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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by denise1904 on August 19, 2004, at 14:06:13
I was just wondering, if these MRI Scans are showing up anything related to depression and what happens to the brain when a person takes antidepressants and responds to them as opposed those who do and don't respond. The same question goes for ECT. And what the difference is between a depressed brain and a non depressed brain.
I keep wondering what happened to me 4 years ago to go into a suicidal depression (because as far as I know, nothing happened) and I need to know why? I can't just pass it off and accept it, things like that must happen for a reason.
Denise
Posted by mike lynch on August 19, 2004, at 15:37:46
In reply to Any ideas what these MRI Scans are showing up?, posted by denise1904 on August 19, 2004, at 14:06:13
I think depression is related to the chemical properties in the brain not structural...as far as I know this is what an MRI shows..I don't think brain scans are able to measure the level of serotonin or anything like that.. If that were the case..it would be utilize to officaly diagnose depression instead of a simple questonaire..
Posted by linkadge on August 19, 2004, at 15:41:07
In reply to Any ideas what these MRI Scans are showing up?, posted by denise1904 on August 19, 2004, at 14:06:13
Generally a depressed person shows prefrontal hypofunction. Especially left prefrontal hypofunction. As well depressed people tend to have hyperactivity in the limbic system. Effective antidepressants oftentimes tame down the limbic system and turn on the prefrontal cortex.
This was one thing noted in sleep deprivation. After 24 of total sleep deprivation the limbic system showed less activity and prefrontal had more. Antidepressants also tend to lower dopamine in the limbic system when effective.Linkadge
Posted by Denise1904 on August 20, 2004, at 1:37:18
In reply to Re: Any ideas what these MRI Scans are showing up?, posted by mike lynch on August 19, 2004, at 15:37:46
Mike,
From what I've heard, they can now do what are called "functional MRIs" which show which cells are active. So wouldn't that be giving them more than just a structural view?
Denise
Posted by linkadge on August 20, 2004, at 6:40:02
In reply to Re: Any ideas what these MRI Scans are showing up?, posted by Denise1904 on August 20, 2004, at 1:37:18
yes there are certain areas of the brain associated with pleasure and positive feelings, likewise there are areas of the brain associated with negativity and anxiety. Brain scans, while not conclusive, can help in certain psychiatric diagnosis. Some new researchers are attempting to predict the responce to a medication based on the initial brain scans.
Linkadge
Posted by SLS on August 20, 2004, at 7:40:47
In reply to Any ideas what these MRI Scans are showing up?, posted by denise1904 on August 19, 2004, at 14:06:13
fMRI determines brain activity by measuring blood flow to specific regions or structures. Changes in brain activity/blood flow can be mapped during the performance of mental tasks, induction of physical sensations, and introduction of drugs, among other things.
There are other types of imaging that can resolve brain function in different ways.
SPECT scans (Single Photon Emission Computed Tomography) can generate three-dimensional renderings similar to X-ray CAT scans. Like the fMRI, it measures blood flow (perfusion).
PET scans (Positron Emission Tomography) use radioactive labelled glucose to see where in the brain it is being used. This is another measure of activity that is more direct. I believe that other radio-labelled compounds like drugs can be used also.
I don't know what has become of it, but there was a technique used that superimposed a PET scan on top of a MRI to give better resolution of the structures involved in brain activity.
- Scott
Posted by Emme on August 20, 2004, at 9:15:36
In reply to Re: Any ideas what these MRI Scans are showing up?, posted by SLS on August 20, 2004, at 7:40:47
> SPECT scans (Single Photon Emission Computed Tomography) can generate three-dimensional renderings similar to X-ray CAT scans. Like the fMRI, it measures blood flow (perfusion).It uses technetium (a short lived gamma emitter) to trace blood flow.
Posted by dazedandconfused on August 20, 2004, at 11:42:01
In reply to Re: Any ideas what these MRI Scans are showing up?, posted by Emme on August 20, 2004, at 9:15:36
This is a great thread. I am really curious what exactly is the status in the use brain imagery in diagnosis of mental illness. I know Daniel Amen of ADD fame uses SPECT scans but I also know his work is controversial. This technology seems so promising. For example, I have obsessive tendencies. So far, nothing has helped. We haven't quite figured out whether I have OCD or ADD with obsessive tendencies (and the associated hyperfocusing).
I understand that the diagnosis is not important, treating the symptoms is. But I feel like I have wasted so much time and money on things that don't work. Just spent a year on CBT with a top OCD therapist which didn't help at all. So by process of elimination, I'm thinking my problem may more likely be ADD. Sorry, this is turning in to a vent.
So, where are we with brain scans? When will this technology be available to the masses?
Posted by SLS on August 20, 2004, at 12:06:03
In reply to What is status of brain scan usage in mental ill?, posted by dazedandconfused on August 20, 2004, at 11:42:01
Here's a great introduction I just found.
It will take me two days to read it, but what the hell!
- Scott
Posted by SLS on August 20, 2004, at 13:25:11
In reply to Re: What is status of brain scan usage in mental ill?, posted by SLS on August 20, 2004, at 12:06:03
> Here's a great introduction I just found.
>
> It will take me two days to read it, but what the hell!
>
>
> - Scott
Duh.http://www.fmrib.ox.ac.uk/fmri_intro/fmri_intro.htm
Posted by dazedandconfused on August 20, 2004, at 13:36:04
In reply to Re: What is status of brain scan usage - Oops., posted by SLS on August 20, 2004, at 13:25:11
Scott,
He he...I knew you would catch it. I can tell at first glance that even if I took 2 days to read, I wouldn't comprhend it (I have defnitely lost some IQ points). Let us know what you think! P.S. We are all praying for you on the Cymbalta!
Posted by Denise1904 on August 22, 2004, at 15:34:53
In reply to Any ideas what these MRI Scans are showing up?, posted by denise1904 on August 19, 2004, at 14:06:13
Something else, which might be of interest, not sure though if a less active anterior cingulate correlates with a severer form of depression.
April 19, 2004. Journey To The Center Of The Mind. By Joan O'C. Hamilton in Business Week magazine. "Functional" MRI is yielding a clearer picture of what thoughts look like. This article is available on their web site only to subscribers of the magazine. The benefits in psychiatric diagnosis and treatment for functional MRIs may be revolutionary. One study is imaging the brains of depressed patients taking Effexor. It has found that the drug works specifically on the anterior cingulate, a region of the brain involved in focused attention and conflict. Depressed patients whose anterior cingulates were more active before taking the drug responded better to it. The hope is that, in the future, doctors will be able to predict which patients will be the best candidates for antidepressants by looking at brain scans.
Denise
This is the end of the thread.
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