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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by manowar on January 3, 2002, at 15:50:16
If you want to save money, use plain old generic buproprion.
I've been a Wellbutrin consumer for many years. Of course, the story was that Wellbutrin could cause seizures. From what I've read, there was a high incidence of seizures when the drug was first put out on the market, because the dosage amount was too high. Once that problem was fixed, (from what I've heard) the drug didn't cause seizures any more than any other Psycho drug.
The problem was, the patent for Wellbutrin ran out. The company ingeniously took a negative and made a positive out of it. They said, “Wellbutrin SR is the way to go, because there is less risk of seizures”.
I’ve talked to two pharmacists so far that have told me that there isn’t much of a difference between the two drugs (of course the SR is a little smoother in its release into the blood stream). They both said it was mainly a marketing ploy.
I’m glad the medical community is looking out for my best interests:)
Posted by MB on January 3, 2002, at 17:02:31
In reply to Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM?, posted by manowar on January 3, 2002, at 15:50:16
You're missing the big picture < g >. The SR tabs of Wellbutrin look kinda like purple smiley-faces with cocked eyes. Cuteness--isn't that what's really important. Personally, I had better luck with the immediate release: I could titrate my doses more precisely.
Peace,
MB
Posted by manowar on January 3, 2002, at 20:16:28
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM? » manowar, posted by MB on January 3, 2002, at 17:02:31
> You're missing the big picture < g >. The SR tabs of Wellbutrin look kinda like purple smiley-faces with cocked eyes. Cuteness--isn't that what's really important. Personally, I had better luck with the immediate release: I could titrate my doses more precisely.
>
> Peace,
> MBI must say I did like the purple tabs, but I like the bright yellow ones better. It's nice to start the day with some yellow sunshine!
--Tim
Posted by MB on January 3, 2002, at 20:29:00
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM? » MB, posted by manowar on January 3, 2002, at 20:16:28
> > You're missing the big picture < g >. The SR tabs of Wellbutrin look kinda like purple smiley-faces with cocked eyes. Cuteness--isn't that what's really important. Personally, I had better luck with the immediate release: I could titrate my doses more precisely.
> >
> > Peace,
> > MB
>
> I must say I did like the purple tabs, but I like the bright yellow ones better. It's nice to start the day with some yellow sunshine!
> --Tim
I had some of the red Wellbutrins (I think 75 mg) as well as the 100 mg tablets...all mixed up in the same bottle. Now that made for some colorful mornings. I could shake them up really fast and make orange (heh heh)...
Posted by Bekka H. on January 3, 2002, at 22:27:53
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM? » manowar, posted by MB on January 3, 2002, at 20:29:00
> > > You're missing the big picture < g >. The SR tabs of Wellbutrin look kinda like purple smiley-faces with cocked eyes. Cuteness--isn't that what's really important. Personally, I had better luck with the immediate release: I could titrate my doses more precisely.
> > >
> > > Peace,
> > > MB
> >
> > I must say I did like the purple tabs, but I like the bright yellow ones better. It's nice to start the day with some yellow sunshine!
> > --Tim
>
>
> I had some of the red Wellbutrins (I think 75 mg) as well as the 100 mg tablets...all mixed up in the same bottle. Now that made for some colorful mornings. I could shake them up really fast and make orange (heh heh)...Well, whether you prefer Wellbutrin SR or IR, the REAL scam or real CRIME is the fact that there isn't enough research going on into other noradrenergic/dopaminergic antidepressants. Wellbutrin is the only medicine of its kind (other than amphetamines, which don't do much for depression) currently available in this country. The manufacturers and purveyors of the WIMPOGENIC ssri's have effectively prevented research and/or FDA approval of much better, more creative and useful antidepressants for a great majority of patients. Instead, we are turning into a country of spaced-out, apathetic, ssri-ingesting wimps.
Posted by JGalt on January 4, 2002, at 0:55:24
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM?, posted by Bekka H. on January 3, 2002, at 22:27:53
> Well, whether you prefer Wellbutrin SR or IR, the REAL scam or real CRIME is the fact that there isn't enough research going on into other noradrenergic/dopaminergic antidepressants. Wellbutrin is the only medicine of its kind (other than amphetamines, which don't do much for depression) currently available in this country. The manufacturers and purveyors of the WIMPOGENIC ssri's have effectively prevented research and/or FDA approval of much better, more creative and useful antidepressants for a great majority of patients. Instead, we are turning into a country of spaced-out, apathetic, ssri-ingesting wimps. > >
I agree with you mostly Bekka, though I certainly do not believe that all people become spaced out or apathetic on ssri's...I doubt you do either. It is most certainly is sad to see most of the money going down the same tired old roads for mostly political reasons. As I understand it, amineptine was a very nice antidepressant for many, until the FDA and other countries forced it off the market...probably because it was able to make normal people more happy (and sometimes hypersexual), and that doesn't fit the picture frame of an antidepressant. Of course it may also be because if someone made a class of highly successful (say 90%+) antidepressants, there wouldn't be so much money shelled out on polypharmacy and switching meds (from which pdocs profit).
JGalt
Posted by MB on January 4, 2002, at 7:34:52
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM?, posted by Bekka H. on January 3, 2002, at 22:27:53
> we are turning into a country of spaced-out, apathetic, ssri-ingesting wimps.
And I'm soon to join their ranks. < sigh > You forgot to mention impotent.MB
Posted by manowar on January 4, 2002, at 15:09:15
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM?, posted by Bekka H. on January 3, 2002, at 22:27:53
> > > > You're missing the big picture < g >. The SR tabs of Wellbutrin look kinda like purple smiley-faces with cocked eyes. Cuteness--isn't that what's really important. Personally, I had better luck with the immediate release: I could titrate my doses more precisely.
> > > >
> > > > Peace,
> > > > MB
> > >
> > > I must say I did like the purple tabs, but I like the bright yellow ones better. It's nice to start the day with some yellow sunshine!
> > > --Tim
> >
> >
> > I had some of the red Wellbutrins (I think 75 mg) as well as the 100 mg tablets...all mixed up in the same bottle. Now that made for some colorful mornings. I could shake them up really fast and make orange (heh heh)...
>
> Well, whether you prefer Wellbutrin SR or IR, the REAL scam or real CRIME is the fact that there isn't enough research going on into other noradrenergic/dopaminergic antidepressants. Wellbutrin is the only medicine of its kind (other than amphetamines, which don't do much for depression) currently available in this country. The manufacturers and purveyors of the WIMPOGENIC ssri's have effectively prevented research and/or FDA approval of much better, more creative and useful antidepressants for a great majority of patients. Instead, we are turning into a country of spaced-out, apathetic, ssri-ingesting wimps.
***********************I couldn't agree with you more.
BTW: I've read some articles that say Buproprion is dopaminergic, some say noradrenergic, while other articles say that chemists and doctors really don't know the true mechanism of the drug. What gives?And what is Wellbutrin IR?
SSRIs are Wimpinergic, and Suckyinergic.:)
I did a lot of reading about Survector (You know the true selective dopamine reuptake inhibitor). It helped lots of people, and amazingly it was developed back in the 70's. But God forbid, it happen to make some people better than well. Some men had multiple orgasms--how awful!
I'm excited about the Modafinil/Adrafinil because not only does it work with the catechalomine neurotransmitters, but also with some of the Aminos. It seems to 'energize' the brain. I think drug companies have gotten too obsessed with making "selective" drugs. I think depression is much more than millions of someone’s alpha 1 noradrenergic receptors in his/her brain not working properly.
--Tim
Posted by JohnX2 on January 4, 2002, at 17:07:22
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM?, posted by JGalt on January 4, 2002, at 0:55:24
You bring up a really good point that I discussed
with my pdoc at my last trip. One day, probably
in the next 1-2 decades, the technology will have
advanced to the point where a patient can go through
some initial neurological/genetic screening and get
the appropriate treatment from day 1. No med
swizzle game. At that point the psychiatrists will
more or less go the way of the dinosaurs.I drew a parallel somewhat to my own industry, the
home pc, where people are running out of reasons
to have faster computers running their software,
they just need faster internet connections at
this point.-john
> > Well, whether you prefer Wellbutrin SR or IR, the REAL scam or real CRIME is the fact that there isn't enough research going on into other noradrenergic/dopaminergic antidepressants. Wellbutrin is the only medicine of its kind (other than amphetamines, which don't do much for depression) currently available in this country. The manufacturers and purveyors of the WIMPOGENIC ssri's have effectively prevented research and/or FDA approval of much better, more creative and useful antidepressants for a great majority of patients. Instead, we are turning into a country of spaced-out, apathetic, ssri-ingesting wimps. > >
>
> I agree with you mostly Bekka, though I certainly do not believe that all people become spaced out or apathetic on ssri's...I doubt you do either. It is most certainly is sad to see most of the money going down the same tired old roads for mostly political reasons. As I understand it, amineptine was a very nice antidepressant for many, until the FDA and other countries forced it off the market...probably because it was able to make normal people more happy (and sometimes hypersexual), and that doesn't fit the picture frame of an antidepressant. Of course it may also be because if someone made a class of highly successful (say 90%+) antidepressants, there wouldn't be so much money shelled out on polypharmacy and switching meds (from which pdocs profit).
>
> JGalt
Posted by Bekka H. on January 4, 2002, at 23:58:13
In reply to Re: Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM?, posted by manowar on January 4, 2002, at 15:09:15
> > > > > You're missing the big picture < g >. The SR tabs of Wellbutrin look kinda like purple smiley-faces with cocked eyes. Cuteness--isn't that what's really important. Personally, I had better luck with the immediate release: I could titrate my doses more precisely.
> > > > >
> > > > > Peace,
> > > > > MB
> > > >
> > > > I must say I did like the purple tabs, but I like the bright yellow ones better. It's nice to start the day with some yellow sunshine!
> > > > --Tim
> > >
> > >
> > > I had some of the red Wellbutrins (I think 75 mg) as well as the 100 mg tablets...all mixed up in the same bottle. Now that made for some colorful mornings. I could shake them up really fast and make orange (heh heh)...
> >
> > Well, whether you prefer Wellbutrin SR or IR, the REAL scam or real CRIME is the fact that there isn't enough research going on into other noradrenergic/dopaminergic antidepressants. Wellbutrin is the only medicine of its kind (other than amphetamines, which don't do much for depression) currently available in this country. The manufacturers and purveyors of the WIMPOGENIC ssri's have effectively prevented research and/or FDA approval of much better, more creative and useful antidepressants for a great majority of patients. Instead, we are turning into a country of spaced-out, apathetic, ssri-ingesting wimps.
> ***********************
>
> I couldn't agree with you more.
> BTW: I've read some articles that say Buproprion is dopaminergic, some say noradrenergic, while other articles say that chemists and doctors really don't know the true mechanism of the drug. What gives?
>
> And what is Wellbutrin IR?
>
> SSRIs are Wimpinergic, and Suckyinergic.:)
>
> I did a lot of reading about Survector (You know the true selective dopamine reuptake inhibitor). It helped lots of people, and amazingly it was developed back in the 70's. But God forbid, it happen to make some people better than well. Some men had multiple orgasms--how awful!
>
> I'm excited about the Modafinil/Adrafinil because not only does it work with the catechalomine neurotransmitters, but also with some of the Aminos. It seems to 'energize' the brain. I think drug companies have gotten too obsessed with making "selective" drugs. I think depression is much more than millions of someone’s alpha 1 noradrenergic receptors in his/her brain not working properly.
>
> --TimI read on www.biopsychiatry.com that Wellbutrin blocks the reuptake of dopamine but inhibits its release, and I think they said that WB blocks the reuptake of norepinephrine. When I mentioned that to my doctors, they said that we really don't know how Wellbutrin works! From my experience with Wellbutrin, it FEELS as if it does more to affect norepinephrine than dopamine, but that's just my own subjective take on it. Medicines that are more dopaminergic (like dexedrine and methylphenidate, for example) seem to make me more quiet and focused, but they don't give me a lot of physical energy; Wellbutrin, on the other hand, gives me TONS of physical energy, but very little mental focus. That's why I think it influences norepinephrine more, but I might be completely wrong.
When I used the "IR" after wellbutrin, I did that to indicate immediate release Wellbutrin rather than sustained release. It was never called "Wellbutrin IR." I call it that to differentiate it from the newer formulation.
I agree that there is much too much emphasis on super selectivity. So far, the most selective antidepressants have been the least helpful to me. And, as far as the SSRI's are concerned, I've read that the more selective they are, the more likely they are to cause apathy, indifference, and lack of motivation. I will never, ever understand how a substance that makes you apathetic, overweight, impotent, and completely lacking in motivation or drive, could possibly be called an "antidepressant." I think some patients believe they are less depressed on SSRI's not because they are less depressed, but because they STOP CARING WHETHER THEY ARE DEPRESSED due to the SSRI-induced apathy. And I have often wondered whether some doctors like to prescribe SSRI's because many patients become so compliant and wimpy on those drugs. The patients don't complain as much. They don't call their shrinks as often. They even stop complaining about things they SHOULD be complaining about. Those doctors should be made to eat their medical school application essays. But, first, they should be forced to re-read those essays, so they can be reminded why they became doctors in the first place.
Posted by OldSchool on January 5, 2002, at 21:04:33
In reply to Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM?, posted by manowar on January 3, 2002, at 15:50:16
> If you want to save money, use plain old generic buproprion.
>
> I've been a Wellbutrin consumer for many years. Of course, the story was that Wellbutrin could cause seizures. From what I've read, there was a high incidence of seizures when the drug was first put out on the market, because the dosage amount was too high. Once that problem was fixed, (from what I've heard) the drug didn't cause seizures any more than any other Psycho drug.
>
> The problem was, the patent for Wellbutrin ran out. The company ingeniously took a negative and made a positive out of it. They said, “Wellbutrin SR is the way to go, because there is less risk of seizures”.
>
> I’ve talked to two pharmacists so far that have told me that there isn’t much of a difference between the two drugs (of course the SR is a little smoother in its release into the blood stream). They both said it was mainly a marketing ploy.
> I’m glad the medical community is looking out for my best interests:)Nah, the SR version is superior to the original instant release Wellbutrin. The SR version is safer than the original instant release. SR version is smoother, easier to take. It also has a lower incidence of seizures cause its sustained release.
Old School
Posted by CalvaryHill on January 6, 2002, at 1:11:18
In reply to Wellbutrin SR: A big SCAM?, posted by manowar on January 3, 2002, at 15:50:16
I found that immediate-release Wellbutrin caused more tremor than the Sustained Release formulation.
This is the end of the thread.
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