![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Alice Fay on March 3, 2001, at 17:59:57
I started on Effexor about 7 months ago. Gradually increased the dosage until I was taking 187 mg (5 pills). Found out by mistake from my internist a few weeks ago that my heart rate was up to 88 beats per minute at rest (my normal was 64), but my blood pressure was normal at that time. In the last 2 weeks, I began having more migraines (known side-effect of Effexor) and increased muscle tension to the point where my back muscles began to hurt quite badly. Per my psychiatrist, I went back down to 4 pills (150 mg). But three days ago, I discovered my blood pressure was up to 156/96 (my normal had been 120/70). So I stopped the Effexor cold turkey with my psychiatrists approval. Today I have felt quite ill: a dizzy feeling, nausea, dull headache. After reading all your information about the importance of gradual withdrawal, I then took 110 mg today. Call this an EFFEXOR NIGHTMARE. It is hard to consider staying on the medication at all, with what is to me, an alarming increase in my BP and HR. Thanks to all of you who have so kindly shared your stories to help the rest of us. Thank you, Dr. Bob! I am also interested in whether anyone else has had side effects from Effexor like those I have had. Bless and good luck to you all!
Posted by ItsJustMe on March 3, 2001, at 20:19:07
In reply to New thread; effexor withdrawal , bad bad news, posted by Alice Fay on March 3, 2001, at 17:59:57
I went from 450 mg/day to 300 mg/day cold turkey without any problems whatsoever. Maybe it is different since I'm not totally going off the med. ???
> I started on Effexor about 7 months ago. Gradually increased the dosage until I was taking 187 mg (5 pills). Found out by mistake from my internist a few weeks ago that my heart rate was up to 88 beats per minute at rest (my normal was 64), but my blood pressure was normal at that time. In the last 2 weeks, I began having more migraines (known side-effect of Effexor) and increased muscle tension to the point where my back muscles began to hurt quite badly. Per my psychiatrist, I went back down to 4 pills (150 mg). But three days ago, I discovered my blood pressure was up to 156/96 (my normal had been 120/70). So I stopped the Effexor cold turkey with my psychiatrists approval. Today I have felt quite ill: a dizzy feeling, nausea, dull headache. After reading all your information about the importance of gradual withdrawal, I then took 110 mg today. Call this an EFFEXOR NIGHTMARE. It is hard to consider staying on the medication at all, with what is to me, an alarming increase in my BP and HR. Thanks to all of you who have so kindly shared your stories to help the rest of us. Thank you, Dr. Bob! I am also interested in whether anyone else has had side effects from Effexor like those I have had. Bless and good luck to you all!
Posted by dj on March 4, 2001, at 3:21:19
In reply to Re: New thread; effexor withdrawal , bad bad news, posted by ItsJustMe on March 3, 2001, at 20:19:07
As I only very briefly tried Effexor I can't comment on it's effects other than recalling a tension headache during the week or so I tested it. I'm curious whether your symptoms are in the drug profile. I'm particularly curious about the tension and back pain you've experienced and what sort of impact ADs in general, and effexor in particular, have on muscles' tone. Cam or Sunnely may be the best to answer the general question.
Good luck sorting it out...
dj
> I started on Effexor about 7 months ago. Gradually increased the dosage until I was taking 187 mg (5 pills). Found out by mistake from my internist a few weeks ago that my heart rate was up to 88 beats per minute at rest (my normal was 64), but my blood pressure was normal at that time. In the last 2 weeks, I began having more migraines (known side-effect of Effexor) and increased muscle tension to the point where my back muscles began to hurt quite badly. Per my psychiatrist, I went back down to 4 pills (150 mg). But three days ago, I discovered my blood pressure was up to 156/96 (my normal had been 120/70).
...interested in whether anyone else has had side effects from Effexor like those I have had. Bless and good luck to you all!
Posted by willow on March 4, 2001, at 10:19:32
In reply to Re: New thread; effexor effects, Cam, Sunnely etc?, posted by dj on March 4, 2001, at 3:21:19
When I first started the effexor XR I too had muscle pain, tension in jaw, and headaches. The headaches I fixed by splitting the dose into twice a day. I have had a chronic problem with my muscles so I was able to use methods I've had for combatting them. (pills, relaxation, and light stretching) They did all go away.
Alice Fay
Are you taking the XR version? I am and I've had an increase in my blood pressure and pulse. I've split my dose into twice a day and I think perhaps sometimes I may have forgotten that I've taken a dose and may have taken an extra one? I'm not sure. The doctor had me wear a monitor for 24 hrs to see if it was related to the time I take my medications. The lady who hooked it up said caffeine can increase both so I've bought decaffeinated coffee. I go tomorrow to discuss the results and will write back if I get any useful info.
Willow
Posted by Alice Fay on March 4, 2001, at 21:36:05
In reply to Re: New thread; effexor side effects, , posted by willow on March 4, 2001, at 10:19:32
Thank you Willow and all others for your prompt and helpful responses to my first e-mail about my problems going off Effexor and the side effects I am having from Effexor. Willow, yes, I am taking the Effexor XR. Yes, in response to another query, I have seen from side-effect lists that muscle tension can be a side-effect of Effexor. In my case, the elevated blood pressure and the extreme increase in muscle tension did not begin until a few weeks after I increased to 187 mg. (probably, when the higher dose began taking effect). I am pretty clear that the Effexor did markedly increase the muscle tension in my neck, back and one leg. I can see no other reason for this increased tension; the extent to which I was not used to experiencing.
Willow, I'm glad your headaches and muscle tension went away after a while and by splitting your doses. However, I do not think this is the drug for me, given the nature of how many and how serious my side-effects with this drug have been. I question whether my highly elevated BP and HR would go away, given what I have read in the literature. So I am continuing on with my process of trying to withdraw from the drug. It is unfortunate that my psychiatrist did not advise me to taper when I spoke to him on Friday. I did though, after reading about Effexor withdrawal problems at this web site, but apparently tapered too quickly over the weekend. I am still headachy, dizzy, with dull headache, and very nauseous. Fortunately I see the psychiatrist tomorrow, and plan to get meds for the headaches, nausea and get his advice re: tapering. I hope his is aware of the serious withdrawal phenomena, but if he is not I guess I'll be educating him. Thanks again to all who responded to me, and good luck to all of you. I am still very interested in hearing anyone else's withdrawal experiences and/or side-effects with Effexor. What a great service this is.
> When I first started the effexor XR I too had muscle pain, tension in jaw, and headaches. The headaches I fixed by splitting the dose into twice a day. I have had a chronic problem with my muscles so I was able to use methods I've had for combatting them. (pills, relaxation, and light stretching) They did all go away.
>
> Alice Fay
>
> Are you taking the XR version? I am and I've had an increase in my blood pressure and pulse. I've split my dose into twice a day and I think perhaps sometimes I may have forgotten that I've taken a dose and may have taken an extra one? I'm not sure. The doctor had me wear a monitor for 24 hrs to see if it was related to the time I take my medications. The lady who hooked it up said caffeine can increase both so I've bought decaffeinated coffee. I go tomorrow to discuss the results and will write back if I get any useful info.
>
> Willow
Posted by pat123 on March 4, 2001, at 22:44:33
In reply to Re: New thread; effexor side effects, » willow, posted by Alice Fay on March 4, 2001, at 21:36:05
I did not have raised BP for several years but it started going up 3 years ago. Effexor is the only one that works, I have tried more than 10 others,
and there is no resason to expect the new SNRI to be any better in this respect. (raised BP) It is expected that anything that effects nor adrenalin
will have cardiac effect in some. I was allready
taking a small dose of Inderal to help with an existing problem so we just upped that and the BP
came down. I stopped smoking and we could lower the Inderal some, I suspect if I can lose some weight this will improve my BP as well.Pat
Posted by dj on March 4, 2001, at 23:29:32
In reply to Re: New thread; effexor side effects, » willow, posted by Alice Fay on March 4, 2001, at 21:36:05
>Yes, in response to another query, I have seen from side-effect lists that muscle tension can be a side-effect of Effexor. In my case, the elevated blood pressure and the extreme increase in muscle tension did not begin until a few weeks after I increased to 187 mg. (probably, when the higher dose began taking effect). I am pretty clear that the Effexor did markedly increase the muscle tension in my neck, back and one leg. I can see no other reason for this increased tension; the extent to which I was not used to >experiencing.
What would the deal on this be and is this a side effect of other ADs? As I've state elsewhere I've noted my muscle tone and tension to have altered both with and without ADs (though certainly in refelction of my anxiety/depresion levels) and am curious about the correlation. Any insights would be appreciated about this dynamic, which is vexing and would have cost me lots in massage and chiropractory charges if it was not partially covered by B.C.'s medicare system, which still does not suffice for my fasciae and muscular strains and energy drains...
dj
Posted by Alice Fay on March 5, 2001, at 10:30:36
In reply to Muscle tension side effects, Cam, Sunnely???, posted by dj on March 4, 2001, at 23:29:32
> >Yes, in response to another query, I have seen from side-effect lists that muscle tension can be a side-effect of Effexor. In my case, the elevated blood pressure and the extreme increase in muscle tension did not begin until a few weeks after I increased to 187 mg. (probably, when the higher dose began taking effect). I am pretty clear that the Effexor did markedly increase the muscle tension in my neck, back and one leg. I can see no other reason for this increased tension; the extent to which I was not used to >experiencing.
>
> What would the deal on this be and is this a side effect of other ADs? As I've state elsewhere I've noted my muscle tone and tension to have altered both with and without ADs (though certainly in refelction of my anxiety/depresion levels) and am curious about the correlation. Any insights would be appreciated about this dynamic, which is vexing and would have cost me lots in massage and chiropractory charges if it was not partially covered by B.C.'s medicare system, which still does not suffice for my fasciae and muscular strains and energy drains...
>
> dj
Good question, dj, I hope that Cam and Suneley will respond soon. The muscle tension I have noticed is very unusual and rather extreme, and as I said, it is not normal for me. I am a physical therapist myself, and the tone in my muscles is markedly higher than what I have experienced before. I'll ask my psychiatrist what he thinks about it today; but don't hope for a clear answer, but will follow up with you. Thanks for your comment.
Posted by dj on March 5, 2001, at 10:44:13
In reply to Re: Muscle tension side effects, Cam, Sunnely??? » dj, posted by Alice Fay on March 5, 2001, at 10:30:36
> > > dj
> Good question, dj, I hope that Cam and Suneley will respond soon. The muscle tension I have noticed is very unusual and rather extreme, and as I said, it is not normal for me. I am a physical therapist myself, and the tone in my muscles is markedly higher than what I have experienced before. I'll ask my psychiatrist what he thinks about it today; but don't hope for a clear answer, but will follow up with you. >Thanks for your comment.I raised the issue below as well in: Re: Muscle/fascia tone, depression and ADs, CamW, Sunn so hopefully Cam, Sunnely or someone else who is insightful and knowledgable about ADs and their impacts will make some comment in one or both of these threads, sometime soon. Be interested to hear what your p-doc. has to say as well, if anything.
Posted by Cam W. on March 5, 2001, at 13:49:38
In reply to Re: Muscle tension side effects, Cam, Sunnely??? » Alice Fay, posted by dj on March 5, 2001, at 10:44:13
Sorry guys - I don't know the answer and haven't come across it in my readings. I'll keep an eye out for it. - Cam
Posted by willow on March 5, 2001, at 21:25:51
In reply to Re: Muscle tension side effects, -Sorry Guys » dj, posted by Cam W. on March 5, 2001, at 13:49:38
My muscle tension always gets worse when my sleep is disturbed. I've had this problem before the Effexor. The Effexor made my sleep disturbed through the muscle jerks, sweating, and dreams. I think poor sleep can make me hypersensitive. (Like when you're overtired and the ticking clock drives you nuts.) Over the weekend I had company resulting in altered sleeping pattern resulting in some fatigue, and today when I got my B12 shot I literally felt the needle being inserted and withdrawn.
So my theory is if something disturbs your sleep it can result in muscle tension.
Willow, one of my many opinions.
Posted by dj on March 5, 2001, at 21:33:16
In reply to Muscle tension: My theory ..., posted by willow on March 5, 2001, at 21:25:51
> So my theory is if something disturbs your >sleep it can result in muscle tension.
That's true, however sustained over-tensed muscles (part of the fight or flight stress reaction)can also interfere with your sleep, so it can come from either direction and one can contribute to the other...and it is possible some ADs may have a contributory effect as well... I wonder how this all relates to Chronic Fatigue Syndrome which some have characterized as being related to depression?
Posted by willow on March 5, 2001, at 22:18:08
In reply to Re: Muscle tension: My theory ...and vice versa.. » willow, posted by dj on March 5, 2001, at 21:33:16
"That's true, however sustained over-tensed muscles (part of the fight or flight stress reaction)can also interfere with your sleep, so it can come from either direction and one can contribute to the other"
This is why I think it turns into a chronic problem. If you can break the cycle it makes a chance of relief. For myself the effexor probably dulled the "fight or flight" response and the baclofen relaxes the muscles and as a reult I'm started to feel normal again. (eg. normal characteristics returning pre CFS) The main problem I have is to take it slow so not to over tax my poor out of shape body and thus start the cycle again (that hasn't completely resolved.)
"...and it is possible some ADs may have a contributory effect as well..."
Definetly, especially if it increases anxiety or impairs sleep, etc.
"I wonder how this all relates to Chronic Fatigue Syndrome which some have characterized as being related to depression?"
My psychologist said something like chronic anxiety wears you down and the result is depression. I don't remember how it exactly went, but at the time it made some sense. For myself when the CFS started emotionally I was okay I was just starting to have brief weird sensations which I mostly attributed to electrical shorts in our appliances and couldn't figure out why noone else was getting shocked. (I probably have a phobia for housework. :) But the hypersomnia and fatigue I couldn't ignore. Even though I tried to stay awake it was impossible. This in itself caused anxiety for me, I can recall the feeling, and then I just gave in, perhaps depression?
Who knows?
Willow
Posted by Alice Fay on March 6, 2001, at 0:59:37
In reply to Re: Muscle tension: My theory ...and vice versa.. » willow, posted by dj on March 5, 2001, at 21:33:16
> > So my theory is if something disturbs your >sleep it can result in muscle tension.
>
> That's true, however sustained over-tensed muscles (part of the fight or flight stress reaction)can also interfere with your sleep, so it can come from either direction and one can contribute to the other...and it is possible some ADs may have a contributory effect as well... I wonder how this all relates to Chronic Fatigue Syndrome which some have characterized as being related to depression?Some interesting thoughts here. Thanks dj and willow for your comments. First, I think you have a very good point, willow, that sleep deprivation probably can increase muscle tension. The effexor xr has certainly caused me to lose sleep (in more ways than one!), and I think this may have played a part (but only a part) in the increased muscle tension I have experienced.
But I read dj's comment as saying that ADs (does that mean adrenergics? That's what I thought) can, through the "fight or flight" response, directly stimulate or overstimulate skeletal muscles, which might even lead to muscle spasms or sore, tight muscles (such as in my case). Thanks for reminding me of this adrenergic reaction of the muscles, dj. Actually, this concept of muscle "overactivation" from the "fight or flight" response is a tenet of many physical therapists and bodyworkers like myself.
So that is why I'm a little confused why your doctors, Willow, would give you one drug, that causes in you some profound adrenergic side-effects, such as high BP and HR, and from your own account, increased muscle tension, and then give you Baclofen, which basically undoes what the Effexor most likely actually aggravated! (That is, an increase in your muscle tension.) Very, very strange, I think, but that is my opinion. I think what dj was saying was not (as you thought) that Effexor might decrease the "fight or flight" response, but that the sympathetic stimulation it causes, actually can create that response.
All the doctors (including some psych ones) I have
talked with about the high blood pressure side effect of Effexor have seen that as a reason for discontinuing the drug.I also have been interested in the link between CFS and depression, dj. Interesting, that is may be due to overstimulation of the sympathetic nervous system. In looking at some websites, I saw that fibromyalgia is linked to too much epinephrine in the nervous system. Well, I'm not about to wait on this dose of Effexor to see if it will cause even longer-term muscle pain than I already have (feels like temporary symptoms of fibromyalgia). Anyway, I HOPE it is temporary.
So today, I saw my psych M.D. who did not quarrel with my assertion that my increased Effexor dose caused increased muscle tension and pain. I am tapering off the drug, and he gave me an Rx for Valium to help with the muscle tension I am still experiencing.
Anyway, did not want to be preachy or anything, Willow, but thought you might want to think about those things. Hope it helps.
Posted by dj on March 6, 2001, at 5:27:32
In reply to Re: Muscle tension and ADs, posted by Alice Fay on March 6, 2001, at 0:59:37
> But I read dj's comment as saying that ADs (does that mean adrenergics? That's what I thought) can, through the "fight or flight" response, directly stimulate or overstimulate skeletal muscles, which might even lead to muscle spasms or sore, tight muscles (such as in my case). Thanks for reminding me of this adrenergic reaction of the muscles, dj...
...some profound adrenergic side-effects, such as >high BP and HRI just awoke in the early a.m. because anxiety from a dream I was having (and a full bladder awoke me) so just jotting this off as the fatigue kicks back in.
I generally try to avoid abbreviations (acronyms ?)and jargon unless I'm quite certain those I'm communicating with understand them. However we all slip. In an exchange above under: Re: And... » danf dj 3/6/01, I am querying Danf about the meaning of BP and HR though I figured it out by the context and Alice, your comments and context of use of the same ensures me that I was right. However, when I use ADs, usually the only acronymn I use on this board, I mean it as short hand for anti-depressants.
Regardless your musings about adrenal effects are interesting and do definitely play a role, linked to anxiety (which is what the discussion thread above focuses on) and sleep patterns. However for each of us the sequence of patterns, cause and effect can vary, though they can all lead to similar results in dis-ease and dysfunction of brain, body, etc...
That noted, I'm taking my tired, over-tense body back to bed...
dj
Posted by willow on March 6, 2001, at 9:26:16
In reply to Re: Muscle tension and ADs, posted by dj on March 6, 2001, at 5:27:32
Alice
When it comes to body chemicals etc I'm quite illiterate. For myself I consider the muscle tension and pain as an inconvenience, though it does become intense if I'm not careful, compared to the thought problems and fatigue.
With the effexor I'm finally able to wakeup on my own after five years. (My children are still amazed when I get up without being awoken.) I also find my memory and thought processes improving, plus as an added bonus my stamina is slowly increasing.
As DJ has speculated I do believe with myself the muscle problems have come from poor posture etc. After the births of my last two children I didn't do the strengthening exercises as faithfully as I had done after the first one. I suspect this added to the problem.
Thanks for the input Alice. I do admit that I don't understand how these medications work, but I'm just happy to have somewhat of a normal semblance back.
Willow
Posted by dj on March 6, 2001, at 10:59:09
In reply to Re: Muscle tension and ADs, posted by willow on March 6, 2001, at 9:26:16
> As DJ has speculated I do believe with myself the muscle problems have come from poor posture etc. After the births of my last two children I didn't do the strengthening exercises as faithfully as I had done after the first one. I >suspect this added to the problem.
And just as there are positive feedback loops there are negative ones with one negative impact contributing to and reinforcing another and another, as posture deters due to neglect because attention is focused more on anxiety, obsessing, depressing or what have you...
My question still remains though about what effects ADs may play in the physical manifestations of these cycles - both positive and negative...???
Posted by Alice Fay on March 6, 2001, at 19:07:45
In reply to Re: Muscle tension and ADs, posted by dj on March 6, 2001, at 10:59:09
> > As DJ has speculated I do believe with myself the muscle problems have come from poor posture etc. After the births of my last two children I didn't do the strengthening exercises as faithfully as I had done after the first one. I >suspect this added to the problem.
>
> And just as there are positive feedback loops there are negative ones with one negative impact contributing to and reinforcing another and another, as posture deters due to neglect because attention is focused more on anxiety, obsessing, depressing or what have you...
>
> My question still remains though about what effects ADs may play in the physical manifestations of these cycles - both positive and negative...???Thanks, willow and dj, for your comments and words of wisdom. When I thought you were talking about "Adrenergics" (AD), guess I got a little carried away thinking about how Effexor has caused these other side effects for me then when I was taking some SSRIs (like prozac). Well, thanks dj for letting me know that ADs means "antidepressants". (And sorry about using the abbreviations HR and BP for heart rate and blood pressure). I feel a little foolish now. Oh well!
I do realize that these medications have different effects on different people. I mean, I did think Effexor was better for me than the SSRIs at first because it seemed to decrease some of the anxiety I felt when on the SSRIs. Though I'm aware that for some people, SSRIs can actually help to decrease their anxiety.
Also, the blood pressure increase and increased muscle tension didn't happen for me until I jumped up to 187 mg. of the Effexor XR. (the heart rate problem may have occurred earlier). So it could very well be that other people don't get these "adrenergic" side effects at all, or else they are more likely to get them when they reach a dose which may be too high for them. Or, if the medication benefits outweigh the annoyance or danger of side-effects, they still may choose to stay on the drug. One other responder said she decided to simply increase her dose of the BP med she was already taking, and that seemed to work for her. I've also heard that Effexor is actually prescribed by some MDs partly because it is supposed to HELP with muscle tension! Well, it certainly didn't do that for me, but maybe it helps for some people at lower doses, or whatever.
So by "adrenergic" I mean the neurotransmitter norepinephrine, which becomes more plentiful in the brain with Effexor. The SSRIs don't have an effect on norepinephrine, so they are not adrenergic. I believe the effexor side effects such as increased heart rate and blood pressure, and probably also increased muscle tension have been attributed to the effects of norepinephrine, and not to serotonin. It is neurotransmitters in the class of norepinephrine (the "adrenergics"), and not serotonin, that are thought to contribute to the "fight or flight" response, which is characterized by all the symptoms above.
I think its great that Effexor has helped you so much, Willow. I might be in bed all day myself if it wasn't for antidepressants. It makes sense that the cause of your muscular pain and tension was from posture and possibly lack of exercise (I was also wondering if muscle tension/pain is a common ailment of people with CFS; I don't know very much about CFS). I too have had problems with one shoulder, an old back injury, and a previous tendency for mild tension in my left calf. However, as I said before, in the last few weeks the tension in this areas became MUCH more pronounced, to the point of becoming quite painful. So I was just wondering whether that might also be the case for you, and whether (or not) you may have reached a dose on the Effexor which might have aggravated your pre-existing muscle tension. On the other hand, if you have some good ways of relieving the tension (sounds like you have), and Effexor is working so well for you, I can see why you might want to keep taking it!
I don't know, I've just had too many side-effects with Effexor, and the BP and muscle ones were sort of the last straw for me. (I have also have had extremely dry mouth, more migraines (another one of Effexor's side-effects), itchiness, trouble getting to sleep, and a few others I can't think of right now.) For me, 150 mg didn't help enough with some of my depressive symptoms, and my body does not seem to tolerate 187 mg well.
So I'm not sure what my psych MD and I will do after I wean from the Effexor. I've recently accepted that my depressions are so severe and close together that I will probably have to be on a "maintenance" dose of whatever AD that ends up working for me. He is thinking of Elavil or amitryptaline, a tricyclic AD, and I need to do a little research on that drug. Have either of you ever tried that? A couple things I know about it are that it can prevent migraines (which I also suffer from)it is good for pain, also it is good for anxiety. I have a vague idea that some people with CFS take it, but maybe I'm wrong.
DJ, as I said I'm new to this site, and am wondering if you also suffer from CFS (I wasn't sure). Anyway, as I said I think probably any antidepressant that increases norepinephrine, particularly at higher doses, could potentially step-up or even trigger the "fight or flight"/muscle tension cycle. I think there might be research supporting this, but don't have the energy or time to look into it further. But I think that any medication/AD that decreases one's anxiety, and as Willow suggested, helps one's sleep, would tend to have the opposite effect. Certainly any drug or activity that relaxes you, I would think would help to relax the muscles. Well, anyway, these are my ideas and theories, based in part on some things that have been studied. Perhaps Cam could shed some light on these ideas.
Hope my long-windedness hasn't annoyed you guys. Take care. I'm looking forward to continuing this conversation, if you so desire!
Posted by willow on March 6, 2001, at 23:49:24
In reply to Re: Muscle tension and ADs, posted by Alice Fay on March 6, 2001, at 19:07:45
Alice
I've been on many different AD's (I too am starting to learn these abbreviations, in the admin section there's a post concerning them and lists many of the more common ones, I'll look it up tomorrow for you) and the side-effects had been worse than anything the drugs had positive in them for me. I had actually given up on AD's until my latest setback and my new doctor suggested effexor.
I too have the itchines, plus I get pleasure from chewing my finger nails now. My eldest is constantly after me to stop. I do it on the sly! :)
When going off the effexor lower your dose real slowly. Plus go through the threads to see what has helped other people, there's some good advice in them.
For me I think the ephrenine (sp) has given me the boost I needed. I too had problems with my BP and HR and I think it came when I accidentally take an extra dose, boosting me from 150 upto 225mg daily. I was almost in tears at the thought that the doctor may want to take away my rx. When I had the halter on I made an extra effort to stay relaxed no strenuous activity, and it must have worked because the test came back fine. I'm just going to take it slow concerning my physical rehab. Enough about myself!
Have you ever kept a journal concerning your physcial activity. You may find an activity that aggravates your symptoms. I know my physical therapist sure gets a regular workout and I couldn't imagine being able to carry on like that for a full eight hours.
Concerning the Elavil I have a friend who is taking it for nerve pain and it is helping her. If you have had side effects from other ADs I would consider starting at a very low dose and very slowly upping it. I know this way is harder but in the long wrong it will probably help out because you won't get discouraged with the meds like I had. There's some people on the board who believe that if the side-effects outway the benefits in the first few weeks to trash the med. There seems to be alot of different ADs out there don't give up until you find a suitable one.
BEST WISHES
Willow
Posted by dj on March 7, 2001, at 0:50:40
In reply to Re: Muscle tension and ADs, posted by Alice Fay on March 6, 2001, at 19:07:45
> DJ, as I said I'm new to this site, and am wondering if you also suffer from CFS (I wasn't sure). Anyway, as I said I think probably any antidepressant that increases norepinephrine, particularly at higher doses, could potentially step-up or even trigger the "fight or flight"/muscle tension cycle. I think there might be research supporting this, but don't have the energy or time to look into it further. But I think that any medication/AD that decreases one's anxiety, and as Willow suggested, helps one's sleep, would tend to have the opposite effect. Certainly any drug or activity that relaxes you, I would think would help to relax the muscles. Well, anyway, these are my ideas and theories, based in part on some things that have been studied. Perhaps Cam could shed some >light on these ideas.
AF,
Long postings are good, if they are thoughtful and well articulated as yours most certainly are! I am very tired and have to get up early so I'm not going to go on long. CSF for me (they have a more gibbled jargonistic name for it in Canada, as I discovered last night while doing some on-line searching) I don't think so based on a quick review of a couple of sites, though I have had low energy and lots of physical tension, particularly in the past couple of years. A lot of it from just being too apathetic, dis-spirited and sedentary after some bad breaks and a resurge of massive anxiety (social and general and definitely to do with perfectionism), followed by major depression on top of dysthamia (ie. - double depression) followed by a low level mania (hypomania ??) and major depression again, which has leveled out but still struggling with apathy, tension, disillusionment, some anxiety and depression never mind a lot of lousy advice from the medical types and therapists I've dealt with - so add on a healthy dose of disgust, stir it all together and you have discontent, upset, frustration and confusion which dispels somewhat on sunnier days, which we've had our fair share of on Canada's often wet-coast.
ADs, I've dabbled with over the past year or so but have mixed feelings about them, though discussing some possibilities again - perhaps some Prozac combo. Remains to be seen.... Neurophsyiology (ie. mental biofeedback using software) session tomorrow a.m. and meeting with a new/old p-doc. and therapist tomorrow for some discussions. Been doing a bit of the former once a week for the past 1.5 months and it seems to help with my sleep and anxiety some... but the juries still out...
Sante!
dj
P.S. - Massage and chiro. have been helpful at times in dealing with upper body tension which is partially a result of general anxieties and tensions, apathy, computer-time, slack exercise habits, etc... May be doing some physio.over the next while to rebalance but energy firtt...
Elavil I know sweet tweet about...
However
Posted by Alice Fay on March 8, 2001, at 21:44:24
In reply to New thread; effexor withdrawal , bad bad news, posted by Alice Fay on March 3, 2001, at 17:59:57
Thanks again, Willow and dj for your kind and very helpful comments and sharing.
I'm glad your HR and BP went down with the monitoring, Willow. Yeah, sometimes I've forgotten if or how much of the Effexor pills I take too. Very thoughtful comment about asking about my activity level or physical issues re: my working as a physical therapist. Yes, it can be hard on the body. In fact, my job plus perhaps too strenuous yoga brought on 2 shoulder injuries, the first of which in turn led to my latest major depression. And since a recent car accident I also have to be very careful about my back in the work I do. Not to mention stress.
Even though I only work p/t now as a physical therapist, I have been under a lot of additional stress lately because I'm in my last semester in a grad program in clinical psychology. The main stress is in writing my thesis, which is due 8 weeks from now. I'm sure all of the above has contributed to my muscle tension.It must be hard, dj, to deal with a major depression and/or its aftermath without meds. Neat that the biofeedback has helped you somewhat with your anxiety and muscle tension. At times, even on antidepressants, I have felt so drained and exhausted that CFS, or coming down with it, has crossed my mind.
I guess many of us depression sufferers must have a lot in common. I too have dysthymia and so my latest depression has been a "double depression". It has lasted more than 2 years. I also suffer from different kinds of anxiety, social anxiety among them. And since I injured my first shoulder and came down with the depression over two years ago, I stopped doing yoga (which before I had done avidly) and exercising as much: partly due to my shoulder injury, and of course partly due to the depression. My issues with social anxiety really came out in my last session with my psychotherapist.
The valium I've been taking for about 2 days has helped decrease my muscle tension and also some symptoms of anxiety a bit. But I know this is not a good permanent solution. I hope that soon, perhaps after finishing school, I can get back into a yoga and/or meditation practice that will help me to manage my anxiety in a more natural way.
So far its been better with the weaning process from Effexor, on 3 1/2 pills now, will go down slowly. No more withdrawal symptoms like I had last weekend. Thank you, Willow, and I have looked at the other threads re: Effexor withdrawal, and they have definitely helped.
Again, thank you both for your comments and kindness. Wishing you both well,
- AF
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