is to much to bear anymore and I don't know what else to do. Please if anyone has some advice let me know...thank you so much.
> Sincerely, Lauren
>
Lauren,Sorry to hear you're doing so poorly. Good news is you have identified something that can give you some relief. I think the concern about potential addiction and abuse is a real one. Addiction isn't just about withdrawal symptoms but escalating use and abuse with unwanted repercussions on one's life, leaving you in worse shape than before you started.
That said, you should be able to find a doctor who will work with you. Clearly, the fact that you haven't abused alcohol in 6 years despite it being so available speaks to your ability to maneuver around addiction. If not xanax, another benzo may indeed be a good choice.
I wouldn't go the non-prescription route, however. I'll give ya 5 reasons. First, any operation that sells controlled substances without a prescription would have no qualms about selling phony, or tainted, or below grade product as well. You don't want to leave yourself open to potential harm. Second, you're likely to pay more for the same drug without a prescription as you would with a prescription. Third, if you experience any medical complications on the drug, you want to be able to access care from your doctor without anything like your foray into self-medication getting in the way. Fourth, if you are indeed predisposed to addicition, you want your doctor to be monitoring you on a regular basis to head off the possibility of abusing the drug. Fifth, I believe its a criminal offense to acquire/posess controlled substances without a prescription. Remember Noelle Bush's mug shots?
Good luck with whatever you do. Hopefully you can get your current provider to come around and you won't have to go an alternative route. But if that's not gonna happen, I hope you find some relief sooner rather than later.
Mark
Posted by Fred23 on September 26, 2004, at 20:10:06
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax, posted by mcp on September 26, 2004, at 19:14:08
> If they don't budge, suggest another benzo. Maybe Klonopin. There doesn't seem to be the hysteria over it like there is over Xanax. If it is still a no go, try a new doc and don't mention anything about prior substance abuse. I am an alcoholic and take Ativan without abusing it.
Seconding the above, ask for Ativan. One of the subtle differences in the not-in-the-books area is that Xanax seems to tickle my hunger for alcohol, while Ativan diminishes it.
Klonopin has a reputation for causing or accentuating depression, plus makes people tireder than Ativan.
Posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 20:23:09
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax » mcp, posted by Fred23 on September 26, 2004, at 20:10:06
I feel such RELIEF that other people understand how frustrating this is for me! THANK YOU ALL so much for replying and for the great advice. I am really glad I found this place. There is a doctor at my counseling place and all the people in my therapy group talk about how great she is and compassionate and how much they HATE this nurse that I've been dealing with. I want to see if I can be seen by the doctor instead but I wonder if that will cause negative reprucussions for me as a patient there. I am kinda afraid to ask to see this doctor, afraid of what the nurse will tell her about me. I feel like she thinks I am some kind of junkie or something! It's not fair, I shouldn't have to be made to feel this way...what do you guys think I should do?
Hugz, Lauren
Posted by rvanson on September 26, 2004, at 21:07:08
In reply to They wont give me Xanax, posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 15:26:24
> I have been suffering from severe PTSD and anxiety and depression for the past 6 years. I've been in therapy, am still in therapy and am now on Effexor 225mg, I am still having severe anxiety attacks. Since I was raped and brutalized by my ex for 2 years I have been a basket case. I happened to be at my Prim. care physicians office for my asthma and was having an intense anxiety attack when I asked if she could prescribe something to helpme. She gave me a 1 month supply of Xanax .25 mg and I have to say that it has been so great for me, the anxiety attacks were far less severe and I actually went clothes shopping for the first time in 2 years. I have been a recluse for about 2 years since I left my abusive ex and I am afraid to leave my house and basically only go out for therapy sesssions and grocery shopping. So I saw the nurse who prescribes my Effexor to me and asked her for Xanax and that it seemed to really help me alot. She refuses to give me xanax stating that because I used to drink heavily 6 years ago that I would get addicted to it and that EVERYONE who takes Xanax is addicted to it! So she gives me Gabitril, it does NOTHING for me and I just don't know what to do! I am so frustrated with the fact that everyone else I go to therapy with is on Ativan or Xanax except me, I am suffering, my quality of life is crap, my anxiety is to much to bear anymore and I don't know what else to do. Please if anyone has some advice let me know...thank you so much.
> Sincerely, Lauren
>Unfortunately, you wont be able to obtain Xanax from these people.
You can try another Pdoc, but IMO if you disclose your past drinking history, you wont be prescribed Xanax by most Pdocs. There is a nationwide tedency away from using Benzos like Xanax, ny many hospitals/doctors becuase of the dependency aspect of using Xanax, as if the anxiety you experience wasn't enough to drive you up a wall.
Just some of my experiences, anyway.
Posted by jerrympls on September 26, 2004, at 21:17:01
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax, posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 20:23:09
> I feel such RELIEF that other people understand how frustrating this is for me! THANK YOU ALL so much for replying and for the great advice. I am really glad I found this place. There is a doctor at my counseling place and all the people in my therapy group talk about how great she is and compassionate and how much they HATE this nurse that I've been dealing with. I want to see if I can be seen by the doctor instead but I wonder if that will cause negative reprucussions for me as a patient there. I am kinda afraid to ask to see this doctor, afraid of what the nurse will tell her about me. I feel like she thinks I am some kind of junkie or something! It's not fair, I shouldn't have to be made to feel this way...what do you guys think I should do?
>
> Hugz, LaurenLauren - sounds like you've already made your decision and I think it's the right one. SEE THE DOCTOR - don't worry about what the nurse MAY say. I know it's not easy, but stand up for yourself and be assertive. This nurse is making your life worse.
Hang in there - Jerry
Posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 22:27:09
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax » honeychica, posted by jerrympls on September 26, 2004, at 21:17:01
Thanks Jerry, I really appreciate it, thanks to you all...
Hugz, Lauren
Posted by Dr. Bob on September 27, 2004, at 3:57:58
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax, posted by jlbl2l on September 26, 2004, at 15:54:51
> order it online, its not hard to find...
Just a reminder, please don't use this site to exchange information that could be used to import prescription medication without a prescription:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#illegal
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Bill LL on September 27, 2004, at 8:41:34
In reply to They wont give me Xanax, posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 15:26:24
Go to a different doctor. Ask some people in your support group who they go to.
Posted by woolav on September 27, 2004, at 9:06:26
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax, posted by rvanson on September 26, 2004, at 21:07:08
I just wanted to say I have taken xanax for years and recently my pdoc took me off it. Now, I am trying ativan. But, I didnt get addicted to xanax and I took 2mg daily (or more) for about 5 yrs!!
So, yeah, try a different pdoc....
S
Posted by ravenstorm on September 27, 2004, at 10:28:43
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax, posted by woolav on September 27, 2004, at 9:06:26
First of all I'm so sorry about what happened to you in that abusive relationship.
Second, do you live in or near a university town? I ask this because I have seen two Pdocs through the University psychiatry departments (NOT student health, just pdocs affiliated with the university and covered by my HMO) and they have been benzo crazy!!!!!!!!! Meaning, they offer me benzo's all the time. I have never been addicted to anything but my family is full of alcoholics so I am scared to take anything addictive. My husband is a recovering alcoholic and AODA counselor and he gets very pissed off about this. THat said, I took 1.0mg of Ativan for four nights last week and had wonderful anxiety control. I can't take it during the day, however, because it makes me more tired. Does anyone know if xanax causes less drowsiness? I can't take Klonopin because I have an opposite reaction to it: I get wired and my anxiety gets worse.
I am currently on 200mg Wellbutrin and 15mg remeron and was trying to bump up to 300mg Wellbutrin and wean off the remeron when a huge anxiety problem hit and still has not totally dissipated even though I have bumped back down to 200mg Wellbutrin and up to 15mg remeron again. Now I wish I had just stayed where I was because I was doing pretty well, but I really wanted to get off remeron. I just can't get the anxiety back under control.
I went to see my pdoc this morning and he asks me how I am doing on the prozac. I am not on prozac. HONEST TO GOD. Then he says, oops I guess I have the wrong file!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Anyway, we are going to try neurontin at night before going with the benzos because I am afraid of them.
I'm now afraid that it is the wellbutrin causing the anxiety, but he doesn't think so.
Good Luck finding another pdoc. As I said, I always end up with doctors who can't wait to prescribe the stuff!!!
Posted by AntiTrust on September 27, 2004, at 13:17:29
In reply to They wont give me Xanax, posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 15:26:24
Don't feel alone, Only Klonipin works for me personally and I can't get a doc to RX it and I dont have a past record of abuse of drugs/alcohol.
I was given Vistaril at a high dose-garbage!
Posted by Dave001 on September 27, 2004, at 13:54:33
In reply to They wont give me Xanax, posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 15:26:24
> I have been suffering from severe PTSD and anxiety and depression for the past 6 years. I've been in therapy, am still in therapy and am now on Effexor 225mg, I am still having severe anxiety attacks. Since I was raped and brutalized by my ex for 2 years I have been a basket case. I happened to be at my Prim. care physicians office for my asthma and was having an intense anxiety attack when I asked if she could prescribe something to helpme. She gave me a 1 month supply of Xanax .25 mg and I have to say that it has been so great for me, the anxiety attacks were far less severe and I actually went clothes shopping for the first time in 2 years. I have been a recluse for about 2 years since I left my abusive ex and I am afraid to leave my house and basically only go out for therapy sesssions and grocery shopping. So I saw the nurse who prescribes my Effexor to me and asked her for Xanax and that it seemed to really help me alot. She refuses to give me xanax stating that because I used to drink heavily 6 years ago that I would get addicted to it and that EVERYONE who takes Xanax is addicted to it! So she gives me Gabitril, it does NOTHING for me and I just don't know what to do! I am so frustrated with the fact that everyone else I go to therapy with is on Ativan or Xanax except me, I am suffering, my quality of life is crap, my anxiety is to much to bear anymore and I don't know what else to do. Please if anyone has some advice let me know...thank you so much.
> Sincerely, Lauren
>Lauren,
I sympathize with your frustration in obtaining a prescription. Only you are capable of assessing the the risk to benefit ratio of a particular medication for your situation, but unfortunately others feel the need to "protect you" from yourself. In the case of Xanax, it is true that everyone will eventually become physically dependent upon it if taken on a chronic basis, but that is hardly of consequence if it allows you to move forward with your life.
The usual suggestion is to find another doctor. Of course, the irony is that when one most needs to find a new doctor, one is also in a state with the least capability of doing so.
Good luck.
Dave
Posted by Dave001 on September 27, 2004, at 14:20:23
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax » mcp, posted by Fred23 on September 26, 2004, at 20:10:06
> Klonopin has a reputation for causing or accentuating depression
Do you have any references to support that claim?
Dave
Posted by Fred23 on September 27, 2004, at 18:51:56
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax » Fred23, posted by Dave001 on September 27, 2004, at 14:20:23
> > Klonopin has a reputation for causing or accentuating depression
>
> Do you have any references to support that claim?That issue has been discussed on this forum long before I joined. Searching the archives should yield many posts. If someone more familiar with the issue could direct to the "best" ones, that would be helpful, though.
Posted by chemist on September 28, 2004, at 1:48:00
In reply to Re: They wont give me Xanax » Fred23, posted by Dave001 on September 27, 2004, at 14:20:23
> > Klonopin has a reputation for causing or accentuating depression
>
> Do you have any references to support that claim?
>
> Davehello there, chemist here...i have the following citations from pubmed...i do believe evidence is scant supporting the claim that clonazepam induces depression or, at worst does nothing. all signs point to antidepressant activity of clonazepam. on another note, hi fred, good to see you again! best, chemist
A Case of ``Double'' Depression under Outpatient Treatment Conditions. Ros, LT. World J. Biol Psychiatry. 5(3):161-163 (2004).
(from abstract): studied major depression with psychic depressive attacks. N = 1 (yes, one patient). sertraline 100 mg qd, clonazepam 1 mg a.m., 1 mg noon, 2 mg in evening (4 mg total) and titration on tegretol from 200 mg to 400 mg, qd in evening. complete remission of major depression and complete remission of dysthymic attacks of ``temporal epilepsy'' were obtained.
Clonazepam as a therapeutic adjunct to improve the management of depression. Morishita, S. Nihon Shinkei Seishin Yakurigaku Zasshi. 24(2):75-78 (2004).
(from abstract): The effect of clonazepam on depression was first reported by Jones and Chouinard in 1985. Since their report, many other investigators have reported on the antidepressant properties of clonazepam. A daily dose of at least 3.0 mg clonazepam in augmentation of ongoing antidepressant treatment should be considered in depression.
A case of marital discord and secondary depression with attempted suicide resulting from REM sleep behavior in a 35-year-old woman. Yeh, SB and Schenck, CH. Sleep Med. 5(2):151-154 (2004).
(from abstract): 35 yr. old female w/childhood-onset parasomnia developed marital discord due to disruption of husband's sleep. Separate bedrooms led to depression then acute suicidal behavior. No psychiatric history prior to marriage. Confirmed idiopathic sleep behavior disorder (RBD). Treatment with clonazepam, 1.0-1.5 mg hs controlled her RBD, moved back into bedroom, which fully resolved their marital discord and her secondary depression.
Clonazepam in the long-term treatment of patients with unipolar depression, bipolar and schizoaffective disorder. Winkler, D. et al. Eur. Neuropsychopharmacol. 13(2):129-134 (2003).
(from abstract): Patients with unipolar depression had significantly (P=0.026) less depressive episodes after initiation of treatment with clonazepam. Patients with bipolar disorder did not benefit from this therapy. Interestingly, clonazepam also reduced affective phasess in our 4 schizoaffective patients on a trend level. Our results indicate that patients with unipolar depression may benefit from a maintenance treatment with clonazepam.
Clonazepam augmentation of antidepressants: does it distinguish unipolar from bipolar depression? Morishita, S. and Aoki, S. J. Affect. Disord. 71(1-3):217-220 (2002).
(from abstract): N = 38, 1:1 unipolar:bipolar. 3.0 mg clonazepam/day for 4 weeks. In the unipolar depression group, 84.2% of the subjects fulfilled the response criteria (at least an 80% reduction in their HDRS score). However, in the bipolar depression group, only 10.5% of them fulfilled these criteria. CONCLUSIONS: ...clonazepam can play an active role in the treatment of protracted depression in patients with unipolar depression. LIMITATIONS: open study, and effect on clonazepam alone was not established.
Clonazepam inthe treatment of protracted depression: a hundred-case report. Morishita, S. Nihon Shinkei Seishin Yakurigaku Zasshi 22(3):97-101 (2002).
(from abstract): N = 100 depressed patients. assess use of clonazepam as adjunct for treating protracted depression. 3 mg/day expressed high effectiveness (78.4%) on prtracted depression. same trend in re: less effective in bipolar observed. Continuation of clonazepam after improvement disturbed the recurrence of depression, and it seems that clonazepam augmentation has a preventive effect.
...and a whole lot more. go to pubmed, keywords clonazepam and depression....
Posted by honeychica on September 28, 2004, at 2:12:23
In reply to i have refs., and they support AD effects » Dave001, posted by chemist on September 28, 2004, at 1:48:00
Wow! Thanks to all of you for all the great info.I really am grateful I found this board. I am going this week to see my pdoc (nurse) and I am just gonna be assertive and also open to her opinions and suggestions but I am going to stick to my guns. Wish me luck, thanks everyone again...
Hugz, Lauren :)
Posted by jms600 on September 28, 2004, at 16:26:15
In reply to They wont give me Xanax, posted by honeychica on September 26, 2004, at 15:26:24
Hi,
It's just an opinion, but a number of the SSRIs are licensed for PTSD - especially Seroxat. Trouible is it doesn't have the best side effects profile and is shire hell to come off (however a switch to Prozac can help when withdrawing)!
If the Seroxat doesn't work on its own ask your doc about adding a low dose anti-psychotic such as Zyprexa.
Posted by Fred23 on September 28, 2004, at 18:44:59
In reply to i have refs., and they support AD effects » Dave001, posted by chemist on September 28, 2004, at 1:48:00
> > > Klonopin has a reputation for causing or accentuating depression
> >
> > Do you have any references to support that claim?
> >
> > Dave
>
> hello there, chemist here...i have the following citations from pubmed...i do believe evidence is scant supporting the claim that clonazepam induces depression or, at worst does nothing. all signs point to antidepressant activity of clonazepam. on another note, hi fred, good to see you again! best, chemistMy recollection is that the anecdotal evidence voiced here tilted strongly toward the not helping depression side.
This is the end of the thread.
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