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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 9:07:54
Well...Here I am again...Ready to blow my head off.
I need serious help or I'm going to truly go insane. I just don't understand. I cant tell whether my depression is causing my problems or my problems are causing my depression.
Has anyone used 5htp with success. I have a brutally difficult time tolerating meds.
Scott
Posted by Chairman_MAO on February 4, 2004, at 10:54:52
In reply to Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 9:07:54
Describe your depression. 5htp is useless forf depression unless you take it with carbidopa, AFAIK.
Posted by Sooshi on February 4, 2004, at 11:08:27
In reply to Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 9:07:54
Wow, I'm really sorry you're having such a hard time. I've been there too many times, and I know what you mean. I haven't tried 5htp, so I can't help you there, but I just wanted to send some support your way, and tell you to please try all the different options out there, because there are MANY, and there IS something out there that will work...you just have to keep trying till you find it!
Since you're sensitive to meds, have you tried Cognitive Behavioral Therapy? This therapy helped me deal WITH the side effects of my meds, which helped me tolerate taking them every day, as well as the deep despair and anxiety of living with the depression. Just a thought.
Good luck to you,
Sooshi
Posted by SLS on February 4, 2004, at 14:01:28
In reply to Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 9:07:54
> Well...Here I am again...Ready to blow my head off.
>
> I need serious help or I'm going to truly go insane. I just don't understand. I cant tell whether my depression is causing my problems or my problems are causing my depression.
>
> Has anyone used 5htp with success. I have a brutally difficult time tolerating meds.
Hi Scott.I really don't have anything to suggest. I just wanted to let you know that you are cared about. I hope your bad time passes soon.
Maybe S-AMe ?
- Scott
Posted by flyingdreams on February 4, 2004, at 17:56:42
In reply to Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 9:07:54
go to:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/
there they talk about alternatives to medications. Here's some that have been suggested:
Sam-E
St. John's Wort
L-Theanine
Picamilon
Taurine
Idebenone
magnisium citrate
Omega 3
Super B-Complex
Green TeaThey suggested the harder to find ones can be found at:
http://www.nutriscienceusa.com
http://www.nowfoods.comGood Luck!
Posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 18:47:59
In reply to Re: Total Despair » Mr. Scott, posted by Chairman_MAO on February 4, 2004, at 10:54:52
My Depression:Great fatigue and stiffness. Irritable mood and accusatory frame of mind (what are you really trying to say?). Chronic yet fluctuating anxiety. Feeling that everything is just too stressfull. Frequent communication to others about my despair often with a smile on my face or making a joke about it. Lack of patience of tolerance particularly with those closest. Exceptional hostility. Sadness. Super Pessimistic thinking. Feelings of inadequacy and self doubt. Desire for escape and sleep. Occassional thoughts of suicide but not too often. Mostly a real shitty feeling and a desire to tell everyone and everything to go away so I can sleep. Only mildy affecting work, but definately impairing my ability to have any kind of relationship with my girlfriend.
She is selfish and so am I. I am I guess because of my illness (only so much energy and good mood to go around and i have to work!). I try to be a great boyfriend to her and generally I am, but I feel disrepected, unappreciated, and as if all responsibility falls upon my shoulders. I must change and yet accept her for who she is. I am having a hard to living up to her expectations and well I'm thinking I would feel less stress without her, but obviously more loneliness too.
I have lost perspective as to whether this is mostly my depression or if she is the cause of this exacerbation. Probably both.
Current Med Regimen:
Trileptal 600mg - 900mg
Tranxene 7.5mg
Fish Oil 1 Gram
5htp 50mg
GABA 750mgOccassional psuedoepedrine or anti depressant use for quick and short lived bursts of energy. The Psuedophed generally leads to a crash.
Posted by Tiss on February 4, 2004, at 18:58:17
In reply to Re: Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 18:47:59
Maybe you could ask your dr. about Lamictal-a mood stabilizer that has helped many people with unipolar depression. Keep trying to find the right med. Are you in therapy to address some of your relationship problems? Good luck, Tiss
Posted by scott-d-o on February 4, 2004, at 19:55:11
In reply to Re: Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 18:47:59
>
> My Depression:
>
> Great fatigue and stiffness. Irritable mood and accusatory frame of mind (what are you really trying to say?). Chronic yet fluctuating anxiety. Feeling that everything is just too stressfull. Frequent communication to others about my despair often with a smile on my face or making a joke about it. Lack of patience of tolerance particularly with those closest. Exceptional hostility. Sadness. Super Pessimistic thinking. Feelings of inadequacy and self doubt. Desire for escape and sleep. Occassional thoughts of suicide but not too often. Mostly a real shitty feeling and a desire to tell everyone and everything to go away so I can sleep. Only mildy affecting work, but definately impairing my ability to have any kind of relationship with my girlfriend.
>
> She is selfish and so am I. I am I guess because of my illness (only so much energy and good mood to go around and i have to work!). I try to be a great boyfriend to her and generally I am, but I feel disrepected, unappreciated, and as if all responsibility falls upon my shoulders. I must change and yet accept her for who she is. I am having a hard to living up to her expectations and well I'm thinking I would feel less stress without her, but obviously more loneliness too.
>
> I have lost perspective as to whether this is mostly my depression or if she is the cause of this exacerbation. Probably both.
>
> Current Med Regimen:
> Trileptal 600mg - 900mg
> Tranxene 7.5mg
> Fish Oil 1 Gram
> 5htp 50mg
> GABA 750mg
>
> Occassional psuedoepedrine or anti depressant use for quick and short lived bursts of energy. The Psuedophed generally leads to a crash.
>
>perhaps you should try going on an antidepressant like an SSRI or even a psychostimulant.. I mean for chronic use, not just occasional. pseudoephedrine doesn't help with anything except nasal decongestion, it's action is too peripheral to be of any use.. 5htp at that low of a dose is also practically useless in my experience.. sounds like you are on too many GABAnergic meds which relieve anxiety but can cause depression in the longterm.. definitely try adding a serotonergic medication first, then if that doesn't work try something more activating like wellbutrin or a stimulant, since it's most likely a dysfunction of the serotonin or dopamine systems.. I doubt she is the cause of your problems; you sound way too pessimistic and should look at the postive aspects--like at least you have a gf and there is someone who cares about you..
scott
Posted by ace on February 4, 2004, at 20:20:50
In reply to Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 9:07:54
> Well...Here I am again...Ready to blow my head off.
First of all please please don't think like this. You must be in a lot of pain, but try and push those thoughts away...just shove 'em out and grit as much as you can...just for the time being....I know how bad it is...for two months a bouple of years ago I had severe major clinical depression....but i just couldn't give in...i thought of suide all the time
if thinking of it is a relief think of it, BUT DONT ACT ON IT!! NEVER GIVE IN BRAVE PERSON!
> I need serious help or I'm going to truly go insane. I just don't understand. I cant tell whether my depression is causing my problems or my problems are causing my depression.
You need to immediately see a doctor and be put on an antidepressant...something quick acting...maybe Parnate...also, a low dose of Zyprexa or risperidone might help...
>
> Has anyone used 5htp with success. I have a brutally difficult time tolerating meds.
>Not strong enough I believe...go for an AD, and maybe use another med for s/effects.
Please lket us know how you are going...
Ace.
> Scott
Posted by bill-bob on February 4, 2004, at 21:47:29
In reply to Re: Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 18:47:59
Mr Scott,
I can say that I had at least 75% of the symptoms you describe - so I have a very good idea of where you're at, and I know that it's not fun. I used to call it a deep, dark funk.
I started taking Lexapro (an SSRI-type drug) about 7 weeks ago and it has helped me tremendously. You do have to be patient since it takes awhile to work and there are some acute side effects (I had some stomach problems, jumpiness, some irratiability). And I still have some other SE, such as some decreased libido (diminished, but not totally gone) and delayed orgasm (but I had premature ejactulation before so it's not all bad). But I feel soooooo much better, so much more optimistic, patient, sunnier, less angry - the stuff really does work. I am going to try some counceling at some point but at least now I can engage in that starting from a positive frame of mind.
I looked at the list of stuff you're taking and it didn't look like anti-depressants were on the list.
My advice (from one who knows what it's like): keep trying things until you find something that works for you, and be patient enough to give things a chance to work (drugs or non-drugs). Don't settle for your current horrible state of mind! You don't have to!
Best of luck to you.
Bill
Posted by Mr. Scott on February 5, 2004, at 8:31:21
In reply to Re: Total Despair » Mr. Scott, posted by scott-d-o on February 4, 2004, at 19:55:11
I think you're right on all three aspects...
1) Look at the bright side.
2) Take less Gaba meds.
3) Get on an antidepressant.Thanks!
Posted by Bill LL on February 5, 2004, at 9:19:48
In reply to Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 9:07:54
Mr. Scott- You definitely need an antidepressant. There is no doubt about that. Which have you tried? The following is from an FDA site. You should keep taking the trileptal, but this is one more reason you need an antidepressant:
General Precautions with Trileptal:
Some people taking Trileptal can get serious reactions, including:Dizziness
Drowsiness
Depression or abnormal thinking
Difficulty concentrating
Speech or language problems
Difficulty with coordination and walking
Posted by mik on February 7, 2004, at 10:28:52
In reply to Re: Total Despair, posted by Bill LL on February 5, 2004, at 9:19:48
WHEN YOUR DEALING WITH DEPPRESSION LOW SELF ESTEEM , IRRITABILITY, ECT., YOU HAVE TO FOCUS MOST IF NOT ALL OF YOUR ENERGY ON GETTING BETTER.
THINK OF YOUR TREATMENT PLAN AS FOUR LEGS OF A TABLE. THAT TABLE WILL COLLASP WITHOUT ALL FOUR LEGS SUPPORTING IT . AND THE TABLE WOULD BE OF VERY LITTLE USE IF IT ONLY HAD QNE OR TWO LEGS.
I HAVE VERY SIMILIAR PROBLEMS THAT YOU HAVE. BECAUSE IM A FIREFIGHTER I LIKE TO USE THE ANALOGY THAT YOU HAVE TO PUT THE FIRE OUT BEFORE YOU CAN SAVE ANYONE IN THE STRUCTURE. IN OTHER WORDS WORK ON YOURSELF WITH PROFFESSIONAL HELP MEDS EXCERSISE CBT COUNSELING AND OR ANYTHING ELSE THAT WORKS!
ALSO DID THE STIMULANT YOU TOOK MAKE YOU FELL BETTER AND HELP YOU FOCUS. IF SO YOU MAY ASK YOUR DOCTOR ABOUT BEING TESTED FOR ADD AND USING A LONG ACTING MED. SUCH AS ADDERAL XR THAT HAS WORKED VERY WELL FOR ME ,FOR ADD AND DEPPRESSION ,AND LOSS OF FOCUS TAKE CARE MIK
Posted by noa on February 7, 2004, at 14:10:43
In reply to Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 4, 2004, at 9:07:54
I think you do need to consider medications. You say you've had difficulty tolerating meds. But have you pursued different combos?
I also have had difficulty tolerating meds, and it took a long time, but I was able to find a combo I can tolerate. It isn't perfect--believe me--not anywhere near perfect. But I consider it my "holding pattern" until a better med or other type of treatment comes along. And the SEs that I'm tolerating now are worth it because of the horrible state I was in before.
Which is what your situation sounds like. You do sound very depressed.
Get a good Pdoc, please, who will work with you to tweak your meds until it is good enough--notice my wording--good enough--yes, there are people who achieve better than that, but that is standard I use--for now--because the alternative is awful.
And, remember that untreated, depression can prime the brain for a worsening course of the illness (kindling effect).
Fwiw, here is the combo I take now:
Meds:
Effexor XR 225 mg
Serzone 500 mg
Adderall XR 30 mg
Lorazepam .25 mg--at night for restless leg SE (from Effexor)
Synthroid 50 mcg and Cytomel 12.5 mcg twice a day
(For hypothyroidism and depression)Supplements:
Fish oil
Chromium Polynicotinate
Zinc
Selenium
Folic Acid
Posted by Mr. Scott on February 7, 2004, at 19:32:46
In reply to Re: Total Despair » Mr. Scott, posted by noa on February 7, 2004, at 14:10:43
Thank You all for your support. I am 3 days into taking Effexor XR now and while my mood feels improved I do notice several irritating side effects. Constipation, agitation and muscle tension and also teeth grinding (Constipation and agitation being the worst). Also my head seems generally a bit cloudy. I have to ask what people just said a lot.
I tried Lexapro, but it made me a touch hypomanic and then I crashed into severe fatigue and all the while I had really nasty muscle aches. If the Effexor proves intolerable maybe I'll try Zoloft. All of these Antidepressants seem to have bad side effects for me.
Scott
Posted by bill-bob on February 8, 2004, at 23:16:43
In reply to Re: Total Despair, posted by Mr. Scott on February 7, 2004, at 19:32:46
Mr Scott
Maybe you could try starting at a very low dose. I started Lexapro at 5 mg per day for about 3 weeks before going to 10 mg. I don't know what the equivalent dose of Effexor would be.
Unfortunately, the "short term" side effects can last for several weeks or more - you have to be patient (but of course, I'm not in your shoes).
Hang in there!
Bill
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