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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by awatts on May 2, 2004, at 20:33:58
When I gain weight on Abilify, is it just my appetite that changes, causing me to eat more - or is my metabolism actually slowed down?
I don't think that I'm eating that much more, but the weight is piling on.
awatts
Posted by Camille Dumont on May 2, 2004, at 21:38:37
In reply to Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds?, posted by awatts on May 2, 2004, at 20:33:58
Some meds like Zyprexa can mess with your blood sugar and make you gain weight.
Posted by chemist on May 2, 2004, at 22:29:09
In reply to Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds?, posted by awatts on May 2, 2004, at 20:33:58
> When I gain weight on Abilify, is it just my appetite that changes, causing me to eat more - or is my metabolism actually slowed down?
>
> I don't think that I'm eating that much more, but the weight is piling on.
>
> awattshi awatts... chemist here...you are taking an atypical antipsychotic indicated for schizophrenia, with off-lable use in the bipolar world. the weight gain appears to be related to your preexisting BMI, and i am quoting from BMS white-paper and another source. you can expect a weight gain (from baseline) of between 8% and 30%, with the higher increase correlated with lowest BMI. if you are thin, then you are pusing the 30% increase; if you are slightly overweight, that is at 19% (BMI 23-27); if your BMI is above 27, then 8%. can't say more, as i am not schooled in which receptors are responsible: nanomolar K_{i} for D_{2,3} as well as 5-HT_{1A,2A}, way tight; moderate affinity (nanomolar) for - among others - histamine H_{1}, which may be the problem. the affinity for alpha_{1}-adrenergic receptors is appreciable - statistically the same as for the histamine - but this class of receptors (adrenergic) wouldn't be implicated. taking anything else on the side? all the best, chemist
Posted by awatts on May 3, 2004, at 12:36:03
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds? » awatts, posted by chemist on May 2, 2004, at 22:29:09
>taking anything else on the side? all the best, chemist
Abilify 10mg -for depression
Effexor 150mg -for motivation
Klonopin 3x0.5mg -for anxiety
Inderal 3x20mg -for flushing and tremblingWhat do you think of this cocktail? Everything seems to work as expected, but I'm up 40 pounds.
awatts
Posted by chemist on May 3, 2004, at 16:13:14
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds?, posted by awatts on May 3, 2004, at 12:36:03
> >taking anything else on the side? all the best, chemist
>
> Abilify 10mg -for depression
> Effexor 150mg -for motivation
> Klonopin 3x0.5mg -for anxiety
> Inderal 3x20mg -for flushing and trembling
>
> What do you think of this cocktail? Everything seems to work as expected, but I'm up 40 pounds.
>
> awatts
>
hi awatts...nothing sticks out like a sore thumb to me, but i am going to defer to sad panda, king vultan, or SLS (Scott) on this, as they are more schooled than i am with the SSRIs/beta-blockers....all the best, chemist
Posted by Sad Panda on May 4, 2004, at 13:28:57
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds?, posted by Camille Dumont on May 2, 2004, at 21:38:37
> Some meds like Zyprexa can mess with your blood sugar and make you gain weight.
Yes, I believe that all the atypical AP's have been implicated with causing diabetes & their packaged literature has been altered to reflect that.
Cheers,
Panda.
Posted by Sad Panda on May 4, 2004, at 13:40:03
In reply to how do i gain weight, defer..., posted by chemist on May 3, 2004, at 16:13:14
> > >taking anything else on the side? all the best, chemist
> >
> > Abilify 10mg -for depression
> > Effexor 150mg -for motivation
> > Klonopin 3x0.5mg -for anxiety
> > Inderal 3x20mg -for flushing and trembling
> >
> > What do you think of this cocktail? Everything seems to work as expected, but I'm up 40 pounds.
> >
> > awatts
> >
> hi awatts...nothing sticks out like a sore thumb to me, but i am going to defer to sad panda, king vultan, or SLS (Scott) on this, as they are more schooled than i am with the SSRIs/beta-blockers....all the best, chemist
>
>I don't know what causes SSRI weight gain except for the apathy that they can induce. Generally, most meds either cause weight gain, with only the stimulating ones being capable of being weight neutral or weight reducing.
For appetite increase, the H1 blocking drugs have a high chance of causing this as well as the 5-HT2C blockers.
Cheers,
Panda.
Posted by Camille Dumont on May 4, 2004, at 15:21:59
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds?, posted by Sad Panda on May 4, 2004, at 13:28:57
But the strange thing is ... when I took Seroquel (atypical AP if I remember well) the weight started to fall off like crazy.
I'm usually like 110 - 115 (five feet one inch tall) ... and I would systematically drop a pound a week without changing anything ... until I reached 103 and stopped the Seroquel for unrelated reasons.
Course teh Zyprexa sent me back up to 108 in less than two weeks but since stopping it and only taking the Effexor + Celexa ... its been stable. But then again, my experience might be an exception. I tend to have extremely stable weight as a general thing.
Posted by chemist on May 5, 2004, at 0:46:31
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds?, posted by Camille Dumont on May 4, 2004, at 15:21:59
> But the strange thing is ... when I took Seroquel (atypical AP if I remember well) the weight started to fall off like crazy.
>
> I'm usually like 110 - 115 (five feet one inch tall) ... and I would systematically drop a pound a week without changing anything ... until I reached 103 and stopped the Seroquel for unrelated reasons.
>
> Course teh Zyprexa sent me back up to 108 in less than two weeks but since stopping it and only taking the Effexor + Celexa ... its been stable. But then again, my experience might be an exception. I tend to have extremely stable weight as a general thing.hi there, chemist here.....i play cribbage - a lot. often it's a 2-person game, and there's a lot of luck involved. when you to 3 players, it's strategy on the meld and a bit of luck. by the time 4 players are in, all bets are off, and you are going for corners, skunks, and high-hands. the point? you have a genetic profile that is suitable for tolerating the effects of atypical antipsychotics, most (if not all) of which result in weight gain: you're lucky! so seroquel was discontinued due to untoward side-effects, and weight loss was not one of them. okay. zyprexa worked as advertised - pile on the pounds - and the next step might be risperidone or ziprasidone, which might put the weight back on for you while taking care of business in your head as well. if you are good on effexor and celexa, so be it. if you want to put on some pounds, try some variations of the atypical APs or go to a tricyclic AD.....again, you are lucky in re: weight loss on seroquel. thank your genetic markers.....all the best, chemist
Posted by Camille Dumont on May 5, 2004, at 11:09:13
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds? » Camille Dumont, posted by chemist on May 5, 2004, at 0:46:31
Yes, but unfortunately my "genetic markers" also give me absence seizures on atypical APs.
Technically they're not absolutely necessaire ... or at least its what I've decided. Pdoc always tries to push them on me ... actually mentioned the same as you. Her main reason is because I see stuff but its only visual not super disturbing or scary ... it only makes me jump in surprise sometimes. For example, yesterday night I was watching the floor and then the patern on the floor tiles started to move and ondulate like a wave and this morning I was watching my rats sleep and they would grow and shrink intermitently ... back and forth ... sometimes I will interpret small reflections of the light as actual things or people ... or I will see words when in fact its not what is really written. But after closer inspection things "come back" to normal
Sometimes its even downright humorous because words will change (and turn up as very funny) and I will see things that are totally impossible so I know its not real. But in the end I've decided to learn to live with them rather than be completely zombified by the APs.
I've also told my pdoc : weight gain is unacceptable. If you give me something tha makes me grow fat ... its simple ... I just won't take it. But she's a very nice lady ... kind of why she suggested the Celexa as an augmenting agent instead of say Paxil and such.
Posted by chemist on May 5, 2004, at 12:38:59
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds?, posted by Camille Dumont on May 5, 2004, at 11:09:13
hmmmmm, interesting with the visual stuff...i was tempted to suggest palinopsia, but you seem to present with symptoms not consistent with palinopsia - entirely.....if you can live with it - and it sounds as if you can - then my hat is off to you...all the best, chemist
> Yes, but unfortunately my "genetic markers" also give me absence seizures on atypical APs.
>
> Technically they're not absolutely necessaire ... or at least its what I've decided. Pdoc always tries to push them on me ... actually mentioned the same as you. Her main reason is because I see stuff but its only visual not super disturbing or scary ... it only makes me jump in surprise sometimes. For example, yesterday night I was watching the floor and then the patern on the floor tiles started to move and ondulate like a wave and this morning I was watching my rats sleep and they would grow and shrink intermitently ... back and forth ... sometimes I will interpret small reflections of the light as actual things or people ... or I will see words when in fact its not what is really written. But after closer inspection things "come back" to normal
>
> Sometimes its even downright humorous because words will change (and turn up as very funny) and I will see things that are totally impossible so I know its not real. But in the end I've decided to learn to live with them rather than be completely zombified by the APs.
>
> I've also told my pdoc : weight gain is unacceptable. If you give me something tha makes me grow fat ... its simple ... I just won't take it. But she's a very nice lady ... kind of why she suggested the Celexa as an augmenting agent instead of say Paxil and such.
Posted by Camille Dumont on May 5, 2004, at 14:37:27
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds? » Camille Dumont, posted by chemist on May 5, 2004, at 12:38:59
Well, the pdoc doesn't know what it is ... eyes are fine, brain is fine ... so who knows.
The way it feels like its as if my brain gets sort of "lazy" with visual stuff. Like it will decide waht something is based on a very small part of a whole picture ... taking a small detail and constructing the rest of the image or text with that.
The funniest ones are with words and signs. I once walked passed a billboard add taht said something like "think of your kids, save the earth, recycle" ... well something like that ... it was in french. Well, all my brain paid attention was "kids" and "recycle" so as I walked pas the sign I read "save the earth, recycle your kids" lol ... after that I couldn't help but have mental images of a big compost heap with tiny little kid shoes over it ... kind of sick in a way ... but it made me laugh when I looked for the second time and realized what it really said.
Posted by chemist on May 5, 2004, at 21:02:29
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds?, posted by Camille Dumont on May 5, 2004, at 14:37:27
> Well, the pdoc doesn't know what it is ... eyes are fine, brain is fine ... so who knows.
>
> The way it feels like its as if my brain gets sort of "lazy" with visual stuff. Like it will decide waht something is based on a very small part of a whole picture ... taking a small detail and constructing the rest of the image or text with that.
>
> The funniest ones are with words and signs. I once walked passed a billboard add taht said something like "think of your kids, save the earth, recycle" ... well something like that ... it was in french. Well, all my brain paid attention was "kids" and "recycle" so as I walked pas the sign I read "save the earth, recycle your kids" lol ... after that I couldn't help but have mental images of a big compost heap with tiny little kid shoes over it ... kind of sick in a way ... but it made me laugh when I looked for the second time and realized what it really said.well, you got me there, camille...can't say i have any idea of what's happening....but you seem to be taking it in stride and addressing what to you are more imposing issues....with best wishes, chemist
Posted by Camille Dumont on May 7, 2004, at 11:10:48
In reply to Re: Hey Chemist - How Do I Gain Weight On Meds? » Camille Dumont, posted by chemist on May 5, 2004, at 21:02:29
It turned out that what I've been seeing is apparently quite common in ppl with schizoid pd and defense mechanism ... and is even more apparent with imaginative ppl.
Basically when under stress, the symptoms tend to ressemble psychotic symptoms but are not ... its just that the schizoid defense is to escape somewhere else ... kind of a dreamland but if the stress increases then so does the attempt to escape and eventually the person will start to "project" part of that around her.
Its also apparently quite consistent with episodes of depersonalization ... which I've had alot but can control now.
Kind of relieved to see I'm not really psychotic.
Posted by chemist on May 7, 2004, at 17:29:42
In reply to Got sort of answer yesterday, posted by Camille Dumont on May 7, 2004, at 11:10:48
> It turned out that what I've been seeing is apparently quite common in ppl with schizoid pd and defense mechanism ... and is even more apparent with imaginative ppl.
>
> Basically when under stress, the symptoms tend to ressemble psychotic symptoms but are not ... its just that the schizoid defense is to escape somewhere else ... kind of a dreamland but if the stress increases then so does the attempt to escape and eventually the person will start to "project" part of that around her.
>
> Its also apparently quite consistent with episodes of depersonalization ... which I've had alot but can control now.
>
> Kind of relieved to see I'm not really psychotic.camille, this is very encouraging, it's always great to get affirmation that what is going on is ``normal,'' under the circumstances! wishing you well, and taking a break, all the best, chemist
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