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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by TofuEmmy on January 6, 2005, at 22:14:52
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by fires on January 6, 2005, at 20:56:34
>You asked so I shall answer: No not a bit.
Despite GG's request, please consider this - Sometimes it is better to not reply to a post if it is not possible for you to offer something supportive.
Or as my mother always said, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all"
PS: Some guidelines for posting are in the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Posted by fires on January 6, 2005, at 22:51:03
In reply to Please be Supportive » fires, posted by TofuEmmy on January 6, 2005, at 22:14:52
> >You asked so I shall answer: No not a bit.
>
> Despite GG's request, please consider this - Sometimes it is better to not reply to a post if it is not possible for you to offer something supportive.
>
> Or as my mother always said, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all"
>
> PS: Some guidelines for posting are in the FAQ:
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
>
>What? When someone asks me if something makes sense, I answer truthfully. I'm not sure what you are suggesting? Are you implying that I lied?
The only other thing I can even think of is: that the question was strictly rhetorical. Yet after reading the post 3 times, it still doesn't sound rhetorical to **me**.
Sorry, if I offended anyone. I didn't mean to. I sincerely found that her post didn't make sense to me. Also, if I may ask, are you telling me that a comment directed to someone else, is "not supportive"? Please explain.
Thank you
Posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 23:41:51
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by fires on January 6, 2005, at 20:56:34
Fires,
I suppose I did think of it as a rhetorical question, cause if it made sense, I wouldn't be so confused. And frankly, when I read your first post, I thought you were saying that I was not resisting a bit. Which surprised me.But anyway, snookems. I'm so pleased you joined this thread. I am just tickled to tell you that one hypothesis about what is going on is that I am feeling as if I might be on the verge of a recovered memory.
"EEEKKK! BREAK OUT THE ARTICLES! THE WEBSITES! THE PITHY COMMENTS"
"GET ME SOME IODINE, I'VE GOT DOG GERMS!" (with apologies to Snoopy)
RUN AWAY RUN AWAY RUN AWAY!
;)
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:08:59
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by annierose on January 6, 2005, at 9:06:16
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:12:57
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by TofuEmmy on January 6, 2005, at 11:50:05
awww, thanks. If only he knew how many babblers were poking around in my head.
It could be that dynamic. He does tend to disagree with her a lot, and he seemed disappointed when I decided not to keep weaning off Nardil, although he never said so.
But then he's the great blank slate, so I could be doing a ton of projection, too.
Thanks,
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by fallsfall on January 6, 2005, at 12:42:20
Well, I went. He was very gracious and concerned about me missing yesterday.
He wondered, when I said my behavior was so rude, and that's why I felt like a turd (he laughed at that), why I might want to be rude to him. I really didn't have any answers to that.
Instead, I told him about the odd dream I had while in Detroit. It was kind of a triggering dream. I was kicking my hubby while it was going on. What felt odd to me was that my emotion after this dream felt very detached and kind of numb. Usually I am much more in the moment of the emotion when I wake up, and sometimes thru at least part of the day.
He's very good about listening without priming or leading. It lead to me doing some serious crying and sobbing for a bit again. The session itself was a bit disjointed. I hopped around, and he didn't always bring me back to the dream. We did talk about a trauma when I was about 21, and family issues stuff. Heck we even talked about the tsunami for a minute or two. (I've been avoiding looking at images or reading too much about it...just take my donation and I'll close my eyes.)
I did mention that I was glad I didn't have to go back to work, which surprised him. He wondered why that would be a problem. (Duh!). But I mentioned that I always go to Starbucks after sessions, as my little treat for myself. And that sometimes I feel like I need to crawl into bed and sleep for a bit. Or do something else self-care related. Now, silly me, I thought this was healthy. But he seems concerned that maybe therapy is too intense if I can't put myself back together enough to be able to go back to work.
At the end, he said he wasn't able to put everything together into a meaningful whole like he usually can. Instead, he said he would lay out the pieces on the table, so to speak, for us to just look at. Maybe next session we can put some of them together. That's odd for him, to feel just as confused as I am.
So, intense, and meaningful session, I suppose. But draining. Very draining. But I can tell he is concerned about me, and in a weird way, that is nice. Cause I can't remember a time in my life when I wasn't depressed except maybe when I was very young. And yet it was my brother my mother had hospitalized when he was 16 for depression. Now I didn't act out, but didn't anybody notice me?
Thanks for your encouragement, falls
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:31:58
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by Shortelise on January 6, 2005, at 13:11:12
Hmmm, I didn't look at it that way. I suppose that could be, except I feel as if I am more depresesd. Lordy, sometimes I think it's just the weather. I would kill to see the sun right now. ;)
And I suppose if it were a conscious effort to step back and take time off, I might have at least called to cancel? I was just so appalled at my not showing up and not calling. But maybe I did not go in order to have a break.
Right now I feel like I could use one. I had been wanting to know more about the body memory event I had, and what it means. And then this dream...I am not sure I want to know what it all means. At least not right now. Maybe after my dissertation...?
Thanks, shortE. Your posts always make me think...
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:34:47
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by mair on January 6, 2005, at 20:17:19
You know, post-holiday recovery makes a lot of sense. I was depressed right after the holidays last year, too.
And my super-ego was telling me I was a horrible person, and very very rude and disrespectful. I felt like I had to slink in today in shame. But he didn't treat me like that and was very interested in what was going on with me.
I posted more about the session above.
Thanks for you input.
gg
Posted by daisym on January 7, 2005, at 1:08:19
In reply to today's session » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
<<<Now I didn't act out, but didn't anybody notice me?
>>>>Oh, (((GG))) -- so much pain in a single statement. Being with family really brings up so much old cr*p.
So much of what you described sounds like how I feel when I'm either recovering a memory that I don't really want...or when I'm faced with mom stuff. We've talked about this, mom stuff just rips you up. You've been dreaming about your brother and your mom too...hmmm. It all sounds so hard.
I'm glad you could at least lay it out on the table today. At least you don't have to hold it all by yourself. When is your next appointment?
Posted by mair on January 7, 2005, at 5:07:38
In reply to today's session » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
I think it's right and good that he be concerned for you, but I, too, can't imagine why he would be surprised that you don't always want to jump back into work after sessions. I frequently have that urge to go home and get in bed and it doesn't just go away. I pretty much always dutifully return to my office for what is sometimes a very unproductive afternoon; but I probably crawl into bed tons earlier on nights when i've had therapy.
Do these people not understand how exhausting and draining it can be?
I'm glad your T didn't treat this as an act of rudeness, even if you thought of it that way. When I've felt suicidal the contract my T likes striking with me is to get me to promise that I'll show up at the next session, not necessarily to ask me to promise to call her if I think I'm in danger (which is implied I'm sure). I think it's the "promise you'll show" statement that gives me pause when I think about just not showing. I'm just afraid she'd jump to the wrong conclusions.
Mair
Posted by annierose on January 7, 2005, at 7:27:48
In reply to Re: today's session » gardenergirl, posted by mair on January 7, 2005, at 5:07:38
GG- I relate to your feeling invisible. That is what we are talking about in therapy right now too. And I'm from a family of 5 children and I don't think they ever noticed me. It's nice how your T tries to wrap up each session for you. And how honest he was that he wasn't able to do that for you yesterday. You're probably so close to something big right now. Just try to stay in the moment and it will come out (if you let it).
Annierose
Posted by fires on January 7, 2005, at 12:20:59
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » fires, posted by gardenergirl on January 6, 2005, at 23:41:51
> But anyway, snookems. I'm so pleased you joined this thread. I am just tickled to tell you that one hypothesis about what is going on is that I am feeling as if I might be on the verge of a recovered memory.<<
A fellow skeptic and MD, concurs with me: Isn't it curious that ALL recovered memories are negative ones?
>
> "EEEKKK! BREAK OUT THE ARTICLES! THE WEBSITES! THE PITHY COMMENTS"
>
> "GET ME SOME IODINE, I'VE GOT DOG GERMS!" (with apologies to Snoopy)
>
> RUN AWAY RUN AWAY RUN AWAY!Doesn't Dr. Bob have anything in his civility rules about it being rude to post in all caps?
Why are you yelling at me?
> ;)
Posted by fallsfall on January 7, 2005, at 12:29:07
In reply to today's session » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
>But he seems concerned that maybe therapy is too intense if I can't put myself back together enough to be able to go back to work.
I think that they often really don't have a clue how much therapy effects us. My therapist changed how he was dealing with me a lot right after we had a discussion about how it wasn't "healthy" for me to be so destroyed by therapy. And the changes really have helped with that.
I'm glad you were open and honest with him. Sometimes I think the disjointed sessions are really important. I find that if I can accept the disjointedness that I am more honest - the rest of the time, I might be editing thing so that what I say all supports the point I'm trying to make. But it is true that when the sessions are really disjointed, it might take a little while (sessions) to figure out what the issues really are.
I hope that whatever you are heading towards is helpful in the long run.
Posted by Annierose on January 7, 2005, at 12:31:14
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by fires on January 7, 2005, at 12:20:59
Not sure I want to get involved in this conversation, but just as a fyi, I have recovered wonderful memories of my grandmother! And I love it when I discover another time we shared together!!
Posted by antigua on January 7, 2005, at 12:32:28
In reply to Re: today's session, posted by annierose on January 7, 2005, at 7:27:48
GG, I'm so very glad you went today. One thing I am picking up on is that maybe you're really opening up more to your T--I don't know how to say this, really, but if he was somewhat surprised at how you felt and wasn't able to put it neatly together, then that could be a really good thing. A new level of trust, maybe? I've also been told that these kinds of feelings/behavior often precede a breakthrough and I certainly hope that is what is happening to you.
Also, about being late. When I first started, I was always exactly on time (my father had a thing about tardiness. The last two years, maybe, I've been very conscious of being late. It doesn't matter how much time I give myself, I'm always late now. We talk about it. It's significant.
One silly story for you.
My T moved over the summer, as I know I've mentioned. I didn't (and maybe still haven't) adjusted well to her move. One day the traffic was terrible (I have a 9 am appt)and I decided to go the back way, or so I thought. I ended up getting lost and the more anxious I became, the more lost I became. The clock was ticking and my prescious T minutes were awasting! I ended up overshooting her new place and had to pass by her old place to get to the new place (still following me?). I don't regularly go by her old place; it's out of the way.By the time I reached my T, I was more than 30 minutes late. I was so flustered. She sweetly told me it was fine and said that I wasn't late for therapy, I had just started it somewhere else (her old house). It was a very productive session.
good luck,
antigua
Posted by Shortelise on January 7, 2005, at 12:44:39
In reply to today's session » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
gg,
You really are in the middle of it, aren't you?
You are so aware, coming at yourself from a place of knowledge of the psyche, and the tender ignorance of self of the analysand. That must be the hardest of all, and I think of this every time I read posts from those of us here who have that knowledge. I second guess myself all the time, with very little of that knowledge. I can imagine what it's like for you.
I love it when my T is "concerned" about me. I feel cared about, and there is safety in that. It means that someone is looking out for me, someone is hearing me, and in that concern I am somehow safe. And when I am in that precarious place of opening cans of worms, I need *some* sense of safety.
Are you the middle child? You make me think of my sister. I was hospitalized when I was 16, and she kept it together.
ShortE
Posted by Dinah on January 7, 2005, at 19:41:17
In reply to today's session » fallsfall, posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 0:28:41
> Now I didn't act out, but didn't anybody notice me?
That's very much a subtext of what's going on with me. The only time I ever got any help was when I acted out. The rest of the time, it was just expected that I'd be and do whatever I should. Of course, I really hated the sort of help I got so I went back to being good again and everyone was happy.
It meant so much for my therapist to tell me that he would believe me just because I told him so.
Posted by Dinah on January 7, 2005, at 19:43:49
In reply to Re: today's session, posted by antigua on January 7, 2005, at 12:32:28
What a great response!
Posted by mair on January 7, 2005, at 22:02:14
In reply to Re: today's session, posted by antigua on January 7, 2005, at 12:32:28
That is a nice story. One of my most mortifying moments was showing up an hour early. My appointment is at 11 and I really need to leave my office by about 15 to 20 minutes before to get there on time. I was sitting at my desk and looked at the clock and it was 10 minutes before 10. I panicked and went into brain lock and either thought it was 10 minutes til 11 or just forgot my appointment was at 11 and not 10. I flew out of there and raced up to her office arriving breathless at about 5 after with apologies at the ready. I felt beyond stupid when she pointed out to me that I was an hour early, but very fortuitously, her 10 o'clock patient had cancelled so she didn't have to send me away. So I guess it really could have been worse. In fact I arrived for an appointment last week and found another woman in the waiting room which is unusual but not unheard of since the waiting room is shared with another therapist. My T's look when she came out of her office told me that this other woman was there to see her also. She was 2 hours early, having gotten confused about the time. The woman appeared to handle it ok, but I'm sure she was upset. There's no way to kill time where my T's office is. The nearest anything of interest is about 7 or 8 miles away.
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 23:31:26
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy » gardenergirl, posted by fires on January 7, 2005, at 12:20:59
>
> A fellow skeptic and MD, concurs with me: Isn't it curious that ALL recovered memories are negative ones?Wow, ALL recovered memories? Have you ever remembered anything you had forgotten for years? Was it negative, too? Ever remember anything good? I know I have. But of course if someone remembers a traumatic event, it's going to be traumatic. So it gets attention.
> >
> > "EEEKKK! BREAK OUT THE ARTICLES! THE WEBSITES! THE PITHY COMMENTS"
> >
> > "GET ME SOME IODINE, I'VE GOT DOG GERMS!" (with apologies to Snoopy)
> >
> > RUN AWAY RUN AWAY RUN AWAY!
>
> Doesn't Dr. Bob have anything in his civility rules about it being rude to post in all caps?There isn't anything in the FAQ on civility. I checked the archives, and there has been discussion, but I believe that it is accepted as an intensification of the message and a posting preference. It has been noted to be more difficult to read, however.
>
> Why are you yelling at me?Well, I do remember--------it was for dramatic effect.
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 23:37:33
In reply to Re: today's session » gardenergirl, posted by fallsfall on January 7, 2005, at 12:29:07
> I think that they often really don't have a clue how much therapy effects us. My therapist changed how he was dealing with me a lot right after we had a discussion about how it wasn't "healthy" for me to be so destroyed by therapy. And the changes really have helped with that.
Falls, I would be interested in hearing how things changed, if you feel like posting about that. I actually have a client who felt worse after our first session, and I think we need to do some wind down or containment stuff at the end of the sessions. I have some ideas, but I would love to hear what you and your T have found successful.
>
> I'm glad you were open and honest with him. Sometimes I think the disjointed sessions are really important.Yeah, I think you are right. It certainly points to something that is disrupting my usual flow of speech. (Can't help it, I'm a talker!)
> I hope that whatever you are heading towards is helpful in the long run.
Thanks, me too. But I do remember (giggle) telling him "remember how I said I always need to know *why*? Well, I'm not sure I do anymore."
Ignorance feels appealing right now. ;)gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 7, 2005, at 23:39:49
In reply to Re: I think I'm resisting in therapy, posted by Annierose on January 7, 2005, at 12:31:14
> Not sure I want to get involved in this conversation, but just as a fyi, I have recovered wonderful memories of my grandmother! And I love it when I discover another time we shared together!!
That sounds lovely.
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 8, 2005, at 0:02:00
In reply to Re: today's session, posted by antigua on January 7, 2005, at 12:32:28
> GG, I'm so very glad you went today. One thing I am picking up on is that maybe you're really opening up more to your T--I don't know how to say this, really, but if he was somewhat surprised at how you felt and wasn't able to put it neatly together, then that could be a really good thing. A new level of trust, maybe?
Yeah, I suppose that if I can surprise him (and scare myself) after more than a year, that must mean something good. And I new level of trust would be good. But he still wonders if I needed to be rude to him. We kind of let that aspect (of me not showing) drop.
> I've also been told that these kinds of feelings/behavior often precede a breakthrough and I certainly hope that is what is happening to you.I hope so too. It's got to be leading to something, or it will really tick me off! :)
>
> It doesn't matter how much time I give myself, I'm always late now. We talk about it. It's significant.What significance do you and your T attach to it?
>
> One silly story for you.
> My T moved over the summer, as I know I've mentioned. I didn't (and maybe still haven't) adjusted well to her move. One day the traffic was terrible (I have a 9 am appt)and I decided to go the back way, or so I thought. I ended up getting lost and the more anxious I became, the more lost I became. The clock was ticking and my prescious T minutes were awasting! I ended up overshooting her new place and had to pass by her old place to get to the new place (still following me?). I don't regularly go by her old place; it's out of the way.
>
> By the time I reached my T, I was more than 30 minutes late. I was so flustered. She sweetly told me it was fine and said that I wasn't late for therapy, I had just started it somewhere else (her old house). It was a very productive session.
> good luck,
> antiguaAww, your T sounds lovely. I had a disaster on the way to a T appt. once. That's when I had my car wreck. Ugh. Never did make it in.
Thanks for your insights,
gg
>
>
Posted by gardenergirl on January 8, 2005, at 0:14:28
In reply to Re: today's session » gardenergirl, posted by Shortelise on January 7, 2005, at 12:44:39
> gg,
>
> You really are in the middle of it, aren't you?
>
>I second guess myself all the time, with very little of that knowledge. I can imagine what it's like for you.You really seem to get it. That's a nice feeling. And yes, I am the middle child. Although many think I am the oldest, cause my bro is 40 going on about 14. How did you guess?
>gg
Posted by gardenergirl on January 8, 2005, at 0:17:38
In reply to Re: today's session » gardenergirl, posted by Dinah on January 7, 2005, at 19:41:17
> > Now I didn't act out, but didn't anybody notice me?
>
> That's very much a subtext of what's going on with me. The only time I ever got any help was when I acted out. The rest of the time, it was just expected that I'd be and do whatever I should. Of course, I really hated the sort of help I got so I went back to being good again and everyone was happy.
Sounds like a classic example of how we learn to act the way we do. I think I was always the good girl. 'cept when I was about two. I threw tantrums then. A lost skill... :)> It meant so much for my therapist to tell me that he would believe me just because I told him so.
That is really a special thing to hear, I'll bet.
gg
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