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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 6 of 6. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by JonW on June 15, 2002, at 15:11:28
Hi all,
I'm on Nardil and when I take ambien to try to get a good night sleep it only serves to put me to sleep. I mean, I'll wake up 2 or 3 hours later which is not a good night's sleep for me. Has anyone here had this same problem and had better results with Sonata?
Thanks,
Jon
Posted by beardedlady on June 15, 2002, at 17:02:23
In reply to Ambien vs. Sonata?, posted by JonW on June 15, 2002, at 15:11:28
Sonata is a short-acting drug, so you are less likely to get good results from that. Ambien is the six- to eight-hour version of Sonata, which lasts about four on the dot. I use Sonata for waking up too early, like if I'm up from 1 a.m. to 2 a.m. and it doesn't seem likely I'll fall back to sleep. I usually awaken exactly 3.5 or 4 hours later, but sometimes, like this morning, I'm able to fall back to sleep for a little while longer.
You can, of course, use two Sonatas--one to fall asleep and one when you wake up. Or maybe this is not the right drug for you. (Since Ambien and Sonata are essentially the same, I believe.)
beardy : )>
Posted by JonW on June 15, 2002, at 18:54:48
In reply to Re: Ambien vs. Sonata? » JonW, posted by beardedlady on June 15, 2002, at 17:02:23
Posted by katekite on June 15, 2002, at 21:50:04
In reply to Thanks! (nm) » beardedlady, posted by JonW on June 15, 2002, at 18:54:48
For me ambien lasts 4.5 hrs and sonata 3.5. So I usually take ambien first and sonata in the middle of the night.
Another route I follow sometimes is vistoril at the same time as ambien, then I tend to stay asleep through the wear-off of ambien.
Definitely sonata is always shorter than ambien.
kate
Posted by 3 Beer Effect on June 16, 2002, at 2:39:57
In reply to Ambien vs. Sonata?, posted by JonW on June 15, 2002, at 15:11:28
Sonata is really an inferior drug when compared to Ambien. Sonata is good in that in clears from your body before you wake up in the morning (so there is no hangover like with Halcion) but the half life of Sonata is I believe atleast about an hour shorter than Ambien.
The main problem with Sonata is that it is really only 30% bioavailable while Ambien is 70 % bioavailable. First past metabolism essentially destroys most of the Sonata before it ever get a chance to enter your (CNS) system.
My first sleeping pill prescription was 10 mg Sonata & it was a joke- 50 mg of Benadryl put me to sleep better than Sonata.
I am now on Ambien 10 mg & it works great, although you have to stop taking it periodically (best to do this on Friday & Saturday night when you don't have work the next day) or you tend to develop tolerance to it.
I personally found that 3 mg of Melatonin taken right when it becomes dark & the sun has gone down, & then Ambien 10 mg 1/2 hour before bedtime works great (Ambien 10 mg peaks at I think 1 hr 36 minutes on an empty stomach). I used to have to take 1 mg Klonopin after the sun went down, but now the Melatonin 3 mg has replaced that & seems to work (for me) just as well for sleep.
I read in a magazine that the experts recommend that you take 1 mg of Melatonin instead of the 3 mg that most people take because your body might stop producing it naturally if you are taking it in pill form everyday. I don't have any 1 mg Melatonin pills so I don't know if they would be nearly as effective as the 3 mg ones. Be sure to buy synthetic & not natural/animal derived melatonin since you can get mad cow disease, salmonella & other horrible stuff from "natural" animal-derived supplements.
JonW- Since you take the potentially dangerous MAOI Nardil, I don't know if you are supposed to take Melatonin with MAOIs or not. You better do some extensive research on that combination because if there is some interaction where the MAOI amplifies the Melatonin you might fall asleep & never wake up again. Also, if you are also taking Ambien at the same time, the increases the complexity &/or number of possible drug interactions.
Another (non-melatonin) soluton would be to take 1 Ambien when you go to sleep & another when you wake up again, or perhaps change to Halcion which I think lasts a bit longer than Ambien. But unlike Ambien (& Sonata), Halcion & other Benzos decrease the time spent in deep sleep (but that may not be all that bad since they appear to makes up for that by an increase in total sleep time).
Klonopin or Ativan probably wouldn't make good sleeping pills even though they last all night long, because you become tolerant to the sleep-inducing effects in as little as 2 weeks with regular benzos. It is better to stick with the selective sleep benzos like Ambien or hypnotic benzos like Halcion. There are a few other regular benzos used for hypnotic purposes only but I forget their names- ProSom maybe?, estazolam?, nitrazepam? & one or two others.
3 Beers......
Posted by beardedlady on June 16, 2002, at 6:06:30
In reply to Sonata would be even worse for you than Ambien, posted by 3 Beer Effect on June 16, 2002, at 2:39:57
Our experiences are dreadfully opposite. I went to the hospital after Benedryl made me anxious and wide awake. (They gave me valium, and sent me home.)
I take an occasional 10mg. Sonata, and I'm out like a light in anywhere from 5 to 30 minutes. (If I'm extremely anxious, it can take a while to fall asleep, but I usually wind up getting six hours with two back-to-back pills.)
I tried Ambien first. Nothing happened. I suppose I will have to try it again, as I wasn't "stabalized" with Serzone at the time.
Nyquil knocks me out, too.
As for melatonin, that stopped working for me after a few weeks. As it is mostly for clock regulation (jet lag, etc.), it really shouldn't even have an effect for any length of time. (Hell, a placebo effect is better than nothing, though.)
We're all different.
beardy : )>
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