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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by jonh kimble on March 21, 2003, at 21:07:49
well i ended up at the hospital emerge the other day as i was feeling pretty darn bad. (thats where im typing this from) talked to a couple of pdocs here and they think im bi polar. i never would have thought that. Im 19 and they say the real mood swings dont start till your in late 20's usually. Is this the experience you all have had? is the fact that i feel depressed all the time contradictory to this diagnosis? is severe social anxiety and add ever a part of bi polar or is this separate? i guess the fact that my uncle is severely bi polar helps fit the diagnosis. but i heard bi polars who try normal ads go manic and this didnt happen to me.
im starting lamictal and seroquel tonight. can they help with focus, increased energy, mood lift, and especially social anxiety? what are these meds effects on the dopamine system? i think dopamine dysfunction is a biggie with me.
im so glad im finally getting help, two days ago i was planning my suicide. thanks everyone for your help
Posted by Krissy P on March 21, 2003, at 23:14:14
In reply to i guess im bi polar, posted by jonh kimble on March 21, 2003, at 21:07:49
Hey-Hang in there:-)
What criteria are your docs going on that they think you may be Bipolar? My mood swings begun when I was 13. I have heard that they can develop in young adulthood, yes, however that's a debate. I've been on Seroquel for 3 1/2 years-it helps me sleep but I have gained weight from it. I restarted on Lamictal-my wonder med 3 weeks ago (after stopping it because I felt good-mistake)-so I went back on it. On Lamictal, I am so much more focused and it definately lifted my mood-it just helps me all around. I don't get too much social phobia-but have in the past. BAD. The Effexor-XR helps me a little with that because the XR is approved for GAD and I believe it.
As far as dopamine receptors-there is A LOT of good info on that topic here-if you look around.
Best of luck,
Kristen
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------im starting lamictal and seroquel tonight. can they help with focus, increased energy, mood lift, and especially social anxiety? what are these meds effects on the dopamine system? i think dopamine dysfunction is a biggie with me.
>
> im so glad im finally getting help, two days ago i was planning my suicide. thanks everyone> well i ended up at the hospital emerge the other day as i was feeling pretty darn bad. (thats where im typing this from) talked to a couple of pdocs here and they think im bi polar. i never would have thought that. Im 19 and they say the real mood swings dont start till your in late 20's usually. Is this the experience you all have had? is the fact that i feel depressed all the time contradictory to this diagnosis? is severe social anxiety and add ever a part of bi polar or is this separate? i guess the fact that my uncle is severely bi polar helps fit the diagnosis. but i heard bi polars who try normal ads go manic and this didnt happen to me.
>
> im starting lamictal and seroquel tonight. can they help with focus, increased energy, mood lift, and especially social anxiety? what are these meds effects on the dopamine system? i think dopamine dysfunction is a biggie with me.
>
> im so glad im finally getting help, two days ago i was planning my suicide. thanks everyone for your help
Posted by Ritch on March 22, 2003, at 10:15:03
In reply to i guess im bi polar, posted by jonh kimble on March 21, 2003, at 21:07:49
....Im 19 and they say the real mood swings dont start till your in late 20's usually. Is this the experience you all have had? is the fact that i feel depressed all the time contradictory to this diagnosis? is severe social anxiety and add ever a part of bi polar or is this separate? i guess the fact that my uncle is severely bi polar helps fit the diagnosis. but i heard bi polars who try normal ads go manic and this didnt happen to me....
That's been my experience. I've had intense depressive periods all the way through childhood, but sustained (more than a few hours) elevated mood episodes didn't get really prominent until my late teens and esp. my 20's. Depression predominating in BPII is very common. It still burns about half the year for me, while the highs probably take up about 3 days out of every 20 on average. Social anxiety goes up and down with my moods. When I'm depressed I get very socially withdrawn. When I get high the reverse tends to happen. I believe I have comorbid ADD, however. At least one pdoc thought so, too, anyhow. The ADD can also worsen at both mood extremes. Highs put too much on your plate to deal with, lows slow down your brain and make it hard to function. When my mood is relatively normal I still have a lot of absent-minded inattentiveness problems. SSRI's are the only AD's that seem to trigger worsened cycling and manic spells for me. Sometimes the AD can make you just irritable instead.
Posted by Jumpy on March 22, 2003, at 11:10:13
In reply to Re: i guess im bi polar » jonh kimble, posted by Ritch on March 22, 2003, at 10:15:03
> That's been my experience. I've had intense depressive periods all the way through childhood, but sustained (more than a few hours) elevated mood episodes didn't get really prominent until my late teens and esp. my 20's. Depression predominating in BPII is very common. It still burns about half the year for me, while the highs probably take up about 3 days out of every 20 on average. Social anxiety goes up and down with my moods. When I'm depressed I get very socially withdrawn. When I get high the reverse tends to happen. I believe I have comorbid ADD, however. At least one pdoc thought so, too, anyhow. The ADD can also worsen at both mood extremes. Highs put too much on your plate to deal with, lows slow down your brain and make it hard to function. When my mood is relatively normal I still have a lot of absent-minded inattentiveness problems. SSRI's are the only AD's that seem to trigger worsened cycling and manic spells for me. Sometimes the AD can make you just irritable instead.
Hey Ritch,
Can you tell me more about ad triggered cycling? Do the SSRIs make the highs and lows more intense ... or do they extend the manic periods from several days into several weeks? Is mood charting the best way to determine if your cycling with hypomania? Thanks alot.
Jumpy
Posted by Ritch on March 22, 2003, at 15:56:51
In reply to Re: i guess im bi polar » Ritch, posted by Jumpy on March 22, 2003, at 11:10:13
> > That's been my experience. I've had intense depressive periods all the way through childhood, but sustained (more than a few hours) elevated mood episodes didn't get really prominent until my late teens and esp. my 20's. Depression predominating in BPII is very common. It still burns about half the year for me, while the highs probably take up about 3 days out of every 20 on average. Social anxiety goes up and down with my moods. When I'm depressed I get very socially withdrawn. When I get high the reverse tends to happen. I believe I have comorbid ADD, however. At least one pdoc thought so, too, anyhow. The ADD can also worsen at both mood extremes. Highs put too much on your plate to deal with, lows slow down your brain and make it hard to function. When my mood is relatively normal I still have a lot of absent-minded inattentiveness problems. SSRI's are the only AD's that seem to trigger worsened cycling and manic spells for me. Sometimes the AD can make you just irritable instead.
>
> Hey Ritch,
>
> Can you tell me more about ad triggered cycling? Do the SSRIs make the highs and lows more intense ... or do they extend the manic periods from several days into several weeks? Is mood charting the best way to determine if your cycling with hypomania? Thanks alot.
>
> Jumpy
Hi, yeah do the mood charting! If you don't do that you will FORGET what has been going on and your appraisal of your cycling will be inaccurate. When you get depressed it will seem like you have been depressed most of the time-when you get high it will seem like you aren't stable enough (even though it is mild and short-lived). If something remarkably bad or good happens to you--write it down that day. Listing your meds and the dosages establishes a pattern that you can look over to see if you can establish some kind of causal relationship to either a lack of response or side effects, etc. Most importantly (in some cases) it will help you determine what med is likely causing what side effect or to possibly eliminate a medication caused unintended effect.Med-induced cycling... In my own case I haven't noticed antidepressants *increasing* the cycle frequency. What they (esp. SSRI's) seem to do is make the peaks and troughs more contrasted or remarkable. It would be similar to riding a relatively flat roller coaster that is mostly below the surface of the ground and then taking the entire track and lifting it mostly out of the ground, but making the kinks taller and deeper in the track, but not moving the location of the kinks.
Posted by jonh kimble on March 22, 2003, at 16:16:04
In reply to Re: i guess im bi polar » Jumpy, posted by Ritch on March 22, 2003, at 15:56:51
I get minor mood swings i believe. sometimes i get all energetic and talkative (which I am NEVER) and in the middle of an enjoyable conversasion my mood and all just dies. i become completely silent and uttering a word can be unbelievably hard. I have horrible motivation(although i am dying to do things, if that makes sense), my ability to form words in conversion outside of things like hows it going is unbelievably hard. I feel low on myself although I really like myself (i know that doesnt make much sense either) and i dont really enjoy doing anything, although like i said i would love to do things if i could get some reward out of them. these things and oh ya, horrible concentration, lead toward the low dopamine idea, although i dont know what meds i could use for these symtoms any help here? thanks for the posts,
Tom
Posted by jonh kimble on March 22, 2003, at 16:21:21
In reply to Re: i guess im bi polar » Jumpy, posted by Ritch on March 22, 2003, at 15:56:51
when will i know if lamictal is doing anthing? i just started on 12.5 mgs last night and not surprisingly, dont feel any different. when will i know if i get that rash? would that have shown up already? also, i have heard that lamictal can lower stimulant tolerance, i have a very high stimulant tolerance. does it have an effect on nmda? does it usually work on people who other ads did absolutly nothing? ( like me) can it help with social withdrawl? how about seroquel, does it do anything other than help you sleep? i just started 100mgs at night. sorry for all the questions but i really want to know and this hospital is boring as hell. thanks, tom
Posted by Jumpy on March 22, 2003, at 20:22:12
In reply to Re: i guess im bi polar » Jumpy, posted by Ritch on March 22, 2003, at 15:56:51
> Med-induced cycling... In my own case I haven't noticed antidepressants *increasing* the cycle frequency. What they (esp. SSRI's) seem to do is make the peaks and troughs more contrasted or remarkable. It would be similar to riding a relatively flat roller coaster that is mostly below the surface of the ground and then taking the entire track and lifting it mostly out of the ground, but making the kinks taller and deeper in the track, but not moving the location of the kinks.Hey Ritch ... thanks a million .... Jumpy
Posted by Krissy P on March 23, 2003, at 1:08:01
In reply to Re: lamictal and seroquel questions, posted by jonh kimble on March 22, 2003, at 16:21:21
Hi jonh,
If you read a lot of the previous posts, and also Dr. Bowden's, it can take anywhere from a day to a week, to a few months to notice if a med is working for you or not. Try not to worry about the rash-even though it is a serious side effect, you may not get it. I take 50mg of Lamictal and I have a slight rash-my pores on my arms are slgihtly pink.
It does bother me because my skin doesn't look as smooth, but I lotion it a lot and that seems to help amd so does the sun. If you do notice a rash, depending on where you live, if sun isn't abundant, try a light box (see many previous posts on this). But try not to worry about it-I know it is a scary side effect, but some don't get it and you wont know, let alone know if Lamictal works for you, unless you give it time.
Are you and your doc working together on your dosages, etc.?
Seroquel is an AP, but is used a lot for persons with insomnia-yours truly. It has been recently now shown to help people with BP. Why are you on Seroquel?
for sleep?
I don't want to write a long post, because you are in the hospital and they can definately, and should be able to help you with all your concerns.
hang in there k?
Kristen:-)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------when will i know if lamictal is doing anthing? i just started on 12.5 mgs last night and not surprisingly, dont feel any different. when will i know if i get that rash? would that have shown up already? also, i have heard that lamictal can lower stimulant tolerance, i have a very high stimulant tolerance. does it have an effect on nmda? does it usually work on people who other ads did absolutly nothing? ( like me) can it help with social withdrawl? how about seroquel, does it do anything other than help you sleep? i just started 100mgs at night. sorry for all the questions but i really want to know and this hospital is boring as hell. thanks, tom
Posted by Ritch on March 23, 2003, at 10:00:10
In reply to Re: mood swings and how i feel, posted by jonh kimble on March 22, 2003, at 16:16:04
> I get minor mood swings i believe. sometimes i get all energetic and talkative (which I am NEVER) and in the middle of an enjoyable conversasion my mood and all just dies. i become completely silent and uttering a word can be unbelievably hard. I have horrible motivation(although i am dying to do things, if that makes sense), my ability to form words in conversion outside of things like hows it going is unbelievably hard. I feel low on myself although I really like myself (i know that doesnt make much sense either) and i dont really enjoy doing anything, although like i said i would love to do things if i could get some reward out of them. these things and oh ya, horrible concentration, lead toward the low dopamine idea, although i dont know what meds i could use for these symtoms any help here? thanks for the posts,
> Tom
Hey, I used to get those sudden mood "crashes" like what you mention back when I was on lithium (instead of AED's). I rapid-cycle anyhow, but that was one thing I didn't mention was the flips that used to occur during the day. It was similar to what you describe. I could be feeling very elated and talkative and then it would be like someone popped a balloon and I would have nothing to say and would feel like crawling away to hide someplace. Then sometimes I would be feeling relatively normal and then have this "sinking" or "diving" sensation that would be very abrupt-like an airplane losing altitude suddenly. I haven't had those type of flips since I've been on Depakote (didn't get them on Trileptal either). As far as the low dopamine thing.. Stims were very helpful and seemed to flatten my cycling but made me too anxious. I found L-Tyrosine to be helpful, too (without the anxiety). However the tyrosine only seems to work for a few days and then it poops out. I wait a while and restart it if I am feeling down and that's how I use it. I've heard about Enada NADH here and am curious about that, but never tried it.
Posted by Ritch on March 23, 2003, at 10:03:17
In reply to Re: lamictal and seroquel questions, posted by jonh kimble on March 22, 2003, at 16:21:21
> when will i know if lamictal is doing anthing? i just started on 12.5 mgs last night and not surprisingly, dont feel any different. when will i know if i get that rash? would that have shown up already? also, i have heard that lamictal can lower stimulant tolerance, i have a very high stimulant tolerance. does it have an effect on nmda? does it usually work on people who other ads did absolutly nothing? ( like me) can it help with social withdrawl? how about seroquel, does it do anything other than help you sleep? i just started 100mgs at night. sorry for all the questions but i really want to know and this hospital is boring as hell. thanks, tom
Ron, Colin, Krissy, Rainbowlight, and others here are currently taking Lamictal and would best answer your questions about that. I haven't tried the stuff yet. If I try it, it would be in combination with Depakote and that is the riskiest way to take it and I have a history of skin reactions to meds so I am a little apprehensive at this point.
Posted by Ritch on March 23, 2003, at 10:04:15
In reply to Re: i guess im bi polar » Ritch, posted by Jumpy on March 22, 2003, at 20:22:12
Posted by jonh kimble on March 23, 2003, at 14:53:24
In reply to Your welcome--take care! (nm) » Jumpy, posted by Ritch on March 23, 2003, at 10:04:15
Thanks for the posts. if i want down id write more.
This is the end of the thread.
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