Shown: posts 1 to 25 of 46. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by male34 on March 1, 2003, at 22:34:37
i want to know can klonpin be used daily like ssri's and are there side effects?weight gain? and DOES IT WORK FOR ANXIETY?,truthfull helpfull answers please,my point is im not getting good anti-anxiety results from 10 mg 4 weeks now on LEXapro,ssri,THANKS
Posted by KrissyP on March 1, 2003, at 23:11:02
In reply to KLONPIN users,help??, posted by male34 on March 1, 2003, at 22:34:37
Hi, I take 2mg of Klonopin every night. It helps with any anxiety and sleep for me. I haven't noticed any side effects at all except when I missed 2 doses and landed in the ER-but it wasn't from the drug per say-I missed 2 doses-not a good thing to do on a benzo. I have never tried Lexapro so I'm sorry but I can't help you there. Hang in there and keep us posted:) I hoped this helped a little?
Kristen
*************************************************
i want to know can klonpin be used daily like ssri's and are there side effects?weight gain? and DOES IT WORK FOR ANXIETY?,truthfull helpfull answers please,my point is im not getting good anti-anxiety results from 10 mg 4 weeks now on LEXapro,ssri,THANKS
Posted by viridis on March 2, 2003, at 0:30:13
In reply to Re: KLONPIN users,help?? » male34, posted by KrissyP on March 1, 2003, at 23:11:02
Klonopin can help tremendously with anxiety. It's a benzodiazepine, which means that if you use it on a regular basis and decide to stop, you should cut back gradually (just like with most antidepressants). I'm biased (since it works so well for me, after many failed trials on ADs), but recommend it highly. It may make you a bit sleepy etc. at first, but this should go away pretty fast. If you try it, at least you'll know quickly whether it's helpful. I find it excellent for anxiety.
Posted by KrissyP on March 2, 2003, at 1:03:56
In reply to Re: KLONPIN users,help??, posted by viridis on March 2, 2003, at 0:30:13
I find Klonopin excellent for anxiety also, and in a small dose such as 2 mg. Good luck:-)
KristenKlonopin can help tremendously with anxiety. It's a benzodiazepine, which means that if you use it on a regular basis and decide to stop, you should cut back gradually (just like with most antidepressants). I'm biased (since it works so well for me, after many failed trials on ADs), but recommend it highly. It may make you a bit sleepy etc. at first, but this should go away pretty fast. If you try it, at least you'll know quickly whether it's helpful. I find it excellent for anxiety.
Posted by mattdds on March 2, 2003, at 1:16:02
In reply to Re: KLONPIN users,help??, posted by viridis on March 2, 2003, at 0:30:13
Hi,
I haven't posted for a while, but cool things have been happening in my anxiety tx. I used to take Klonopin only as needed (2-3 times per week), but have recently decided to just go on it regularly, at 0.5 mg daily. I have been on this for about a month now.
I did lots of CBT type therapy, which relieved about 80% of my anxiety symptoms. But, there was always that residual low anxiety threshold that remained. I decided to quit teasing myself with the as needed business and just go on it indefinitely.
I can honestly say that the last month has been the best month that I can remember! All my anxiety is gone, and the depression and panic that used to accompany it left as well.
The most amazing thing is that it works, at least for me, in such miniscule doses, 0.5 mg daily! If I have to raise it if/when that time comes I will not hesitate to do so. Taking Klonopin for me has been as close to a magic bullet as I could possibly conceive. I have absolutely no side effects, no joke! Just zero anxiety. And yes, I too failed many different rounds of SSRI's; sometimes, I even failed the same one twice as the result of some poor treatment planning by my (ex)psychiatrist.
Another thing. My anxiety having been relieved for over a month now, I keep noticing my mood getting better and better. I was diagnosed with dysthymia before. I am enjoying things like I used to when I was a child, am more comfortable in social settings, and am remembering feelings I hadn't felt in years! (good ones!). Forget the stereotype that benzos dull you. Much to the contrary, for me, they are psychic and spiritual energizers!
YMMV with Klonopin, but I hope it works for you like it does for me, a veritible silver friggin' bullet! My reaction may not be typical, because I worked hard for years to overcome panic/generalized anxiety/ social anxiety / chronic depression with CBT with much success. Perhaps they have some type of synergistic effect?
Anyway, this is psycho babble, not psycho ramble, so I'll end by strongly recommending Klonopin (and definitely CBT, if you feel inclined).
Matt, whose only med is,
Klonopin 0.5 mg po qam
Life kicks ASS!
Posted by Mikey_C on March 2, 2003, at 3:09:08
In reply to KLONPIN users,help??, posted by male34 on March 1, 2003, at 22:34:37
I would also definitely recommend Clonazepam (Klonopin) for help with anxiety... I've been taking 1mg per night for the last 8 months and don't seem to be having any real problems with it...Though, come to mention it... that whole thing about not missing a few doses is starting to scare me.... Since I started on that Seroquel I haven't taken the Clonazepam because the Seroquel has been far too sedating for me already... hmmmm...
Posted by SBOATRN on March 2, 2003, at 8:14:40
In reply to Re: KLONPIN users,help?? » male34, posted by Mikey_C on March 2, 2003, at 3:09:08
Been on Klonopin at .125 mg (1/4 of a .5mg tab) at usually 2-3 times a day for about a year. Helps greatly with anxiety. No real side effects. The only thing I have noticed is some neck pain and some lack of drive and motivation. I'm on so low a dose I almost think I can't blame that on Klonopin. It's the only med I take. I could not tolerate SSRI's due to increased anxiety and other side effects. You have questioned your Lexapro many times. Contact your Dr. With the lack of drive, my doc and I did discuss "trying" something again, but concluded my side effect profile was so bad.... it may just complicate things !!! I think I finally realized some of that (lack of drive) was indeed up to me to change. We all look for a magic pill... they help, but there is life work to do, too !!! Good luck to you !!!!
Posted by Emme on March 2, 2003, at 9:52:31
In reply to KLONPIN users,help??, posted by male34 on March 1, 2003, at 22:34:37
Love it. Helps with anxiety, no side effects except sleepiness if I take more than I really need, can easily vary the dosage as needed. Though as the others said, I would stop altogether without some tapering.
Emme
Posted by exbenzouser on March 2, 2003, at 11:59:24
In reply to KLONPIN users,help??, posted by male34 on March 1, 2003, at 22:34:37
> i want to know can klonpin be used daily like ssri's and are there side effects?weight gain? and DOES IT WORK FOR ANXIETY?,truthfull helpfull answers please,my point is im not getting good anti-anxiety results from 10 mg 4 weeks now on LEXapro,ssri,THANKS
Like many others who have responded here, I also found klonopin to be great for anxiety without noticeable side effects. However it also became a trap for me as I built up tolerance to it. Then when I realized I needed to get myself off of it I suffered very unpleasant withdrawal symptoms for weeks. I now know that this is one of the hardest drugs to withdraw from. For more information check out: http://www.benzo.org.uk/ . Some people seem to take it for years without any problem but I personally can't recommend it based upon my own experience.
About SSRI's, I haven't had any success with them either. But the one drug I have done the best on and am now back on it again is Nardil. I actually tolerate it better than any other type of AD. And it is effective for anxiety as well as depression and increases motivation. In fact, according to info that my doc showed me, it is the most effective drug for anxiety next to a benzo and I believe it. I would highly recommend giving it a try before becoming addicted to klonopin, speaking as one who has been there.
Larry
Posted by Mikey_C on March 2, 2003, at 12:21:53
In reply to A word of caution, posted by exbenzouser on March 2, 2003, at 11:59:24
I would have to say that after using Clonazepam every night for the last 8 months, and just about every night before that for two years with taking a break before getting back onto it for the last 8 months, I never really felt a need to increase my dosage. My PDoc has told me that I could go up as high as 2mg per night IF I needed it.. so far I've been more than happy with 1mg per night, and on my absolutely worst days, 1.5mg per night.When I decided to quit taking Clonazepam for those 6 months... just to see how hard it was actually to stop using it, I found that it was as easy as cake. I actually just stopped using it cold turkey during that time. Sure, there are some withdrawal side effects from it, but NOTHING compared to Paxil, Effexor, Zoloft, or Celexa. The only real problem that I noticed was after about 3 weeks of being completely off of it, my panic attacks started up again and I was starting to suffer from some severe insomnia again. But those two symptoms are the reason why I started taking Clonazepam in the first place.
So maybe Clonazepam does provide you with some severe withdrawal side effects and a need to constantly increase your dosage after a very long time on the drug... but with having used the drug for about 2 years and 8 months just about every night, and going through the withdrawal cold turkey at one point, I never really found it that much of a problem.
Posted by utopizen on March 2, 2003, at 12:59:09
In reply to A word of caution, posted by exbenzouser on March 2, 2003, at 11:59:24
Klonopin isn't the hardest drug to withdraw from. Benzo.co.uk is not an objective source.
It's just so happened that Klonopin is more popular to prescribe these days (because it's milder to come off from), people are going off it more because more are on it, and in the numbers game this means people whine more about withdrawl from it. But it's not as if someone is in the position to compare it to other benzos if that's the only one they've taken in their lifetime, which for most is the case...
And you can go up to 6mg before tolerance is something to be enough to think about coming off it for, it's just that people get sensitive over this too much.
Posted by Emme on March 2, 2003, at 13:04:50
In reply to Re: KLONPIN users,help?? » male34, posted by Emme on March 2, 2003, at 9:52:31
Oooops, I meant I would NOT stop altogether without some tapering. Shessh, it seems like my fingers are disconnected from my brain lately.
Emme> Love it. Helps with anxiety, no side effects except sleepiness if I take more than I really need, can easily vary the dosage as needed. Though as the others said, I would stop altogether without some tapering.
>
> Emme
Posted by KrissyP on March 2, 2003, at 13:13:32
In reply to Re: KLONPIN users,help??, posted by mattdds on March 2, 2003, at 1:16:02
WOW! I am extremely happy for you! That is awesome! Is CBT Cognitive Behavioral Therapy? Or am I missing it? *laugh*Please share:)
Thank you, Kristen:)
> Hi,
>
> I haven't posted for a while, but cool things have been happening in my anxiety tx. I used to take Klonopin only as needed (2-3 times per week), but have recently decided to just go on it regularly, at 0.5 mg daily. I have been on this for about a month now.
>
> I did lots of CBT type therapy, which relieved about 80% of my anxiety symptoms. But, there was always that residual low anxiety threshold that remained. I decided to quit teasing myself with the as needed business and just go on it indefinitely.
>
> I can honestly say that the last month has been the best month that I can remember! All my anxiety is gone, and the depression and panic that used to accompany it left as well.
>
> The most amazing thing is that it works, at least for me, in such miniscule doses, 0.5 mg daily! If I have to raise it if/when that time comes I will not hesitate to do so. Taking Klonopin for me has been as close to a magic bullet as I could possibly conceive. I have absolutely no side effects, no joke! Just zero anxiety. And yes, I too failed many different rounds of SSRI's; sometimes, I even failed the same one twice as the result of some poor treatment planning by my (ex)psychiatrist.
>
> Another thing. My anxiety having been relieved for over a month now, I keep noticing my mood getting better and better. I was diagnosed with dysthymia before. I am enjoying things like I used to when I was a child, am more comfortable in social settings, and am remembering feelings I hadn't felt in years! (good ones!). Forget the stereotype that benzos dull you. Much to the contrary, for me, they are psychic and spiritual energizers!
>
> YMMV with Klonopin, but I hope it works for you like it does for me, a veritible silver friggin' bullet! My reaction may not be typical, because I worked hard for years to overcome panic/generalized anxiety/ social anxiety / chronic depression with CBT with much success. Perhaps they have some type of synergistic effect?
>
> Anyway, this is psycho babble, not psycho ramble, so I'll end by strongly recommending Klonopin (and definitely CBT, if you feel inclined).
>
> Matt, whose only med is,
> Klonopin 0.5 mg po qam
> Life kicks ASS!
Posted by KrissyP on March 2, 2003, at 13:49:43
In reply to Re: KLONPIN users,help?? » male34, posted by Mikey_C on March 2, 2003, at 3:09:08
OK-I need to make a point. When I saw my psychiatrist Friday, she re-iterated AGAIN that benzos are very addicting. She says to me " you might as well be addicted to street drugs-heroin"- I was like okaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyy Geez-Klonopin is great-it works for me and I only take 2mg- so I compromised and will follow her advice of cutting to 1 1/2mg for a week, and then 1mg for a week an stay on only 1mg a week. My opinion--------I agree, and I don't want to be hooked on this med to a point where I start building tolerance-I have seen that happen in a sibling. If the Seroquel prevents you from having to take Klonopin and possibly getting hooked, building up tolerance, etc. -GO FOR IT. Just my opinion Good luck:)
Kristen
I would also definitely recommend Clonazepam (Klonopin) for help with anxiety... I've been taking 1mg per night for the last 8 months and don't seem to be having any real problems with it...
Though, come to mention it... that whole thing about not missing a few doses is starting to scare me.... Since I started on that Seroquel I haven't taken the Clonazepam because the Seroquel has been far too sedating for me already... hmmmm...
Posted by jonh kimble on March 2, 2003, at 14:12:58
In reply to Re: KLONPIN users,help?? » Mikey_C, posted by KrissyP on March 2, 2003, at 13:49:43
how about this? what if klono is the only thing that helps, and as soon as you go off all the dehabilitating anxiety returns and you simply cant function? can I stay on a dose like 3mgs a day for life? thanks
Posted by Guy on March 2, 2003, at 14:47:42
In reply to KLONPIN users,help??, posted by male34 on March 1, 2003, at 22:34:37
Not sure if clonazepam will remain effective for life. I've heard conflicting reports. I do know Seroquel has potential for very serious side-effects, unlike clonazepam which is extremely safe from a physical point of view. My shrink says I can stay on con for the rest of my life, but who knows...the choices we have to make. It just adds to all the stress in my opinion.
Posted by KrissyP on March 2, 2003, at 17:42:05
In reply to Re: KLONPIN daily for life?, posted by jonh kimble on March 2, 2003, at 14:12:58
If Klonopin is the ONLY thing that help you, then by all means, stick with it. The issue of TOLERANCE comes up again here: I don't know how old you are, BUT if you stayed on 3mg for minimum of 10 years- I am almost positive your body would definately build up tolerance to it-causing you to have to up the dose-I would ask your doc on this and let ME know:)I'm curious.
Kristen
how about this? what if klono is the only thing that helps, and as soon as you go off all the dehabilitating anxiety returns and you simply cant function? can I stay on a dose like 3mgs a day for life? thanks
Posted by KrissyP on March 2, 2003, at 17:47:01
In reply to Re: KLONPIN users,help??, posted by Guy on March 2, 2003, at 14:47:42
Male 34-hiya,
May I ask what side effects of Seroquel you are talking about here? I'm on it! yikes I agree, regarding Klonopin, the only serious side-effect, if that's what we could call it---is ADDICTION. Oh yeah-the choices we have to make huh?........It adds to my stress too. Please try to get back to me
Take it easy:)
Kristen-------------------------------------------------
Not sure if clonazepam will remain effective for life. I've heard conflicting reports. I do know Seroquel has potential for very serious side-effects, unlike clonazepam which is extremely safe from a physical point of view. My shrink says I can stay on con for the rest of my life, but who knows...the choices we have to make. It just adds to all the stress in my opinion.
Posted by jonh kimble on March 2, 2003, at 18:24:55
In reply to Re: KLONPIN daily for life? » jonh kimble, posted by KrissyP on March 2, 2003, at 17:42:05
well im 19. so i guess that presents a problem. but in ten years, who knows, maybe theyll find a non tolerance building anti anxiety med. (that works for me)
Posted by utopizen on March 2, 2003, at 18:42:48
In reply to Re: KLONPIN daily for life?, posted by jonh kimble on March 2, 2003, at 18:24:55
> well im 19. so i guess that presents a problem. but in ten years, who knows, maybe theyll find a non tolerance building anti anxiety med. (that works for me)
>
I'm 19, too. Do you really want to be anxious now? You won't even have to worry about thinking about worrying about going off Klonopin until you're at least 40, and by then nothing matters because you're fat and old anyway.
So go on the K-Pax like I am about to in 2 days and get your life back. It's more important right now than worrying about something you shouldn't be thinking of at this stage.
Besides, you could be on it for 20 years with no tolerance at all, that depends on the person.
Posted by mattdds on March 2, 2003, at 18:45:23
In reply to Re: KLONPIN daily for life? » jonh kimble, posted by KrissyP on March 2, 2003, at 17:42:05
Guys,
People routinely take benzos for decades, without loss of its ANTIANXIETY effect. This is an important distinction to make, as there are different effects of benzos (e.g. anxiolytic, anticonvulsant, and sedative). The tolerance you are all so freaked about is more to the sedative and anticonvulsant effects, and NOT so much to the antianxiety effects. Furthermore, the anxiolytic properties are what most of us are interested in, right? This is pretty well documented in the literature. I will look for some references, but did learn this in my pharmacology class in dental school.
Yes, if you take benzos for extended periods of time, you will likely become dependent on them. I don't understand why this is so disturbing. This doesn't mean they stop working, it just means you need to taper when you come off them. What is it that people don't get about this? If you come off of most psychoactive drugs (even the pristine and free of sin SSRI's and atypical neuroleptics that seem to be so en vogue these days) without a good slow taper, you are going to get withdrawals! This is true of Paxil, Celexa, Seroquel, and even with drugs that aren't psychoactive, like B-blockers and Coumadin. Why is this aspect, dependence requiring a SLOW taper, so magnified with only the benzos? Honestly, in my opinion, if you go off a benzo without a taper and experience withdrawals, you only have yourself to blame. These effects can be minimized or even eliminated with a good slow taper. Read about this in Goodman & Gilman's pharmacology, where they say that withdrawals from diazepam and clonazepam are virtually nonexistent in slow tapers (1-2 months, gradually).
In sum, I am not convinced that in the majority of people there is much tolerance to the antianxiety effects of benzos. This is obviously possible in some, but I think it's the exception, rather than the rule. There is, however substantial tolerance to their sedative and anticonvulsant effects, but in my opinion, benzos should not be taken for these purposes long-term, because there are drugs which are much better suited for these concerns (e.g. zolpidem for sleep, valproate et. al for seizures)
Finally, PLEASE explain why people have such a difficult time distinguishing between two simple words: ADDICTION and DEPENDENCE. These are two very different things. Addiction involves intense cravings and a compulsive need to take a substance, and antisocial behavior. Benzos do not do this, especially in people with diagnosed anxiety disorders. Please, why is this so difficult to use the appropriate language?Matt
Posted by viridis on March 2, 2003, at 19:12:31
In reply to Tolerance more to sedative and anticonvulsive , posted by mattdds on March 2, 2003, at 18:45:23
I'll just second Matt on pretty much all of his points. It's frustrating to hear the word "addiction" used so casually (and inappropriately) -- one person in this thread even had a doctor comparing Klonopin to heroin!
Here are some definitions, from the American Society of Addiction Medicine website:
The American Society of Addiction Medicine (ASAM), the American Academy of Pain Medicine (AAPM), and the American Pain Society (APS) recognize the following definitions and recommend their use:
Addiction: Addiction is a primary, chronic, neurobiological disease, with genetic, psychosocial, and environmental factors influencing its development and manifestations. It is characterized by behaviors that include one or more of the following: impaired control over drug use, compulsive use, continued use despite harm, and craving.
Physical Dependence: Physical dependence is a state of adaptation that often includes tolerance and is manifested by a drug class specific withdrawal syndrome that can be produced by abrupt cessation, rapid dose reduction, decreasing blood level of the drug, and/or administration of an antagonist.
Tolerance: Tolerance is a state of adaptation in which exposure to a drug induces changes that result in a diminution of one or more of the drug's effects over time.
What people are describing with Klonopin is almost always physical dependence. This is common with many drugs that are used for all kinds of conditions. In the list of "hardest-to-quit" meds recently released by the World Health Organization, SSRIs and Effexor figured prominently in the top 10 (benzos didn't), with Paxil at #1, as I recall. It's just that with meds that are still under patent, the preferred term for withdrawal is "discontinuation syndrome", and no one would suggest you were ever addicted.
When I started Klonopin about a year and a half ago, my psychiatrist told me that if I took it for an extended period of time I would have to slowly taper off it. Early on, I talked about quitting it, and he said fine, but chances are I'd go back to my previous, frequent high anxiety state. He considers this much worse for my mental and physical health than use of Klonopin, and I agree. I quickly developed complete tolerance to the sedative and dulling effects, but the same dose (1 mg/day) continues to have the same anxiolytic effect as in the beginning. Apparently, this pattern is pretty standard for people with anxiety disorders, and many take the same dose for years.
If I'm an addict, I sure don't feel like one.
Posted by SBOATRN on March 2, 2003, at 19:56:39
In reply to Re: KLONPIN daily for life?, posted by utopizen on March 2, 2003, at 18:42:48
> I'm 19, too. Do you really want to be anxious now? You won't even have to worry about thinking about worrying about going off Klonopin until you're at least 40, and by then nothing matters because you're fat and old anyway.
Well, I'm OVER 40 and I'm not fat. I don't think I'm old and I have things that still matter alot in my "old age". I realize your point, just wish you could have picked another way to make it !!
Posted by viridis on March 2, 2003, at 20:45:10
In reply to Nothing matters after forty ??? » utopizen, posted by SBOATRN on March 2, 2003, at 19:56:39
My feelings too (not yet 40 but getting close...and not fat yet either).
But hey, when you're 19, 40 does seem old. In the 60s, wasn't it the conventional wisdom that you can't trust anyone over 30?
Anyway, I'm really not too offended; it just reminds me how differently I thought about things when I was that age.
Posted by KrissyP on March 2, 2003, at 22:29:42
In reply to Tolerance more to sedative and anticonvulsive , posted by mattdds on March 2, 2003, at 18:45:23
BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT SOME IDIOTIC, UNPROFESSIONAL, DEAF PSYCHIATRISTS HAVE INSTILLED IN MY HEAD-
just my experience:-)
Kristen
> Guys,
>
> People routinely take benzos for decades, without loss of its ANTIANXIETY effect. This is an important distinction to make, as there are different effects of benzos (e.g. anxiolytic, anticonvulsant, and sedative). The tolerance you are all so freaked about is more to the sedative and anticonvulsant effects, and NOT so much to the antianxiety effects. Furthermore, the anxiolytic properties are what most of us are interested in, right? This is pretty well documented in the literature. I will look for some references, but did learn this in my pharmacology class in dental school.
>
> Yes, if you take benzos for extended periods of time, you will likely become dependent on them. I don't understand why this is so disturbing. This doesn't mean they stop working, it just means you need to taper when you come off them. What is it that people don't get about this? If you come off of most psychoactive drugs (even the pristine and free of sin SSRI's and atypical neuroleptics that seem to be so en vogue these days) without a good slow taper, you are going to get withdrawals! This is true of Paxil, Celexa, Seroquel, and even with drugs that aren't psychoactive, like B-blockers and Coumadin. Why is this aspect, dependence requiring a SLOW taper, so magnified with only the benzos? Honestly, in my opinion, if you go off a benzo without a taper and experience withdrawals, you only have yourself to blame. These effects can be minimized or even eliminated with a good slow taper. Read about this in Goodman & Gilman's pharmacology, where they say that withdrawals from diazepam and clonazepam are virtually nonexistent in slow tapers (1-2 months, gradually).
>
> In sum, I am not convinced that in the majority of people there is much tolerance to the antianxiety effects of benzos. This is obviously possible in some, but I think it's the exception, rather than the rule. There is, however substantial tolerance to their sedative and anticonvulsant effects, but in my opinion, benzos should not be taken for these purposes long-term, because there are drugs which are much better suited for these concerns (e.g. zolpidem for sleep, valproate et. al for seizures)
>
> Finally, PLEASE explain why people have such a difficult time distinguishing between two simple words: ADDICTION and DEPENDENCE. These are two very different things. Addiction involves intense cravings and a compulsive need to take a substance, and antisocial behavior. Benzos do not do this, especially in people with diagnosed anxiety disorders. Please, why is this so difficult to use the appropriate language?
>
> Matt
>
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