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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by margie75 on July 22, 2005, at 1:11:54
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » angelbean, posted by apenname on July 17, 2005, at 21:23:50
This is margie24 (had to change name, forgot password).
I've been working on no effexor for 3 months now. I'm down to 11 of the little beads and you'd think I'd feel CLOSE! I'm so anxious to just STOP, but if I get a wild hair and try to stop (even on 11 beads) I get sick. I'm now 12 weeks pregnant! (time flies) I thought I'd be off this by now. I tried really hard to stop when I found out, but it impossible.I read all your posts and I feel for you. I know how it is. I actually locked myself in our guest bedroom for 3 days when I first started withdrawling. Then I realized I was trying to be a hero or something and everyone was suffering for it.
Scott, I tried flexible dosing for a month and 1/2. I, personally, couldn't make any progress with it because the amount and times I needed to take it stayed the same. For example, I'd take maybe 20 beads just as I felt the dizziness, and then need another 20 maybe 6 hours later. Problem was I'd do the same thing day after day. If I reduced anything I'd feel the same as if I was just reducing the dose gradually. (?) Did I miss something.
Anyway, once I got down to 25 mg (I guess) I did the bead counting thing, and went down one by one.
(I had taken effexor for 2 years at 150 mg.) Tapering down to 75mg was not bad for me, it's when the numbers get small that was hard for me.I would DEFINETLY NOT try to stop effexor any other way than tapering slowly. I tried cold turkey several times (I thought if I just wasn't a wimp, I could tough it out.) I was incapacitated. And even scarier, suicidal.
And quite frankly, what doctors recommend for their "reduction plans", are about as painful as cold turkey. Mine told me to take 150 every other day for 2 weeks, then 75 " ". then stop. They really have no idea. And that's what infuriates me. They have no idea.
Well, I promised myself I would come back here and spread the good news once I got off effexor, be another light at the end of the tunnel. I thought i would have sent that post by now, but this thing is bigger than me and I have to play by it;s rules and count one DAMN bead at a time (and even then, sometimes I have to repeat a number for a day or 2). I WILL be back to tell you I made it, and you all will too.
Oh, about bead counting strategies. I sat down one afternoon and broke apart 75mg capsules (which had 200 beads (I think)) into piles of 50 beads. Then I folded the 50 in foil. I put my little foil packets (or acid, like I called them), in a bowl. That worked for me.
Very very best to everyone.
Margie
Posted by margie75 on July 22, 2005, at 1:14:49
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » angelbean, posted by apenname on July 17, 2005, at 21:23:50
I forgot to mention.
Insomnia has been a thing with me and I take children's liquid benadryl (that's the heaviest I can go). I works really well for me.
Anyone else get the shivers? It's like your cold and need to shake, but your not really that cold, it just feels good to shake?
Margie
Posted by angelbean on July 22, 2005, at 1:40:32
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals, posted by margie75 on July 22, 2005, at 1:11:54
Hi Margie. There is a light at the end of the tunnel. I'm sorry, I've lost track of the days, but it's been appox. 3 weeks for me and I feel great. I started taking Claritan and it cleared up the head problems for me. My pharm. says this is not possible. However, I forgot it last night and felt a little funny in the head. So I am going around his advice, and relying on my own experience.
You can do it. I can't believe I've made it this far cold turkey. Just take each day as it comes and don't let the feelings lie on your mind too long. Release them by reminding yourself it will pass.
My best wishes go to you. Give yourself a hug!
Posted by apenname on July 22, 2005, at 14:27:18
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » margie75, posted by angelbean on July 22, 2005, at 1:40:32
margie: a suggestion, try vitamins. Perhaps if you're already taking some add in more vitamins and minerals a multi-vitamin isn't giving you enough of? rabble_rouser found they got rid of withdrawal symptoms completely, although I'd recommend checking with the pharmacist/doctor on some of the more brain-centered ones. I may have had less withdrawal as well taking them, but I don't know for certain.
Thanks a bunch for sharing and good luck! Pregnancy in and of itself isn't easy. I've had friends go through a whole range of symptoms mostly from that (and being more susceptible to a cold - having it last a month!) in the first 3 months. Just in case any of your symptoms could be that, you may want to explore that possibility. Although you probably "know" what the withdrawal feels like. I know I did.
I've had 23 days (I may be off by a day or two) since my last 5mg dose, and now it's just dealing with whatever life throws me without the medicine's help. I get dizzy/headachy from time to time, but it's usually because I haven't had enough water, caffiene (I'm addicted), food, or sleep (I know this feeling from life before the Effexor).
Posted by margie75 on July 23, 2005, at 2:54:51
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals, posted by apenname on July 22, 2005, at 14:27:18
apenname, thanks for the encouragement. i know some of my emtionalism and fatigue is tied to the pregnancy, but the withdrawal symptoms are pretty distinctive.
i took my 10 beads today and it really didn't do a thing for me. is this when i should just quit all together?
i drank a full cup of coffee this afternoon, somehow thinking it might help...and it did.
i've heard people say they gained weight when they discontinued Effexor. Those of you who have stopped, did you gain any weight?
one more thing, did/does anyone else have achy joints as a side effect? i can't explain it.
Margie
Posted by ariel on July 23, 2005, at 9:52:21
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals, posted by margie75 on July 23, 2005, at 2:54:51
margie75: the first 3 months of pregnancy are the worst if you have any kind of morning sickness (which, for me, extended long past the morning). when you throw being on a drug like effexor into the mix, no wonder you feel physically and emotionally pretty messy.
Posted by ariel on July 23, 2005, at 10:07:25
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » margie75, posted by angelbean on July 22, 2005, at 1:40:32
i haven't posted for a while as i was sick for the past few days. i thought it was from my w/d, then realized, wait a minute, i stopped taking the pills several days before with no dramatic side effects. so i put down the nausea, dizziness, fatigue, and this weird over sensitivity to certain odors to a summer virus of the type i used to get years ago (margie--it all felt eerily like morning sickness, which was quite the thing considering i'm menopausal).
yesterday, friday, i felt fine. who knows--maybe it <was> a w/d effect, but it's over. i haven't had my usual 2 cups of AM coffee in several days as i'm a still just a bit queasy when i get up. i substituted zero cal. flat coke to get some caffeine into my system. i want to have my coffee again, but i seem to be doing ok w/o it. this is a first!
i don't think any dr. or pharm. can do more than provide a guideline for w/d. what works is what works for you. unlike scott, i didn't seem to have to do all that cutting down. it was more like dropping a a big dose, 75 mg, every time. and i'm convinced that, like apenname, that the excellent vitamins she recommended have been very helpful. esp. the b complex vits. i also drink a glass of green tea every day. try to keep the crappy food i love down to a minimum.
the nurse at my dr's office thought that taking granules of the pill out of the capsule isn't a good idea (see, everyone has their own ideas). it's not the amount. more like keeping them in a capsule helps with absorption. i don't know why the cap would help over mixing the grains w/applesauce.
when i was sick earlier this week, i took 37.5 mg one day and 75 mg the next, to no good effect whatsoever. that's what got me thinking that i simply was garden variety sick. anyways, i am <so> relieved to be on the road to complete freedom from this drug. again, thanks to everyone on this board for all the help and support!
Posted by 4WD on July 23, 2005, at 22:07:36
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals, posted by ariel on July 23, 2005, at 10:07:25
Ariel,
I've looked back and can't find the vitamins you were talking about. What kind and brand were they?Marsha
Posted by ed_uk on July 24, 2005, at 6:58:37
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals, posted by margie75 on July 22, 2005, at 1:11:54
Hi!
>This is margie24 (had to change name, forgot password)....
What were you called before?
~ed
Posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 0:45:08
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » ariel, posted by 4WD on July 23, 2005, at 22:07:36
the vitamins are one a day essentials by mega foods. they are carried by several online drugstores. something like $24. maybe they're availbale at a bricks and mortor place, also
Posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 0:54:49
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals, posted by ariel on July 23, 2005, at 10:07:25
well, i just had the most miserable 3 days going. what i thought was a summer bug was withdrawal. it hit me really hard sat. nite and, until this afternoon, i had severely motion sickness sympttoms./ couldn't read, watch tv, do anything, but lie in bed, prone. slept a lot. today, i decided, i can't take this, and went to the dr. a few hours after popping a 75 mg. of course, he was not happy with my trying to get off the drug so quickly after being on for 10 years. i agreed with him to go back to my 225mg and come back and asee him a a month or two to withdraw under his supervision.
i took 150mgs at around 3:30 pm and at 7 pm was completely fine. obviously, i spoke way too early both times i said was off the drug with little or no effect. evidently, in my case, there isn't an effect until about 5 days clean. i want to be off it, but i can't go thru that particular hell again. i'm very susecptible to motion sickness -- i can never be anyone's pasenger in a moving vehicle--and can't handle the symptoms. i'd take searing pain over the dizzinees. so, i'm thrwoing int he towle and w/d over a n extremely gradual 2 year period under dr.'s supervision.
the good news was that i never once felt the depression.. dr. though that would come back, too, but, on that count, i think he's wrong.
i lost 7 lbs over 3 days, altho i don't recommend this form of diet, LOL. the irony is that i wanted to lost 5 lbs or so before my child's wedding in a couple weeks.
Posted by angelbean on July 27, 2005, at 4:14:17
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » ariel, posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 0:54:49
Ariel,
I'm so sorry to hear about your miserable experience. You definitely did the right thing by going to the doctor. How soon is the wedding? Are you planning to stay on the med until some time afterward? Best of luck to you.
Angel
> well, i just had the most miserable 3 days going.
Posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 7:03:19
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » ariel, posted by angelbean on July 27, 2005, at 4:14:17
thanks, ab, i really appreciate all the support. based on my experience, i can't fathom how others are handling this, those who have far more daily responsibilities than i do. i know also fully understand what a "brain zap" is, LOL. i was getting them fast and furious sat. nite. they were the precursor to the vertigo the next day. as of right now, i've taken 2 full doses of effexor, <finally> had some of my precious coffee, and feel extremely grateful that i didn't try to tough it out any longer. when i go back to the doc., i'll see what his weaning regime is. he says he adds to one's effexor dose during that period. i was in such a haze, i didn't fully listen. i think he counts talk therapy as an "addition". which is fine, since i can always go back to my therapist. if he plans to add another antidepressant, it better be one that has far less horrible physical w/d side effects.
the wedding is in only 2 weeks. if i hadn't had that episode of motion sickness last week (that's what seemed to set off the whole slide downward), who knows when the Big WD would've hit me?
my primary's attitude that we all should stay on these drugs, his assumption that they were all prescribed correctly, is erroneous. he knew right off the bat what was going on with me as many of his patients have tried the same thing. at least he encourages us to seek his help during the w/d process. there are many docs, i'm sure, who tell suffering patients to just get back on the drug, case closed.
i don't have the time to go and read all the posts about how others have successfully weaned. what i'm most interested in are thos like me with 10 years on the drug. did their process take 2 years? were they ultimately succesful? etc etc.
the bottom line for me is why should i stay on this if the only thing it's really doing is keeping me from experiencing physical w/d? did i mention that, despite one shaky emotional time 10 days ago, i didn't experience any emotional problems?well, i feel like i've gotten a taste of what it's like for a hard core street addict to detox. cripes, i stopped smoking cold turkey after 40 years. i certainly have the will.
Posted by SLS on July 27, 2005, at 7:54:04
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » ariel, posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 0:54:49
Hi Ariel.
I apologize for my curt tone in my previous post to you. (I think I have the right person).
> the good news was that i never once felt the depression.. dr. though that would come back, too, but, on that count, i think he's wrong.
>
> i lost 7 lbs over 3 days, altho i don't recommend this form of diet, LOL. the irony is that i wanted to lost 5 lbs or so before my child's wedding in a couple weeks.I'm happy things are working out well for you. I'll say a prayer for you that your doctor should forever be proved wrong.
The first 4 months after discontinuing medication are critical. Most relapses occur during this period. Try to identify and reduce your stress and anxiety as much as possible to allow the brain to build a firm foundation to keeping itself working right without medication.
Good luck.
- Scott
Posted by angelbean on July 27, 2005, at 11:00:06
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » margie75, posted by angelbean on July 22, 2005, at 1:40:32
It has been 4 weeks cold turkey for me (after 8 years at 150mg). I feel that things are going great. I only occasionally get the head zaps, although I have been experiencing electricity zaps in my arms and legs (I wonder if that is all in my head). No vertigo. I feel clear and refreshed actually.
I also feel emotionally stronger. I think the meds made me not face the issues in my life. Things were tolerable. Now that I'm pretty much off the stuff, I am realizing that tolerable is not good enough. I'm starting to take better care of myself. People around me are noticing too. My friend told me he just can't take his eyes off me lately, he doesn't know what's different, but I am just looking beautiful lately. I'll tell you what is different. Without my crutch (Effexor), I CARE about myself again.
It feels good to be the one controlling my life again!
Posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 11:33:31
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » ariel, posted by SLS on July 27, 2005, at 7:54:04
thanks for the encouragement, scott. it's another ggod thing to know that one truly has to wait it out for months before the brain starts firing w/o the drug. tell me something: how long do those spins usually last? i couldn't take it 2.5 days in. it was the physical symptoms that made me cry uncle.
Posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 11:38:24
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals, posted by angelbean on July 27, 2005, at 11:00:06
now that i've relapsed, i'm going to ask you the same thing i did scott: how many days does the sickening spinning stuff last? i just couldn't take that illness anymore, even though i told myself i'd go the rest of the week. i've been on 225 mgs for 5 years, 150 mgs previous to that.
i stopped relying on the drug last year when my therapist told me it was pretty darn unreliable on its own. like, duh....i should've figured that out when i went through several depressive cycles over the past 5 years of my 10 years on it. you're so right -- you do so much better doing the work yourself.
Posted by angelbean on July 27, 2005, at 14:32:07
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » angelbean, posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 11:38:24
For me, it was gone after about a week. I don't know if my experience is typical, but it was bareable for me. Day four I began thinking clearly. Actually, that was my best day. I didn't care about the sickness, because I was starting to realize what the drug was doing to me. I felt like I was waking from a coma. I think that kept me going through the rest of the symptoms. Just looking forward to the payoff.
> now that i've relapsed, i'm going to ask you the same thing i did scott: how many days does the sickening spinning stuff last?
Posted by angelbean on July 27, 2005, at 14:36:19
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » SLS, posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 11:33:31
I'm sorry Ariel, I think I misunderstood your question to me. I am still having the zaps a bit. They don't bother me so much, as long as I don't feel like I have the flu. That is what lasted about a week. I still feel odd electical shocks in my legs and arms. I don't know if that's related (if not, I can't imagine what is causing it). But it is not painful, or disturbing. It's just weird. My head is so much better. It was well worth it to go off in my case. I can deal with this. I can't deal with being dependent on that drug for the rest of my life, or with feeling that I am too weak to live my life, which is what it did to me.
Facing the detox has made me so mentally strong. I am loving myself today.
> thanks for the encouragement, scott. it's another ggod thing to know that one truly has to wait it out for months before the brain starts firing w/o the drug. tell me something: how long do those spins usually last? i couldn't take it 2.5 days in. it was the physical symptoms that made me cry uncle.
Posted by 4WD on July 27, 2005, at 21:52:00
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » 4WD, posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 0:45:08
> the vitamins are one a day essentials by mega foods. they are carried by several online drugstores. something like $24. maybe they're availbale at a bricks and mortor place, also
Got it. Thanks.
Marsha
Posted by apenname on July 28, 2005, at 0:30:25
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals, posted by 4WD on July 27, 2005, at 21:52:00
Don't forget to check out this post by rabble_rouser about a more extended set of vitamins one can take that may have more effect:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/wdrawl/20050611/msgs/517178.htmlHe's got some other posts about the research he did on the vitamins (search for "rabble_rouser vitamins").
As for my experience, I was on Effexor XR 262.5mg for 2 years, 5-6 months of Lexapro and Wellbutrin trying, and then Effexor XR 225mg (lower due to high blood pressure) for 2 more years. (I finally found some records - I may have wrong estimates in previous posts of mine). It feels like longer, though, in my memory. It took me 2 months and 2 weeks to finally taper down to enough Effexor XR (5mg) to stop cold, but that was only one month ago.
Life continues to have it's challenges, fun, and stressors, but I seem to be dealing with it well with what I've learned in therapy (continuing). So far no clear withdrawal effects in this past month. I'm sticking with the megafoods multivitamins (make sure whichever one you pick up you take the correct recommended daily dose - I noticed the women's formula wanted to you take more than 1 a day!) and my 2 calcium+D 600 mg a day. I plan to stay with that forever, anti-depressants or not.
Posted by apenname on July 28, 2005, at 0:34:20
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals, posted by apenname on July 28, 2005, at 0:30:25
Oh yes - And Tons of water. rabble_rouser mentioned that as well in his vitamin post, and I do that too. Tons of water. Maybe it helped with withdrawal. Maybe it just helped with general heath. I have an impression that doing anything you can to improve your general health, it helps to ease withdrawal symptoms.
Posted by SLS on July 28, 2005, at 4:01:58
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » SLS, posted by ariel on July 27, 2005, at 11:33:31
> thanks for the encouragement, scott. it's another ggod thing to know that one truly has to wait it out for months before the brain starts firing w/o the drug. tell me something: how long do those spins usually last? i couldn't take it 2.5 days in. it was the physical symptoms that made me cry uncle.
I'm a little confused here. What do you mean by "spins"? (See, even my vocabulary is limited) :-)
- Scott
Posted by ariel on July 29, 2005, at 16:00:28
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » ariel, posted by SLS on July 28, 2005, at 4:01:58
if you've ever had too much to drink, you might've had the spins --it's when you're so dizzy that you need to put a foot on the ground even when you're lying on the bed b/c the room's spinning out of control. maybe i'm overstating my dizziness, but, at the time, i didn't feel like anything could overstate it. i've had kids (no drugs, long labors), surgeries, assorted injuries, but if there's one thing i can't deal with, it's dizziness/nausea. i have a long,long history of motion sickness and all the bad associations. there have been periods when i didn't feel particularly suseptible. when i hit my 40s, tho, i seemed more sensitive to it than ever.
Posted by ariel on July 29, 2005, at 16:22:16
In reply to Re: Effexor XR withdrawals » ariel, posted by angelbean on July 27, 2005, at 14:36:19
as i posted to scott, i simply can't handle prolonged dizziness/nausea. i'd rather have a red hot poker through the eye. what i defined as brain zaps were more like, i don't know, short, intense vertigo incidents. that was on top of the generalized dizziness. anyways, it was all too much.
i am totally, totally with you, ab, re feeling so great about being free of the dependency. anything you can do to rely on yourself and your own strengths is so much better in the long run. we all got taken in by the drug companies who pushed the stuff and the health care plans that pushed even harder. i firmly believe that there are certain people who <should> be on antidepressants for life. i don't think that many of us qualify. certainly very few doctors bother to do the tests required to find out. and it ain't that hard. my therapist, based on what i told her about my depressions, felt that i never had a chemical imbalance to begin with, that i didn't have some genetic predisposition. if she had been the one i talked with back in 1994, that's what my therapy would've been --talk therapy. i had the luck of the draw at my HMO to end up with a shrink who could prescribe and couldn't wait to get me on prozac. which, btw, i loved. only it stopped working after 4 months. i should've gotten the hint. i didn't see a psychologist until my present one in 2001.
anyways, my primary is one of those who feels that my being prescribed effexor back in late 94 was medically necessary. only he doesn't have my history of it. it's the usual case of docs not wanting to slam other docs. but he'll help me get off it. as i said earlier, i can wait for 2 years. being on the pill isn't so much a burden, or a blow to my self esteem, as it's something i feel is superfluous.
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