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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by colin wallace on October 10, 2002, at 10:53:51
I wondered whether anyone here is taking lamictal and neurontin concurrently, and what the results are.
I'm considering adding a small dose of neurontin to counteract the irritability I feel when I(eventually) up my lamictal dose.As there is definitely an anger component to my depression, I need to be on my guard against it.
I tried depakote recently on its own, but didn't like it at all.The dose may have been too high, so I could always experiment with a 'sliver'- but I don't really like the idea of this combo. due to its bad press.
Any thoughts or experiences with neurontin welcome.
Posted by fiddlepuppy on October 10, 2002, at 12:06:25
In reply to Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by colin wallace on October 10, 2002, at 10:53:51
Colin
I recently got off Neurontin because I was irritable all the time and had bouts of rage. Also the Neurontin mad me feel "stupid" and I gained 30 lbs on it.
I hope your experience with it is a more positive one. A lot of people take it and absolutely love it.
Posted by catmint on October 10, 2002, at 14:18:13
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by fiddlepuppy on October 10, 2002, at 12:06:25
I have to say Colin, that I would be careful with Neurontin. It seems to help at first with irritability/anxiety but after a few months I became increasingly anxious and unable to concentrate.
While some may be helped by Nuerontin, it is known to cause anxiety in some patients. Because I am prone to mixed-state episodes, irritability, and agitated depression, It did not benefit me for some reason.
I'm wondering what would help to counteract Lamictal irritality? I am a bit wary to say, but possibly Zyprexa? This a-typical antipychotic helped me immensly during a severe agitated depression where I was literally pulling my hair out. IT acts like a mild tranquilizer. The reason I am wary is because it is very strong and you wake up the next morning very groggy and out of it.Also weight gain is an absolute, BUT, one pdoc I saw told me to take it as needed and I'm thinking that that might help with some of the irritability you experience. Have you ever taken it? Even the smallest amount can work.
Of course you could just do a whole bunch of pushups. That has occasionlally helped me when I'm really angry!
Amy
Posted by Peter S. on October 11, 2002, at 20:58:45
In reply to Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by colin wallace on October 10, 2002, at 10:53:51
Hi Colin
I take 600mg Lamictal with 600mg of Neurontin and 10mg Prozac. I find the combination activating and it has pretty much completely alleviated my depression. This is the first combination that has worked. It's really great! I have not experienced any irritability.
> I wondered whether anyone here is taking lamictal and neurontin concurrently, and what the results are.
> I'm considering adding a small dose of neurontin to counteract the irritability I feel when I(eventually) up my lamictal dose.As there is definitely an anger component to my depression, I need to be on my guard against it.
> I tried depakote recently on its own, but didn't like it at all.The dose may have been too high, so I could always experiment with a 'sliver'- but I don't really like the idea of this combo. due to its bad press.
> Any thoughts or experiences with neurontin welcome.
Posted by GabbiX2 on October 11, 2002, at 21:13:49
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by Peter S. on October 11, 2002, at 20:58:45
Glad to hear you're doing well, Peter S.
Posted by colin wallace on October 13, 2002, at 12:42:08
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by Peter S. on October 11, 2002, at 20:58:45
Pete,
I like the sound of your combo., although your dose range would send me through the roof.
Are you bipolar11, atypical , anxious-agitated ? Did you take the Lamictal first, and then find it's AD properties slightly lacking, hence the prozac?- or did it cause you some anger/irritability which necessitated a Neurontin add-on?
I feel actually feel good on 25mg Lamictal, but I know I'm prone to anger/mixed states when stressed, so I may experiment with a small Neurontin add-on in advance! Either that, or remain permanently on my low dose benzo.Have to weigh up the pros and cons.Cheers,
Col.
> I take 600mg Lamictal with 600mg of Neurontin and 10mg Prozac. I find the combination activating and it has pretty much completely alleviated my depression. This is the first combination that has worked. It's really great! I have not experienced any irritability.
>
>
>
Posted by BarbaraCat on October 13, 2002, at 15:25:42
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by catmint on October 10, 2002, at 14:18:13
I started Lamictal 2 weeks ago and so far, it's been the best thing to come along since i can remember. I'm also on Lithium 600mg and 11.5mg Remeron as well as 1200mg Neurontin. I'm doing so well on this combo that I hate to start messing around to see if I can maybe do without one or the other. I have a feeling that their actions are synergistic. One other major bonus is that since starting lamictal I haven't had the grinding pains of fibromyalgia. A miracle! - BarbaraCat
Posted by kaweah on October 14, 2002, at 11:55:41
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by BarbaraCat on October 13, 2002, at 15:25:42
I like the way that Lamictal works but it seems to have this irritability component to it that I really don't like. I've been titrating very slowly; I started at 12mg for almost 3 weeks, then started moving up to 18mg for 6 days with only minor increase in irritability, then after 3 days at 25 mg, my irritability and difficulty going to sleep increased considerably. I'm also taking 600mg of lithium to balance me out.
Any ideas on how to deal with this irritability?
Colin, what was your titration plan?
This is a very good med but unfortunately like all meds it's got side affects!John
Posted by Peter S. on October 14, 2002, at 12:11:39
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by colin wallace on October 13, 2002, at 12:42:08
You know Colin, I really wish I could tell you what "I am". My depression seems to be of the atypical variety, but recently I've been thinking that I tend toward bipolar II or III because I have had hypomanic episodes in response to anti-depressants.For the last couple of weeks I've been feeling great on the Lamictal/Neurontin and Prozac and then a couple of days ago I was hit with a precipitous drop. I started feeling the same Prozac induced fatigue that I've felt before. I continue to be baffled about finding a combination that works consistantly (more than a couple of weeks). I guess this is the major challenge of my life. I'm a laboratory experiment and I'm the chemist (sigh). I would be fascinated by the whole thing if it didn't have such a huge effect on my life!
I honestly don't know what to do next. I've dropped the Prozac and may start using it on an irregular basis. One phenomenon on Prozac (and other SSRIs is that when I stop taking them I notice a "rebound" effect- my mood is great for a couple of days. Anybody notice this?
> Pete,
>
> I like the sound of your combo., although your dose range would send me through the roof.
> Are you bipolar11, atypical , anxious-agitated ? Did you take the Lamictal first, and then find it's AD properties slightly lacking, hence the prozac?- or did it cause you some anger/irritability which necessitated a Neurontin add-on?
> I feel actually feel good on 25mg Lamictal, but I know I'm prone to anger/mixed states when stressed, so I may experiment with a small Neurontin add-on in advance! Either that, or remain permanently on my low dose benzo.Have to weigh up the pros and cons.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Col.
>
> > I take 600mg Lamictal with 600mg of Neurontin and 10mg Prozac. I find the combination activating and it has pretty much completely alleviated my depression. This is the first combination that has worked. It's really great! I have not experienced any irritability.
> >
> >
> >
Posted by colin wallace on October 14, 2002, at 14:13:26
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by kaweah on October 14, 2002, at 11:55:41
John,
My titration plan was similar to yours-I started cautiously with 4mg or so for a week, then doubled that for a week, then 12.5 by week 3.
I reached 25mg at week 6, and experienced some anger/irritability, so the nexy day I would drop back to around 18.5, and then back up to 25mg again, keeping this up on alternate days for over a week.
I'm now comfortably at 25mg (no irritability) and plan to increase by 6mg in the same fashion as above.
Posted by Hattree on October 14, 2002, at 20:55:18
In reply to Lamictal fade out (bummer), posted by Peter S. on October 14, 2002, at 12:11:39
YES! I have noticed this, and I've never heard anyone mention it before. Go figure.
> One phenomenon on Prozac (and other SSRIs is that when I stop taking them I notice a "rebound" effect- my mood is great for a couple of days. Anybody notice this?
>
Posted by petters on October 15, 2002, at 0:45:46
In reply to Lamictal fade out (bummer), posted by Peter S. on October 14, 2002, at 12:11:39
Hi.....
I realy recommend Effexor, before Prosac. Effexor dosen´t have the same poop out syndrom that ssri seems to have.
Effexor is also also a very good option, in bipolar II or BP III.
Try it.....//// petter
Posted by BarbaraCat on October 15, 2002, at 23:08:09
In reply to Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by colin wallace on October 10, 2002, at 10:53:51
I was doing great on 25mg of Lamictal and then titrated up to my present 50mg. Yuck, irritability, anxiety, fear and body tension. I will drop back down slowly. Thank God for this forum and the knowledge we share. - BarbaraCat
Posted by colin wallace on October 16, 2002, at 10:17:04
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability » colin wallace, posted by BarbaraCat on October 15, 2002, at 23:08:09
> I was doing great on 25mg of Lamictal and then titrated up to my present 50mg. Yuck, irritability, anxiety, fear and body tension. I will drop back down slowly. Thank God for this forum and the knowledge we share. - BarbaraCat
Hi Barbara,
Tricky business trying to find the right 'window'
for this med ain't it?!
I find a benzo. (diazepam) very helpful when I increase the lamictal dose, then I reduce it (benzo) when things settle down.
I suffer with chronic muscle pain/body ache too (not fibromyalgia, just depression related) and plan to add some neurontin when I hit 50mg Lamictal.May help my anxiety too.Keep well,
Col.
Posted by Peter S. on October 16, 2002, at 17:37:51
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability » BarbaraCat, posted by colin wallace on October 16, 2002, at 10:17:04
It's interesting- I take 600mg of Lamictal in the a.m. and it just really gets me going. Not speedy but just energetic and focused. No anxiety at all.
Proves again the huge difference in chemistry between people.
Posted by BarbaraCat on October 21, 2002, at 20:02:36
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability » BarbaraCat, posted by colin wallace on October 16, 2002, at 10:17:04
Hi Colin,
I've learned my lesson about taking my benzos. They seem to be critical to my mental health. I'm now taking lorezapam 3 times a day and the lamictal is working like a charm. Otherwise, the anxiety and dread engulf everything and don't let anything else get through. I'll attempt to stay at this 37.5mg dose because it's just plain working (at least today). One other thing I've been working with is my breathing. Been finding out alot about hyperventilation syndrome, or disrupted over-breathing pattern, and how it knocks the pH balance out of whack. Contributes to every symptom I have, including muscle pain. Theresa Hale has written a book aimed for asthmatics called The 5 Day Breathing Cure, or something like that. Some of it seems a little extreme, but the science behind deficient CO2 hence inefficient Oxygen sound very intriguing. You might want to do a web search on hyperventilation+depression or +anxiety, or what have you, since I know you also have somatic pain and this might be a key. Barbara> > I was doing great on 25mg of Lamictal and then titrated up to my present 50mg. Yuck, irritability, anxiety, fear and body tension. I will drop back down slowly. Thank God for this forum and the knowledge we share. - BarbaraCat
>
> Hi Barbara,
>
> Tricky business trying to find the right 'window'
> for this med ain't it?!
> I find a benzo. (diazepam) very helpful when I increase the lamictal dose, then I reduce it (benzo) when things settle down.
> I suffer with chronic muscle pain/body ache too (not fibromyalgia, just depression related) and plan to add some neurontin when I hit 50mg Lamictal.May help my anxiety too.
>
> Keep well,
>
> Col.
Posted by McPac on October 21, 2002, at 22:12:53
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability » colin wallace, posted by BarbaraCat on October 21, 2002, at 20:02:36
BarbCat, which benzo do you take?
Klonopin, by any chance?
If so, are there any really negative side effects with Klonopin?
Posted by BarbaraCat on October 22, 2002, at 1:18:59
In reply to Re: Countering Lamictal Irritability, posted by McPac on October 21, 2002, at 22:12:53
I'm taking lorezapam (generic Ativan) right now, but was taking clorezapam (generic klonopin) before that. I wanted something different from the klon because I didn't feel it was mellowing me out enough and still had bad anxiety. Lorezapam isn't that much different and doesn't last as long as the klon. I've heard that the brand Klonopin is better than the generic clonezapam, but my HMO will only cover the generic. Otherwise, I'd probably switch back to Klonopin. I dunno. None of them are perfect but better than nothing. As far as really negative side effects, no, none that I can think of. Some people say it can cause depression but in my case anxiety causes depression more than any anti-anxiety med could ever do. If anxiety is a big cofactor in your mood disorder, definitely take something soothing along with your AD, in my opinion.
> BarbCat, which benzo do you take?
> Klonopin, by any chance?
> If so, are there any really negative side effects with Klonopin?
This is the end of the thread.
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