![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 15 to 39 of 39. Go back in thread:
Posted by jazzdog on March 28, 2002, at 14:36:11
In reply to Licorice tea? No, seriously ..., posted by jazzdog on March 28, 2002, at 14:31:17
Check out:
www.wholehealthmd.com/refshelf/substances_view/0,1525,801,00.html
Posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 14:51:10
In reply to Licorice tea? No, seriously ..., posted by jazzdog on March 28, 2002, at 14:31:17
Usually when people are depressed the body has a hyperactive adrenal gland and is producing too much cortisol. Licorice helps to prevent the breakdown of cortisol. There are feedback receptors in the brain called glucocorticoid receptors that are supposed to reduce cortisol production when it is stimulated by excessive glucocorticoids (cortisols, etc).In depressed people, these glucocorticoid receptors are overly downregulated and may not properly feed back and stop the release of cortisol production. Chronic administration of antidepressants often reverses this problem in the HPA axis (hypothalamus-pituitary-adrenal gland). This phenomina may be thought as glucocoritcoid non-suppression. There is a test for this called a dexamethasone (a synthetic steroid) that can be administered to see how your circulating cortisol levels react (maybe your cortisol is too high, and the dexamethasone does not cause a feed back to suppress it).
Now there can be another type of depression that is very backwards that is often associated with PTSD or with Adrenal exhaustion and it has as a trademark of *extremely* low levels of cortisol. This type of depression can be very difficult to treat and give irratic antidepressant responses. In this case there is a hyper-feedback of cortisol administration. The glucorticoid (cortisol detecting) receptors in the brain are overly sensitive (up regulated) and when more glucocorticoid is injected synthetically (say with dexamethasone) then the body will actually do a hyperfeedback and supersupress the cortisol secretion.
I've read that some people believe licorice may be helpful for adrenal exhaustion or ptsd. but it may not be a good idea for vanilla depression (IMO).
You may see an endocrinologist and get your corisol levels checked out 1st.
John
> I've been trying to figure out this ssri dopamine depletion thing. I read that ssri's exhaust the adrenal glands, which may be the underlying cause. And it turns out that one of the most potent adrenal boosters is glycerhizin, the active ingredient in licorice. Of course, the licorice you buy at the store contains virtually no real licorice - aniseed is substituted. But licorice tea - available at the healthfood store - has met with success in treating chronic fatigue syndrome and is considered one of the most potent drugs in Chinese medicine. I'm going to check it out, and I'll let you know.
>
> - Jane
Posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 16:11:26
In reply to Re: Do Lamictal Provigil counteract each other? » SLS, posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 13:32:34
> I was looking into old schools blood pressure issue, and I found that dosing of bromocriptine *reduces* noradrenaline output for some people (and reduces blood pressure) by somehow indirectly reducing MAO. Food for thought. I should look into this some more, it sound like some interesting shit.
>acutally the bromocriptine at the lower doses hits the presynaptic autorectors and lowers catecholinergic activity. One article suggested *increased* MAO activity.
Purportedly low dose of Pramipexole dose the same.
John
1: Kardiologiia 1991 Apr;31(4):22-4 Related Articles, Books, LinkOut
[Effects of bromocriptine on catecholamine metabolism in subjects with borderline arterial hypertension][Article in Russian]
Merkulova NK, Romaniuk SN, Petunin SN, Temirov AA.
Effects of bromocriptine on hemodynamics and catecholamine exchange were evaluated in patients with borderline arterial hypertension with respect to their family history. The agent was shown to be able to bring down blood pressure and decrease plasma catecholamine levels. With this, platelet monoamine oxidase activity was increased in persons with a family history of hypertensive disease.
PMID: 2067174 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
Posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 17:16:48
In reply to Re: Do Lamictal Provigil counteract each other? » JohnX2, posted by SLS on March 28, 2002, at 8:29:58
>
> Neurontin = Accelerated synthesis of GABA
> Gabitril = GABA reuptake inhibition
>I can look into the Neurontin. I would suggest a Topamax trial if you already know that the Neurontin puts you in a haze. The Gabitril has a worse reputation for tolerability from what I hear. Topamax is a good Gabaergic medicine and I really think that the AMPA glutamate modulation may add a unique therapeutic component to your treatment. Just a thought. Also, Topamax is less sedating. It tends to be more stimulating (but it may give a fog).
Did you get some good leads on Gabatril?
John
Posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 20:14:17
In reply to Licorice tea? No, seriously ..., posted by jazzdog on March 28, 2002, at 14:31:17
Hi Jane,
Thanks for the useful information. I also wondered about this matter.
I was once hip-shooting that maybe the body adjusts too far the other way on the AD from a hyperactive HPA (hypothalamus-pituitary-adrenal) axis to a hypoactive HPA.
Can you send any links with information about SSRIs and their connections to the adrenals. I would really appreciate it!
Thanks and best wishes.
John
> I've been trying to figure out this ssri dopamine depletion thing. I read that ssri's exhaust the adrenal glands, which may be the underlying cause. And it turns out that one of the most potent adrenal boosters is glycerhizin, the active ingredient in licorice. Of course, the licorice you buy at the store contains virtually no real licorice - aniseed is substituted. But licorice tea - available at the healthfood store - has met with success in treating chronic fatigue syndrome and is considered one of the most potent drugs in Chinese medicine. I'm going to check it out, and I'll let you know.
>
> - Jane
Posted by jazzdog on March 28, 2002, at 22:20:14
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » jazzdog, posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 20:14:17
Here's the link:
www.antidepressantsfacts.com/pinealstory.htm
It's a pretty interesting site. The adrenal connection is made in Section 2a, Affecting Mood or Mind.
- Jane
Posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 22:50:01
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » JohnX2, posted by jazzdog on March 28, 2002, at 22:20:14
Scott/Jane,
I was wondering about the possiblity of getting evaluated for a DST (dexamethasone suppression test)? I have never done this. Do I need to see an endocrinologist?
Scott had indicated a long time ago he was a DST non-suppressor (which is a norm for major depression), I was wondering myself if it was possible to get stuck in a hypocortisolemia state and become a DST super-suppressor. This could give very erratic AD/stimulant poop out.People with MDD who have adrenal exhaustion or perhaps a history of PTSD may have a hypocortisolemia state. I believe detecting this can significantly alter ones treatment strategy.
John
Posted by Bekka H. on March 28, 2002, at 23:26:21
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion, posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 22:50:01
Hi John,
I think that an endocrinologist would be the best person to see, but I imagine some internists could do it, too. Some internists have dual specialties in endocrinology and internal medicine. I've had two Dexamethasone suppression tests in my life. They are used to test for certain endocrine abnormalities as well as for the psychiatric disturbances. Actually, the DST for psychiatric use is highly controversial and somewhat unreliable. I have had highly elevated corticosteroid levels for many years, yet both of my DST's were normal (i.e., I DID suppress cortisol). If I'm not mistaken, I believe it was Peter Stokes, M.D., at the Weill Medical College of Cornell University, who "gave birth to" the use of the Dexamethasone Suppression Test for depression.
Perhaps your psychiatrist could refer you to an endocrinologist. That would probably be the best route.
I don't know what part of the country you live in. If you're in NY, I could recommend some people, but most Manhattan doctors charge too much and most do not participate in managed care, so you have to foot the bill yourself and then submit the bill to your insurance company.
P.S. This weekend I will rent "Planes, Trains and Automobiles."
Bekka
Posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 23:27:04
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » JohnX2, posted by jazzdog on March 28, 2002, at 22:20:14
Hi Jane,Most conventional psychiatry would disagree with the information presented on that web site.
If I am reading that paragraph correct, the website implies that the SSRIs increase the output of cortisol and adrenaline to produce a euphoric state. Best I understand, this is simply not the case according to conventional thought.
What is generally thought to be the case is that a depressed person may have excessive levels of cortisol circulating through the body, and the feedback mechanisms to control this are not in check. One may also find enlarged adrenal glands in a depressive. An effective antidepressant would correct the hypercortisolemia, which could be protective in many ways to ones health, contrary to the statement made in the web site.
John
> Here's the link:
>
> www.antidepressantsfacts.com/pinealstory.htm
>
> It's a pretty interesting site. The adrenal connection is made in Section 2a, Affecting Mood or Mind.
>
> - Jane
Posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 23:38:36
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustionJohnx2, posted by Bekka H. on March 28, 2002, at 23:26:21
> Hi John,
>
> I think that an endocrinologist would be the best person to see, but I imagine some internists could do it, too. Some internists have dual specialties in endocrinology and internal medicine. I've had two Dexamethasone suppression tests in my life. They are used to test for certain endocrine abnormalities as well as for the psychiatric disturbances. Actually, the DST for psychiatric use is highly controversial and somewhat unreliable. I have had highly elevated corticosteroid levels for many years, yet both of my DST's were normal (i.e., I DID suppress cortisol). If I'm not mistaken, I believe it was Peter Stokes, M.D., at the Weill Medical College of Cornell University, who "gave birth to" the use of the Dexamethasone Suppression Test for depression.
>Hi Bekka,
Can I pick your brain...
Thanks, I have read that the DST is not a very accurate marker, just a proxy. Were you depressed when you were marked a DST suppressor?
I've heard of people with certain flavors of disorders being able to get their cortisol levels down, but never suppressing cortisol after AD administration.
Also have you had your cortisol levels measured "normal" after a depression lift?
I'm pretty sure I have immune system dysfunction associated with my problems as I have this Raynaud's problem that flares up.
Regards,
John
> Perhaps your psychiatrist could refer you to an endocrinologist. That would probably be the best route.
>
> I don't know what part of the country you live in. If you're in NY, I could recommend some people, but most Manhattan doctors charge too much and most do not participate in managed care, so you have to foot the bill yourself and then submit the bill to your insurance company.
>
> P.S. This weekend I will rent "Planes, Trains and Automobiles."
>
> Bekka
Posted by Bekka H. on March 29, 2002, at 0:31:50
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustionJohnx2 » Bekka H., posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 23:38:36
Hi John,
Yes, I was depressed when I was a DST suppressor. I think I've been depressed most of my life, but the two DST tests were done in 1996 and 2000. Both were "normal." My corticosteroid levels, however, have been consistently elevated for YEARS, regardless of whatever antidepressant I've been on - or off. I'm convinced that my hippocampus must be all shriveled up by now. Earlier this year, I tried Tianeptine, because I heard that it might reverse some hippocampal damage caused by excess cortisol. Unfortunately, I was unable to give the Tianeptine a long enough trial. I did try it for about a month, but I wasn't up to the therapeutic dose during most of that time, and I did not see much improvement in my mood during that brief trial. I might try it again some day, but not for a while.
Do you see a rheumatologist for your Raynaud's?
Bekka
Posted by jazzdog on March 31, 2002, at 13:25:20
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » jazzdog, posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 23:27:04
Hi John -
The thing that impressed me about the notion that ssri's have longterm implications for the endocrine system is that it gelled so well with my experience. When I first took zoloft, I had about a year of incredible well-being - energy, creativity, libido, a capacity for joy - it was like a reprieve from a lifelong anhedonic sentence. And only once before, on a two-week treatment with hydrocortisone - had I ever felt so well. Then began a long decline - my ability to cope with stress decreased, my energy disappeared, I gained weight, got very foggy-minded, and started sleeping excessively once again. I guess you'd call it poop-out. I developed a bunch of physical symptoms relating to a mild kidney ailment, so I started seeing an endocrinologist. I found out I had severe hyperinsulinism and low cortisol levels - this after eight years on zoloft. I never connected the two before, but when I ran across that website stating that ssri's caused hyperinsulinism and adrenal exhaustion, I felt a eureka moment. It's thanks to you that I started thinking about ssri's causing dopamine depletion, and this seemed to me to be a possible answer - don't the adrenal glands produce dopamine?
I know this thinking would be greeted with skepticism by many psychiatrists, but here's the thing: psychiatrists seem unwilling to think outside the box of neural pathways - they seem to resist a more organically connected whole-body approach. This seems to be true in all medical disciplines - not seeing the forest for the trees. Also, most articles I read on mood stabilizers, ad's, and ap's seem to contain the sentence: 'the exact mechanism is not clearly understood.' Maybe we need more research into the endocrine - neural axis, expecially since so many neurotransmittors are manufactured by the adrenal/pineal/pituitary glands.
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on this. I always value your opinion. :>)
- Jane
Posted by JohnX2 on March 31, 2002, at 19:57:54
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » JohnX2, posted by jazzdog on March 31, 2002, at 13:25:20
Hi Jane,A couple of quick thoughts. Please note, I'm swagging here a bit as I learn more about this stuff.
> Hi John -
>
> The thing that impressed me about the notion that ssri's have longterm implications for the endocrine system is that it gelled so well with my experience. When I first took zoloft, I had about a year of incredible well-being - energy, creativity, libido, a capacity for joy - it was like a reprieve from a lifelong anhedonic sentence. And only once before, on a two-week treatment with hydrocortisone - had I ever felt so well. Then began a long decline - my ability to cope with stress decreased, my energy disappeared, I gained weight, got very foggy-minded, and started sleeping excessively once again. I guess you'd call it poop-out. I developed a bunch of physical symptoms relating to a mild kidney ailment, so I started seeing an endocrinologist. I found out I had severe hyperinsulinism and low cortisol levels - this after eight years on zoloft. I never connected the two before, but when I ran across that website stating that ssri's caused hyperinsulinism and adrenal exhaustion, I felt a eureka moment. It's thanks to you that I started thinking about ssri's causing dopamine depletion, and this seemed to me to be a possible answer - don't the adrenal glands produce dopamine?
>I'm wondering if your mood elevation from the hydrocortisone prior to Zoloft administration is indicative that your depressive systems in terms of the HPA axis were "reversed" from what is typical. I.e. possibly you were predisposed to adrenal exhaustion or some sort of traumatic/prolonged stress that sent you into depression. There seem to be some good corralations between the type of depression seen in PTSD and what may be seen in an adrenal exhaustion. I.e. the depressed person shows lower than normal levels of circulating cortisol. This could cause the feedback glucoroticoid receptors in the brain to be overly "upregulated". Zoloft briefly from what I understand, can help to correct a maladaptive HPA axis in either case (the common case of hypercortisolemia or the less common case of hypocortisolemia). I believe this is why Zoloft has FDA approval for PTSD.
If this was your case, then the Zoloft may have been able to increase your cortisol/adrenal output by correcting glucoroticoid feedback receptor mechanisms. I don't want to speculate at this time what the long term affect of this would be.
For the vast majority of depressives, a hypercortisolemia state is noted.> I know this thinking would be greeted with skepticism by many psychiatrists, but here's the thing: psychiatrists seem unwilling to think outside the box of neural pathways - they seem to resist a more organically connected whole-body approach. This seems to be true in all medical disciplines - not seeing the forest for the trees. Also, most articles I read on mood stabilizers, ad's, and ap's seem to contain the sentence: 'the exact mechanism is not clearly understood.' Maybe we need more research into the endocrine - neural axis, expecially since so many neurotransmittors are manufactured by the adrenal/pineal/pituitary glands.
I agree with these comments.
I'm trying to better understand how neuroendocrines effect the monoamine system. They most certainly do interact. I'll let you know if come to any more interesting conclusions.Can I ask you a question:
Have your doctors been able to ascertain whether or not your adrenal glands are functioning in a healthy manner at this time? I.e. maybe your cortisol output is low, but you still have healthy adrenals?
John
>
> I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on this. I always value your opinion. :>)
>
> - Jane
Posted by Janelle on April 1, 2002, at 3:47:12
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » jazzdog, posted by JohnX2 on March 31, 2002, at 19:57:54
Could someone please explain this fascinating connection between SSRI's and adrenal dysfunction - what do SSRI's do to cortisol and what affect does this have on adrenal function?
Also, how are results of the DST test interpreted - if it reveals suppression what does this mean, and if it reveals no suppression what does this mean? And how do the results tie in to depression?
Thanks a million.
Posted by jazzdog on April 1, 2002, at 14:12:58
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » jazzdog, posted by JohnX2 on March 31, 2002, at 19:57:54
Hi John -
I wish I knew. My next endocrinologist appointment isn't for several months, but I intend to ask for adrenal tests. If she won't give them, I may just get them myself.
yours, Jane
Posted by JohnX2 on April 2, 2002, at 4:28:16
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » JohnX2, posted by jazzdog on April 1, 2002, at 14:12:58
> Hi John -
>
> I wish I knew. My next endocrinologist appointment isn't for several months, but I intend to ask for adrenal tests. If she won't give them, I may just get them myself.
>
> yours, Jane
Hi Jane,Have you ever tried medications like Zyprexa for your derealization symptoms?
Also, I have seen that the opioid antagonist Naltrexone may also be helpful. Curiously in the tips section this medicine is supposed to reverse SSRI poop out. I am looking into this phenomina and there does seem to be a connection between opioids/serotonin/hpa/cortisol, etc.
Regards,
John
Posted by jazzdog on April 2, 2002, at 22:50:34
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » jazzdog, posted by JohnX2 on April 2, 2002, at 4:28:16
Thanks, John. Naltrexone does indeed look interesting, especially as it's the subject of studies related to depersonalization at Mt. Sinai in New York. The discouraging note comes from fellow dp sufferers at the dpselfhelp site, none of whom have had success with it. As for Zyprexa, I'm concerned about what it would do to my already sky-high insulin levels - hyperinsulinism is the step just before diabetes. Right now I'm still titrating up on the lamictal - I want to give it a month at 300 mg. to really assess if there's a change in my dp. If no change, there are a number of things I want to try. What I'd really like is something that boosts dopamine but not noradrenaline or norepinephrine - something that clears my head without making me irritable and anxious.
Again, thanks a lot for your interest. I always read your posts on the board - I think of you as a neuronaut, venturing into neurochemical pathways where lesser men fear to tread. :)
yours, Jane
Posted by JohnX2 on April 3, 2002, at 12:02:04
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » JohnX2, posted by jazzdog on April 2, 2002, at 22:50:34
> Thanks, John. Naltrexone does indeed look interesting, especially as it's the subject of studies related to depersonalization at Mt. Sinai in New York. The discouraging note comes from fellow dp sufferers at the dpselfhelp site, none of whom have had success with it. As for Zyprexa, I'm concerned about what it would do to my already sky-high insulin levels - hyperinsulinism is the step just before diabetes. Right now I'm still titrating up on the lamictal - I want to give it a month at 300 mg. to really assess if there's a change in my dp. If no change, there are a number of things I want to try. What I'd really like is something that boosts dopamine but not noradrenaline or norepinephrine - something that clears my head without making me irritable and anxious.
>
> Again, thanks a lot for your interest. I always read your posts on the board - I think of you as a neuronaut, venturing into neurochemical pathways where lesser men fear to tread. :)
>
> yours, JaneHi Jane,
I think "neuronut" would be more apropro than "neuronaut". ;)
Anyways, I'm also very impressed with your knowledge and vigor to understand your condition. I wish you continued succuess in your search for comfort.
My feeling from investigating these fringe axis II disorders: PTSD, BPD, derealization, CFS, depersonalization, etc. Is that there are a lot of common themes that are linked into malfunctions to the HPA as wy have discussed. And their hasn't been enough good research into pharmacology to treat this to date. But it seems as though studies are starting to pour in to get a better understanding of the underlying disoder, and this is good.
So, I have some chronic joint pain and I think I will be seeing a rheumatologist or endocrinologist and have some work-up done. I also struggle with symptoms of dissociation stemming from ancient PTSD. In fact sometimes when I take anti-depressants they trigger a manic state and then abruptly switch me into this state where I litterly loose all sense of emotions. I litterally can't feel anything. I don't know if this is "derealization" or "depersonalization".
But now, even with most of my bipolar mood under control, I still feel that my affect is somewhat blunted (and not using a SSRI).
This affect blunting actually lifted completly a few times on ADs and it was a bizarre feeling, different than a depression lift (i.e. different than getting a dopamine kick). I.e. a return of "a range of feeling". Do you know what I am referring to?
BTW, I have seen many references to people with derealization having a common marker of hypocortisolemia. Right? Many people actually feel better after treatment with hydrocortizone, although I don't know if this can persist?
Best wishes,
John
Posted by jazzdog on April 4, 2002, at 12:26:43
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » jazzdog, posted by JohnX2 on April 3, 2002, at 12:02:04
Hi John -
> This affect blunting actually lifted completly a few times on ADs and it was a bizarre feeling, different than a depression lift (i.e. different than getting a dopamine kick). I.e. a return of "a range of feeling". Do you know what I am referring to?
Yes, I know exactly what you mean. It's a feeling of being fully alive - not emotionally numb, excited, or over-reactive. I think it also has something to do with libido, though not in any 'driven' way.>
> BTW, I have seen many references to people with derealization having a common marker of hypocortisolemia. Right? Many people actually feel better after treatment with hydrocortizone, although I don't know if this can persist?
>Yes, this is sort of where I entered on this thread. Hydrocortisone did indeed help, but any prolonged treatment undermines the adrenals' ability to manufacture it on their own. This seems to be true even with low-dose hydrocortisone, though cfs patients would argue against this. My feeling is, anybody with cfs should grab a anything that makes them feel better, even if it means they have to take cortisone the rest of their lives. Anything has to be better than living with that disease. Anyway, that's why I think I'll try a combo of licorice tea, ginseng and tyrosine - they seem to boost the adrenals' ability to manufacture its own cortisone.
By the way, do you know if tyrosine can work in this way? Is it just the brain blood barrier it doesn't cross?
Good luck with your endocrinological explorations. I think you'll enjoy a whole new field of body-mind interaction. :-)yours, Jane
Posted by jazzdog on April 7, 2002, at 15:20:21
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » jazzdog, posted by JohnX2 on April 3, 2002, at 12:02:04
Here's a great link for derealization studies, a couple of which mention low cortisone levels.www.beepworld.de/members17/depersonalization/abstracts.htm
- Jane
Posted by JohnX2 on April 8, 2002, at 0:37:19
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion ps » JohnX2, posted by jazzdog on April 7, 2002, at 15:20:21
>
> Here's a great link for derealization studies, a couple of which mention low cortisone levels.
>
> www.beepworld.de/members17/depersonalization/abstracts.htm
>
> - Jane
Hi Jane,Thanks for the leads!
Take Care,
John
Posted by Marilyn on February 19, 2004, at 20:30:54
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion » jazzdog, posted by JohnX2 on March 28, 2002, at 23:27:04
Maybe you should do some more research regarding antidepressants and cortisol:
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/cortisol-citalopram.htm
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/cortisol-sertraline.htm
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/cortisol-buspirone.htm
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/cortisol-fluoxetine1.htm
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/cortisol-fluoxetine2.htm
Marilyn
> Hi Jane,
>
> Most conventional psychiatry would disagree with the information presented on that web site.
>
> If I am reading that paragraph correct, the website implies that the SSRIs increase the output of cortisol and adrenaline to produce a euphoric state. Best I understand, this is simply not the case according to conventional thought.
>
> What is generally thought to be the case is that a depressed person may have excessive levels of cortisol circulating through the body, and the feedback mechanisms to control this are not in check. One may also find enlarged adrenal glands in a depressive. An effective antidepressant would correct the hypercortisolemia, which could be protective in many ways to ones health, contrary to the statement made in the web site.
>
> John
>
>
>
>
> > Here's the link:
> >
> > www.antidepressantsfacts.com/pinealstory.htm
> >
> > It's a pretty interesting site. The adrenal connection is made in Section 2a, Affecting Mood or Mind.
> >
> > - Jane
>
>
Posted by Dreaman on February 21, 2004, at 0:19:07
In reply to Re: SSRI, adrenal exhaustion, posted by Marilyn on February 19, 2004, at 20:30:54
I got tested for cortisol and came out below the normal range. I to0 was thinking about licorish supplementation. Does it come in capsule form? How much should one take and what brands are good. Does licorish stimulate you adrenal to produce the cortisol or is it a natural cortisol itself? I would really like to know the results of others trials with licorish. How did it compare if applicable with hydrocortisone? Specifically what effects did it have on your energy, concentration, mood, motivation, and sleep.
Dont know if any one can answer this question but Ill ask anyway. I also have hypothryroidism (or a High TSH) so I would like to know how cortisol and thyroxine or the adrenal glands and the thryoid gland are related. I think I remember reading that if you have adrenal insuffiecciency not to treat hypothryoidism before correcting the adrenal prob. Does anyone one know why? Also can adrenal probs somehow cause high TSH(which is indicative of hypothryodism)?
Thanks
*Dreaman
Posted by irwind on May 11, 2004, at 19:30:12
In reply to modafinil (Provigil) and Serotonin, posted by JohnX2 on March 26, 2002, at 17:48:16
modafinil and adrafinil are both alpha 1 agonists
atleast thats what is said in any litrature pertaining to these meds. alpha 1 agonists usually cause vasoconstriction - which mean blood pressure will increase. but all the literature pertaining to these two meds say they dont affect heart rate or pressure.
so can some one clarify this for me. any response in this matter will be greatly appreciated.
thanks.
Posted by utopizen on May 11, 2004, at 20:28:23
In reply to Re: modafinil (Provigil) and Serotonin, posted by irwind on May 11, 2004, at 19:30:12
Speaking of Serontonin, what's up with this anecdote I found on the 'net claiming the anti-depressant potential of Provigil requires 2 weeks before noticing? Maybe I should have trialed it for more than 3 days before giving up on it for my sleepiness....
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.