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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by markwell on August 2, 2011, at 8:11:03
In reply to Re: Day 31 of Viibryd » bearfan, posted by Chris O on August 2, 2011, at 7:20:23
So viibryd doesn't sound like the miracle drug. I have major depression and the problem is this is the only drug I haven't tried. Is it worth trying? Does it calm the mind at all?
Mark
Posted by Chris O on August 2, 2011, at 14:12:59
In reply to Re: Day 31 of Viibryd, posted by markwell on August 2, 2011, at 8:11:03
Mark:
Well, I'm only on Day 10, but already up to 40mg. It doesn't seem at all like "a miracle drug" to me. It seems similar to the other SSRIs I have taken in the last three years--Paxil, Prozac, and Luvox. There is some mild anti-anxiety effect so far for me, but I wouldn't say it calms my mind the way I need it to. It just doesn't feel strong enough, but I'll stick with it a bit longer to see if it improves. My hopes are not high right now.
Chris
Posted by bearfan on August 2, 2011, at 14:41:48
In reply to Re: Day 31 of Viibryd » markwell, posted by Chris O on August 2, 2011, at 14:12:59
I agree with Mark's comments. For it to be a "Miracle Drug", it really has to offer significantly better efficacy, superior tolerability, broad range of indications/symptom control, and better safety margin. Neither of former has been proven. I view it as another 'me too' SSRI with a slightly different side-effect profile vs the existing therapies. Not to say you and your doctor shouldn't consider using it, but if your expecting 'life changing' results, you may be disappointed.
Posted by joe schmoe on August 2, 2011, at 23:38:49
In reply to Re: Day 31 of Viibryd, posted by bearfan on August 2, 2011, at 14:41:48
I'm a little puzzled by this talk of miracle drugs, skipping the prescribed dosage taper, and evaluating an antidepressant after only ten days.
Before evaluating an antidepressant I would follow the manufacturer's recommendations for dosage (unless side effects became intolerable) and give it at least month, or two months.
To me Viibryd was supposed to be an ssri antidepressant with minimal sexual or weight gain effects. No more and no less. If you never got any good effect from ssris, then Viibryd was probably nothing to get excited about.
SSRIs do work for me for dysthymia and atypical depression. I take clonazepam for social anxiety. What I wanted from Viibryd was something like celexa but without the sexual numbing or the fatness. So far the sexual numbing seems to be absent, so I am quite happy with it. I wish my appetite was lower, but you can't have everything - and maybe that will improve over time.
Posted by SLS on August 3, 2011, at 6:47:21
In reply to Re: Day 31 of Viibryd, posted by joe schmoe on August 2, 2011, at 23:38:49
> I'm a little puzzled by this talk of miracle drugs,
Me too. No one drug heals all. However, for the one person that a specific drug does heal, it is a miracle drug.
> skipping the prescribed dosage taper,
Desperation?
> and evaluating an antidepressant after only ten days.
This frustrates me to no end when I see people draw a conclusion about the effectiveness of a drug before three weeks passes.
> Before evaluating an antidepressant I would follow the manufacturer's recommendations for dosage (unless side effects became intolerable) and give it at least month, or two months.
I don't know. I think the experience of multiple clinicians over time can yield new ways to use old drugs.
> To me Viibryd was supposed to be an ssri antidepressant
Not really. It was meant to be different. In addition to serotonin reuptake inhibition, Viibryd is a 5-HT1a partial agonist. I'm not sure, but I think the serotonin reuptake inhibition of Viibryd is less robust than the SSRIs.
> with minimal sexual or weight gain effects.
This is due to the 5-HT1a receptor partial agonism.
> No more and no less. If you never got any good effect from ssris, then Viibryd was probably nothing to get excited about.
Possibly, but clinical data on new drugs often supercedes theory.
> SSRIs do work for me for dysthymia and atypical depression. I take clonazepam for social anxiety. What I wanted from Viibryd was something like celexa but without the sexual numbing or the fatness. So far the sexual numbing seems to be absent, so I am quite happy with it. I wish my appetite was lower, but you can't have everything - and maybe that will improve over time.
I wish you luck. I hope you experience a clinical response greater than what your theory would predict.
- Scott
Posted by Chris O on August 3, 2011, at 8:26:39
In reply to Re: Day 31 of Viibryd, posted by joe schmoe on August 2, 2011, at 23:38:49
Joe:
Chris here. I'm the guy who's evaluating Viibryd after 10 days. Perhaps normally, I wouldn't do that (evaluate a drug so quickly). I've come to this board on and off for over ten years, though not as often as others, perhaps. When I saw your post (which started evaluating Viibryd after Day 1, I think), I just decided to share my experience with the drug as well. I thought it would be helpful as an add-on to this thread, and I wanted to interact with someone who was also taking the drug. No more, no less. Even though you and Scott are "puzzled," I'd like to continue to share here. In terms of skipping the prescribed dosing, I did jump up to 40mg a few days before I was supposed to (Yes, I guess I'm "desperate." I'll own that.) But I've been through the SSRI drill enough to get a feeling of how these drugs affect my body/brain. Why another SSRI if the ones I've tried in the past have been unsuccessful? My next stop is Nardil or a tricyclic, and I'd just prefer to have something work with fewer side effects than one of those drugs. That's my story.
Chris
Posted by bearfan on August 3, 2011, at 13:28:02
In reply to Re: Day 31 of Viibryd » joe schmoe, posted by Chris O on August 3, 2011, at 8:26:39
Who was the one who only tried it for 10 days? I've taken it for 32 and followed the titration schedule
Posted by Chris O on August 3, 2011, at 18:48:10
In reply to Re: Day 31 of Viibryd, posted by bearfan on August 3, 2011, at 13:28:02
Bearfan:
It's me, Chris. I'm the one who has taken it for ten days.
Posted by joe schmoe on August 16, 2011, at 19:48:31
In reply to Re: Day 31 of Viibryd » bearfan, posted by Chris O on August 3, 2011, at 18:48:10
Been away for a week visiting family. I noticed I was having some dizziness and spaciness while walking around during the day (harder to notice this in my usual sedentary lifestyle at home). This occurred (the following day) even while taking the Viibryd in the evening.
Taking it late at night gave me very weird dreams and an instance of "night terrors" or sleep paralysis where I was trying to wake up from a dream and couldn't for a while, thrashing around - reminded me of imipramine. In six weeks that has only happened once though, and only while taking 40mg Viibryd late at night.
Libido continues to be great. In fact, being this horny all the time is rather distracting - not used to it. Sensation is also great. Unless this drug falls down later and lands me in a depression I can't see going back to a regular ssri.
In any case the dizziness and spaciness during the day, after being at 40 mg for nearly 4 weeks, has me thinking this dose may be above my sweet spot, so several days ago I dropped back to 20mg by breaking the pills in half. We'll see how that holds up.
I am entering my final semester in this degree program I am in, and am looking for post-graduation jobs, facing the terrible economy etc. so this will be a very stressful and depressing time for me. The drug will really be put to the test in the coming weeks and months as far as AD effectiveness goes.
At the moment I would say 20mg has no side effects for me whatsoever. If that changes I will make a post.
Over the summer I have been having an annoying problem with a muscle in my inner or middle ear twitching throughout the day at random. It may or may not have anything to do with Viibryd. It is an annoying sensation I have had before, typically when some part of my body was irritated in some way (usually something weirdly unrelated to the ear, like being constipated). It has been bothering me a lot lately but now that I think about it, seems to have decreased quite a bit since I moved back down to 20mg. Could be coincidence. I have not been constipated, so I know it isn't that causing it.
Posted by joe schmoe on August 16, 2011, at 20:56:11
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by joe schmoe on August 16, 2011, at 19:48:31
Incidentally the sweets/carbs cravings I was having earlier when starting Viibryd seem to be decreasing significantly. I am hoping now to go on a diet and lose some of the weight I put on while on celexa.
Posted by Chris O on August 17, 2011, at 11:01:35
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by joe schmoe on August 16, 2011, at 20:56:11
Joe:
It's good to know that Viibryd is working so well for you. For me so far, into Week 4, it's similar to other SSRIs for me. After meeting with my p-doc, I'm up to 50mg a day. I still do not feel a significant anti-anxiety/anti-depressant effect. If anything, it has a blunting effect--a bit pro-depressive--not opening me up the way I'd like it to. (I think another new Viibryd taker commented on that in this post stream.) I've also got a bit of anorgasmia and my anhedonia really hasn't lifted, but I've been on SSRIs pretty much continually for the past 3+ years. I don't have any other significant side effects, no weight gain yet, and I lost about 10 pounds after stopping Paxil and Serzone several months ago. I'm going to stick this out for a couple of months, but my hopes are not high.
Chris
Posted by bearfan on August 17, 2011, at 15:45:12
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by joe schmoe on August 16, 2011, at 19:48:31
I'm on week 6 as well and still having trouble coping. I don't feel as calm or talkative as on other SSRIs. I got a few of the night terrors you speak of when taking it late at night. It only happens every now and then, but it seems to be much less pronounced when I take it about a half hour to hour before bedtime and take it with a cracker or two. I'm not noticing the 'super libido', like you mention, but i'm 30 and still depressed which is effecting it.
Posted by Jenbr on September 3, 2011, at 13:58:39
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by joe schmoe on August 16, 2011, at 20:56:11
I am on day 3 of 40mg now. Started at 10mg and titrated up over a couple weeks. I suppose it's a bit early to determine whether or not this med will be a good one for me or not - so far I don't feel too many harsh side effects, but I suppose it's too early in the game to determine that as well! I have to admit that one of my primary concerns in terms of side effects is weight gain. Any personal experiences with Viibryd's effect on appetite or metabolism?
Posted by Chris O on September 3, 2011, at 18:19:50
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by Jenbr on September 3, 2011, at 13:58:39
Jen:
I'm on Week 6 at a pretty high dose of Viibryd, 80mg. I don't have any weight gain yet, but perhaps some increased appetite. This med, like most of the SSRIs I've tried at high doses over the past four years, doesn't seem to be doing much for my anxiety disorder though. I meet with my psychiatrist next week. I'm probably going to try something else. Good luck with your trial and I hope it helps you.
Chris
Posted by Jenbr on September 3, 2011, at 22:31:27
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6 » Jenbr, posted by Chris O on September 3, 2011, at 18:19:50
Chris,
Sorry it isn't working so well for you. I was truly hoping this new med wouldn't simply be just another SSRI. That there would be something more innovative about it. It's pretty early on it it's "existence" I suppose, but my hopes have not been terribly high. And I haven't been hearing a lot of success with this med so far. Hopefully that will change...
Good luck with trying a different med. It isn't fun, I know...
Jen
Posted by Chris O on September 4, 2011, at 0:23:39
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by Jenbr on September 3, 2011, at 22:31:27
Thanks, Jen. It sounds like you've done some time with SSRIs, like me. Not to get into a big discussion, but what were you taking before trying Viibryd? And did it just poop out or was it not strong enough or something else? Just curious.
Chris
Posted by Jenbr on September 4, 2011, at 13:47:59
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6 » Jenbr, posted by Chris O on September 4, 2011, at 0:23:39
Oh, yes! I've been on almost every medication available, I believe. I have treatment resistant bipolar and have had to resort to ECT treatments for over 6 years now. Needless to say, I have virtually no long or short term memory left. But the SSRIs have not been extremely helpful for me in general. Zoloft has been the most helpful and was the first med I was on. It pooped out on me! The rest did nothing for me. ( although, I have never been on Celexa for some reason). I suppose I still get a tiny bit of hope whenever a new psychotropic comes out (unless it's infamous for weight gain!)
I was on cymbalta right before Viibryd. Didn't help.
Have you tried all of the other ssris?
Posted by Chris O on September 5, 2011, at 22:23:38
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by Jenbr on September 4, 2011, at 13:47:59
Jen:
I've tried, I think, most of the SSRIs. I'm 44 now. I now realize I've had a massive anxiety disorder my whole life. When I was in college, in the late 1980s, cognitive therapy (a/la David Burns) was all the rage. Into the 1990s, when I was in my 20s and 30s, I tried every type of will-based, non-psychotropic method to treat my GAD, including yoga, tai chi, jogging, long bike rides, camping, ballroom dancing, and pretty much every single herbal treatment in the highest highest of doses. I was also in a therapy group and seeing a therapist for much of the 1990s. Finally, in 1999, I gave in and took a Celexa (20mg)/Wellbutrin (150mg) combo, and it helped. I took that combo for a year. Even though I lost my teaching job during that period, that was probably the best I've felt in my entire life. Since 2000, I've had long-term trials of high-dose Lexapro (40mg), Prozac (100mg), Luvox (whatever the high was for that), Paxil (75-100mg), and Serzone (1200mg). None of them really touched my GAD. I also took Klonapin (3-5mg) for a year, and dabbled in months long experiments with Effexor, Cymbalta, Neurontin and Zoloft. Now, I'm on month two of 80mg of Viibryd, and it's just not going to cut it. I'm fine as long as I'm "dependent/codependent" on someone (now it's my wife). But if I have to survive alone in the world, nope, this drug is not going to cut it. You said you have bipolar, which is much different from my GAD, I know, but it sounds like the ECT helped. Years ago, I never would have considered that, but lately ... I'm starting to ... want to try anything to make this terminal anxiety/panic dissipate. Frankly, this whole condition is humiliating to me. Anyway, on the issue of weight gain: So far, I have zero weight gain with Viibryd. I actually lost about 10 pounds after coming off Serzone, and the Viibryd has been weight neutral so far, even at high doses. Sorry to babble. Good talking to you.
Chris
Posted by markwell on September 6, 2011, at 15:18:49
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by Jenbr on September 4, 2011, at 13:47:59
Jenbr,I am also bipolar and resistant to most meds. I'm currently taking tegretol and buspar but nothing for depression. I was hoping to try viibryd but it doesn't seem that anyone is doing well on it. Let us know if you stop taking it. I'm trying counseling but not doing so well with that. Keep us posted.
Mark
Posted by Jenbr on September 6, 2011, at 16:05:10
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6 » Jenbr, posted by Chris O on September 5, 2011, at 22:23:38
Chris,
Well it sounds like you have also run the gamut on all of the various treatments. I, too, struggle horribly with GAD. I empathize with you. And I can't even count how many more natural or holistic approaches I took to help ease the pain. Acupuncture, yoga, a myriad of overpriced supplements, and on and on and on. I know that exercise and diet and filling the body and mind with the natural things in life is very important, but it just isn't enough for me to function and it sounds like that is the case for you as well. ECT has been a blessing and a curse for me. It does help with the anxiety, depression, OCD tendencies etc. And I know that the vast majority of ECT patients do NOT have to go as often as I have/do so their side effects are much less severe. I say this because I have to admit that it can help very extreme situations and provide relief for some. If you decide to consider it and ever want to know more about it from a client's pov just let me know. I also recently tried several months worth of TMS. Not sure it did much to help me in particular, but it is pain free and has helped others! Worth a shot... Do you have good health insurance?
Jen
Posted by joe schmoe on September 6, 2011, at 16:39:39
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by markwell on September 6, 2011, at 15:18:49
> I was hoping to try viibryd but it doesn't seem that anyone is doing well on it.
I think I am doing quite well on it.
Posted by Jenbr on September 6, 2011, at 20:35:58
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 6, posted by markwell on September 6, 2011, at 15:18:49
Hi Mark,
Sorry to hear that therapy isn't going so smoothly right now. It always sparks something in us when we hear of a new med (like Viibryd)- I actually felt a tiny bit of hope. But I am going to go off of it because there aren't enough studies on it's effect on breastfeeding. I have a 2.5 month yr old and don't feel comfortable continuing this med because of that.
My friend has been on Viibryd for 2 months now. She says she isn't sure if it's helping, but honestly, it seems she is doing a bit better than usual to me. Hopefully, it will be a good med for some people...
Jen
Posted by Phillipa on September 6, 2011, at 21:07:23
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 9, posted by joe schmoe on September 6, 2011, at 16:39:39
Hey that's great a positive review on the med. In what way do you feel it's helping? Phillipa
Posted by joe schmoe on September 6, 2011, at 21:20:05
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 9 » joe schmoe, posted by Phillipa on September 6, 2011, at 21:07:23
> Hey that's great a positive review on the med. In what way do you feel it's helping? Phillipa
Well my mood is good, and since I'm taking it for atypical depression, it's doing its job. Libido and sensation feel back to normal, after years of Celexa numbness. I have stopped drinking beer and am on a diet and have lost a few pounds so far. Probably eating too much dark chocolate (got hooked on Dove's) but as long as the weight is coming off, that's ok, dark chocolate is good for you.
I am back at 40 mg after backing off to 20 mg for a week. Once in a while I have a bit of spaciness or anxiety, but it passes and most days I have none. Weird dreams I have trouble waking up from, and sleeping 9 or 10 hours a day/having trouble getting out of bed are the most annoying symptoms left. But part of that may be due to me also discontinuing my diet soda addiction in favor of tea/water. I am probably getting a lot less caffeine than I used to, and no aspartame.
I also get some twitching of an inner ear muscle, which I have mentioned before, at 40 mg. I hope this strange symptom passes over time. It is not constant, but it definitely stops at 20 mg and comes back at 40 mg.
I feel like I am moving in a positive direction weight wise, and sexually I have no complaints, unlike regular SSRIs. My mood is quite good despite the horrendous economic situation and the pressures of my last semester in school/my job search, which normally would get me way down. My roommate thinks my mood is quite good, which gives me some objective feedback.
If I were working I would take this drug with dinner to minimize any daytime effects while at work, since once in a while I get a weird sensation or two several hours after taking it.
I take clonazepam for social anxiety, so I am not expecting Viibryd to help with anxiety, just with depression.
Posted by Phillipa on September 6, 2011, at 23:30:37
In reply to Re: Viibryd end of week 9, posted by joe schmoe on September 6, 2011, at 21:20:05
It sounds like doing extremly well. I don't feel ad's help with anxiety also. Inner ear twitching? Think like a twitchy eye lid? Does it stop? Phillipa
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