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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Mishal on December 3, 2003, at 23:25:52
Klonopin is mentioned a good number of times in this board so do SSRIs. I know both klonopin and SSRIs produce some withdrawal syndromes when one tries to come off those. But will there be anybody in this board with the experience of both types of withdrawal syndromes ? Which is hard to come off? Klonopin or Zoloft/paxil? No speculations please. Need an answer from experience. Mishal
Posted by cubbybear on December 4, 2003, at 1:57:05
In reply to Withdrawal Symptoms. SSRIs vs Klonopin, posted by Mishal on December 3, 2003, at 23:25:52
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> know both klonopin and SSRIs produce some withdrawal syndromes when one tries to come off those. But will there be anybody in this board with the experience of both types of withdrawal syndromes ? Which is hard to come off? Klonopin or Zoloft/paxil?I was on Zoloft for a few months at max. dosage of 150 mg. and made a gradual phaseout with mild withdrawal symptoms of fatigue, feeling generally unwell, and very mild electrical "zapping" sensations in my face that lasted only 2 or 3 weeks. My withdrawal from this medication wasn't bad but I did notice a definite change after I had fully stopped it.
I'm now in the process of very slowly decreasing my Klonopin dosage. The first time I was hit with withdrawal symptoms, it was a very weird kind of anxiety that lasted about a week. The warning sign that anxiety was coming was that I had felt much irritability and was blowing up excessively at people. I subsequently decided to make my dosage decreases even smaller, and so I haven't experienced any anxiety for the past few months; however, I can usually count on having a couple of nights of insomnia after each decrease. What will happen toward the very end of my taper, I don't know, but I'm keeping my fingers crossed (am now taking .5 mg.) Hope this helps.
Posted by burnedout on December 4, 2003, at 11:21:12
In reply to Re: Withdrawal Symptoms. SSRIs vs Klonopin, posted by cubbybear on December 4, 2003, at 1:57:05
For me, it was without doubt the withdrawal from the SSRIs, actually, SSNRI--Effexor-XR.
I had been on Zoloft, Celexa, for a number of years, then to Lexapro, then to Effexor.
The Effexor was a nightmare and put me in the Emergency room. You can read on this board other peoples experiences, you can also do a search on Google for something like "SSRI withdrawal discontinuation pain" and the same for Klonopin.
Like the previous writer, the Klonopin taper is not as dangerous as a taper from Xanax or Ativan because of the way those drugs go out of the system so quickly. But there will probably be withdrawal effects with the Klonopin, unless you do a very, very gradual taper.
For me it's mainly feeling stress more and shaking. I try to stay there a while then if it goes away, I can try lowering the does a tad more. If it doesn't go away, I raise the dose back up to where I was stable and do the taper again. Eventually, I'll be off the Klonopin.But coming down on Klonopin, in my experience is nothing to what happened when I came off the Effexor-XR (SSNRI).
Also the worst day for the SSRI withdrawal, after being completely off, was day three. My doc told me if I could get past that without a seizure then the worst is over. He was right. Then it took 39 days before I finally came out from most of the effects of the SSRI.
With either of these, if you've taken them for a while, (over two weeks) DO NOT STOP ABRUPTLY. You are asking for serious/acute and dangerous reactions. I know.
Posted by DanielJ on December 4, 2003, at 14:46:12
In reply to Re: Withdrawal Symptoms. SSRIs vs Klonopin, posted by burnedout on December 4, 2003, at 11:21:12
My son was taking Klonopin for panic attacks for a short time. The next day after starting Klonopin he was begging for another one every few hours. We did not yield, he got it twice a day as perscribed and after he took it he headed for his bed to sleep and showed up 3 hours later unimproved. He quit taking it on his own 2 weeks later ( strange but true ). He was put on Zoloft 2 days later and never experienced bad withdrawal symptoms from the Klonopin that we noticed. All I can say is its good for producing naps. That was our experience.
Posted by cubbybear on December 5, 2003, at 4:14:42
In reply to Re: Withdrawal Symptoms. SSRIs vs Klonopin, posted by burnedout on December 4, 2003, at 11:21:12
You can read on this board other peoples experiences, you can also do a search on Google for something like "SSRI withdrawal discontinuation pain" and the same for Klonopin.
I sure do know all about the nightmare of Effexor withdrawal and am so glad i never took it. Am also aware of the class action litigation going on. Now that says it all.
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> But there will probably be withdrawal effects with the Klonopin, unless you do a very, very gradual taper. . .It's taking me many months to get off it because I'm deliberately doing a very gradual taper from a high of 4 mg. I definitely recommend buying a pill cutter and going at the rate of .125 mg. every 1-2 weeks, at least.
> For me it's mainly feeling stress more and shaking. I try to stay there a while then if it goes away, I can try lowering the does a tad more. If it doesn't go away, I raise the dose back up to where I was stable and do the taper again. Eventually, I'll be off the Klonopin.
With the exception of shaking, your experience sounds much like mine, in which going back up to the previous dose helped.
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>. Then it took 39 days before I finally came out from most of the effects of the SSRI.You sound like me--do you write down this stuff and keep careful records of your med experiences? One thing I've done with the Klonopin taper is to put it all on graph paper, with the vertical axis being the dosage and the horizontal axis being the date. It's gratifying to see that line continuously sloping downward over time.
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> With either of these, if you've taken them for a while, (over two weeks) DO NOT STOP ABRUPTLY. You are asking for serious/acute and dangerous reactions. I know.And so I've heard and read many times myself.
Good luck. cubbybear
Posted by shadows721 on December 5, 2003, at 21:20:29
In reply to Re: Withdrawal Symptoms. SSRIs vs Klonopin » burnedout, posted by cubbybear on December 5, 2003, at 4:14:42
Withdrawing from prozac was a breeze. I had one week that I felt irritable, but I did taper over a month. Klonopin was hell on Earth! My doc abruptly took me off of it after I had taken 2mg/day for 4 years. I felt suddenly paranoid one night. The next day (day 4) of no Klonopin, I felt knives all over me and I had violent convulsions. I had violent convulsions until the klonopin was administered. The next time the doc tried to get me to stop over 6 weeks. I hallucinated and felt ants biting me. I got a new doc and tapered the drug over 3 years. It was really rough.
Posted by Mr.Scott on December 5, 2003, at 22:11:14
In reply to Re: Withdrawal Symptoms. SSRIs vs Klonopin » burnedout, posted by shadows721 on December 5, 2003, at 21:20:29
For me benzo and particularly Klonopin has been thousands of time worse than SSRI withdrawal.
I have come off Zoloft, Prozac, Paxil, and Effexor with little more than the brain shocks all equally mild and different only by time course to onset based on the medicines half life. For me going slow meant I'd be okay.
I tapered off Xanax and Klonopin in my day and eventually returned to the benzos for relief. Coming off of them was very intense for me. Anxiety, agitation, insomia, de-realization. yuck!
Scott
Posted by cubbybear on December 5, 2003, at 23:36:39
In reply to Re: Withdrawal Symptoms. SSRIs vs Klonopin, posted by Mr.Scott on December 5, 2003, at 22:11:14
> For me benzo and particularly Klonopin has been thousands of time worse than SSRI withdrawal.
>
Wow, if there was ever proof that everyone reacts differently to every drug, this is it.
Posted by cubbybear on December 5, 2003, at 23:43:37
In reply to Re: Withdrawal Symptoms. SSRIs vs Klonopin » burnedout, posted by shadows721 on December 5, 2003, at 21:20:29
>. Klonopin was hell on Earth! My doc abruptly took me off of it after I had taken 2mg/day for 4 years. I felt suddenly paranoid one night. The next day (day 4) of no Klonopin, I felt knives all over me and I had violent convulsions. I had violent convulsions until the klonopin was administered. The next time the doc tried to get me to stop over 6 weeks. I hallucinated and felt ants biting me. I got a new doc and tapered the drug over 3 years. It was really rough.
It never ceases to amaze me what gross incompetence, if not downright malpractice exists out there in the medical profession. Every patient and every doctor should know the #1 rule about abruptly stopping benzos: never quit cold turkey.
And, tapering off 4 mg. over a period of 6 weeks? Also insufficient. Even six months might not be enough. As I mentioned in my prior post, I've been tapering off 4 mg. myself, and have been deliberately taking it super-slow over many months. I'm not in the market for any convulsions or hallucinations of ants.
Posted by shadows721 on December 6, 2003, at 12:38:16
In reply to Re: Withdrawal Symptoms. SSRIs vs Klonopin » shadows721, posted by cubbybear on December 5, 2003, at 23:43:37
I totally agree with you. This doc just wanted to see what would happen if I just stopped taking the Klonopin. Can you believe that?
I was in the hospital with severe dehydration from throwing up so much from taking Zoloft. When I began to have convulsions. I demanded the nurse to go look up this drug in the PDR, because it would explain that I was having withdrawals. While the staff was coming in to hold my body down, she said, "Yes, you are correct in your assessment." My doc was no where to be found, so they grabbed a GI doc that was on the floor. She told my family to get out of the room, because of what was going on. She started chanting for the spirit to leave my body. I yelled out I'm in withdrawals. This isn't an exocism! Get me the damn drug and this will all be over with. Sure enough the nurse called another neurologist and got an order to give me one 0.5 mg pill of Klonopin. Bravo! The convulsions stopped within 15 mins. What a nightmare! It was the worst experience of my life and to think this doc is a neurologist. What was with that GI doc?
I just had to vent on that one. Whew!!!! Anyway, while I tapered off the Klonopin for 3 yrs, I took Kava Kava on an as needed basis to help with the increased anxiety. It helped me.
Posted by cubbybear on December 7, 2003, at 0:05:23
In reply to Re: GI doc thought it was an exocism?cubbybear, posted by shadows721 on December 6, 2003, at 12:38:16
This doc just wanted to see what would happen if I just stopped taking the Klonopin. Can you believe that?
In a way yes, I've read horror stories on this board. In a way no, every new one is no less shocking than the one before. Did this guy maybe think you were his guinea pig in an experiment?
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My doc was no where to be found, so they grabbed a GI doc that was on the floor. She told my family to get out of the room, because of what was going on. She started chanting for the spirit to leave my body. I yelled out I'm in withdrawals. This isn't an exocism!What part of the country are you in? Is it perhaps near southeastern Kentucky or Tennessee where some people still use snakes while worshipping? I spent some "quality" time there while in college doing research, and will never forget the locals' obsession with being possessed by evil spirits. You're lucky that these fools were willing to open the medicine cabinet and give you the medication.
Posted by cubbybear on December 7, 2003, at 0:07:20
In reply to Re: GI doc thought it was an exocism?cubbybear, posted by shadows721 on December 6, 2003, at 12:38:16
Please see my new post regarding submitting horror stories.
Posted by shadows721 on December 7, 2003, at 17:24:34
In reply to Re: GI doc thought it was an exocism?cubbybear » shadows721, posted by cubbybear on December 7, 2003, at 0:05:23
I am in Louisiana, so I don't know why the GI doc acted like that. Weird!!
This is the end of the thread.
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