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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 8 to 32 of 37. Go back in thread:
Posted by Kaysey on October 16, 2001, at 18:37:16
In reply to Re: Effexor/Wellbutrin combo » Kaysey, posted by pellmell on October 16, 2001, at 17:07:07
> Kaysey,
>
> Ok, I've had another week to try to find this elusive med balance, and I'm a little closer than before.
>
> Right now I'm sticking with 75mg Effexor XR in the morning, 100mg Wellbutrin SR at noon, and another dose of Wellbutrin around 7.
>
> Moving my first Wellbutrin dose from breakfast to noon has helped the most. I actually felt groggier than ever when I took it in the morning. Maybe it's a circadian rhythm thing. I'm sleeping a whole lot better now, remembering my dreams, but I still don't feel quite right. I feel more awake, but also more anxious; I wonder sometimes if boosting my Effexor dose significantly, all the way back up to 225, would be a good thing, with the Wellbutrin as balance. On the other hand, I feel more aware, more alive on 75mg. Maybe the drop in the Effexor dose was all I needed? Maybe the Wellbutrin is hurting more than it's helping? ..sigh..
>
> So, like I said, I'm closer...but not quite where I'd like to be.
>
> When you get a chance, let me know how you're doing. I'd like to hear.
>
> Best,
> -pmHi!
Except for the Effexor dosage and a few other idiosyncracies that I have experienced, we seem to be pretty much in the same 'boat.' I reduced the Effexor dose down to less than 225, am now back at 225, and considering going back up (started at 300 when I added Wellbutrin two weeks ago). I am now at 200mg Wellbutrin (had to slowly get there, but now seem to be doing okay--still have extremely dry skin and some urinary and fluid retention and therefore drinking lots of water.The increased alertness has been a real plus, but like you, the Wellbutrin makes me sleepy in the AM--makes me want to go back to bed. I'm trying to take it about mid to late-morning and early evening--doesn't interfere with sleep. However, I seem to be 'down'--more so than I know I should be--anxious and overly concerned, etc. That is the reason I was considering increasing the Effexor again.
I am also curious as what type of potentiating effect the Wellbutrin might have on the Effexor. Effexor has always exacerbated the carb cravings that I have with PMS, and this has been even more pronounced with the addition of the WB. Though I have been more alert and somewhat more active, I certainly have not experienced any of the appetite and weight loss, etc. that many people report. I never did with Effexor either, and it seems that the Wellbutrin magnifies this. While this is not a health problem, it is really annoying.
I guess I will continue to 'tweak' the dosage here and there, but there isn't much else to try unless I go up to 300 on the Wellbutrin, which I am reluctant to do at this point. Stay tuned and good luck. Keep in touch.
Kaysey
Posted by SLS on October 16, 2001, at 18:49:05
In reply to Re: Effexor/Wellbutrin combo:almost ditto » pellmell, posted by Kaysey on October 16, 2001, at 18:37:16
Hi.
I wouldn't give up on the combo until you reach 300mg of each.
- Scott
Posted by Kaysey on October 16, 2001, at 22:11:24
In reply to Re: Effexor/Wellbutrin combo:almost ditto, posted by SLS on October 16, 2001, at 18:49:05
> Hi.
>
> I wouldn't give up on the combo until you reach 300mg of each.
>
>
> - ScottThanks for the information. I have researched Wellbutrin and looked at most of the posts related to it here (I did the same thing with Effexor). I was not surprised by the carb-cravings with Effexor. Though I realize everyone is different, and there are those who report weight gain on Wellbutrin, I have really been surprised by my intense carb cravings with it.
Could this be a temporary side effect? Is it a result of some potentiation effect on Effexor? Is there some way I can alleviate it? I am not overweight, and I have generally had pretty good willpower where food is concerned, but the craving is very annoying. Is there a possibility this will diminish at a higher dose (i.e when I reach 300)?
Yes, I realize it just might be that my body reacts differently, but could you (or anyone) shed some light on this?
Thanks again.
Kaysey
Posted by SLS on October 17, 2001, at 0:13:15
In reply to Re: Effexor/Wellbutrin combo:almost ditto » SLS, posted by Kaysey on October 16, 2001, at 22:11:24
> Thanks for the information. I have researched Wellbutrin and looked at most of the posts related to it here (I did the same thing with Effexor). I was not surprised by the carb-cravings with Effexor. Though I realize everyone is different, and there are those who report weight gain on Wellbutrin, I have really been surprised by my intense carb cravings with it.
>
> Could this be a temporary side effect? Is it a result of some potentiation effect on Effexor? Is there some way I can alleviate it? I am not overweight, and I have generally had pretty good willpower where food is concerned, but the craving is very annoying. Is there a possibility this will diminish at a higher dose (i.e when I reach 300)?
>
> Yes, I realize it just might be that my body reacts differently, but could you (or anyone) shed some light on this?
Dear Kaysey,I don’t have anything intelligent to add to what you have already offered as possible explanations and thoughtful questions.
I do have a question or two, though. In what ways are you sure that Wellbutrin is improving your condition? Why are you sure?
One thing that can happen with people as they begin to respond to antidepressant therapy is that they begin to regain the sensation of taste. Food just tastes better. When this happens to me, it is very striking, and I do eat more because of it – at least, at first. If this were to be the case with you, I guess that you would soon reach a balance as the novelty of taste dissipates. I don’t think it makes sense to make treatment decisions based on food cravings at this point in time.
- Scott
Posted by Kaysey on October 17, 2001, at 0:48:54
In reply to Re: Effexor/Wellbutrin combo:almost ditto » Kaysey, posted by SLS on October 17, 2001, at 0:13:15
> > Thanks for the information. I have researched Wellbutrin and looked at most of the posts related to it here (I did the same thing with Effexor). I was not surprised by the carb-cravings with Effexor. Though I realize everyone is different, and there are those who report weight gain on Wellbutrin, I have really been surprised by my intense carb cravings with it.
> >
> > Could this be a temporary side effect? Is it a result of some potentiation effect on Effexor? Is there some way I can alleviate it? I am not overweight, and I have generally had pretty good willpower where food is concerned, but the craving is very annoying. Is there a possibility this will diminish at a higher dose (i.e when I reach 300)?
> >
> > Yes, I realize it just might be that my body reacts differently, but could you (or anyone) shed some light on this?
>
>
> Dear Kaysey,
>
> I don’t have anything intelligent to add to what you have already offered as possible explanations and thoughtful questions.
>
> I do have a question or two, though. In what ways are you sure that Wellbutrin is improving your condition? Why are you sure?
>
> One thing that can happen with people as they begin to respond to antidepressant therapy is that they begin to regain the sensation of taste. Food just tastes better. When this happens to me, it is very striking, and I do eat more because of it – at least, at first. If this were to be the case with you, I guess that you would soon reach a balance as the novelty of taste dissipates. I don’t think it makes sense to make treatment decisions based on food cravings at this point in time.
>
>
> - Scott
Scott:
Your questions are reasonable. Considering I just added this med 3 weeks ago (and have only been at 200mg/day for less than a week), I can't honestly say that any improvement is directly due
to WB. However, the fact that I no longer desire to sleep 12+ hours per day and can actually get up early (with only a little prodding)is definitely an improvement--and this occurred immediately when I began taking the Wellbutrin. Prior to that, I could fall asleep so easily that I was almost afraid to drive long distances--and actually planned trips around the Effexor dosage.Effexor alone certainly lifted my depression (yes, I know what you mean by the distinct improvement in all sensory images--taste especially), but the drowsiness was debilitating. Rather than continue increasing the
Effexor beyond 300mg (which I realize is not a bad thing), the decision was made to augment with Wellbutrin. The increased alertness (whether or not it is actually due to the WB at this point) has been sufficient for me to want to continue with this med (at least for now).Sorry, this post ended up longer than it should have. Thanks again for your help.
Kaysey
Posted by pellmell on October 20, 2001, at 13:02:44
In reply to Re: Effexor/Wellbutrin combo:almost ditto » SLS, posted by Kaysey on October 17, 2001, at 0:48:54
Okay, here's the latest:
I dropped the Wellbutrin for two days, and hung on to the 75mg Effexor. I found myself feeling more depressed (maybe 'cause the Wellbutrin-induced anxiety wasn't there to distract me), so I went back up to 112.5mg. I've been on that dose for a couple of days and I'm feeling better...except I sliding back into lethargy again.
So today I did what helped me in the beginning, and took a 150mg Wellbutrin pill around noon. I was feeling best when I was taking that amount at that time; hopefully I will again. I have to talk to my pdoc again soon for more Effexor, unless I want to take 150-225mg a day again (I've got a prescription for 5 refills at that dose).
Anyway... wish me luck.
By the way, how've you been doing since you posted last?-pm
Posted by kregpark@yahoo.com on October 20, 2001, at 15:39:51
In reply to Reduction in Celexa or Increase in Wellbutrin?, posted by Simcha on October 8, 2001, at 7:33:28
Interesting post.
I have been gaining increase in Wellbutrin.
My regimen of 60 Nardil + 2.75 Klonopin + 50 Provigil
and why I take is at http://www.socialfear.com/Though I trialed extensively in the past, I do with much more reservation primarily due to the fact I want to be able to show up at work and not be having frequent mood and behavioral or personality changes.
Also interferes with friends, family etc.I recently decided that if I *do* want to trial, I want a good *washout* and *washin* regimen to/from MAOI (even at the low dose I take). Probably 4-7 days worth.
My feeling is that Wellbutrin + Xanax, or Ritalin + Xanax (have actually done these for 1 or 2 days a couple times already), allows me to retain excellent SP and good energy treatment and drop nardil from 60mg to 0 immediately.Tramadol + Wellbutrin is another but I'm not sure about that one.
At least the Xanax + Ritalin (I've tried it) is not even FDA contraindicated for washout, or even concurrent MAOI use for that matter.
I would like to sometime try the Wellbutrin + Xanax for a week or so and see how it goes.
I could try it for washout/washin but it may also be good long term regimen for me.
It is what I want to discuss with my doc next time
(I really should see him more than once every 3 months!!!)Anyways... a bit off topic at the end ...
kregpark@yahoo.com
http://www.socialfear.com/
> OK folks,
>
> My pdoc has me increase my Wellbutrin SR from 150mg to 200mg/day and he had me decrease my Celexa dose from 40mg to 20mg a day.
>
> The next couple of days were great. My sexual energy was back. I felt fine.
>
> Then whammo!!!! Last Thursday I felt a bit off-balance. This has continued through the weekend. I find myself more irritated at trivial stupid things. I feel that I am less easy going. I am cleaning the house like mad. I can't stand having clutter all of a sudden. (Not normally my behavior)
>
> Initially I have been thinking that this combo has me in a manic state. The boyfriend talked to me this morning about my behavior lately. He loves me very much and he has been very supportive. He seems to think that the Celexa needs to go back to 40mg. He said that the last time I increased Wellbutrin (from 100mg to 150) I had a similar reaction and I relapsed by having a compulsive episode. The pdoc increased the Celexa to 40mg and I levelled out.
>
> I'm thinking that my base problem is Major Depressive Disorder, as the pdoc verifies, AND underlying SEVERE OCD. I do seem to respond to the Celexa very well. My pdoc has me convinced that I need it to combat my OCD. I cry that I will never be able to be off of it but if that is what it takes to not have sex with 12 strangers a day then I'm willing to take it. That life was HELL!
>
> I took the full 40mg of Celexa this morning. I will let you all know how this goes. I'm hoping that I will not have to call the pdoc to have my Wellbutrin dose adjusted back to 150mg. My pdoc gave me the option of going back up to 40mg of Celexa on my own. He gave me control of the dose. I'm glad he did. I can go back up and see how it goes.
>
> I am scared now. I do not want to go back to compulsion again. I have been very happy with my sobriety lately. I love my partner so much. I do not want to put him through another one of my compulsive binges. That is the place of nightmares. Please pray for me everyone while I balance out again. I really need your support.
>
> Thanks,
> Simcha.....
Posted by Kaysey on October 21, 2001, at 10:44:50
In reply to Re: Effexor/Wellbutrin combo: another update » Kaysey, posted by pellmell on October 20, 2001, at 13:02:44
> Okay, here's the latest:
>
> I dropped the Wellbutrin for two days, and hung on to the 75mg Effexor. I found myself feeling more depressed (maybe 'cause the Wellbutrin-induced anxiety wasn't there to distract me), so I went back up to 112.5mg. I've been on that dose for a couple of days and I'm feeling better...except I sliding back into lethargy again.
>
> So today I did what helped me in the beginning, and took a 150mg Wellbutrin pill around noon. I was feeling best when I was taking that amount at that time; hopefully I will again. I have to talk to my pdoc again soon for more Effexor, unless I want to take 150-225mg a day again (I've got a prescription for 5 refills at that dose).
>
> Anyway... wish me luck.
> By the way, how've you been doing since you posted last?
>
> -pmHi!
I can say this, for now: depression is non-existent, energy level is fair to almost good at times, carb-cravings are as bad as ever. Scott pointed out that I shouldn't discard a med so quickly because of food cravings, and I realize that is probably the sensible thing to do. However, this is a distraction and makes it difficult to concentrate (I spend a lot of time at a computer and just like the story says, "visions of sugar plums dance in my head" ha!)
There is a post below about WB and weight gain--Terra suggested protein bars--which I did use with just the Effexor, with some degree of success. If it was just an increase in appetite, I could handle that by munching on veggies, etc...but that isn't it.
Enough about that. I have to admit it is nice to be out of that dark mode, and for that I am thankful. I don't know if there is any advantage to increasing the meds or not at this point. Really the only things I would be interested in are more alertness (fatigue is still there to some degree--I find myself feeling good then 'hitting the wall' all of a sudden), and eliminating or minimizing these hounding cravings.
Stay tuned and keep me posted. You may have said and I don't remember, what were you taking before this combo?
Thanks.
Kaysey
Posted by Kaysey on October 25, 2001, at 19:09:15
In reply to Re: Effexor/Wellbutrin combo: another update » pellmell, posted by Kaysey on October 21, 2001, at 10:44:50
Hi:I am preparing to start 300mg (2x150mg-up from 200mg 2x100 perday) Wellbutrin SR next week (with my 225mg Effexor). I say 'preparing' because I am concerned about the continuing fatigue. As compared to the Effexor alone experience, I am somewhat more alert, and my depression control is good. However, I have this dull fatigue and some muscle weakness that doesn't seem to want to subside (i.e I'm alert but certainly not energetic or strong).
I have gone through the archives (especially about Wellbutrin), to see if this dissatisfying side-effect ever subsides alone (or with increased dosage).
On Effexor alone I kept increasing the dosage to see if the fatigue and drowsiness would ever subside--went to 300mg and then doc and I agreed to add the Wellbutrin. Fortunately some of the hair loss and edema seems to have subsided--but the fatigue is at times almost as debilitating as the depression was.
When I was on Prozac (and when it was working), I never suffered this kind of fatigue (some sedation, but no fatigue). Anyone have anymore suggestions. They are certainly welcome!Thanks.
Kaysey
Posted by Dreamy on October 26, 2001, at 17:38:49
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB combo: update and ask for help, posted by Kaysey on October 25, 2001, at 19:09:15
>
> Hi:
>
> I am preparing to start 300mg (2x150mg-up from 200mg 2x100 perday) Wellbutrin SR next week (with my 225mg Effexor). I say 'preparing' because I am concerned about the continuing fatigue. As compared to the Effexor alone experience, I am somewhat more alert, and my depression control is good. However, I have this dull fatigue and some muscle weakness that doesn't seem to want to subside (i.e I'm alert but certainly not energetic or strong).
> I have gone through the archives (especially about Wellbutrin), to see if this dissatisfying side-effect ever subsides alone (or with increased dosage).
> On Effexor alone I kept increasing the dosage to see if the fatigue and drowsiness would ever subside--went to 300mg and then doc and I agreed to add the Wellbutrin. Fortunately some of the hair loss and edema seems to have subsided--but the fatigue is at times almost as debilitating as the depression was.
> When I was on Prozac (and when it was working), I never suffered this kind of fatigue (some sedation, but no fatigue). Anyone have anymore suggestions. They are certainly welcome!
>
> Thanks.
> KayseyYeah...I am on that combo right now...although not
that much effexor...
I feel great...wake early want to excersize...etc.
AND I was totally lethargic!
AND let me tell you something else...I have had
a ton of hair fall out prior to using effexor...
since starting effexor...it's like my hair is
actually sticking in...its totallly weird.
May I ask you why you were losing hair?
I am a female and it was totally devestating and
horrifying for me to lose my hair...
Now I look like buck wheat with a TON of new hair
growth.
Let me know!
Thanks,
Dreamy
Posted by Kaysey on October 26, 2001, at 19:11:02
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB combo: update and ask for help, posted by Dreamy on October 26, 2001, at 17:38:49
> >
> > Hi:
> >
> > I am preparing to start 300mg (2x150mg-up from 200mg 2x100 perday) Wellbutrin SR next week (with my 225mg Effexor). I say 'preparing' because I am concerned about the continuing fatigue. As compared to the Effexor alone experience, I am somewhat more alert, and my depression control is good. However, I have this dull fatigue and some muscle weakness that doesn't seem to want to subside (i.e I'm alert but certainly not energetic or strong).
> > I have gone through the archives (especially about Wellbutrin), to see if this dissatisfying side-effect ever subsides alone (or with increased dosage).
> > On Effexor alone I kept increasing the dosage to see if the fatigue and drowsiness would ever subside--went to 300mg and then doc and I agreed to add the Wellbutrin. Fortunately some of the hair loss and edema seems to have subsided--but the fatigue is at times almost as debilitating as the depression was.
> > When I was on Prozac (and when it was working), I never suffered this kind of fatigue (some sedation, but no fatigue). Anyone have anymore suggestions. They are certainly welcome!
> >
> > Thanks.
> > Kaysey
>
> Yeah...I am on that combo right now...although not
> that much effexor...
> I feel great...wake early want to excersize...etc.
> AND I was totally lethargic!
> AND let me tell you something else...I have had
> a ton of hair fall out prior to using effexor...
> since starting effexor...it's like my hair is
> actually sticking in...its totallly weird.
> May I ask you why you were losing hair?
> I am a female and it was totally devestating and
> horrifying for me to lose my hair...
> Now I look like buck wheat with a TON of new hair
> growth.
> Let me know!
> Thanks,
> DreamyHi Dreamy:
I associated the most recent hair loss with the addition of Wellbutrin SR. I say 'most recent' because I have had it happen before: when I have changed oral contraceptives (or gone off them), when I began effexor, and now it has coincided with the start of Wellbutrin SR a little over a month
ago. I am one of those people who, if there is an unpleasant side effect, I am darn sure going to experience it. I had no energizing effect from Effexor, no loss of appetite and no energy--craved sweets and wanted to sleep every 3-4 hours. Ditto the Wellbutrin except I am more 'alert' and only get drowsy a little after taking it. However, I have my fingers crossed that these WB (SR) negative side effects may be subsiding---and that is the reason I asked for im- put. I don't want to feel 'sped up,' I just want to be able to not worry about driving and/or falling asleep at inappropriate times. I will also add that I am very thankful for the control of the depression.
Dreamy--you mentioned that you were on the same combo, except for the dosage of Effexor. I take it (based on some of your other postings) that you have decreased it? What dosage are you on? I have reached a point where, if the WB SR turns out to be OK, I will try to further titrate down the Effexor. What has been your experience?
Getting back to the hair loss, again. Yes, it is distressful, but the first time it happened I was 23 and I just about freaked! It has happened several times since then-- at times I have used Rogaine for women,-- and now that I am 43, I just take it in stride. My husband has seen me with bald spots, with sunsburned scalp and a receding hairline that looked like a man's--he is still with me, but even if he had split, I would have dealt with it. There are worse things in life, I have found out over the past two decades.
Get back with me regarding your experiences. I appreciate your imput.
Thanks and good luck!
Kaysey
Posted by Dreamy on October 27, 2001, at 17:13:24
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB combo: update and ask for help » Dreamy, posted by Kaysey on October 26, 2001, at 19:11:02
> > >
> > > Hi:
> > >
> > > I am preparing to start 300mg (2x150mg-up from 200mg 2x100 perday) Wellbutrin SR next week (with my 225mg Effexor). I say 'preparing' because I am concerned about the continuing fatigue. As compared to the Effexor alone experience, I am somewhat more alert, and my depression control is good. However, I have this dull fatigue and some muscle weakness that doesn't seem to want to subside (i.e I'm alert but certainly not energetic or strong).
> > > I have gone through the archives (especially about Wellbutrin), to see if this dissatisfying side-effect ever subsides alone (or with increased dosage).
> > > On Effexor alone I kept increasing the dosage to see if the fatigue and drowsiness would ever subside--went to 300mg and then doc and I agreed to add the Wellbutrin. Fortunately some of the hair loss and edema seems to have subsided--but the fatigue is at times almost as debilitating as the depression was.
> > > When I was on Prozac (and when it was working), I never suffered this kind of fatigue (some sedation, but no fatigue). Anyone have anymore suggestions. They are certainly welcome!
> > >
> > > Thanks.
> > > Kaysey
> >
> > Yeah...I am on that combo right now...although not
> > that much effexor...
> > I feel great...wake early want to excersize...etc.
> > AND I was totally lethargic!
> > AND let me tell you something else...I have had
> > a ton of hair fall out prior to using effexor...
> > since starting effexor...it's like my hair is
> > actually sticking in...its totallly weird.
> > May I ask you why you were losing hair?
> > I am a female and it was totally devestating and
> > horrifying for me to lose my hair...
> > Now I look like buck wheat with a TON of new hair
> > growth.
> > Let me know!
> > Thanks,
> > Dreamy
>
> Hi Dreamy:
> I associated the most recent hair loss with the addition of Wellbutrin SR. I say 'most recent' because I have had it happen before: when I have changed oral contraceptives (or gone off them), when I began effexor, and now it has coincided with the start of Wellbutrin SR a little over a month
> ago. I am one of those people who, if there is an unpleasant side effect, I am darn sure going to experience it. I had no energizing effect from Effexor, no loss of appetite and no energy--craved sweets and wanted to sleep every 3-4 hours. Ditto the Wellbutrin except I am more 'alert' and only get drowsy a little after taking it. However, I have my fingers crossed that these WB (SR) negative side effects may be subsiding---and that is the reason I asked for im- put. I don't want to feel 'sped up,' I just want to be able to not worry about driving and/or falling asleep at inappropriate times. I will also add that I am very thankful for the control of the depression.
> Dreamy--you mentioned that you were on the same combo, except for the dosage of Effexor. I take it (based on some of your other postings) that you have decreased it? What dosage are you on? I have reached a point where, if the WB SR turns out to be OK, I will try to further titrate down the Effexor. What has been your experience?
> Getting back to the hair loss, again. Yes, it is distressful, but the first time it happened I was 23 and I just about freaked! It has happened several times since then-- at times I have used Rogaine for women,-- and now that I am 43, I just take it in stride. My husband has seen me with bald spots, with sunsburned scalp and a receding hairline that looked like a man's--he is still with me, but even if he had split, I would have dealt with it. There are worse things in life, I have found out over the past two decades.
> Get back with me regarding your experiences. I appreciate your imput.
> Thanks and good luck!
> KayseyHey Kaysey!
No...I have not decreased off of effexor...I am
on 75mg although my doctor prescribed 150mg...
I am worried to take the prescribed amount if
it is as bad as all these people make it sound.
So...I am holding off.
The first week of taking the effexor was the worst
of it for me...leaving me real drowsy etc. But
all that went away and I now am more active and
more energetic than I was w/out it.That's a horrifying story about your hair loss.
And I know exactly how you have felt.
And I agree...there are worse things that can happen!
I too had a VERY burnt scalp for the first time
this year...it was awful when it was flaking!
Its growing back though and I now look like buck-
wheat!!!Oh-well...live and learn right?
Take care and Good Luck to you too!!!
Dreamy
Posted by Kaysey on October 28, 2001, at 0:35:18
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB combo: update and ask for help, posted by Dreamy on October 27, 2001, at 17:13:24
> > > >
> > > > Hi:
> > > >
> > > > I am preparing to start 300mg (2x150mg-up from 200mg 2x100 perday) Wellbutrin SR next week (with my 225mg Effexor). I say 'preparing' because I am concerned about the continuing fatigue. As compared to the Effexor alone experience, I am somewhat more alert, and my depression control is good. However, I have this dull fatigue and some muscle weakness that doesn't seem to want to subside (i.e I'm alert but certainly not energetic or strong).
> > > > I have gone through the archives (especially about Wellbutrin), to see if this dissatisfying side-effect ever subsides alone (or with increased dosage).
> > > > On Effexor alone I kept increasing the dosage to see if the fatigue and drowsiness would ever subside--went to 300mg and then doc and I agreed to add the Wellbutrin. Fortunately some of the hair loss and edema seems to have subsided--but the fatigue is at times almost as debilitating as the depression was.
> > > > When I was on Prozac (and when it was working), I never suffered this kind of fatigue (some sedation, but no fatigue). Anyone have anymore suggestions. They are certainly welcome!
> > > >
> > > > Thanks.
> > > > Kaysey
> > >
> > > Yeah...I am on that combo right now...although not
> > > that much effexor...
> > > I feel great...wake early want to excersize...etc.
> > > AND I was totally lethargic!
> > > AND let me tell you something else...I have had
> > > a ton of hair fall out prior to using effexor...
> > > since starting effexor...it's like my hair is
> > > actually sticking in...its totallly weird.
> > > May I ask you why you were losing hair?
> > > I am a female and it was totally devestating and
> > > horrifying for me to lose my hair...
> > > Now I look like buck wheat with a TON of new hair
> > > growth.
> > > Let me know!
> > > Thanks,
> > > Dreamy
> >
> > Hi Dreamy:
> > I associated the most recent hair loss with the addition of Wellbutrin SR. I say 'most recent' because I have had it happen before: when I have changed oral contraceptives (or gone off them), when I began effexor, and now it has coincided with the start of Wellbutrin SR a little over a month
> > ago. I am one of those people who, if there is an unpleasant side effect, I am darn sure going to experience it. I had no energizing effect from Effexor, no loss of appetite and no energy--craved sweets and wanted to sleep every 3-4 hours. Ditto the Wellbutrin except I am more 'alert' and only get drowsy a little after taking it. However, I have my fingers crossed that these WB (SR) negative side effects may be subsiding---and that is the reason I asked for im- put. I don't want to feel 'sped up,' I just want to be able to not worry about driving and/or falling asleep at inappropriate times. I will also add that I am very thankful for the control of the depression.
> > Dreamy--you mentioned that you were on the same combo, except for the dosage of Effexor. I take it (based on some of your other postings) that you have decreased it? What dosage are you on? I have reached a point where, if the WB SR turns out to be OK, I will try to further titrate down the Effexor. What has been your experience?
> > Getting back to the hair loss, again. Yes, it is distressful, but the first time it happened I was 23 and I just about freaked! It has happened several times since then-- at times I have used Rogaine for women,-- and now that I am 43, I just take it in stride. My husband has seen me with bald spots, with sunsburned scalp and a receding hairline that looked like a man's--he is still with me, but even if he had split, I would have dealt with it. There are worse things in life, I have found out over the past two decades.
> > Get back with me regarding your experiences. I appreciate your imput.
> > Thanks and good luck!
> > Kaysey
>
> Hey Kaysey!
> No...I have not decreased off of effexor...I am
> on 75mg although my doctor prescribed 150mg...
> I am worried to take the prescribed amount if
> it is as bad as all these people make it sound.
> So...I am holding off.
> The first week of taking the effexor was the worst
> of it for me...leaving me real drowsy etc. But
> all that went away and I now am more active and
> more energetic than I was w/out it.
>
> That's a horrifying story about your hair loss.
> And I know exactly how you have felt.
> And I agree...there are worse things that can happen!
> I too had a VERY burnt scalp for the first time
> this year...it was awful when it was flaking!
> Its growing back though and I now look like buck-
> wheat!!!
>
> Oh-well...live and learn right?
>
> Take care and Good Luck to you too!!!
> DreamyDreamy--I guess one thing that has come from this is I have one heck of a collection of hats! And, yes when the hair grows back in, it is weird looking, as I have longer than shoulder length blonde hair---and all of sudden there are these little spikes coming up at the crown and at the front, etc. Might as well laugh at these things, I guess.
Still I would like your or other's 'long-term' (i.e greater than 6-8 weeks) experience with Wellbutrin --or a Wellbutrin combo (mine being with Effexor) (I know that you have recently had a good experience with adding the Effexor)--does the weakness fatigue subside with the Wellbutrin though--or did you even experience that?
Thanks again.
Kaysey
Posted by Dreamy on October 30, 2001, at 9:56:58
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB combo: the good with the bad, posted by Kaysey on October 28, 2001, at 0:35:18
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi:
> > > > >
> > > > > I am preparing to start 300mg (2x150mg-up from 200mg 2x100 perday) Wellbutrin SR next week (with my 225mg Effexor). I say 'preparing' because I am concerned about the continuing fatigue. As compared to the Effexor alone experience, I am somewhat more alert, and my depression control is good. However, I have this dull fatigue and some muscle weakness that doesn't seem to want to subside (i.e I'm alert but certainly not energetic or strong).
> > > > > I have gone through the archives (especially about Wellbutrin), to see if this dissatisfying side-effect ever subsides alone (or with increased dosage).
> > > > > On Effexor alone I kept increasing the dosage to see if the fatigue and drowsiness would ever subside--went to 300mg and then doc and I agreed to add the Wellbutrin. Fortunately some of the hair loss and edema seems to have subsided--but the fatigue is at times almost as debilitating as the depression was.
> > > > > When I was on Prozac (and when it was working), I never suffered this kind of fatigue (some sedation, but no fatigue). Anyone have anymore suggestions. They are certainly welcome!
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks.
> > > > > Kaysey
> > > >
> > > > Yeah...I am on that combo right now...although not
> > > > that much effexor...
> > > > I feel great...wake early want to excersize...etc.
> > > > AND I was totally lethargic!
> > > > AND let me tell you something else...I have had
> > > > a ton of hair fall out prior to using effexor...
> > > > since starting effexor...it's like my hair is
> > > > actually sticking in...its totallly weird.
> > > > May I ask you why you were losing hair?
> > > > I am a female and it was totally devestating and
> > > > horrifying for me to lose my hair...
> > > > Now I look like buck wheat with a TON of new hair
> > > > growth.
> > > > Let me know!
> > > > Thanks,
> > > > Dreamy
> > >
> > > Hi Dreamy:
> > > I associated the most recent hair loss with the addition of Wellbutrin SR. I say 'most recent' because I have had it happen before: when I have changed oral contraceptives (or gone off them), when I began effexor, and now it has coincided with the start of Wellbutrin SR a little over a month
> > > ago. I am one of those people who, if there is an unpleasant side effect, I am darn sure going to experience it. I had no energizing effect from Effexor, no loss of appetite and no energy--craved sweets and wanted to sleep every 3-4 hours. Ditto the Wellbutrin except I am more 'alert' and only get drowsy a little after taking it. However, I have my fingers crossed that these WB (SR) negative side effects may be subsiding---and that is the reason I asked for im- put. I don't want to feel 'sped up,' I just want to be able to not worry about driving and/or falling asleep at inappropriate times. I will also add that I am very thankful for the control of the depression.
> > > Dreamy--you mentioned that you were on the same combo, except for the dosage of Effexor. I take it (based on some of your other postings) that you have decreased it? What dosage are you on? I have reached a point where, if the WB SR turns out to be OK, I will try to further titrate down the Effexor. What has been your experience?
> > > Getting back to the hair loss, again. Yes, it is distressful, but the first time it happened I was 23 and I just about freaked! It has happened several times since then-- at times I have used Rogaine for women,-- and now that I am 43, I just take it in stride. My husband has seen me with bald spots, with sunsburned scalp and a receding hairline that looked like a man's--he is still with me, but even if he had split, I would have dealt with it. There are worse things in life, I have found out over the past two decades.
> > > Get back with me regarding your experiences. I appreciate your imput.
> > > Thanks and good luck!
> > > Kaysey
> >
> > Hey Kaysey!
> > No...I have not decreased off of effexor...I am
> > on 75mg although my doctor prescribed 150mg...
> > I am worried to take the prescribed amount if
> > it is as bad as all these people make it sound.
> > So...I am holding off.
> > The first week of taking the effexor was the worst
> > of it for me...leaving me real drowsy etc. But
> > all that went away and I now am more active and
> > more energetic than I was w/out it.
> >
> > That's a horrifying story about your hair loss.
> > And I know exactly how you have felt.
> > And I agree...there are worse things that can happen!
> > I too had a VERY burnt scalp for the first time
> > this year...it was awful when it was flaking!
> > Its growing back though and I now look like buck-
> > wheat!!!
> >
> > Oh-well...live and learn right?
> >
> > Take care and Good Luck to you too!!!
> > Dreamy
>
> Dreamy--I guess one thing that has come from this is I have one heck of a collection of hats! And, yes when the hair grows back in, it is weird looking, as I have longer than shoulder length blonde hair---and all of sudden there are these little spikes coming up at the crown and at the front, etc. Might as well laugh at these things, I guess.
> Still I would like your or other's 'long-term' (i.e greater than 6-8 weeks) experience with Wellbutrin --or a Wellbutrin combo (mine being with Effexor) (I know that you have recently had a good experience with adding the Effexor)--does the weakness fatigue subside with the Wellbutrin though--or did you even experience that?
> Thanks again.
> KayseyFunny...I have long blond hair too...except for the punk spikes all over the top!
And yep...got lots of hats too!
OK...
I don't think the welbutrin ever made me feel week or give me fatigue -but the effexor did.
Don't know what to tell you...too bad you can't get a good prescription...
Take it easy and good luck!
Dreamy
Posted by Dreamy on October 30, 2001, at 18:59:06
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB combo: update and ask for help, posted by Kaysey on October 25, 2001, at 19:09:15
Kaysey,
One more note for you...
Welbutrin will wear off quickly...
I at one time was taking three pills/day at about
3 hour intervals.
When the pill starts wearing off...I will start
to get fatigue-ish.
I told my doctor and was upped on the medication.
Hope that helps too!
Dreamy
Posted by Kaysey on October 30, 2001, at 20:45:24
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB combo: update and ask for help, posted by Dreamy on October 30, 2001, at 18:59:06
>
> Kaysey,
> One more note for you...
> Welbutrin will wear off quickly...
> I at one time was taking three pills/day at about
> 3 hour intervals.
> When the pill starts wearing off...I will start
> to get fatigue-ish.
> I told my doctor and was upped on the medication.
> Hope that helps too!
> DreamyDreamy:
Were/are you taking the immediate release form? I can't imagine any set of circumstances where one could take WB SR that often (my understanding is at least 8 hours apart, though I think there are people who do not follow that, but it is the general rule). What dosage were you taking and what are you taking now? What time frame have you been on it an how long did it take you to reach your current dosage? (forgive me if you have said this in another post--I try to keep up, but sometimes I miss things). I am currently at 250 mg SR (150 and 100 12 hours apart) and moving up to 300 mg SR. Thanks again for the info.
Kaysey
Posted by Dreamy on October 31, 2001, at 16:06:01
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB combo: » Dreamy, posted by Kaysey on October 30, 2001, at 20:45:24
> >
> > Kaysey,
> > One more note for you...
> > Welbutrin will wear off quickly...
> > I at one time was taking three pills/day at about
> > 3 hour intervals.
> > When the pill starts wearing off...I will start
> > to get fatigue-ish.
> > I told my doctor and was upped on the medication.
> > Hope that helps too!
> > Dreamy
>
> Dreamy:
> Were/are you taking the immediate release form? I can't imagine any set of circumstances where one could take WB SR that often (my understanding is at least 8 hours apart, though I think there are people who do not follow that, but it is the general rule). What dosage were you taking and what are you taking now? What time frame have you been on it an how long did it take you to reach your current dosage? (forgive me if you have said this in another post--I try to keep up, but sometimes I miss things). I am currently at 250 mg SR (150 and 100 12 hours apart) and moving up to 300 mg SR. Thanks again for the info.
> Kaysey150mG of WB-SR Morning, Noon and 3:00PM.
So 450 total...and WAY less than 8 hours apart.
Closer to every 3 hours.
If I wait 6 hours I start to hit the floor...
Can't imagine taking them so far apart!
Posted by Kaysey on November 1, 2001, at 7:21:09
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB combo:, posted by Dreamy on October 31, 2001, at 16:06:01
> > >
> > > Kaysey,
> > > One more note for you...
> > > Welbutrin will wear off quickly...
> > > I at one time was taking three pills/day at about
> > > 3 hour intervals.
> > > When the pill starts wearing off...I will start
> > > to get fatigue-ish.
> > > I told my doctor and was upped on the medication.
> > > Hope that helps too!
> > > Dreamy
> >
> > Dreamy:
> > Were/are you taking the immediate release form? I can't imagine any set of circumstances where one could take WB SR that often (my understanding is at least 8 hours apart, though I think there are people who do not follow that, but it is the general rule). What dosage were you taking and what are you taking now? What time frame have you been on it an how long did it take you to reach your current dosage? (forgive me if you have said this in another post--I try to keep up, but sometimes I miss things). I am currently at 250 mg SR (150 and 100 12 hours apart) and moving up to 300 mg SR. Thanks again for the info.
> > Kaysey
>
> 150mG of WB-SR Morning, Noon and 3:00PM.
> So 450 total...and WAY less than 8 hours apart.
> Closer to every 3 hours.
> If I wait 6 hours I start to hit the floor...
> Can't imagine taking them so far apart!Hi again!
Sorry to keep asking so many questions, but my curiosity just keeps going. How long did it take you to get to 450 mg WB SR? How long altogether have you been on it at any dose? What happens between 3PM and the next AM (i.e you are taking it at short intervals and then all of sudden you don't take anymore for 12-18 hours)? Obviously this works for you, so I am not questioning the dosage or administration of it, I am just amazed
at the disproportionate time intervals. Just another example of how we are all unique with regard to our responses!
Thanks again.
Kaysey
Posted by Dreamy on November 2, 2001, at 17:05:29
In reply to Re: Effexor/WB and more questions » Dreamy, posted by Kaysey on November 1, 2001, at 7:21:09
> > > >
> > > > Kaysey,
> > > > One more note for you...
> > > > Welbutrin will wear off quickly...
> > > > I at one time was taking three pills/day at about
> > > > 3 hour intervals.
> > > > When the pill starts wearing off...I will start
> > > > to get fatigue-ish.
> > > > I told my doctor and was upped on the medication.
> > > > Hope that helps too!
> > > > Dreamy
> > >
> > > Dreamy:
> > > Were/are you taking the immediate release form? I can't imagine any set of circumstances where one could take WB SR that often (my understanding is at least 8 hours apart, though I think there are people who do not follow that, but it is the general rule). What dosage were you taking and what are you taking now? What time frame have you been on it an how long did it take you to reach your current dosage? (forgive me if you have said this in another post--I try to keep up, but sometimes I miss things). I am currently at 250 mg SR (150 and 100 12 hours apart) and moving up to 300 mg SR. Thanks again for the info.
> > > Kaysey
> >
> > 150mG of WB-SR Morning, Noon and 3:00PM.
> > So 450 total...and WAY less than 8 hours apart.
> > Closer to every 3 hours.
> > If I wait 6 hours I start to hit the floor...
> > Can't imagine taking them so far apart!
>
> Hi again!
> Sorry to keep asking so many questions, but my curiosity just keeps going. How long did it take you to get to 450 mg WB SR? How long altogether have you been on it at any dose? What happens between 3PM and the next AM (i.e you are taking it at short intervals and then all of sudden you don't take anymore for 12-18 hours)? Obviously this works for you, so I am not questioning the dosage or administration of it, I am just amazed
> at the disproportionate time intervals. Just another example of how we are all unique with regard to our responses!
> Thanks again.
> KayseyKay,
Here's how it has gone...I was on Zoloft, but
couldn't control my sweet tooth...couldn't
concentrate at work...
Then I was put on WB...at 300mg which was good to
get me moving and get me out excersizing...and
I was on it for probably a year at that level.
I needed more of a boost however on nights that I
was going out, so I would take an additional one
early afternoon.BUT...I was still super depressed...would cry
uncontrollably...so the doc put me back on zoloft
and added a third WB to help w/the sugar cravings.From there I went to Prozac cause I was still
craving too much. And this was w/NO WB.Then the next year I went to Celexa, w/NO WB.
And about 6 months into the year...I was noticing
way too much hair fall out and attributed it
to the Celexa...simply went off.About 6 months later...noticed I had fallen into
a deep depression went in for my annual and asked
to be put back on WB. No problem.
Doctor also told me that the hair loss wasn't due
to the Celexa...which I of course believed him...
so I started taking that again. And my hair started
falling out again.
Sooo, again I quit taking it.Then went in again and I was upped on the WB w/no
other AD. (back to 450)Then went in again and got Effexor and was backed
down 150 of the WB.
I tell ya, I still take an extra WB occasionally...
and occasionally I forget to take my second one.The deal for me is that I crash from WB after about 3 to 4 hours.
So...for the most part...taking them 3 or 4 hours apart
has been just perfect for me...then at night, I am down
for the count...which is perfect.Occasionally I have noticed now however that that
third pill can bring on a panick attack, so I am
really carefull about taking a third one in a day.
Only do it under really critical situations...etc.Sooo, that's my story...
Frankly...I think you should be taking the WB's
closer together and not at night.
The crash I would feel w/just two was horrible.
When taking just two w/no Celexa this last time
around...was horrible. At three o-clock I would really
crash...taking the third one was just what I needed.OK...
I gatta go!
Take it easy!
Dreamy
Posted by maximillian on March 1, 2002, at 7:13:37
In reply to Reduction in Celexa or Increase in Wellbutrin?, posted by Simcha on October 8, 2001, at 7:33:28
i've been reading the postings concerning the two drugs. i take 150mg effexor in am and 150mg effexor at night...also believe it or not my neuro has perscribed 150mg wellbutrin in am and 150mg wellbutrin at night. excessive???? comments would be welcome. my main problem is sex...decreased libido and probs with very, very delayed (almost non-existant) ejaculations. i think the two drugs have helped in a lot of ways, but i the sexual thing has me bothered. would appreciate comments. i don't experience any tiredness at all at any time during the day.
Posted by ST on March 2, 2002, at 4:07:30
In reply to effexor xr and wellbutrin combo, posted by maximillian on March 1, 2002, at 7:13:37
Hi,
I don't think that sounds excessive - but everyone is different. I'm on 225 mg of Effexor XR and 300 mg of Wellbutrin daily. The libido thing really does stink...mine's diminished as well...
Sarah
Posted by maximillian on March 3, 2002, at 2:00:58
In reply to Re: effexor xr and wellbutrin combo, posted by ST on March 2, 2002, at 4:07:30
hey sarah,
well, i was just wondering. the 's' thing is pretty much a bummer. do you feel this combo has helped you? it seems as if its calmed me down a little. i wonder if there is something else out there that won't mess with the libido thing and just do what its suppose to?
max
Posted by ST on March 3, 2002, at 3:30:19
In reply to Re: effexor xr and wellbutrin combo » ST, posted by maximillian on March 3, 2002, at 2:00:58
I like this combo. In particular, I think Wellbutrin is a great drug.
When I was just on the Depakote and the Wellbutrin, my sex drive was fine. It was the addition of an SSRI. I think they all do that to our libidos! Although now that I've been on Effexor for a couple of months, my drive has increased and the annoying "anorgasmia" thing is gone.
Good luck!
Sarah
Posted by maximillian on March 3, 2002, at 6:35:03
In reply to Re: effexor xr and wellbutrin combo, posted by ST on March 3, 2002, at 3:30:19
well, i think when i go back to see my doc i'll talk to him in more detail about a possible switch to another less libido inhibiting type of d-drug. i do seem to have more under control and life seems somewhat okay again. playing my guitar more(five to six hours a-day) and that makes me real happy. reading more and laughing more, but still have this feeling of not accomplishing much in life, although i seem to suppress it better. good luck to you too, sarah.
max
Posted by Reneeb on March 5, 2002, at 13:34:26
In reply to effexor xr and wellbutrin combo, posted by maximillian on March 1, 2002, at 7:13:37
Hi Max, I was on effexor and wellbutrin and thought it worked great as far as my depresson. I am only on wellbutrin right now and boy has it make a big difference getting off the effexor. My sex drive has come back and I believe is a bit stronger then it was before. When I was on effexor I had no sex drive at all.
Good luck,
Renee
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