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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by zeugma on August 1, 2003, at 20:43:57
http://psychservices.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/full/52/11/1469#T2
An article of interest
Posted by jay on August 2, 2003, at 3:07:08
In reply to can recovery from depression be achieved?, posted by zeugma on August 1, 2003, at 20:43:57
> http://psychservices.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/full/52/11/1469#T2
>
> An article of interestInteresting article, but I honestly believe there is so much more hope, in particular when people are able to get some non-judgmental help from a partner, friend, parents, etc. In fact, I think the 'healing process' often only begins after many years of difficulties. It's like you have to 're-build' yourself, and you question and choose from everything you had in your 'previous' life. In the Western world, we have created a society that is big on many, many unnatural stressors. Money, time, and social status (mixed with materialism and greed) play a massive role in how we define ourselves. Depression and other mental illness can rob you of those things, or achieving them, whichever way you look at it. Most 'generic' mental health treatment is absolutely hideous! Many doctors and psychiatrists often blame the patient for not getting the 'expected' response out medication. I blame the SSRI's in part, because along came these meds that *any* doctor could prescribe, and not only that, but their limited knowledge of mental health made them think often a single pill, if at the most maybe two, could cohesively treat depression. I am not saying anything against SSRI/SNRI's, they are often excellent meds, but what about all of all other aspects of both your illness and your life around you. What about the therapeutic effect of conversation about the 're-building' of yourself? As a social worker I learn't plenty about these last two things, and there is some good research which shows parallels between depression and the grieving process. Many of us are sad for a few reasons: a) we feel our 'old-self' has abandoned us and b)we 'grieve' for this, and the world around us doesn't seem to have the time of day to acknowledge this. Many of the classic symptoms of grief seem to shadow those of depression. I am not trying to 'medicalize' grief, but it's time this severity, and complexity is acknowledged.
My depression was thrown to the center of the earth when I endured my own grieving tragedies, of losing my only child and likely my future wife to death. We are now 6-7 years past that, but that absolute dreadful feeling of loss and shock when it all happened feels so close to my enduring depression, which was bad around even before my tragedies.
Anyhow...just my .02 cents, but I hope folks can take something away from this. In fact it really has *nothing* to do with being *strong; but everything in the to be as brave as we have been, and there is bravado in reaching out extensively for help.
Best,
Jay
Posted by David Smith on August 2, 2003, at 23:00:51
In reply to Re: can recovery from depression be achieved? » zeugma, posted by jay on August 2, 2003, at 3:07:08
Thank you for that posting Jay. I am sorry for your HUGE loss. Your courage and insight have helped me this evening. I especially like the part about the abandonment of our "old-self." If you care to talk more about it I will look for a post in Psychological Babble. Thanks again.
dave
Posted by Bob on August 2, 2003, at 23:49:19
In reply to Re: can recovery from depression be achieved? » zeugma, posted by jay on August 2, 2003, at 3:07:08
In the Western world, we have created a society that is big on many, many unnatural stressors. Money, time, and social status (mixed with materialism and greed) play a massive role in how we define ourselves.
>
>Jay: I think you're selling the rest of the world short here. The Western world doesn't place more emphasis on it, we've just achieved more of it. I know plenty of people from other parts of the world personally, and there's no shortage of overemphasis placed on money, power, sex, and all the things people seem to think the Western world invented. I think it depends on the individual, as these are universal human traits.
Posted by Kacy on August 3, 2003, at 7:20:40
In reply to Re: can recovery from depression be achieved? » jay, posted by Bob on August 2, 2003, at 23:49:19
I agree with Bob. Most of the elements in our lives in the west are in other cultures. Opposition and adversity take other guises, but they are the same. The prizes are different, but the competition and games are the same. See Shakespeare.
I do wonder, sometimes, if we face more change than many other cultures. Since change is a threat, we may have a stressed out society because of that.
I'm sorry for your loss, Jay. We change communities so much that we lose parts of the grieving process. The world keeps going around us and the people around don't all know and observe the process, too. I think our community's acknowledgement of our loss is incomplete and we are left holding something by ourselves too quickly.
On a small note, I think your meant 'courage' where you wrote 'bravado'. (?) Bravado is a false show of bravery.
Posted by Bob on August 3, 2003, at 14:38:27
In reply to Re: can recovery from depression be achieved?, posted by Kacy on August 3, 2003, at 7:20:40
> I agree with Bob. Most of the elements in our lives in the west are in other cultures. Opposition and adversity take other guises, but they are the same. The prizes are different, but the competition and games are the same. See Shakespeare.
>
> I do wonder, sometimes, if we face more change than many other cultures. Since change is a threat, we may have a stressed out society because of that.
>
> I'm sorry for your loss, Jay. We change communities so much that we lose parts of the grieving process. The world keeps going around us and the people around don't all know and observe the process, too. I think our community's acknowledgement of our loss is incomplete and we are left holding something by ourselves too quickly.
>
> On a small note, I think your meant 'courage' where you wrote 'bravado'. (?) Bravado is a false show of bravery.I agree with the element of change hypothesis. Humans were not designed for a lot of change. Yes, a few seem to not mind it, but most of it have a hard time dealing with it. The farther back in history you go, the more humans lived in small, tight groups for their whole lives, often in the same exact place. Even nomadic humans often frequented the same places, and did so with the same group their whole lives. I've heard it said that moving (from one house to another) is at the top of the list for stressful events people experience in their lives.
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 4, 2003, at 4:18:17
In reply to Re: can recovery from depression be achieved? » jay, posted by Bob on August 2, 2003, at 23:49:19
> Jay: I think you're selling the rest of the world short here...
This is fine to discuss, could you just redirect follow-ups not related to medication to Psycho-Social-Babble? Here's a link:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20030727/msgs/247945.html
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Bob on August 4, 2003, at 4:45:12
In reply to Redirect: the rest of the world, posted by Dr. Bob on August 4, 2003, at 4:18:17
> > Jay: I think you're selling the rest of the world short here...
>
> This is fine to discuss, could you just redirect follow-ups not related to medication to Psycho-Social-Babble? Here's a link:
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20030727/msgs/247945.html
>
> Thanks,
>
> BobWow, Dr. Bob! Your one quick moderator!
This is the end of the thread.
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