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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 36 to 60 of 113. Go back in thread:
Posted by Margie24 on June 3, 2005, at 22:49:12
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by kcjuggler on June 3, 2005, at 21:21:43
Today I had a much better day too. I'm not free, but trying the flexible dosing and it seems to be working rather well.
I'm so glad you have good news. There isn't enough. I think it's easier for us to get on here and rant and rave, then forget to come back and talk about the positives.
Thanks jugg.
MW
Posted by jdjour on June 5, 2005, at 5:13:08
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by Margie24 on June 3, 2005, at 15:47:16
Hey, Thanks for the info about the petition. I signed it also. I've also felt better today and have been using the dosing schedule when needed. Today I didn't have those head zap symptoms and didn't need to take "beads" (!). Now if I could just get this insomnia under control...! I didn't exercise today, and that might be the problem.
Posted by kcjuggler on June 5, 2005, at 13:28:16
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by Margie24 on June 3, 2005, at 15:47:16
Well sad to say I had to take some beads today. I had 2 days without any physical symptoms, which I'm grateful for. I was easily agitated though, and a bit anxious those 2 days. I don't know if these were drug side effects or not. Saturday, I felt a bit lite headed, and thought: "it can't be withdrawal can it"? I tried to ignore the symptoms, thinking it was something else. I played my tennis match and I wasn't really there on the court. I was very disappointed & frustrated with my my play. I play for fun, so it shouldn't be a big deal, but it was a downer nonetheless. Today (Sunday), I finally took a few beads as again I am feeling a bit lite headed.
How many days to you have do you have to be "clear" of symptoms before you know you are done with the drug?
kc
ps. trying not to let this get me down, I'm trying to be patient, which isn't one of my strengths. Also thanks for the petition website. I finally signed it today.
Posted by Margie24 on June 6, 2005, at 12:56:06
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by kcjuggler on June 5, 2005, at 13:28:16
Anyone else extrememly irritable trying to come of this. (I'm pregnant, but this is like serious anger). Yesterday, I was trying to resist taking another 1/2 becasue I had made it through 1 1/2 days without symptoms much, thought it would get better from here. Yesterday, it just got worse and worse and worse.
I've known my husband for 3 years. WE NEVER YELL AT EACH OTHER. Yesterday I slammed a door in his face and told him to go away because he moved something and I was looking for it.
Also, when the withdrawal is bad like that I CANNOT THINK. Seriously, like I'm mentally retarded.
Anyone have the same?
Mags
Posted by Margie24 on June 6, 2005, at 12:58:40
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by kcjuggler on June 5, 2005, at 13:28:16
One more thing....
CHECK YOUR PUPILS.
My pupils are tiny. They are usually larger. I compared them with my husband, almost half the size!
Anyone else?
Posted by SLS on June 6, 2005, at 16:59:47
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by Margie24 on June 6, 2005, at 12:58:40
Don't be so "brave". It will just cause you great stress and discomfort. Imagine what your baby is experiencing from these withdrawal effects.
If your system responds as mine does:I would restart the Effexor and take small amounts several times a day when you feel the withdrawal symptoms appear. This is a flexible-dosing strategy. Use small amounts of the drug as if it were aspirin to treat a headache. When the headache appears, take enough aspirin to last 6-8 hours. Wait until the headache reappears, then take more. You will see that you can take smaller and smaller amounts to get you through the 6-8 hours. You will eventually reach a point when a further decrease in the dose no longer gets you through 6 hours. At that point, just stop taking it. You will go through a mild withdrawal that lasts only a few days at the most.
Your other option is to switch over to Prozac for a few days. Its long half life will act as a naturally gentle taper.
Either of these two methods should have you free of medication in 2-3 weeks.
Again, don't be a hero. Continue to use medication as a tool to gently remove them.
Good luck.
- Scott
Posted by LBB on June 8, 2005, at 0:29:41
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by Margie24 on June 3, 2005, at 15:47:16
Hey friends, well I have been Effexor free for almost 2 weeks now! All side effects are gone now, except for slight vertigo every so often. I went to my acupuncturist 3 times last week and also went on a toxin "juicing fest." Drank lots of fresh veggie and fruit juices and ate really healthily. I think my body really was craving certain foods to help rid my body of this crap. Whatever it was that worked: whether it was a combination of time, acupuncture and trying to maintain a diet to help keep me on a more even keel to be able to deal with the withdrawal - I am just super thankful it is over.
Anyway, I have decided to grieve the death of my daughter without any meds if I can. I will never go back on Effexor, that's for sure!! I have also signed the petition. I don't care what the pamphlet says that the pharm. co. puts out, it does NOT discuss this severe type of syndrome that so many of seem to have gotten.
I wish all of you the very best and thank you for your support. ((HUGS))
Posted by margie24 on June 8, 2005, at 1:49:33
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by LBB on June 8, 2005, at 0:29:41
Thanks so much LBB, for coming on to post something positive. That's hard to find in this mess. It's nice to see there may be a light at the end of this tunnel.
M
Posted by kcjuggler on June 8, 2005, at 12:19:51
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by Margie24 on June 6, 2005, at 12:56:06
I've been wanting to reply to this and just haven't made the time - sorry.
I SO RELATE TO THIS!
I'm a dog person, and am blessed with the best, sweetest dog in the world (yes I'm biased).
I had several days where I yelled at her for no reason. I felt very bad about it, but I couldn't stand to be near her. She did absolutely NOTHING to deserve it. I feel like a horrible person, but it just came out before I could squelch it.
I've been better about this the past few days, I'm no longer immediately yelling. I'm at more of a tolerant stage, and I think, (please oh please), even that is improving.
Posted by kcjuggler on June 8, 2005, at 12:21:04
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by LBB on June 8, 2005, at 0:29:41
Congrats!!! I'm so happy you've made it through. I hope the rest of us will follow in your same steps!
Posted by Emmi on June 9, 2005, at 17:30:05
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by margie24 on June 8, 2005, at 1:49:33
Well..after a year of tapering off...I think I did it!! The last several weeks I opened the capsule and counted out the granules. I went from 150mg down to 65mg capsules. Once I hit 65mg, I started opening them. There's 150 granules in a 65mg capsule. I got daring and only took 50, or 1/3. Did that for 4 days...then dropped to 49, then 48, th45, the 35 for a few days..then a big leap down to 10 granules for 3 days. I'm on my fourth day with NONE..ZERo..ZIPPO...yeah I'm a little lte headed and some double vision. but I guess since I had been recuding so slowly, I ended up having only about 5mg inme when i quit cold turley for days ago. Had a tooth pulled today and he put me on activan. HOpefully I"ll now sleep through the last hours of withdrawl. Finally.....
Hang in the gang and remember...slower is better!
Emmi
Posted by canadiangirl3 on June 10, 2005, at 20:54:24
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by LBB on June 8, 2005, at 0:29:41
Hey Lisa,
I'm happy for you feeling so good. I did a fast effexor taper with small prozac doses and was feeling good until i tapered off the prozac. I'm paying for it now....It's been almost five weeks off prozac and I feel like crap. Zappy, moody, achy and bloated.....and really really scared about when (and whether) this will ever end! Can you tell me more about your juice cleanse as well as what your acupuncturist did. Was there a particular area on your body that you were treated on? My stepdad does acupuncture so maybe I should try that route. I am dying to feel better!!!
D.
Posted by LBB on June 10, 2005, at 21:08:33
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by canadiangirl3 on June 10, 2005, at 20:54:24
D,
I am so sorry you are feeling bad still. It just sucks so bad!
As far as juicing and diet goes, this is what my nutritionist had me doing: Steam and eat an artichoke a day (helps with gallbladder and gallbladder helps cleanse the body of toxins), drink one glass of veggie juice of: carrots, fennel, beet, kale, spinach, garlic and lemon. Drink one glass of fruit juice of: pear, apple, ginger, plum.
The points my acupuncturist focused on were liver (Effexor, well most if not all SSRIs and SNRIs, screw with the liver), kidney, gallbladder. She also gave me Fish Oil capsules to take (Metagenics brand).
I swear, I really truly believe this made a big difference. I noticed after my first acu session with her a difference - I am not sure if I can say I felt "better" per se, but I certainly felt different, like something was happening, like my body was trying to get a grip. After a few days I began to feel better. I think the diet really helped keep my blood sugar stable, too, which really makes a difference suffering from those vertigo, dizziness and brain shock side effects.
Overall, I am feeling much better than ever. Even in dealing with my depression, I feel better now without the stupid Effexor than I did when I was on it. I am noticing a big improvement in my sleeping, too.
Well, let me know if you want more specific info., I can email my acupuncturist for specific points if you like. I hope you are feeling better soon!
How is everyone else doing today?
Lisa
Posted by apenname on June 13, 2005, at 10:25:50
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by LBB on June 10, 2005, at 21:08:33
Thanks for the good thread. This is my second time going off of Effexor XR, the last time I was ramping up Lexapro before getting an out-of-the-blue parosmia (sense of smell change-was actually from a sinus infection and not the medicine), and being on nothing for a hellish week. I thought of myself as one of the "lucky" ones where I have had zero symptoms as I slowly stepped down. I went from 225 mg, with a 37.5 mg drop every 1.5 weeks. Then: 3 days early and having some nausea (and other symptoms that made me think I was just fighting a virus), I made the drop from 37.5 mg to 0 last Friday. I've been dizzy and dizzy and feel like I'm thinking through molassas (can't even spell the word).
I often suffer from sinus problems and thought the dizziness might be some other bug I picked up and am fighting, along with the spring-summer weather change, the increase in AC use, etc.
I like the "healthy" and "fruit" cleanse idea. I've been craving fruit and (for the past 3 weeks), meat, red meat and feeling like I need protein (I'm not necessarily a fan, but I went ahead and gave in). Unfortunately I'm wanting to use this change time to start fixing the overweight I slipped into without paying attention, but I have noticed eating helps keep the dizziness at bay. I guess I shouldn't try and change everything at once.
I guess I will call my psych and see what to do (my husband said: "call your doctor", and I didn't know which one to call).
Another note: yesterday when I was working outside with plants and getting some small exercise, the dizziness wasn't there at all.
I really don't want to have to take any Effexor, and want to see the decrease in blood pressure I'm hoping for. I stayed on it even with the heightened BP because it's what worked for about 5 years now, with some half years of trying other things. It's been completely worth it, even with this lingering withdrawl. I'll find out what the psychiatrist says about what to do.
Query: how long before the medicine is completely "flushed out of your system"? Is there any data about that? My previous pharma-psychiatrist thought it was a week, but I really don't believe that.
-Meg
Posted by SLS on June 14, 2005, at 7:57:58
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XR withdrawals last?, posted by apenname on June 13, 2005, at 10:25:50
Hi Meg.
> Query: how long before the medicine is completely "flushed out of your system"?
Most of it will be gone in 5 half-lives of the drug. The half-life is that period of time necessary for the body to eliminate 1/2 of the drug from the blood stream. The half-life of Effexor is roughly a day, so your pharmacist was quite correct to tell you that only one week would be necessary.
The goal of reducing the intensity and length of the withdrawal syndrome is NOT served by "cleansing" the system. It is served best by tapering the dosage gradually - more gradually than you did. You can do several things as remediation of your current state; the best among them being the reintroduction of Effexor using a flexible-dosing strategy or substituting it temporarily with Prozac. Prozac is much easier to taper, and it shouldn't take more than 2 weeks. It sounds to me like you will not entertain either of these ideas, though.
Alternatively, you can try taking Benadryl (diphenhydramine), an over the counter antihistamine/antcholinergic, to reduce the intensity of the withdrawal symptoms. Exercise is supposed to help also. You might also want to ask some questions on the "Alternative" PB board and find out what supplements people suggest. If you do that, please come back to this board and post what you learned. It would be much appreciated.
- Scott
Posted by apenname on June 14, 2005, at 13:06:49
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XR withdrawals last? » apenname, posted by SLS on June 14, 2005, at 7:57:58
I took a 37.5 mg pill yesterday and was finally able to think straight and get some work done.
I skimmed through the pamphlet that came with the Effexor XR samples. It not only listed a lot of interesting symptoms (I'd have to check, but many of them sounded like what's reported here) for both "normal dose" but also for discontinuation (it said "see precautions"). It looked to me as if everything people have experienced was listed, but listed in medical terms. (Also of interest was the number of people in the placebo group who had dizziness as a side effect in the short-term trials). I personally found reading the pamphlet interesting and good for relieving anxiety, but I was approaching it from a data analysis perspective and was trying to keep a firm lid on hypochondriac feelings.
My psychiatrist called back and said to do half pill a day for a week and then see if I can go to zero from there. He recommended having the half pill with peanut butter. The pamphlet said that if necessary, the capsule can be broken open and sprinkled on a spoonful of applesauce.
I agree with Scott, and other posters here, always be careful to slowly reduce dose. A nurse friend of mine had me vow not to go off the medication without doing it under psychiatric care, and chided me when she found out I'd dropped the last dose 3 days early.
Thanks for the benadryl advice, but I'm not going to try it. As it is, most medication (over the counter, etc), gives me side effects. Effexor was one of the ones that didn't, except for the blood pressure! So far, non-medication options which help are hot tea (caffienated black or green), exercise, reading a good book, and sleep. Dizziness and concentration problems seem to get much worse when I'm getting hungry, so food helps as well. I'm also going to be checking to see if I have low blood pressure (which dizziness is also a symptom of), as the main reason for discontinuing Effexor is because it increases my blood pressure.
I'll do the half pill a day as the doctor recommended. We'll see how it goes. I was actually planning on waiting until I was completely done with the Effexor and post my "No Effexor XR horrors" story here to let people know that there is at least one case where the dose reduction was easy!
-Meg
Posted by SLS on June 14, 2005, at 15:49:16
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XR withdrawals last? » SLS, posted by apenname on June 14, 2005, at 13:06:49
Hi Meg.
I'm glad you opted to continue to taper the Effexor.
I have suggested to others an Effexor discontinuation method that I discovered works well for me. It is a flexible-dosing strategy that manages to establish a taper rate that matches the brain's rate of compensation for dosage reductions. It involves taking several very small doses of Effexor throughout the day. You might want to look back on some of my earlier posts in the "Previous Periods" archive at the top of the page.
Once you reach 75mg or less of Effexor:
Briefly, you end up using small amounts of Effexor as needed (PRN) in much the same way as you would use aspirin for a headache. You wait for the withdrawal symptoms to reappear before taking your next dose. Ideally you take the amount of Effexor that will allow you to remain symptom-free for 6-8 hours. This takes a bit of experimentation, but precision is not really necessary. You don't have to be exact in cutting up tablets or counting the pellets inside a capsule. An approximation is good enough because your dosing time remains flexible. At some point, it will not be possible to reduce the dosage any further and remain without symptoms for 6 hours. This is when you discontinue the drug entirely. Hopefully, the withdrawal syndrome will be mild and brief.
- Scott
Posted by feelin crazy on June 25, 2005, at 0:50:35
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last? » SLS, posted by 4WD on May 8, 2005, at 23:30:55
Its me again, I keep reading! I cant get away from this site. I have one Effexor 150 mg. tab left over. Im going to try and open the cap and take a small amount. God willing it will take some of the edge away from feeing so agitated and keep me from crying! Thank you all for posting on this page. I know I would have wondered what was wrong with me if I had not stumbled onto this site.
Posted by rabble_rouser on June 25, 2005, at 21:40:39
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XL withdrawals last?, posted by feelin crazy on June 25, 2005, at 0:50:35
choline, ginkgo biloba, co q-10, l-phenylalanine, l-tyrosine, l-glutamine, omega 3's, multivit and mega B vits.
Kiss goodbye to symptoms.
Posted by ariel on June 27, 2005, at 9:33:58
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XR withdrawals last? » apenname, posted by SLS on June 14, 2005, at 15:49:16
i am planning to get off effexor -- very, very, very gradually, as outlined in all the extremely helpful posts on this site!
ok, i've been on effexor xr for 10 years. my dosage for the past 4 yrs has been 225 mg a day, sometimes 300 mgs a day (maybe a couple times a month). my main reason for discontinuing this med is the information i got from my therapist last year. before i hit menopause this year, i was hit with several bouts of bad depression due to fluctuating hormones. the therapist reminded me that no pill is "magic", that the brain can override the effects if one doesn't work at it. altho she wants me to stay on effexor (and i don't know a therapist who would counsel otherwise), it got me to thinking. my depression, which i always thought was chemical, she feels is more situational. now that i'm more hormonally balanced, and with the information her therapy has provided, i feel i can deal with my problems without meds.
i have never popped open an effexor capsule to see what's inside. i thought it was powder, but one of the posts indicates the cap contains little beads. i'm prepared to count them out as part of the weaning process. i will take as much time as i need. also: someone here strongly recommends natural vitamin and mineral supplements. please tell me what they are.
once i'm prepared, then it will come down to when to start this. i'm inclined to start very soon. no time is a really "good" time, with late summer/early fall being a tough time for me(change of seasons, child leaving for college, houseguests gone).
i've read all the info in your posts but would really appreciate help and replies. thanks so much!
Posted by SLS on June 27, 2005, at 10:17:25
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XR withdrawals last? » SLS, posted by ariel on June 27, 2005, at 9:33:58
Hi Ariel.
I'm on my way out the door, but I wanted to acknowledge your post. You might want to ask your doctor for the 25mg tablets to help you through the tapering process. Splitting them is easier than counting beads and fine enough to produce sufficiently small doses.
- Scott
Posted by apenname on June 27, 2005, at 10:19:56
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XR withdrawals last? » SLS, posted by ariel on June 27, 2005, at 9:33:58
Answers to some questions:
rabble_rouser and others: I take One Daily Essentials multivitamin, Mega Foods brand. This is a "100% whole foods" vitamin that I found after trial and error of different multivitamins to find one I could handle without stomach upset. A google search of "mega foods vitamin one daily" gives links to stores that list the multivitamin's components. I've been taking this vitamin for at least 4 years now, and in that time, I've been on Effexor XR 225 mg, then stepped down Effexor, and up Lexapro, and then discontinued Lexapro for a very depressed week, then Wellburtrin for awhile, and then back on Effexor XR, and now during discontinuation of Effexor XR.
I also take 2 tablets a day of "Caltrate 600 +D", a calcium supplement, either a "store brand" or Wyeth's brand.I don't know whether my neurochemistry, my extra attempts to reduce stress in my life during this Effexor XR decrease, the multivitamin, or all of the above meant that I didn't have side effects until this last step of 37.5mg to 0 mg. I also may have had some earlier on but thought they were the cause of something else (stress, sinus infection, weather change, etc.)
ariel: I got some free sample packs from my psychiatrist which contained 75mg and 37.5mg doses. You can open up a capsule on a tray or plate. I found that the little "beads" aren't all the same size, so I would just push the "beads" to two little piles with the edge of a spoon, and judge equality by eye. You might find counting easier: my husband did. When I was dizzy trying to do this, I ended up having a few beads roll around and I accidentally had them bounce off the plate and onto the carpeted floor (which I then had to vaccuum to keep the cat from eating them). A piece of clean cloth on top of an edged tray made that less likely to happen. Also, preparing the "dose" ahead of time, or having someone else do it has helped.
I leave my half dose on the tray to take with applesauce (my psychiatrist recommended peanut butter), and carefully put the rest back in the capsule to carry with me if I need it.Thanks to the other posters who gave me hope and advice for splitting dosages and dealing with withdrawal side effects!
Posted by rabble_rouser on June 28, 2005, at 6:52:26
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XR withdrawals last?, posted by apenname on June 27, 2005, at 10:19:56
Hi penname,
thanks for the info! I agree totally with what you say about stress reduction too - every little helps. I have found meditation to be helpful and really good fun.
I started taking all those vits when first going back on effexor in the hope they would boost levels of neurotransmitters even further (if the internet hype is to be believed). I accidentally found they eliminated my side effects, so I stuck with them. And they seem to do the trick on withdrawal too. As you say pen, every one has different neurochemistry so its gonna be different for all.
Found an article about the effects of some of these vitamins http://www.naturalhealthweb.com/articles/esparza3.html
which may be informative also.
The best advice I have heard when you are coming off, is to prepare every area of your life. Do all the little things like diet and exercise (if you can) and try to get others around you involved. I have found it helpful to keep my dad notified of how I am every other day to make sure I'm not going off the deep end.
In other news, there has been a recent trial of an electronic brain-stimulator thingy, which apparently 'instantly cures depression'. The research was done in Georgia and is called Deep Brain Stimulation, centering on an area of the brain called area 25. Sounds very X files, but cool if it works.
Blue skies
Ross (rabble_rouser)
Posted by ariel on June 28, 2005, at 12:53:38
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XR withdrawals last?, posted by rabble_rouser on June 28, 2005, at 6:52:26
thank you for the information!
i broke open a cap today and took some of the beads along with 2 75 mg caps. i didn't count the beads, though. just sort of eyed them. if this sort of inexact method backfires on me, i will do what penname does. i had several freebie packs of the pills but used them all (darn!). i will probably have to order one more 90 day supply thru my scrip service. better to be safe than very sorry. the costs is fairly minimal (like $20).
i take my pills begore morning coffee, like around 8-9AM. it's about 1:45 pm, after lunch, and i feel just slightly heavy headed. i know what it feels like when the pills aren't in my system, having skipped doses by mistake (only maybe twice in 10 years). like the flu -- sweaty, achy, nauseous, everything people have described. takes only a few hours of a missed dose to feel like sh*t. if i go thru a minor version of this, i can handle it as i am extremely fortunate to be retired with very few daily responsibilities. i can spend the day on the couch, or nap, or walk for hours, or whatever i want. if i get a depression rebound, though, i will have to call up all my emotional reserves. thing is, i'm just as likely to get depressed on the pills as off. which is why i want to get them out of my system.
i will research the multivitamin connection. i am very bad when it comes to taking supplements. very lazy. if i commit to a supply and have laid out the dough, that should be enough motivation. also, if they indeed make me feel better.
ok, one more question: i don't blame weight gain on effexor. but...have any of you lost weight once off the pills?
Posted by ariel on June 28, 2005, at 13:44:10
In reply to Re: How long do Effexor XR withdrawals last?, posted by apenname on June 27, 2005, at 10:19:56
> Answers to some questions:
> rabble_rouser and others: I take One Daily Essentials multivitamin, Mega Foods brand. This is a "100% whole foods" vitamin that I found after trial and error of different multivitamins to find one I could handle without stomach upset. A google search of "mega foods vitamin one daily" gives links to stores that list the multivitamin's components.i just placed an order for the Mega Foods vit. you recommend. i like that it doesn't have additives like gingko or kava kava or other "natural" caffeine like stimulants. i'm sure it will help. as it is, i do eat yogurt, fruits, raw veg., whole grains, drink a glass of green tea, several glasses of water daily.
i also read several posts from one of the many sites that discuss med withdrawal. one such post emphasizes what you experienced types know--you have to be patient, be very careful with the actual cutting down, and listen to your body. i have been on this drug for 10 years. if i can cut down by 5-10% over time, i'll be fortunate. i <am> determined to be drug free.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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