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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by daisyduke on December 29, 2002, at 22:14:11
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdraw COLD TURKEY, posted by bookgurl99 on December 29, 2002, at 22:08:57
> I'm not an md, but you could always measure out half the capsules and mix them into yogurt or orange juice; I've heard of people titrating off meds that way.
Thanks..I'll give it a try...Seems smart!!haha
Posted by daisyduke on December 29, 2002, at 22:17:30
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdraw COLD TURKEY, posted by daisyduke on December 29, 2002, at 22:14:11
> > I'm not an md, but you could always measure out half the capsules and mix them into yogurt or orange juice; I've heard of people titrating off meds that way.
>
> Thanks..I'll give it a try...Seems smart!!hahaDoes anyone know the lowest dose that is prescribed? i'm taking 75..so if i go down to half for a few days..would this be good enough to get off and feel ok? I just want the dizziness to go away..
THanks
Posted by askBob on December 29, 2002, at 22:45:07
In reply to Re: Effexor coming off of 5 years use. Help!, posted by bookgurl99 on December 27, 2002, at 23:51:20
> I wanted to point out that Effexor is not an SSRI, as Prozac is. Effexor is an SNRI (serotonin noripenephrine reuptake inhibitor). As such , the effects of each may be multiplied if they are taken together.
Wow -- thanks for waking me up, bookgirl! I think Sioux's advice is the safest, although lots of people (especially teens) quit cold turkey. If you don't have to work for a living, you can do it. I switched from Prozac (an SSRI) to St. John's Wort (herbal MOAI) and felt great for a year -- until I got overwhelmed with stress from my job and a family tragedy. Ended up in the hospital. That's why you are best off to get advice from a psychiatrist.
If you are broke, go to a hospital that has a psychiatric crisis center -- like someone said, they cannot turn you away for lack of funds. They may insist you stay there for observation while changing your meds, though, and you must ask about expenses and who pays BEFORE you sign any papers!!! And don't go alone. Bring a trusted (and level-headed) friend along who can verify you are not at risk, i.e., suicidal or homicidal.Titrating off meds by mixing half a capsule into OJ might work, but be sure to wash it down with lots of liquids -- otherwise you can burn the lining of your esophagus. If you look up the ingredients of these meds, most are acids, which are apparently safe once in your tummy.
Good luck, and God bless!
Posted by EGR on December 29, 2002, at 22:58:46
In reply to Re: mixing meds to switch to cheaper generic, posted by askBob on December 29, 2002, at 22:45:07
Effexor comes in 37.5 mgs... technically you could probably take 1/2 of those. When I was titrating down off Effexor, I had to take 2 weeks to go from 150 to none, simutaneously starting Wellbutrin. A pharmacist friend told me that going cold turkey could do nasty things to you. Like a) make you extremely dry-mouthed or drool excessively and b) give you diarrhea or the worst case of constipation imaginable. Then there's also the sweats and shakes. I would not go cold turkey. Check with your local hospital's social workers or your DHS office. There are funds available to help with prescription, especially in cases like this. Or follow the advice further up and check into a psyche ward... we don't need any of us nutting out and harming ourselves!
Posted by bookgurl99 on December 30, 2002, at 6:44:29
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdraw COLD TURKEY, posted by daisyduke on December 29, 2002, at 22:17:30
I don't recall if you had insurance problems or not. If you do have good insurance, it might be possible to ask your doctor for a liquid version of your antidepressant. (Sometimes they make them for kids.) That would make it easier to take smaller doses.
Posted by Lynnads on December 30, 2002, at 9:04:40
In reply to Re: Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by charlie mac on December 28, 2002, at 20:46:02
To your question, yes it is the Effexor that is causing your heart palpitations. Go see your doctor as soon as possible and perhaps they can put you on an alternative anti-depressant.
I too have been on Effexor for a short while and suddenly started getting heart palpitations. I have had past problems with my heart and found that once on Effexor it became more aggrivated. I do have an appt. with my doctor and plan to get off Effexor imediately. Although extremely happy with the outcome of Effexor, I believe heart palpitations are nothing to mess with.
Posted by blueheron on December 30, 2002, at 11:10:06
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdraw COLD TURKEY, posted by daisyduke on December 29, 2002, at 22:17:30
Back in August I was fed up with the sexual side of effexor xr (was on 150/day) and wanted to see what these much feared withdrawl symptoms were all about, so I went cold turkey... 150 -> 0 in one day... Lucky I had LOTS of experience with recreational psycoactives in my past, 'cause going cold turkey is a trip. Lots of brain zaps, visual distortions, muscle twitches... you name it, I felt it... The first two weeks were very interesting, incredible manic high accompanied by wild withdrawl, then the high subsided, but the withdrawl lasted about 7 weeks until there were no more symptoms. It wasn't THAT bad, if you have a 60's/70's drug culture background, but I can see how it would freak you out if you thought the withdrawl would never end.
By the way, the sex thing?, No More Frustration!, YAAAYYYYY!!!! I can attest that when you go off effexor, orgasms are fun again (and plentiful too!!!).
A footnote... I went back on effexor, to 150/day, once I knew I could kick it, I wanted and got the positive side back. But the orgasms became harder to achieve so my doc suggested wellbutrin. I am in the process of weaning off effexor, 150 -> 112.5 -> 75 -> 37.5 -> 0 and I have to say this is way better than cold turkeybottom line... cold turkey is like working for a relative, not recommended, but an experience
Posted by Dimbulb on December 31, 2002, at 14:01:03
In reply to Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by jp on October 24, 1999, at 14:59:14
grrrr.........I spent a half hour typing a post then had to register, then my post wasnt available anymore. My first post was a literary jewel and now I am so ^#%$& this one is going to suck...
my comment or question started with my doctor prescribing Effexor which I havent started yet but this is my fifth or sixth anti depressant and my question relates to:
Will any antidepressant help me if my depression is caused by real world things and not by the infamous inbalance in my brain as I am told? I wont bore you with my problems but let me just say my problems would depress just about anyone and they are not things that will go away. They stem from medical problems and not something imaginary. Does any of the above make any sense at all?
Also my worry about the going off my anti depressant for ten days before I start on Effexor revolves around the possibility that the current anti depressant is actually helping me without me realizing it. If this is true I am going to be a basket case when I am on nothing for a short period.
I have a call in to my pharmacist and my doctor to further discuss this but I will not go off of my current medication until I hear something from somebody. I would very much like to hear from someone here who may have had similar thoughts to mine. And if there is anyone out there who is having similar thoughts to mine......sorry....
Brad
Posted by Lynnads on December 31, 2002, at 14:48:50
In reply to Re: Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by Dimbulb on December 31, 2002, at 14:01:03
> grrrr.........I spent a half hour typing a post then had to register, then my post wasnt available anymore. My first post was a literary jewel and now I am so ^#%$& this one is going to suck...
>
> my comment or question started with my doctor prescribing Effexor which I havent started yet but this is my fifth or sixth anti depressant and my question relates to:
>
> Will any antidepressant help me if my depression is caused by real world things and not by the infamous inbalance in my brain as I am told? I wont bore you with my problems but let me just say my problems would depress just about anyone and they are not things that will go away. They stem from medical problems and not something imaginary. Does any of the above make any sense at all?
>
> Also my worry about the going off my anti depressant for ten days before I start on Effexor revolves around the possibility that the current anti depressant is actually helping me without me realizing it. If this is true I am going to be a basket case when I am on nothing for a short period.
>
> I have a call in to my pharmacist and my doctor to further discuss this but I will not go off of my current medication until I hear something from somebody. I would very much like to hear from someone here who may have had similar thoughts to mine. And if there is anyone out there who is having similar thoughts to mine......sorry....
>
> BradBrad,
If I were you, I wouldn't go off whatever meds you are on cold turkey. It could very possibly make you a basket case, not to mention other worse side effects. I am now on my fourth anti-depressant, and admitting that makes me feel like I shouldn't be throwing out any advice.When I started I had similar concerns to yours. I didn't understand how a pill could change my thought process. Since childhood, I hadn't known what it was like to be "happy". I too have had difficulties in my life ranging from family issues, medical problems, to worldly incidents.
Now on Effexor XR, life seems to be a bit more bearable. I still have what I'd like to explain as numbed thoughts lying on the back burner of my brain, but at least it isn't constantly prodding me.
But asside from all that rambling, I guess what I am trying to say is give the new meds (hopefully Effexor) a chance, but have your doctor taper off whatever it is you are currently taking.
Good Luck
Posted by Sioux on December 31, 2002, at 23:14:54
In reply to Re: Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by Dimbulb on December 31, 2002, at 14:01:03
>>> grrrr.........I spent a half hour typing a post then had to register, then my post wasnt available anymore. My first post was a literary jewel and now I am so ^#%$& this one is going to suck...
<<<This is a literay jewel. ; ) Unfortunately, I know exactly that frustration.
On to your other question. I, too, have a compicated and nasty medical situation (a cluster of autoimmune disease) which causes nasty and complicated financial situations. The neuromuscular consequences come and go - so I have to adjust/readjust - and also affect my speech and facial expression which, of course, affect my social transactions not to mention my sex life. In real life I was a biological scientist.
So. Just like fearful situations cause adrenaline to rush, so chronic stressors (depressing situations) can cause "depression" rushes - releases of chemicals which, over a period of time, seem to alter the brain chemistry. Depressing situations also require a lot more eneregy to deal with them. Sometimes antidepressants work in this situation.
Myself I found, however, that getting a handle on it all was the best antidepressant. By that I mean I recruited a whole *lot* of help from other people. One tracks my meds so they are ordered and arrive on time, another tracks the insurance billing, another examines every hospitalization and argues the billing, another lets folks know how I am, another writes 'thank you' notes, another raises funds for and tracks my various assistive devices.
All of this leaves me with enough energy to put up with it all: fall over, drop things, break bones, need need need need one damned thing after another.
Now. I'll bet you don't have that much help. So my list above should help you understand exactly how much energy you no longer have for yourself. It takes half a dozen people just to deal with some of the more obvious external consequences of some kinds of medical conditions.
That's depressing. So you get depressed.
In sum - use absolutely everything and everyone that you can to make yourself comfortable. Your first step is to identify what it takes - daydreaming's a good place to start, but the miraculous cure doesn't count. (sorry) Then do the same thing with what would positively pump you. The third step is to see how much of that you can actually do with what you have or can acquire.
Hope you find this helpful.
In the end I had to not use antidepressants because they all dulled my mind (which is about the only thing left that works). I worked even harder to find out how I could actually a have bunch of *fun* and, in the end, that's what worked for me. (believe it or not, it turned out to be going to movies in the afternoon; I didn't even know I liked movies!)
Posted by askBob on December 31, 2002, at 23:43:48
In reply to Re: Anyone had success on Effexor XR? » charlie mac, posted by Lynnads on December 30, 2002, at 9:04:40
Heart palpitations are nothing to mess with, but many people get them from stress or anxiety. I hear that many antidepressants have early "side-effects" which are actually caused by anxiety -- anxiety about taking the medication. If you are having trouble sleeping as well, try a mild anti-anxiety med at bedtime. After a week or so the palpitations should go away. Xanax is too addictive -- Klonapin worked for me (Clonazepam 0.5 mg). I can't take it during the day (as my doc prescribed) but I get edgy if I don't take it every night. It may lower your blood pressure, so discuss it with a good doctor.
> To your question, yes it is the Effexor that is causing your heart palpitations. Go see your doctor as soon as possible and perhaps they can put you on an alternative anti-depressant.
> I too have been on Effexor for a short while and suddenly started getting heart palpitations. I have had past problems with my heart and found that once on Effexor it became more aggrivated. I do have an appt. with my doctor and plan to get off Effexor imediately. Although extremely happy with the outcome of Effexor, I believe heart palpitations are nothing to mess with.
Posted by Dysfunk on January 1, 2003, at 12:23:02
In reply to Re: Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by Dimbulb on December 31, 2002, at 14:01:03
Brad:
I think I know what you are talking about. Definitely cognitive therapy is needed to change your perspective and adjust your reactions to things in the outside world- or at least understand them.Medication may help ease the symptoms you are experiencing. I say this only from my own experience with years of therapy and diff. medications.
As far as being off medication before you start a new one, I also have those fears. Some medications stay in your system after you have stopped taking them, so you could be "protected". I would do whatever I could, if I were you, to try and avoid the situations that cause your depression during that time. Maybe some xanax will help take your edge off and calm the fears you have.
Either way, good luck. Just try and wait it out with the hopes that the next medication will work better for you and the 10 days is the means to an end.
Been there,
Dysfunk
Posted by Katia on January 1, 2003, at 19:17:24
In reply to Re: weird symptom » Allen F., posted by LisaDiann on February 23, 2002, at 10:19:19
> I'm wondering if maybe the Prozac or effexor has harmed my body also. I don't see others with posts about tingling in the arms, fingers, legs.
> When I have the "brain zap" my heart and leg feels tingly at the same time...then it immediately goes away. I'm trying to stay off all medications now except my estrogen...hopefully these are all withdrawal symptoms !?Hi, I have that exact side effect from the Effexor. I've been on it since Sept. (three months) and it's now showing up. It's very frightening when it happens and I've asked the pharamacist and pDr., but no one knows of this. Are you still experiencing this?
Or ANYONE else for that matter. Is it dangerous? It feels at times like I might have a heart attack. The "shocks" happen if I move too quickly or turn my head too fast.
Thanks.
Katia
Posted by bookgurl99 on January 1, 2003, at 22:35:12
In reply to nerve zapping, posted by Katia on January 1, 2003, at 19:17:24
I had these zaps after withdrawing from Serzone. They went away after a few months, but they were really frightening at the time.
Posted by IsoM on January 1, 2003, at 23:16:04
In reply to nerve zapping, posted by Katia on January 1, 2003, at 19:17:24
Too bad more doctors & pharmacists aren't familiar with these symptoms. The good ones who keep up to date & continue to read new developments are aware. I had these symptoms, like bookgurl, when I discontinued two SSRIs, Paxil & Luvox - even with tapering off slowly over a period of months. Even for a year afterwards, I had the sensations but much less. One very reputable pharmacist who I talked with said that there had even been mild EEG changes noted with these 'zaps'.
So I guess some people experience it with starting SSRIs & some with discontinuing them. It's not that rare. But yes, eventually they do fade away, hopefully quicker than some.
Posted by daizy on January 2, 2003, at 8:59:41
In reply to nerve zapping, posted by Katia on January 1, 2003, at 19:17:24
Also experiencing these, every time I move my eyes from side to side I get zaps/shocks down my arms and chest, been off effexor for 2 weeks now, wondering when it will stop. Its rather worrying, and painfull too!!!!!!!
Posted by Kam on January 2, 2003, at 23:27:01
In reply to Re: Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by charlie mac on December 28, 2002, at 20:46:02
Unfortunatly effexor XR did nothing for me, Paxil was the most effective but as most of them had sexual side effects. I still have the desire but "the ending effect" was not there. But what I am experiencing is that, that is typical of that type of med. Best of luck to you to find that miracle drug, the one that makes you feel "NORMAL", I am still working on it!!
Posted by mxgirl13 on January 3, 2003, at 12:45:20
In reply to Re: Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by Kam on January 2, 2003, at 23:27:01
I'm happy, and sad, to say that I did stick to cold turkey off of Effexor XR. Happy because only day 2 and 3 were complete hell, and sad because I know it's NOT the way to go for a million reasons.
Memory issues are significant, but getting better, so I don't remember how many days it's been since my last med. I think it was around the 21st or so of December.
The worst symptoms were: dizzy/shocks, sweats day and night, fatigue, my head hurt to touch it or to wear anything on it (these equate to the intense "blender headaches" that I'd read about), and I "nutted out" a couple times when I got really stressed out (my sister who also has depression and anxiety, was there to talk me down from this).
Mild symptoms were: nausia, shakes, tingling in my arms and hands, intestinal upset and auditory hallucinations.
I was a basket case for most of December. The last few days I've been very pleased that my brain is making a comeback! I can remember things, and even can do things I want to and I don't screw them up! So I know I'm on the upside.
I'm jobless for the time being, and my son was on vacation with other family, so I had a nice quiet home to sit in while this worked out. I could NEVER have done it otherwise!
Effexor XR was the only med that helped me and didn't make me intensly sick. A couple years into it, and after enough behavioral modification do deal with stuff, I came to have a great relationship with Effexor XR because I knew I wouldn't have a life without it. So I moved on with life and continued to educate myself and modify my behavior utilizing Effexor XR, until I had to make this untimely stop. I know I can make it without Effexor because of all the behavior modifications I learned and what I learned to do during ups and downs naturally without meds. It just became a matter of how to get off it. I thought, no time like the present.
If I need it, I will take Effexor again. Not even this cold turkey withdraw was enough to scare me away from the benefits it gave me all these years.
I really enjoyed the post by Daisyduke comparing drugs of the 60's and 70's to withdraw. That was really funny. I'm only 31, and I didn't do drugs, so I can't relate on that level, but I totally understand the point. The statement made "Cold turkey is like working for a relative, not recommended, but an experience." is SO fitting I laughed out loud.
I watched my sister switch meds like candy for a couple years while my Effexor was doing just fine. She got so mixed up that she couldn't tell one from the other. I'm sorry to say she quit trying meds, and she doesn't believe therapy will help her (that she can do it all alone just fine). It took me at least 2 years to find Effexor XR. Yeah, it sucked. But I just kept reminding myself that I knew it would be an extremely lengthy process to find the one that worked best for me, and that it would be worth it. It was. Fortunately, those 2 years are but a blur in my memory. Knowing what I do now, if I were to start a search over, I would definitely taper off the one until it is GUARANTEED gone from my system and then ever so slowly start a new one. I would keep a journal of every symptom every day no matter what. Switching meds gets the symptoms all mixed up and soon that's so complicating you won't be able to know if anything's working because you're too pissed off at the symptoms.
I did find one place on line that had tingling sensations included in the list of sypmtoms. I don't think (although I am NOT a doctor) that they are harmful (like permanently physically change your body unless they are extreme in your case). I think they're just another lovely side effect that should go away with dosage changes or time. I think the dizzyness, brain zaps and shooting through the body sensations are all related and based on who you are, you feel a different percentage of each part of that chain.
I HAVEN'T READ THIS ANYWHERE YET, SO I'LL SAY IT NOW: FOR HEAVEN SAKE STAY OFF THE ROAD! Don't get out there and try to drive while experiencing any head related symptoms. I want you to live.
If you guys can locate what I think was my last post, I wrote it I think on day 3. I'm sure you could see how I was feeling from what I wrote. Obviously today my brain is reattached from that. Thank you, God.
Posted by mxgirl13 on January 3, 2003, at 12:58:46
In reply to Re: Effexor coming off of 5 years use. Help! » mxgirl13, posted by bookgurl99 on December 27, 2002, at 23:39:59
These are two awesome bits of information that I have not come across!
Even though I ended up cold turkey and didn't need to split the capsule, I had ulcers before and have a sensitive tummy. The nausia was bad sometimes right before bed and I bet that tossing acidic meds down to it would have been a disaster!
I forgot to add to my last post Success and Symptoms, that I had a few days (around days 2-5 of cold turkey) of INTENSE carb cravings. I tried to eat a cucumber once instead and about hurled. I didn't know that carbs help make seratonin. I did eat, and eat...and eat. I put on about 6 pounds. But now the dizzyness is getting better so I can go back to yoga and lose it again pretty quickly.
THANK YOU for this information you two that wrote in!!!
Posted by mxgirl13 on January 3, 2003, at 13:06:55
In reply to Splitting Effexor XR capsules and Carb Cravings, posted by mxgirl13 on January 3, 2003, at 12:58:46
Oops, sorry, I forgot to check to notify me of follow-ups.
> These are two awesome bits of information that I have not come across!
>
> Even though I ended up cold turkey and didn't need to split the capsule, I had ulcers before and have a sensitive tummy. The nausia was bad sometimes right before bed and I bet that tossing acidic meds down to it would have been a disaster!
>
> I forgot to add to my last post Success and Symptoms, that I had a few days (around days 2-5 of cold turkey) of INTENSE carb cravings. I tried to eat a cucumber once instead and about hurled. I didn't know that carbs help make seratonin. I did eat, and eat...and eat. I put on about 6 pounds. But now the dizzyness is getting better so I can go back to yoga and lose it again pretty quickly.
>
> THANK YOU for this information you two that wrote in!!!
Posted by Dysfunk on January 3, 2003, at 14:26:29
In reply to nerve zapping, posted by Katia on January 1, 2003, at 19:17:24
-Has anyone experienced an achey back on Effexor?
-What about pains in stomach, but not a stomach ache per se, more like soreness?
-Shakes in the hands?
I am trying to see if what I am experiencing is from the meds or somethng else.
Posted by Stamper on January 3, 2003, at 18:03:39
In reply to Re: nerve zapping or OTHER SYMPTOMS?, posted by Dysfunk on January 3, 2003, at 14:26:29
I had shakey hands from essential tremor before taking Effexor XR, however, since I have been on this med the shaking is definitely a lot worse. Also, I have muscle twitches and jerks that started when I was first on AD beginning with Celexa. My pdoc said that it is rare that this occurs. The twitching is somewhat better. But still have it, though much milder. It doesn't throw me out of bed like it did at first.
> -Has anyone experienced an achey back on Effexor?
>
> -What about pains in stomach, but not a stomach ache per se, more like soreness?
>
> -Shakes in the hands?
>
> I am trying to see if what I am experiencing is from the meds or somethng else.
Posted by M .Lee on January 3, 2003, at 21:53:36
In reply to DON'T go Cold Turkey!!, posted by EGR on December 29, 2002, at 22:58:46
This is my first time posting here. I wish that I had seen this advice back when I needed it.
I was in a similar situation about a year ago - I lost my insurance while taking Effexor and it seemed like there was no alternative except to go off it cold. I had been taking it for several years.
The first few weeks were severe. My head was spinning so bad that I had trouble standing at times. Then, just as I was starting to get through that, my depression turned much worse than it had ever been before. It "rebounded" with a vengeance. I was a wreck for months.
A family member intervened and brought me to the hospital ER. Within a couple of days they got me into a free clinic and back on medication (even though I was unemployed and had no insurance.) If only I had known then... that there were alternatives.
I agree with EGR, and can't stress this enough: "DON'T go cold turkey!!"
I found out (the hard way) that it is possible to stay on medication, even if you can't afford the prescription.
To anyone who is considering cold turkey, please explore all options first. Just walk into the ER and explain the situation that you are in. They should be able to refer you to someplace where you can get treatment without having to go through what I went through.
> I would not go cold turkey. Check with your local hospital's social workers or your DHS office.There are funds available to help with prescription, especially in cases like this. Or follow the advice further up and check into a psyche ward... we don't need any of us nutting out and harming ourselves!
Posted by Caleb462 on January 5, 2003, at 1:36:35
In reply to any sexual side effects?, posted by Elaine on January 11, 2001, at 15:27:35
> This is kind of embarrassing....... But has anyone had any POSITIVE sexual side effects with Effexor XR????
>Yes actually. It delays ejaculation, but not drastically. For me, this is a benefit.
Also, orgasms seem to last longer/be more intense.
This is also something I experienced on low dose Zoloft. My assumption is that it has to do with the delay - the orgasm "builds". Just a guess.Sex drive seems to be about the same.
I must note that I'm also taking 0.25 mg Risperdal at night, and since 5-HT2a antagonists can block the sexual side effects of serotonergic anti-depressants, that may be why I'm not experiencing any strong side effects sexually.
Posted by lynnads on January 5, 2003, at 1:48:58
In reply to Re: any sexual side effects?, posted by Caleb462 on January 5, 2003, at 1:36:35
I believe it depends on the person.
I went on Effexor because a friend raved to me about how Effexor didn't affect her sex life like other anti-depressants. In my experience with it, it is comparable to the side effects of other anti-depressants (Prozac, Celexa, etc), VERY FRUSTRATING. If you are concerned about sexual dysfunction, look into Wellbutrin. There are supposed to be 0 sexual side effects with that.
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