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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by linkadge on September 17, 2010, at 8:19:24
In reply to Re: oh canada! » Conundrum, posted by Vincent_QC on September 16, 2010, at 13:10:35
I'm in Ontario. The system has been marginal, I guess.
It can take a while to see a psychiatrist, if your case qualifies as needing it. The appointments are often short (for me at least) (15 min or so).
The drugs are expensive, and if you don't have private insurance (or aren't needy enough for government coverage) you end up paying out of pocket for drugs.
I take ritalin, but I would benefit from ritalin CR. Ritalin CR would run me over $250 a month out of pocket. Because of my situation, theres nobody to pick up that tab.
Oh, and the drugs don't really work :) But I guess thats pretty much common to all countries :)
Linkadge
Posted by Conundrum on September 17, 2010, at 22:27:33
In reply to Re: oh canada!, posted by linkadge on September 17, 2010, at 8:19:24
So thats $250 for a whole bunch of nothing. :)
Posted by Conundrum on September 17, 2010, at 22:29:01
In reply to Re: oh canada!, posted by linkadge on September 17, 2010, at 8:19:24
BTW that sounds horrible. I guess I'm gonna have to vote for the Repugnantcans this november.
Posted by Maxime on September 18, 2010, at 9:58:15
In reply to Re: oh canada!, posted by Conundrum on September 16, 2010, at 23:22:09
> Maybe all the Pdocs are moving south ;-)
>
> That sucks, but I am paying out of pocket. My pdoc is nice in that she lets me get a lot done in a short phone conversation. I couldn't afford it otherwise.I think many do go to the states to practice. Another thing about the Canadian System is that it takes us longer to have meds approved by Health Canada. Abilify only became available this year in Canada.
Posted by linkadge on September 18, 2010, at 11:26:02
In reply to Re: oh canada! » linkadge, posted by Conundrum on September 17, 2010, at 22:27:33
>So thats $250 for a whole bunch of nothing. :)
What do you mean? I said SSRIs were overhyped.
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on September 18, 2010, at 11:26:56
In reply to Re: oh canada! » Conundrum, posted by Maxime on September 18, 2010, at 9:58:15
And some meds we havn't got at all. I don't think emsam is available.
Linkadge
Posted by Vincent_QC on September 18, 2010, at 12:48:23
In reply to Re: oh canada! » Maxime, posted by linkadge on September 18, 2010, at 11:26:56
> And some meds we havn't got at all. I don't think emsam is available.
>
> LinkadgeYeah, Health Canada always take more times to approve new meds and that's suck...
I guess we will have the Valdoxan only in 3-4 years...
We only had the Cymbalta approve 2 years ago and it was available in the USA 2 years before. Same for the Lexapro who is call Cipralex in the Canada.
The Luvox CR is not avlaible in the Canada and will never be launch here.
My PDoc wanted to start me on the Liquid Paxil because I overreact to SSRI'S meds now and we don't know why... he had to fill out some papers and send them to Health Canada for the SAP programme (The Special Access Programme, who provides access to nonmarketed drugs for practitioners treating patients with serious or life-threatening conditions when conventional therapies have failed, are unsuitable, or unavailable and authorizes a manufacturer to sell a drug that cannot otherwise be sold or distributed in Canada). After 6 months and a lot of phone call and e-mails send to the SAP programme, we receive a negative answer from them... for a mysterious reason they say all the SSRI's in liquid form was withdraw from the Canadian market years ago because they was toxic?!? The only one liquid SSRI who stay available in the Canada is the BAD Generic Prozac (APO-Fluoxetine...
Emsam is not avalaible in the Canada and will never be available. My PDoc try to import it into the Canada and the drug company who produce it in the States asking for a lot a $$$$ for it, it was something like 12-16 $ for each patch and at the smaller dose...more expensive for higher dose patch.
Same for the Marplan, who is another MAOI who will never be available in the Canada, my PDoc ask Health Canada and the SAP programme to have the right to import it and they say yes but I had to pay for it and it was around 200$ for 90 pills of 10mg, and the effective dose is 30 mg who mean 600$ for one month and Health Canada wanted that my PDoc send a medical report of side-effects and improves to them each month for all the time I will be on it, so I say no to the Marplan.
Some of the older TCA's are not available in the Canada also... can't remember witch ones... as well as older tetracyclic (not the Remeron)...
One drug who will be interresting to try is not available in the USA and the Canada, only in Europe, even if it's old, it's the Coaxil (Stablon), always wanted to know if it's good to treat anxiety disorders???
Health Canada is also very strict for the natural products. You have to be lucky to succeed to buy natural products from the web and receive them by mail!!! I was lucky to receive the Inositol, who is not allowed here, only in Vitamine B complex at low dose of 100mg maximum... wanted to try it because some studies show it was effective for panic disorder and other anxiety disorders as well but I was afraid to try it to the recommended dose of 18 gramm day... but I receive it! lol
Anyway... I think both country, USA or Canada, face a lot of problems with the medical cares system... and meds...
Posted by Conundrum on September 18, 2010, at 14:09:19
In reply to Re: oh canada! » linkadge, posted by Vincent_QC on September 18, 2010, at 12:48:23
I've figured out the way these big companies keep making money here. They give the doctors all these new drugs that are samples. Which the patients and the doctors love because they're free, but then if they get you hooked on them, you have to have your insurance pay some ridiculous amount. Or you go on patient assistance programs, but they still are making a boat load of money. I thought about because I wanted to try Wellbutrin XL but now they have a new brand name bupropion hydrobromide. I could probably get samples but then I would have to pay and who knows if its really as good as wellbutrin? The same goes for pristiq.
Posted by linkadge on September 18, 2010, at 14:17:28
In reply to Re: oh canada! » linkadge, posted by Vincent_QC on September 18, 2010, at 12:48:23
>Health Canada is also very strict for the >natural products. >Inositol, who is not allowed here, only in Vitamine B complex at low dose of 100mg maximum... wanted to try it because some studies show it was effective for panic disorder and other anxiety disorders as well but I was afraid to try it to the recommended dose of 18 gramm day... but I receive it! lol
I agree. Canada is pathetic when it comes to medications and supplements. They obviously don't give a rats behind about staying with cutting edge medicine.
Inositol *is* available in canada. I just bought a jar of inositol powder from GNC. 500g for about $25.
Linkadge
Posted by ed_uk2010 on September 18, 2010, at 14:57:55
In reply to Re: oh canada!, posted by linkadge on September 18, 2010, at 14:17:28
>Canada is pathetic when it comes to medications........
It's not always a bad thing that they're cautious to approve new products, some meds which have had to be withdrawn from the market (for safety reasons) in other coutries might never have been approved in Canada in the first place.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on September 18, 2010, at 15:00:34
In reply to Re: oh canada! » linkadge, posted by Vincent_QC on September 18, 2010, at 12:48:23
>he had to fill out some papers and send them to Health Canada for the SAP programme
That sounds complex. In the UK, the doctor just prescribes as usual and the pharmacy can buy from a specialist importing company.
Posted by Maxime on September 18, 2010, at 16:22:57
In reply to Re: oh canada! » linkadge, posted by ed_uk2010 on September 18, 2010, at 14:57:55
I totally agree. Serzone was taken off the market here way before the US.
It's just that sometimes it is frustrating to read on PB the different meds that are available and how well they work. I think "I must try that med!". They can import a med to Canada if your doctor fills out a form. I don't know how easy it is to do.
I remember waiting a long time for Cymbalta to come to Canada. I went on it and it worked for about a year. I still had some depression, but no med gets rid of my depression 100 percent.
Posted by Maxime on September 18, 2010, at 16:24:39
In reply to Re: oh canada! » Vincent_QC, posted by ed_uk2010 on September 18, 2010, at 15:00:34
> >he had to fill out some papers and send them to Health Canada for the SAP programme
>
> That sounds complex. In the UK, the doctor just prescribes as usual and the pharmacy can buy from a specialist importing company.It's a pain in the *ss. My psych had to do the same thing for Adderall. We are still waiting to have it approved and we submitted the form about a month ago or maybe before.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on September 18, 2010, at 16:48:42
In reply to Re: oh canada! » ed_uk2010, posted by Maxime on September 18, 2010, at 16:24:39
>We are still waiting to have it approved
I don't think they've even applied for Adderall to be approved here. We don't really 'do' stimulants apart from tea, coffee and cigs, usually tea. Can't beat a cup of Tetley's lol :)
Posted by conundrum on September 18, 2010, at 18:39:03
In reply to Re: oh canada! » ed_uk2010, posted by Maxime on September 18, 2010, at 16:22:57
serzone is still available in the US under the generic nefazodone. Its just that bristol meyes squib removed the brand name from the market. A lot of psychiatrists in my area seem to still use it.
Posted by Maxime on September 18, 2010, at 18:58:50
In reply to Re: oh canada! » Maxime, posted by ed_uk2010 on September 18, 2010, at 16:48:42
> >We are still waiting to have it approved
>
> I don't think they've even applied for Adderall to be approved here. We don't really 'do' stimulants apart from tea, coffee and cigs, usually tea. Can't beat a cup of Tetley's lol :)
>LMAO! So I should drink more tea and take up smoking. You are right about a cup of Tetley's. A cup of tea can help in all situations ... that is what my dad believed too.
Posted by Vincent_QC on September 19, 2010, at 6:06:56
In reply to Re: oh canada!, posted by linkadge on September 18, 2010, at 14:17:28
> Inositol *is* available in canada. I just bought a jar of inositol powder from GNC. 500g for about $25.
>
> LinkadgeYou are from the Ontario Linkadge???
I think some provinces in the Canada have different allowed natural products... not sure but I ask all the Pharmacists in my area, they do some research and they told me it was not allow in the Quebec province... So I order it from the States...
Posted by Vincent_QC on September 19, 2010, at 6:08:22
In reply to Re: oh canada! » Vincent_QC, posted by ed_uk2010 on September 18, 2010, at 15:00:34
> >he had to fill out some papers and send them to Health Canada for the SAP programme
>
> That sounds complex. In the UK, the doctor just prescribes as usual and the pharmacy can buy from a specialist importing company.That's complex... everything is complex in the Quebec province... Health Canada are very strict...
Posted by linkadge on September 19, 2010, at 6:45:50
In reply to Re: oh canada! » linkadge, posted by Vincent_QC on September 19, 2010, at 6:06:56
Ah, you're in quebec. Inositol is here in ontario. But, there are other supplements I can't get in ontario like picamilon, or lithium (supplemental) etc.
Linkadge
Posted by Conundrum on September 19, 2010, at 6:55:21
In reply to Re: oh canada! » Vincent_QC, posted by linkadge on September 19, 2010, at 6:45:50
Its also interesting that there are quite a few from Canada here. Maybe you'd be better now if you were living in the U.S. (and you had insurance of course.)
Posted by ed_uk2010 on September 19, 2010, at 7:55:48
In reply to Re: oh canada! » linkadge, posted by Conundrum on September 19, 2010, at 6:55:21
>Maybe you'd be better now if you were living in the U.S.
If you want free samples of the latest and greatest new med, yes. Unfortunately, it may also involve being a guinea pig for new side effects, new withdrawal symptoms and often ends up costing a lot of money. In addition, a lot of 'new' meds are just overpriced me-too drugs and patent extenders eg. Pristiq. Perhaps Canada are excessively strict, but there is a lot to be said for being cautious when it comes to new medications which will end up being prescribed for millions of people.
The European authorities appear to be similar in 'strictness' to the FDA, but they sometimes have differing opinions. You have some meds and we don't and vice versa. Also depends on whether the manufacturers applied for approval. Overall, there are many more meds available in the US.
Posted by Vincent_QC on September 19, 2010, at 8:08:58
In reply to Re: oh canada! » Vincent_QC, posted by linkadge on September 19, 2010, at 6:45:50
> Ah, you're in quebec. Inositol is here in ontario. But, there are other supplements I can't get in ontario like picamilon, or lithium (supplemental) etc.
>
> LinkadgeYeah, Quebec city... french QUÉBÉCOIS not Canadian!!! lol ;-)
Humm I see... I think the other guy is right... perhaps it's better to have meds later in the Canada, at least when they are launch in the Canada, they are well tested... But here also all the PDoc I had and the one I have now are trying to push new meds... Had several samples boxes, especially for the Cipralex (Lexapro), Pristiq, Cymbalta... throw all of them in garbaage... especially the Cymbalta, who I hated a lot!!! Anxiety disorder and noradrenaline reputake is not something who work for everyone...
Anyway... I remember one med, Serzone, who was withdraw from the Canadian market in 2003, they don't have it in a generic form in the Canada... wonder why in the USA they have it...it was good for the anxiety, far better than the Desyrel ( less next day sedation and less increase anxiety at daytime)...
Posted by Conundrum on September 19, 2010, at 8:49:15
In reply to Re: oh canada!, posted by ed_uk2010 on September 19, 2010, at 7:55:48
I agree about those dumb me too drugs. Pristiq doesn't even have DRI like the original. Yes we are guinea pigs, but it seems like you get the same drugs eventually anyway. Cymbalta is still linked with liver problems and Canada still approved it. I dont' think its the new drugs that keeps canadian's from getting well. I think its the time it takeks to see a pdoc and then short appointment times. How can they make an accurate assessment if its hard to get consistent visits and they are short like someone on he recently stated?
Posted by ed_uk2010 on September 19, 2010, at 10:36:23
In reply to Re: oh canada! » linkadge, posted by Vincent_QC on September 19, 2010, at 8:08:58
>don't have it in a generic form in the Canada... wonder why in the USA they have it...
Because the USA is the biggest market for prescription drugs in the world, there are a lot of people and prescribing is very high - in spite of the very high cost of new medicines. Even infrequently prescribed products sell well enough to make it worthwhile for the manufacturer. If they tried to sell generic nefazodone elsewhere, it probably wouldn't be prescribed enough to make it financially viable for the manufacturers and suppliers. We don't have it here either, it simply wouldn't be prescribed... or very rarely.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on September 19, 2010, at 10:40:09
In reply to Re: oh canada! » ed_uk2010, posted by Conundrum on September 19, 2010, at 8:49:15
>How can they make an accurate assessment if its hard to get consistent visits and they are short like someone on he recently stated?
I get the impression that Healthcare in the US works very well for those who have good insurance, plenty of money, or both. For those who don't it can be very difficult. Healthcare is fairer here, but the quality is variable and waiting times are often too long. Access to new treatments (eg. for cancer) is sometimes poor.
The Brits are quite medication phobic, but the doctors still prescribe a lot. Most of it ends up in the bin.
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