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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 23 of 23. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by ace on May 1, 2004, at 1:40:00
I think i asked this before, but I am persevering cause I have never seen any human data on the combo...
Maybe I must be the first!
Ace
Posted by SLS on May 1, 2004, at 8:40:42
In reply to last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by ace on May 1, 2004, at 1:40:00
> I think i asked this before, but I am persevering cause I have never seen any human data on the combo...
>
> Maybe I must be the first!What happened to clonidine?
- Scott
Posted by Mats on May 1, 2004, at 14:22:06
In reply to last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by ace on May 1, 2004, at 1:40:00
whats up Ace? are you self medicating? If so, do you rely on the answers from this newsgroups to ingage you in new combos?
Posted by ace on May 1, 2004, at 22:14:07
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by SLS on May 1, 2004, at 8:40:42
> > I think i asked this before, but I am persevering cause I have never seen any human data on the combo...
> >
> > Maybe I must be the first!
>
> What happened to clonidine?
>
>
> - Scott
>
Scott, I am going to use Clonidine IF Remeron is useless...I just have to get the guts up to try remeron first!!Actually I have heard really good things about Clonidine- it is very helpful for depersonalization syndrome, OCD, and depression. I have many anecdotes supporting this. Also for ADHD its good, which I'm sure I have got in a moderate way.
Scott, have u seen ANY human data on Remeron + MAOI???
Thanks mate,
Andrew (Ace)
Posted by ace on May 1, 2004, at 22:16:29
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by Mats on May 1, 2004, at 14:22:06
> whats up Ace? are you self medicating?
Preety much! I'm my own best doctor. I have made the best decisions and I'm not fond of most psychiatrists. MY GP is very open minded- anything I suggest he usually is happy with, that's because he knows I do thorough research.
If so, do you rely on the answers from this newsgroups to ingage you in new combos?
Sometimes, yeah. This forum is brilliant, absolutely brilliant in my opinion.
Take Care mate!,Ace
Nardil 75
Zyprexa 2.5
Posted by snapper on May 2, 2004, at 0:49:45
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » Mats, posted by ace on May 1, 2004, at 22:16:29
Hi Ace, just out of curiosity I did a search on pubmed.com and remeron and nardil combined came back with not one single entry.Have you done this search? It surely seems that someone has had this combo-wish I knew what to tell you
snapper
Posted by flipsactown on May 2, 2004, at 1:07:33
In reply to last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by ace on May 1, 2004, at 1:40:00
Ace,
This site originally referred by Todd, aka King Vultan, addresses Remeron with MAOI.
http://www.currentpsychiatry.com/2002_06/06_02_psy_toc.asp
"Trazodone is frequently employed as a remedy for MAOI-induced insomnia. Mirtazapine can be used safely in combination with MAOIs, and the agent has been reported to acutely treat serotonin syndrome."
Hope this will reassure you.
Nardil still rules? Aside from insomnia which I am taking generic benadryl for, Nardil is working in relieving my unipolar depression. It has only been 4 weeks. I still have some Remeron and I may try it at bedtime as I am not getting good quality sleep with the benadryl as I wake up after only an hour or two and have to wait a couple more hours before I can take more benadryl. Good luck with your present combo.
FST
> I think i asked this before, but I am persevering cause I have never seen any human data on the combo...
>
> Maybe I must be the first!
>
>
> Ace
Posted by ace on May 2, 2004, at 1:16:33
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by snapper on May 2, 2004, at 0:49:45
> Hi Ace, just out of curiosity I did a search on pubmed.com and remeron and nardil combined came back with not one single entry.Have you done this search?
Yep!
It surely seems that someone has had this combo-wish I knew what to tell you
I've searched far and low throughout cyberspace to no avail...!
> snapper
Thanks anyhow mate,
Ace.
Posted by ace on May 2, 2004, at 1:19:36
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » ace, posted by flipsactown on May 2, 2004, at 1:07:33
> Ace,
>
> This site originally referred by Todd, aka King Vultan, addresses Remeron with MAOI.
>
> http://www.currentpsychiatry.com/2002_06/06_02_psy_toc.asp
>
> "Trazodone is frequently employed as a remedy for MAOI-induced insomnia. Mirtazapine can be used safely in combination with MAOIs, and the agent has been reported to acutely treat serotonin syndrome."
>
> Hope this will reassure you.That is my ONLY reassurance! No where else, after vast searching, have I found ANYTHING on the combo! Guess I will have to be brave and take the plunge...lets hope it doesn't cause any harm!
>
> Nardil still rules?Absolutely! It used to rule more but!
Aside from insomnia which I am taking generic benadryl for, Nardil is working in relieving my unipolar depression.
Great to hear!
It has only been 4 weeks.
It took 6 weeks for me- then the euphoria kicked in!
I still have some Remeron and I may try it at bedtime as I am not getting good quality sleep with the benadryl as I wake up after only an hour or two and have to wait a couple more hours before I can take more benadryl.
If u ever try the Remeron with Nardil, advise me IMMEDIATELY!!!
Good luck with your present combo.
>
> FSTGood luck to u to mate,
Ace.>
>
> > I think i asked this before, but I am persevering cause I have never seen any human data on the combo...
> >
> > Maybe I must be the first!
> >
> >
> > Ace
>
>
Posted by flipsactown on May 2, 2004, at 1:38:09
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » flipsactown, posted by ace on May 2, 2004, at 1:19:36
Ace,
Maybe you can track down the footnote* regarding Remeron being used with MAOI.
*20. Hoes MJ, Zeijpveld JH. Mirtazapine as a treatment for serotonin syndrome. Pharmacopsychiatry 1996;29(2):81.
You don't think it is a good idea for me to take Remeron for insomnia? I have a pdoc apmt with a new pdoc (I fired the last one) and will ask him if he will rx Trazodone, or, if it is advisable to take Remeron for insomnia SE of Nardil.
FST
> > Ace,
> >
> > This site originally referred by Todd, aka King Vultan, addresses Remeron with MAOI.
> >
> > http://www.currentpsychiatry.com/2002_06/06_02_psy_toc.asp
> >
> > "Trazodone is frequently employed as a remedy for MAOI-induced insomnia. Mirtazapine can be used safely in combination with MAOIs, and the agent has been reported to acutely treat serotonin syndrome."
> >
> > Hope this will reassure you.
>
> That is my ONLY reassurance! No where else, after vast searching, have I found ANYTHING on the combo! Guess I will have to be brave and take the plunge...lets hope it doesn't cause any harm!
>
>
>
> >
> > Nardil still rules?
>
> Absolutely! It used to rule more but!
>
> Aside from insomnia which I am taking generic benadryl for, Nardil is working in relieving my unipolar depression.
>
> Great to hear!
>
> It has only been 4 weeks.
>
> It took 6 weeks for me- then the euphoria kicked in!
>
> I still have some Remeron and I may try it at bedtime as I am not getting good quality sleep with the benadryl as I wake up after only an hour or two and have to wait a couple more hours before I can take more benadryl.
>
> If u ever try the Remeron with Nardil, advise me IMMEDIATELY!!!
>
>
> Good luck with your present combo.
> >
> > FST
>
> Good luck to u to mate,
> Ace.
>
> >
> >
> > > I think i asked this before, but I am persevering cause I have never seen any human data on the combo...
> > >
> > > Maybe I must be the first!
> > >
> > >
> > > Ace
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by Sad Panda on May 2, 2004, at 15:08:39
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by flipsactown on May 2, 2004, at 1:38:09
Hi All,
I can't see any reason not to take Remeron with an MAOI. Remeron is sort of like a TCA with half the effects taken out. It's an ultra potent antihistamine that blocks a few receptors & doesn't realy increase serotonin or norepinephrine at all. If Effexor fails me I would go to Parnate & I will be taking Remeron or possibly Doxepin or Nortriptyline with it.
Cheers,
Panda.
Posted by ace on May 2, 2004, at 22:42:29
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by Sad Panda on May 2, 2004, at 15:08:39
> Hi All,
>
> I can't see any reason not to take Remeron with an MAOI.So why do we see all the "Don't EVER take Remeron with Nardil" comments around?
Remeron is sort of like a TCA with half the effects taken out. It's an ultra potent antihistamine that blocks a few receptors & doesn't realy increase serotonin or norepinephrine at all. If Effexor fails me I would go to Parnate & I will be taking Remeron or possibly Doxepin or Nortriptyline with it.
>
> Cheers,
> Panda.
>Panda, I'm just a bit hesitant until I see some human data, but I might just take the plunge one of these nights (probably when I had a few benzos to uninhibit me!!)
Cheers!
Ace.
Posted by ace on May 2, 2004, at 22:46:48
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by flipsactown on May 2, 2004, at 1:38:09
> Ace,
>
> Maybe you can track down the footnote* regarding Remeron being used with MAOI.
>
> *20. Hoes MJ, Zeijpveld JH. Mirtazapine as a treatment for serotonin syndrome. Pharmacopsychiatry 1996;29(2):81.
>
> You don't think it is a good idea for me to take Remeron for insomnia?I'm really not sure.
I have a pdoc apmt with a new pdoc (I fired the last one) and will ask him if he will rx Trazodone, or, if it is advisable to take Remeron for insomnia SE of Nardil.
>
> FST
Can you please get back to me with what your doc says....? And please tell me if you combine Remeron with Nardil....im on the verge of doing it...Cheers,
Ace.
Posted by flipsactown on May 2, 2004, at 23:27:22
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » Sad Panda, posted by ace on May 2, 2004, at 22:42:29
Sad Panda,
I am wanting to take Remeron to help me sleep because of Nardil insomnia. I have an almost full container of 45mg Remeron recently leftover from my previous combo. Should I split it in half? I know I slept well through the night when I was taking Remeron. I am getting very good results with Nardil even if I have only taken it less than 4 weeks, except for the insomnia. If taking Remeron helps with my insomnia without it it sabotaging Nardil's effectiveness, then I will ask my new pdoc when I see him in 2 weeks for an rx to make it legit. What do ya think?
FST
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I can't see any reason not to take Remeron with an MAOI.
>
> So why do we see all the "Don't EVER take Remeron with Nardil" comments around?
>
>
>
> Remeron is sort of like a TCA with half the effects taken out. It's an ultra potent antihistamine that blocks a few receptors & doesn't realy increase serotonin or norepinephrine at all. If Effexor fails me I would go to Parnate & I will be taking Remeron or possibly Doxepin or Nortriptyline with it.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Panda.
> >
>
> Panda, I'm just a bit hesitant until I see some human data, but I might just take the plunge one of these nights (probably when I had a few benzos to uninhibit me!!)
>
> Cheers!
> Ace.
Posted by ace on May 2, 2004, at 23:43:09
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » ace, posted by flipsactown on May 2, 2004, at 23:27:22
> Sad Panda,
>
> I am wanting to take Remeron to help me sleep because of Nardil insomnia. I have an almost full container of 45mg Remeron recently leftover from my previous combo. Should I split it in half? I know I slept well through the night when I was taking Remeron. I am getting very good results with Nardil even if I have only taken it less than 4 weeks, except for the insomnia. If taking Remeron helps with my insomnia without it it sabotaging Nardil's effectiveness,I see no way in which it can sabotage Nardil's effectiveness....in fact, it might make Nardil more effective.
then I will ask my new pdoc when I see him in 2 weeks for an rx to make it legit. What do ya think?Try Remeron without your docs consent to test it out before me!! Just Kidding!!! If I do the Remeron/Nardil combo, I will let u know straight away...it is only a matter of time before I combine them i think...
Ace
>
>
Posted by flipsactown on May 3, 2004, at 0:08:12
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » flipsactown, posted by ace on May 2, 2004, at 23:43:09
>
> Try Remeron without your docs consent to test it out before me!! Just Kidding!!! If I do the Remeron/Nardil combo, I will let u know straight away...it is only a matter of time before I combine them i think...
>
> Ace
>
I will be taking half a tab of Remeron (22.5mg) before I sleep tonight, as I have have not been getting any quality sleep since I started Nardil nearly 4 weeks ago. I will let you know first thing in the AM on how it went, hoping for quality ZZZZZZ's.Later
FST
Posted by ace on May 3, 2004, at 1:50:27
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » ace, posted by flipsactown on May 3, 2004, at 0:08:12
> >
> > Try Remeron without your docs consent to test it out before me!! Just Kidding!!! If I do the Remeron/Nardil combo, I will let u know straight away...it is only a matter of time before I combine them i think...
> >
> > Ace
> >
> I will be taking half a tab of Remeron (22.5mg) before I sleep tonight, as I have have not been getting any quality sleep since I started Nardil nearly 4 weeks ago. I will let you know first thing in the AM on how it went, hoping for quality ZZZZZZ's.
>
> Later
>
> FSTNo worries mate....if you feel any probs call an ambulance straight away.
Im actually going to see my doctor now- i might take it today in his presence.
Let me know how you go and be safe, bro.
Ace.
Posted by Sad Panda on May 3, 2004, at 3:17:33
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » Sad Panda, posted by ace on May 2, 2004, at 22:42:29
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I can't see any reason not to take Remeron with an MAOI.
>
> So why do we see all the "Don't EVER take Remeron with Nardil" comments around?
>For the same reasons you see 'Don't EVER use TCA's with MAOI's' & 'Don't EVER eat any cheese of any kind with MAOI's' We now know these two statements are non-sense.
Cheers,
Panda.
Posted by Sad Panda on May 3, 2004, at 3:29:24
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » ace, posted by flipsactown on May 2, 2004, at 23:27:22
> Sad Panda,
>
> I am wanting to take Remeron to help me sleep because of Nardil insomnia. I have an almost full container of 45mg Remeron recently leftover from my previous combo. Should I split it in half? I know I slept well through the night when I was taking Remeron. I am getting very good results with Nardil even if I have only taken it less than 4 weeks, except for the insomnia. If taking Remeron helps with my insomnia without it it sabotaging Nardil's effectiveness, then I will ask my new pdoc when I see him in 2 weeks for an rx to make it legit. What do ya think?
>
> FST
>I would split it. Remeron has two actions that contribute to sleep. First is histamine blockade, this causes the sedation feeling, second is 5-HT2A blockade, this causes an increase in deep sleep & helps keep you asleep. For me, 15mg to 30mg is the range for sleep, YMMW, but 15mg forces me to sleep for 8 hours, 30mg forces me to sleep for 9.
Cheers,
Panda.
Posted by flipsactown on May 3, 2004, at 11:27:06
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » flipsactown, posted by ace on May 3, 2004, at 1:50:27
>
> No worries mate....if you feel any probs call an ambulance straight away.
>Were you trying to scare me? I was having second thoughts when you mentioned AMBULANCE!
Just kidding. I took half a 45mg pill at midnight. I read a for awhile and waited to get sleepy. About an hour later, I went to sleep. At around 4AM I woke up with a mild case of dts. I am home detoxing with the help of my paindoc. I am on the tail end of my detox going from 8 20mg tabs to 3 tabs, taking codeine#3 in place of Oxy. When I awoke, I had a mild headache and the worst part of it was the mild dts in the form of inability to lie still and the skin crawling feeling. I immediately took an Oxy tab and in about 30 mins, the dts were gone, however, I was still unable to go back to sleep until about an hour later, then I woke up again. By this time it was nearly 7am so I got up and took my morning walk. Right now I feel ypretty good, good enough that I did a litle yard work mostly sweeping up leaves. I think I will wait until I have completed my home detox before I continue with the Remeron as I don't want anything to sabotage my detox from Oxy. I have taken Codeine for over 5 years prior to Oxy and had no dts whatsoever. I could go for days without taking it or even weeks and months, but eventually I had to take it as my chronic pain would get so bad that I would be practically bedridden and unable to function even in my limited capacity as a result of low back injury from being struck by a truck while riding a 10 speed bike way back in the 80's. Wish me luck on the home detox, because I think I will need it as I am starting to feel the dts and may have to stay at 3 Oxy tabs for 3 or 4 weeks instead of the agreed upon 2 weeks with my detox plan setup by my paindoc. Later.FST
> Im actually going to see my doctor now- i might take it today in his presence.
>
> Let me know how you go and be safe, bro.
>
> Ace.
Posted by ace on May 3, 2004, at 21:13:58
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron?, posted by flipsactown on May 3, 2004, at 11:27:06
>
> >
> > No worries mate....if you feel any probs call an ambulance straight away.
> >
>
> Were you trying to scare me? I was having second thoughts when you mentioned AMBULANCE!
> Just kidding. I took half a 45mg pill at midnight. I read a for awhile and waited to get sleepy. About an hour later, I went to sleep. At around 4AM I woke up with a mild case of dts.What is DTS?
I am home detoxing with the help of my paindoc. I am on the tail end of my detox going from 8 20mg tabs to 3 tabs, taking codeine#3 in place of Oxy. When I awoke, I had a mild headache
You don't attribute this to Remeron + Nardil?
and the worst part of it was the mild dts in the form of inability to lie still and the skin crawling feeling. I immediately took an Oxy tab and in about 30 mins, the dts were gone, however, I was still unable to go back to sleep until about an hour later, then I woke up again. By this time it was nearly 7am so I got up and took my morning walk. Right now I feel ypretty good, good enough that I did a litle yard work mostly sweeping up leaves. I think I will wait until I have completed my home detox before I continue with the Remeron as I don't want anything to sabotage my detox from Oxy.
So the Remeron was safe?
I have taken Codeine for over 5 years prior to Oxy and had no dts whatsoever. I could go for days without taking it or even weeks and months, but eventually I had to take it as my chronic pain would get so bad that I would be practically bedridden and unable to function even in my limited capacity as a result of low back injury from being struck by a truck while riding a 10 speed bike way back in the 80's. Wish me luck on the home detox, because I think I will need it as I am starting to feel the dts and may have to stay at 3 Oxy tabs for 3 or 4 weeks instead of the agreed upon 2 weeks with my detox plan setup by my paindoc. Later.
>
> FST
Your insomnia sounds bad....have you tried melatonin?Or how about some benzo's?
Or L-trytophan 2 grams?
Or Clonidine?
Sorry I couldn't understand all your post! It's my turn tonight to take the Remeron!Ace.
Posted by ace on May 3, 2004, at 21:15:55
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » ace, posted by Sad Panda on May 3, 2004, at 3:17:33
> > > Hi All,
> > >
> > > I can't see any reason not to take Remeron with an MAOI.
> >
> > So why do we see all the "Don't EVER take Remeron with Nardil" comments around?
> >
>
> For the same reasons you see 'Don't EVER use TCA's with MAOI's' & 'Don't EVER eat any cheese of any kind with MAOI's' We now know these two statements are non-sense.
>
> Cheers,
> Panda.
>I understand. It would be nice if the manafactures could qualify their contraindications with human data!
I agree, some dietary charts I have read are ridiculous...just too obsessive.
Ace.
Posted by flipsactown on May 3, 2004, at 22:40:37
In reply to Re: last time! - has anyone ever used MAOI + Remeron? » flipsactown, posted by ace on May 3, 2004, at 21:13:58
ACE,
>
> What is DTS?delirium tremens (withdrawal symtoms)
>
You don't attribute this to Remeron + Nardil?Yes I am because, this is the first time this has happened. While watching tv this afternoon, I fell asleep and woke up again with a headache. It is my body's way of telling me that I am nearing dts and I took some codeine and in 30 mins it went away. You see, I have to take codeine every 3 to 5 hrs to counter dts.
>
>
> So the Remeron was safe?
>
Yes, it is but I rather wait until I have fully detoxed so I won't have to deal with the headaches.
> Your insomnia sounds bad....have you tried melatonin?
>
Not yet, but I will keep that in mind.> Or how about some benzo's?
>
I don't know anything about benzo's. What are they?> Or L-trytophan 2 grams?
dunno, tell me about it.
> Or Clonidine?
dunno, tell me about it.> Sorry I couldn't understand all your post! It's my turn tonight to take the Remeron!
>
It's ok. Good luck! and don't forget to keep a telephone nearby, just in case you have to call an ambulance. LOL Just kidding my friend! Also, another reason why I am hesitant to continue the Remeron is that I gained 40 lbs in the 5 months I was taking Remeron. With Nardil, at least for me, it appears I am able to control my appetite. How about you? Later.FST
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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