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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Brandon on January 26, 2000, at 19:35:35
Well tonight I went to my local GNC and bought a couple of bottles of the amino acid L-Tyrosine. The bottle contains 1000mg. tablets. I was wondering if anyone here had any experience with this. I am a little curious about dosing and amount. I am taking it to improve my concentration and to relieve some minor fatigue I experience in the mornings upon awakening. Any and all anecdotes are appreciated thanks.
Brandon
Posted by dj on January 27, 2000, at 2:46:07
In reply to Tyrosine supplementation , posted by Brandon on January 26, 2000, at 19:35:35
No experience but I'll be interested to hear how you find it. I believe the book "The Way Up From Down" by Priscilla Slagle, MD may have that info. as she focuses on amino acids. A browse on-line (use google for search) will probably yield you info. on this.
Posted by jd on January 27, 2000, at 2:52:33
In reply to Tyrosine supplementation , posted by Brandon on January 26, 2000, at 19:35:35
I tried this a few years back. I actually bought the closely related amino acid DL-phenylalanine (sp?) (a dopamine/norepinephrine precursor), as I had heard that tyrosine can cause high blood pressure in susceptible people. (I'm hypertensive.) Your mileage may vary, but I had a strong 24-hour mood boost with just quarter of a GNC capsule--along with a "wired" feeling that wasn't entirely pleasant. (Rightly or wrongly, I now associate that feeling with elevated blood pressure, so it's been crossed off my list along with tyrosine...)
Bottom line--I'd be cautious with dosage until you know how your system's reacting to it. I'd be especially prudent if you're taking any other meds that act on norepinephrine. (And of course, don't even think of it if you're taking an MAOI!)
best,
jd> Well tonight I went to my local GNC and bought a couple of bottles of the amino acid L-Tyrosine. The bottle contains 1000mg. tablets. I was wondering if anyone here had any experience with this. I am a little curious about dosing and amount. I am taking it to improve my concentration and to relieve some minor fatigue I experience in the mornings upon awakening. Any and all anecdotes are appreciated thanks.
>
> Brandon
Posted by Cam W. on January 27, 2000, at 7:22:40
In reply to Re: Tyrosine supplementation , posted by jd on January 27, 2000, at 2:52:33
> I tried this a few years back. I actually bought the closely related amino acid DL-phenylalanine (sp?) (a dopamine/norepinephrine precursor), as I had heard that tyrosine can cause high blood pressure in susceptible people. (I'm hypertensive.) Your mileage may vary, but I had a strong 24-hour mood boost with just quarter of a GNC capsule--along with a "wired" feeling that wasn't entirely pleasant. (Rightly or wrongly, I now associate that feeling with elevated blood pressure, so it's been crossed off my list along with tyrosine...)
>
> Bottom line--I'd be cautious with dosage until you know how your system's reacting to it. I'd be especially prudent if you're taking any other meds that act on norepinephrine. (And of course, don't even think of it if you're taking an MAOI!)
>
> best,
> jd
>
> > Well tonight I went to my local GNC and bought a couple of bottles of the amino acid L-Tyrosine. The bottle contains 1000mg. tablets. I was wondering if anyone here had any experience with this. I am a little curious about dosing and amount. I am taking it to improve my concentration and to relieve some minor fatigue I experience in the mornings upon awakening. Any and all anecdotes are appreciated thanks.
> >
> > BrandonBrandon - jd's advice is very good (& yes phenyalanine was spelled correctly - an amino acid)
I really do not believe it will help with your concentration. A safer alternative may be Gingko biloba for concentration. These products only work if your concentration is already compromised (eg. as in Alzheimer's). If you are trying to boost brain power, the only way to do it is to exercise your brain more. Good luck - Cam W.
Posted by Brandon on January 27, 2000, at 11:18:19
In reply to Re: Tyrosine supplementation , posted by Cam W. on January 27, 2000, at 7:22:40
Well thank you for the follow ups. I tried my first dose this morning and at 2000mg. I was nicely stimulated. I think though that it synergized with the vinpocetine I take. Does anyone know if a tolerance level can occur with this? Also to Cam I run 2 miles every day and you are correct, daily aerobic activity releases a host of beneficial hormones that strengthen the brain and release nuerotransmitters. Thanks again and dj I will let you know on my progress.
Brandon
Posted by JohnB on January 28, 2000, at 3:01:42
In reply to Re: Tyrosine supplementation , posted by Cam W. on January 27, 2000, at 7:22:40
Ginko Biloba helped me lift the mental fog that comes with depressive illness. It helped me maintain focus on my work long enough to really accomplish something on several occasions. I'm a big fan.
Posted by Sigolene on January 28, 2000, at 5:00:07
In reply to Re: Tyrosine supplementation , posted by JohnB on January 28, 2000, at 3:01:42
> Ginko Biloba helped me lift the mental fog that comes with depressive illness. It helped me maintain focus on my work long enough to really accomplish something on several occasions. I'm a big fan.
Sorry, it's maybe a stupid question,but what is Ginko Biloba ? Is it like "Ginseng" ?
About tyrosine, I tried it, and it had good effect on my depression. But I had to stop it because of side effect: stomachache due to nervousness.esquisse
Posted by JohnB on January 28, 2000, at 14:58:06
In reply to Re: Tyrosine supplementation , posted by Sigolene on January 28, 2000, at 5:00:07
> Sorry, it's maybe a stupid question,but what is Ginko Biloba ? Is it like "Ginseng" ?Gingko Biloba is an herb derived from the Ginko tree, native to Japan, I believe. If you can't find it where you live, order it on-line.
When I take it, I don't feel "better". I don't notice a thing. I just notice I'm able to concentrate for longer periods of time, without feeling fatigued or wanting to space out.
I think I read somewhere that it's very popular in Germany & some other parts of Europe.
Posted by JohnL on January 28, 2000, at 18:02:37
In reply to Re: Tyrosine supplementation , posted by Sigolene on January 28, 2000, at 5:00:07
Whether tyrosine helps or not depends on whether the underlying problem is dopamine deficiency. Some depressions, anxieties, phobias, and schizophrenias can be caused by excess dopamine. Either a shortage or an overabundance will have undesirable psychiatric symptoms. If there is no dopamine deficiency to begin with, tyrosine supplementation will either do nothing or will produce uncomfortable results. On the other hand, if there is a dopamine deficiency, typrosine could work wonders. No way to find out I guess without trying.
Even if the neurotransmitter levels are OK, they might not be functioning properly. In that case, no amount of supplementation will work. Instead they would need stimulating or substituting. And that's where the stimulants take over. Or they might be unstable, requiring a mood stabilizer. I wish it were as easy as popping a tyrosine supplement and getting better, but it just isn't that simple. If it by chance happens to target the appropriate malfunction, fantastic. But it might not. JohnL
Posted by Cam W. on January 28, 2000, at 18:10:32
In reply to Re: Tyrosine supplementation , posted by JohnL on January 28, 2000, at 18:02:37
> Whether tyrosine helps or not depends on whether the underlying problem is dopamine deficiency. Some depressions, anxieties, phobias, and schizophrenias can be caused by excess dopamine. Either a shortage or an overabundance will have undesirable psychiatric symptoms. If there is no dopamine deficiency to begin with, tyrosine supplementation will either do nothing or will produce uncomfortable results. On the other hand, if there is a dopamine deficiency, typrosine could work wonders. No way to find out I guess without trying.
>
> Even if the neurotransmitter levels are OK, they might not be functioning properly. In that case, no amount of supplementation will work. Instead they would need stimulating or substituting. And that's where the stimulants take over. Or they might be unstable, requiring a mood stabilizer. I wish it were as easy as popping a tyrosine supplement and getting better, but it just isn't that simple. If it by chance happens to target the appropriate malfunction, fantastic. But it might not. JohnLJohn B - Gingko biloba is an plant and so is ginseng. Gingko increases the blood supply (or perfusion) to the brain in people who have decreased blood flow to the brain (like Alzheimer's patients). - Cam W.
Posted by Scott L. Schofield on January 29, 2000, at 13:14:15
In reply to Re: Tyrosine supplementation , posted by JohnL on January 28, 2000, at 18:02:37
> Whether tyrosine helps or not depends on whether the underlying problem is dopamine deficiency. Some depressions, anxieties, phobias, and schizophrenias can be caused by excess dopamine. Either a shortage or an overabundance will have undesirable psychiatric symptoms. If there is no dopamine deficiency to begin with, tyrosine supplementation will either do nothing or will produce uncomfortable results. On the other hand, if there is a dopamine deficiency, typrosine could work wonders. No way to find out I guess without trying.
---------------------------------------------------
Hi JohnL.
Don't forget about norepinephrine.Norepinephrine was suspected to be involved in depression for at least 20 years before serotonin was. Nobody - well almost nobody - considered dopamine function to be at all important. Discussions involving dopamine were focused on its role in schizophrenia, and possibly in mania. It was norepinephrine that was the neurotransmitter most frequently targeted for investigation.
Tyrosine hydroxylase is the rate-limiting step for the manufacture of both norepinephrine and dopamine. I haven't heard of anything that would indicate that a rise in dopamine levels, to the exclusion of any changes in the levels of norepinephrine, would be one of the mechanism by which an improvement in mood occurs.
[L-Phenylalanine -> (l-phenylalanine hydroxylase) -> ] L-Tyrosine (tyrosine hydroxlase) -> L-Dopa (l-amino acid decarboxlase) -> Dopamine (dopamine -b-hydroxylase) -> Norepinephrine (phenylethanolamine N-methyltransferase) -> EpinephrineNorepinephrine=Noradrenaline
Epinephrine=Adrenaline
Maybe I've been a vegetable for too long, but I still have yet to read anything credible that purports to be able to explain affective illness in such simple terms as the "levels" of neurotransmitter found in either smashed brain tissue or cerebrospinal fluid.That said, I've heard of tyrosine augmentation being successful a number of times. I don't recall the details, but I know that it is important not to ingest any of several other amino-acids that would otherwise compete with if for passage through the blood-brain barrier.
I guess if you really wanted to go for it, L-dopa (with a peripheral decarboxylase inhibitor) might be interesting to try, as it is analogous to 5-HTP in the manufacture of serotonin.
- Scott
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