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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Maxime on June 30, 2004, at 20:18:11
I've been on Adderall XR at 30 mg for one week now. The first days were great. I felt normal again. Now I am crashing. How could I build a tolerance so quickly. What am I going to try next? There isn't anything left for me to try.
I don't understand why we can't find something to help me.
Maxime
Posted by King Vultan on July 1, 2004, at 7:51:08
In reply to Crashing ... this isn't fair, posted by Maxime on June 30, 2004, at 20:18:11
> I've been on Adderall XR at 30 mg for one week now. The first days were great. I felt normal again. Now I am crashing. How could I build a tolerance so quickly. What am I going to try next? There isn't anything left for me to try.
>
> I don't understand why we can't find something to help me.
>
> MaximeUnfortunately, you're experiencing one of the reasons that amphetamines are Schedule II controlled substances; although, you are thankfully aware of the tolerance issue. I know that some people have been able to successfully use this type of drug to treat depression, but my opinion is that this is potentially much more problematic that using them to treat disorders such as ADD/ADHD or narcolepsy.
I haven't tried a true stimulant myself, but my best guess is that with my long term depression and own particular personality, I would have the same problem with amphetamines you are experiencing. I've already decided I will not use any of the Schedule II stimulants and will make do as best I can with conventional antidepressants--or perhaps drugs from other classes that are not controlled substances, like the dopamine agonists. If other people can handle the amphetamines and Ritalin without a problem, of course, I'm happy that they fulfill their needs.
So what else have you tried? Have you tried both Nardil and Parnate? If so, I'd be curious as to how long and at what dosages.
Todd
Posted by Maxime on July 1, 2004, at 21:46:18
In reply to Re: Crashing ... this isn't fair » Maxime, posted by King Vultan on July 1, 2004, at 7:51:08
I currently take 80 mg of Parnate. It does help to a point, but I still feel depressed. Nardil made me lethagic and dopey all the time.
I have been on every SSRI and everything in between. I have been on trycyclics, antipsychotics, mood stabilisers and I don't know what else. I lost count after 33 meds. I use vitamin B, zinc and selenium and fish oil. I exercise unless I have gone so low that I can't move.
I am feeling hopeless now. I really am.
Maxime
> > I've been on Adderall XR at 30 mg for one week now. The first days were great. I felt normal again. Now I am crashing. How could I build a tolerance so quickly. What am I going to try next? There isn't anything left for me to try.
> >
> > I don't understand why we can't find something to help me.
> >
> > Maxime
>
> Unfortunately, you're experiencing one of the reasons that amphetamines are Schedule II controlled substances; although, you are thankfully aware of the tolerance issue. I know that some people have been able to successfully use this type of drug to treat depression, but my opinion is that this is potentially much more problematic that using them to treat disorders such as ADD/ADHD or narcolepsy.
>
> I haven't tried a true stimulant myself, but my best guess is that with my long term depression and own particular personality, I would have the same problem with amphetamines you are experiencing. I've already decided I will not use any of the Schedule II stimulants and will make do as best I can with conventional antidepressants--or perhaps drugs from other classes that are not controlled substances, like the dopamine agonists. If other people can handle the amphetamines and Ritalin without a problem, of course, I'm happy that they fulfill their needs.
>
> So what else have you tried? Have you tried both Nardil and Parnate? If so, I'd be curious as to how long and at what dosages.
>
> Todd
Posted by KaraS on July 2, 2004, at 3:01:57
In reply to Re: Crashing ... this isn't fair, posted by Maxime on July 1, 2004, at 21:46:18
Maxime,
I'm really sorry to hear that you've developed a tolerance already to the Adderall. I'm sure it's been a huge disappointment after finally feeling so good. But don't despair - there are still plenty of options.
- NMDA antagonists (Memantine, Acamprosate)
to counteract the tolerance- Amisulpride
- Lots of new drugs in the pipleline
(including the selegeline patch)
- selegiline with l-phenylalanine- Herbal remedies esp. Rhodiola Rosea
(which I'm going to start shortly)- SAM-e
- inositol (I've read about a case where it
helped to jumpstart Parnate after it
pooped-out but maybe it can help with
other things)
- electrical/magnetic stimulation
Mostly what I find from reading this board is that the most difficult to treat cases sometimes end up with a cocktail of several meds and supplements to address multiple issues.So hang in there. I know it's easier said than done but you really do have options left.
Posted by Maxime on July 2, 2004, at 7:19:51
In reply to Re: Crashing ... this isn't fair, posted by KaraS on July 2, 2004, at 3:01:57
Thanks Kara.
I live in Canada where amisulpride is not available, either is Acamprosate or Memantine.
Thanks again for your encouragement.
Maxime
> Maxime,
>
> I'm really sorry to hear that you've developed a tolerance already to the Adderall. I'm sure it's been a huge disappointment after finally feeling so good. But don't despair - there are still plenty of options.
>
> - NMDA antagonists (Memantine, Acamprosate)
> to counteract the tolerance
>
> - Amisulpride
>
> - Lots of new drugs in the pipleline
> (including the selegeline patch)
>
> - selegiline with l-phenylalanine
>
> - Herbal remedies esp. Rhodiola Rosea
> (which I'm going to start shortly)
>
> - SAM-e
>
> - inositol (I've read about a case where it
> helped to jumpstart Parnate after it
> pooped-out but maybe it can help with
> other things)
>
> - electrical/magnetic stimulation
>
> Mostly what I find from reading this board is that the most difficult to treat cases sometimes end up with a cocktail of several meds and supplements to address multiple issues.
>
> So hang in there. I know it's easier said than done but you really do have options left.
>
Posted by Sad Panda on July 2, 2004, at 10:31:16
In reply to Re: Crashing ... this isn't fair - Kara, posted by Maxime on July 2, 2004, at 7:19:51
How about more Parnate?
Cheers,
Panda.
Posted by KaraS on July 2, 2004, at 13:06:38
In reply to Re: Crashing ... this isn't fair - Kara, posted by Maxime on July 2, 2004, at 7:19:51
Dextromethorphan is also an NMDA antagonist. Is that available in Canada? It's available over the counter in the U.S. Besides, a lot of the people on this board who use Memantine and Acamprosate did not get it in from their own country. I don't know about Canada but here in the states it is legal to import a three month's supply of meds from abroad with a prescription. Then there are those who manage to import without a prescription (though of course I would not recommend anything illegal).
What about increasing the Parnate as Sad Panda suggested?
Posted by Maxime on July 4, 2004, at 19:51:04
In reply to Re: Crashing ... this isn't fair - Kara, posted by KaraS on July 2, 2004, at 13:06:38
Hello.
Dextromethorphan is a cough syrup?
I have tried increasing the Parnate up to 120 mg and there was no improvement with increase. So anything above 80 there is no difference but if I go below I do notice a difference.
I will have to look into the law here in Canada about legally obtaining a medication from another country.
I really appreciate your suggestions and will do some investigating.
Maxime
> Dextromethorphan is also an NMDA antagonist. Is that available in Canada? It's available over the counter in the U.S. Besides, a lot of the people on this board who use Memantine and Acamprosate did not get it in from their own country. I don't know about Canada but here in the states it is legal to import a three month's supply of meds from abroad with a prescription. Then there are those who manage to import without a prescription (though of course I would not recommend anything illegal).
>
> What about increasing the Parnate as Sad Panda suggested?
Posted by KaraS on July 4, 2004, at 20:49:24
In reply to Re: Crashing ... this isn't fair - Kara, Sad Panda, posted by Maxime on July 4, 2004, at 19:51:04
> Hello.
>
> Dextromethorphan is a cough syrup?
>
Yes, dextromethorphan is an ingredient in some cough syrups but it's also an NMDA antagonist. It's contraindicated when you are taking an MAOI so you couldn't use it while on Parnate. Others are using it to ward off tolerance however.
> I have tried increasing the Parnate up to 120 mg and there was no improvement with increase. So anything above 80 there is no difference but if I go below I do notice a difference.
I read somewhere of the successful use of inositol to potentiate Parnate. If I can find anything on that again, I'll forward it to you.
> I will have to look into the law here in Canada about legally obtaining a medication from another country.
>
> I really appreciate your suggestions and will do some investigating.I have not checked whether memantine or acamprosate can be taken with MAOIs so you'd obviously want to look into that. If Canada will allow you to import, you should know that memantine is VERY expensive but easily obtainable. I only know of one reputable site for acamprosate out of the UK.
> Kara> Maxime
>
>
> > Dextromethorphan is also an NMDA antagonist. Is that available in Canada? It's available over the counter in the U.S. Besides, a lot of the people on this board who use Memantine and Acamprosate did not get it in from their own country. I don't know about Canada but here in the states it is legal to import a three month's supply of meds from abroad with a prescription. Then there are those who manage to import without a prescription (though of course I would not recommend anything illegal).
> >
> > What about increasing the Parnate as Sad Panda suggested?
>
>
This is the end of the thread.
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