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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 75 to 99 of 134. Go back in thread:
Posted by fluffy on January 10, 2004, at 11:05:11
In reply to Re: Lithium, posted by socks on January 10, 2004, at 8:39:22
Hi Socks--
I have some questions for you re: Depakote. I just started with 250mg for my bipolar II. I also am hopeful that it will kick in and be my wonder drug.
i'm only on my 3rd day. When you first started, did you feel drugged/tired/unemotional/sorta depressed? If so, did this eventually fade away? I know that I've had icky side effects on other drugs that passed over time. (I think I felt sick and drugged on Paxil for like 3 weeks before it worked). I'm just feeling pretty darned awful right now and i need to know there's the possibility of this drugged groggy-ness going bye-bye.
Welcome to our group, socks. (I like the name!). I also hope you will feel restored to as close to normal as you can be, and feel better soon.
Are you at all freaking about your diagnosis? I was diagnosed a year ago, and my doctor and I have been fumbling around with my med cocktail for about that long. I hope you hit the nail on the head with the depakote and the wellbutrin.
good luck,
Katy
Posted by socks on January 10, 2004, at 14:49:41
In reply to Re: Lithium, posted by fluffy on January 10, 2004, at 11:05:11
Hi Fluffy,
I completely freaked out at my diagnosis. I was a wreck, felt like a complete failure, read alot of stuff that made me feel hopeless. My self-image was shattered. Then I met with my T and she calmed me down, let me know we can battle this and assured me that she would there for me. Then she went on to say that many brilliant people have had this diagnosis so that the company we keep is pretty good. Then I meet with my pdoc the next day. I went on and on to him about my feelings of being worthless. He let me carry on for about 5 minutes then he said, look, this illness has had some very positive effects for you and has allowed in some ways, to grow your career. He said that he also would be there to get the meds right and help me along the way. At that point, I felt much better hearing it from two people.
As for the Depakote, I started at 500 mg a day and was very weepy at first. I would cry at anything. We did that for a week. Then we increased it to 1000mg and kept the Wellbutrin. After almost two weeks at these levels, my weepy times are gone, my "I want a nap" at 2pm thing is gone and I am starting to get my concentration back. I am having very weird dreams but that's okay! I am very hopeful that this will work. Let's compare notes as I think this may be a pretty good combination!
Keep me posted(literally),
Socks!
Posted by katia on January 10, 2004, at 16:47:05
In reply to Re: Lithium, posted by fluffy on January 10, 2004, at 11:05:11
Hi Katy,
How's it going? I remember when I first started Depakote at the lower doses I went hypomanic - went wild. did stupid things with strange french man...the pdoc said that this is consistent with the dx since other bp peps have experienced that on low doses of Dep. just a word of warning...maybe you need something activating - like upping of Lam. to offset the fatigue you feel on Dep. It's only been three days you probably don't even have Dep. therapeutic levels yet in your blood. I wouldn't judge anything at this point.
take care-
katia
Posted by katia on January 10, 2004, at 16:51:33
In reply to Re: Here's to coming together » katia, posted by Karen_kay on January 9, 2004, at 17:01:33
Hi Karen,
It's hard to tell if the fog is lifting b/c I did something stupid last night - drank too much and "gave 'em something to talk about". Thesis is in limbo. Oh, loved to buy you a house, but I'm fooling myself in thinking I can. I wait tables three x a week! I live in the bay area where you can't really get anything under $400,000 - maybe a small two bedroom and that's not in the best part of town.
I'm angry with myself. I'll probably go on Antabuse 'cuz I just can't do this alone.
take care,
Katia
Posted by katia on January 10, 2004, at 16:54:42
In reply to Re: Lithium » katia, posted by AMD on January 9, 2004, at 16:10:45
Hi Adam,
If you were on Celexa for four years and it worked then I wonder about your dx as well. What happened surrounding the time when you drank too much? Just wondering why you got the dx of bipolar. What sort of questions did s/he ask?
just curious...
katia
Posted by fluffy on January 11, 2004, at 11:21:38
In reply to Re: Lithium, posted by socks on January 10, 2004, at 14:49:41
Hi again Socks--
Yeah--no bones about it--getting a BP diagnosis is just devistating. The doctors try to soften it for you, but what a shocker to find out you'll have to deal with something the rest of your life. AND you wonder what your personality is apart from the "disease". If you're a perfectionist like me, it's even harder. I've probably tried to control all of this too much. When things get tough, I want to be at the driving wheel--"gimme that! I'll drive!" My "T" is helping with that stuff a great deal. It's been a year, and sometimes it seems harder because all that time has passed, and I still haven't quite gotten to my normal yet. I've had a rough time with medication trials. But I'm having to look at the monster face to face. Before, I didn't know what the hell was wrong with me. I was clinically depressed, and could barely get up take a shower for months. I can't say it's been worse than that since. At least now I'm in the know. If you need to talk about this stuff, just post--it's an uphill battle for awhile. The PB boards are great for support.
Thankfully, the Depakote isn't making me feel like I've been bludgeoned in the head anymore. I'm still having trouble sleeping at night--having to resort to my benzo to get some "zzzz's". I'm quite sure my doctor will up the dose when I go to see him on Monday. I was just dreading the titration if I'd have to feel like I have the past couple of days. I, too cried non-stop on day one and two (hard to say if that was just plain depression with a dallop of being "drugged" on top, though.) I was telling Katia in an earlier post that I had to take crying breaks from work!
I guess if the Depakote only squashes the "up" part of my cycle, we can titrate the Lamictal up again. It did a fine job of helping my depressions.
Let me know how you're doing,
Katy
Posted by fluffy on January 11, 2004, at 11:25:51
In reply to Re: BP freakin', posted by fluffy on January 11, 2004, at 11:21:38
If you don't already have it, then find this at your local library or bookstore. I find it very helpful still, and it was great to have when I was first diagnosed. It's called "The Bipolar Survival Guide: What you and your family need to know".
Posted by socks on January 11, 2004, at 13:50:23
In reply to Re: BP freakin' (good book to check out, Socks), posted by fluffy on January 11, 2004, at 11:25:51
Thanks Fluffy,
By the way, we sound like a couple of cats, hence, that is where my name came from! Anyway, I will check the book out, have seen it recommended before.
As for being a perfectionist, I never thought of myself that way but realize now that I was in some ways. In grade shool, if I didn't get the best grade or the most "a's", it was devestating. In work, I was always wanting to get promoted ahead even though I may not have "paid my dues". I would feel that I was gonna make that next sale and cure all my financial woes. As a financial planner, not a very good plan!!!!!! When I read the Dx, it all came crashing to me. The good news is, something concrete!
I will keep posting when I feel the need, Keep me posted on your meds, hope you can find the right combo!!
All the best,
Socks
Posted by katia on January 11, 2004, at 15:50:33
In reply to Re: BP freakin', posted by fluffy on January 11, 2004, at 11:21:38
Hi Katy,
When I was on Depakote, I didn't need any sleep aids. You say you're having trouble sleeping, but then feel groggy the next day? (god, how familiar is that?). could be your sleep aid? I think if you titrate up, you'll sleep better and won't need the sleep aid. Everyone's totally individual, but like I said at the low dose of 250mg it caused hypomania. good to hear you feel better.
Are you still doing your artwork? What's your website? (I thought you said you had one)
Katia
Posted by fluffy on January 11, 2004, at 16:33:56
In reply to Re: BP freakin' » fluffy, posted by katia on January 11, 2004, at 15:50:33
Hi Katia--
I can't imagine that Depakote would "cause" hypomania--just not prevent it--especially at a low dose like 250mg. According to my mood chart, my hypomania is basically gone--I'm just undulating on the low side now. I've been taking Temazepam for sleep for a week now. So I probably do need to taper off, and titrate up one more bump on Depakote to see if it helps.
I'm not feeling "sleepy" during the day. It's not like my eye-lids are heavy. I feel all drugged up and icky--. I can't say I like that I just feel depressed. The depakote has chopped off one of the heads of the two-headed monster. Unfortunately, it was the one that helped me get my work done and catch up from being depressed! I think I'll suggest upping Lamictal carefully, once the Depakote is at its optimal dose. I think we're getting somewhere slowly. I see my doctor tomorrow. Joy!
I'm still working on my art when I'm not all drugged up or depressed. It's actually going in a pretty good direction, and I'm in a good position to get the ball rolling once I'm feeling better. One step at a time.How are you doing? What's up with the Lithium? When's your next appointment w/ your doc?
Keep me posted and take lots of care,
katy
Posted by katia on January 11, 2004, at 16:56:58
In reply to Re: BP freakin', posted by fluffy on January 11, 2004, at 16:33:56
Hi Katy,
Yes, it's an odd thing as I said before. I went hypo on low levels of Depakote. The pdoc said that this is consistent with the dx as other bp folks have experienced that. I'm not sure why, possibly b/c the low levels takes away the depression in some and doesn't quite address the mania - I don't know. I was just putting that out there for you to be aware of.My brain is back some what - however, life is much flatter! I've lost my mojo, baby! :-(
I'm trying to write and I guess I'm getting there - discipline is a big part of it too, not just inspiration. I'm trying to work w/ the discipline side now. I've written so much, it's now about organizing it all into some sort of coherent work. And organizing is not what I do! I also don't "feel" the work (it's all very personal in nature - self expression sort of writing to briefly describe). You know what I mean? You know what to do, but don't "feel" it....anyway. I feel slightly zombiefied. I'm at 225mg. Maybe we'll keep it here if this feeling goes. Lithium is powerful...it's calmed my arse down! I don't have the irritability hardly at all anymore - not like before. I was irrational. It's wierd b/c I can still feel things going on underneath the surface, I just don't feel it as intensely.
Maybe I'll add wellbutrin for a bit of a kick. I sleep too late - go to bed too late and can't sleep w/o seroquel.
keep in touch Katy!
Katia
Posted by Dr. Bob on January 12, 2004, at 22:52:57
In reply to Re: BP freakin' » fluffy, posted by katia on January 11, 2004, at 16:56:58
> I'm trying to write and I guess I'm getting there - discipline is a big part of it too, not just inspiration. I'm trying to work w/ the discipline side now. I've written so much, it's now about organizing it all into some sort of coherent work. And organizing is not what I do! I also don't "feel" the work (it's all very personal in nature - self expression sort of writing to briefly describe). You know what I mean? You know what to do, but don't "feel" it....
Just wanted to put in a plug for Psycho-Babble Writing, a new board here at which discussion of the creative process and how it's affected by mental health issues is welcome:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/write
Bob
Posted by fluffy on January 16, 2004, at 17:27:36
In reply to Re: BP freakin' » fluffy, posted by katia on January 11, 2004, at 16:56:58
Hey Katia--
I just read your update on the other thread. I'm so sorry you are still having a hard time. Is there a new game plan between you and your doctor? I hope, hope, hope something works out for you really soon.
I've been pretty steady for the past 5 days or so. But it's been a steady low-grade apathy, anhedonia type thing. But I'm not cycling anymore, I don't think. I've been sleeping really well for the past few days. I just feel ick, though. My personality is GONE. I feel like I have no sense of humor. I don't seem to care much about aesthetics anymore either. It's weird. Is this the trade-off? Maybe it'll get better soon.
I'm only on 250mg. But since i seem to only need pediatric doses, then I don't think I'll push it unless I start to cycle again.
The other mystery I'm trying to figure out is this: I seem to clench my teeth more or less, depending on "where I am" in my cycle...when I'm down, I clench really hard, and then my face just seems like a heavy mask. When I'm up, I feel like I have a smirk on my face. Lately, since the Zyprexa, one of my arms and hands doesn't operate as well--it seems kind of heavy, and moves more slowly than the rest of my body. I wonder if this is something else neurological? My doctor doesn't really understand this. It's pretty annoying.
Anyway--let me know what's up. I hope to hear from you soon.
Katy
Posted by katia on January 16, 2004, at 18:13:07
In reply to Re: BP freakin', posted by fluffy on January 16, 2004, at 17:27:36
Hi Katy,
Yeah, not really sure about myself...I think I'm slightly elevated - not nec. in a euphoric way. I'm just talking fast, can't sit still, can't sleep really w/o lots of Seroquel and then it's like at 3:30 I fall asleep. Racy thoughts and head - I think I'm elevated. don't know. hard to tell. states of consciousness - wondering where reality is. Only on 225mg of Lithium. I see my pdoc on Wed. Hopefully we'll come up with a plan. This'll be the first time i won't have a suggestion for him. I was thinking about adding Wellbutrin, but the depression isn't a problem now - it's more the other side of darkness and WB will/might exacerbate it. Was thinking about Lam. again, butI actually feel less irritable off of it. Well, maybe not. I think I was less irritable when I was at higher doses of Li. Am going on Antabuse soon and really get into a sober clean way of living. just eliminate it altogether soas I won't have a choice. when I was pregnant, I didn't drink and it wasn't hard b/c I just knew there wasn't a choice.Glad to hear you're not cycling and you're sleeping.
So sorry to hear about your anhedonia. That sucks. That's what I meant before about creating. It's like you just can't feel it - (your comment about aesthetics). I understand. geezzz this is not fun is it? gotta run...
let's talk soon-
Katia
Posted by katia on January 19, 2004, at 16:28:54
In reply to Re: BP freakin', posted by fluffy on January 16, 2004, at 17:27:36
Hi Katy,
I'm off Lithium. I stopped on Thursday and I've been on a kinda scary ride. My sleep is gone. I am an insomniac again even with thrice the amount of seroquel. Definitely was elevated, now I'm crashing. It's awful. It's wierd since being off of everything, my core mother issues rise immediately to the surface as if the medication was numbing it. Or is it because I'm off of meds and things are exaggerated? You know what I mean? You know, those core things that go back to even before you were born - things you can't describe but that drive you MAD about your parents. They have the ability to drive me mad like none other - this power to jade and color the rest of my life with this dysfunctional crazy coloring! OR is it because I'M the one who's losing the plot? and every thing is exaggerated w/o meds. I'm soooooo gosh darn thankful that I see my pdoc on Wed. I'm scared that I"m losing it. What to try now? Trileptal? That worked for you didn't it? I think we're very similar in the expressions of our bipolar. Hopefully it'll work for me. if that's what we do. Lithium did something for me - it worked, but I couldn't stand being a slobbering crossed eyed fool.
How are you?
the best-
Katia
Posted by Eve1 on February 1, 2004, at 22:34:19
In reply to Re: Lithium stupor » katia, posted by Karen_kay on January 6, 2004, at 16:13:01
Hello to all,
This is may first post. I really enjoy reading all of your posts, especially Karen Kay. Let me tell you a little about me. For the past 9 years I've been struggling with severe depression and anxiety disorder. I've been on all the SSRI's meds that are out there. My white blood count go's down on all, to the point of having flu like symtoms for months. I was doing some research on my on, I believe that my condition is more of a Bipolar disorder. I have to speak to my doctor this week, I will suggest a MS like Topamax. Right now I feel very irritable, I've even thought of leaving everything behind and moving on my own, having partial custody of the kids. I think this is not like me, but this is me without medication. I'm taking ambien to sleep even during the day just to get away from it all. HELP.
Posted by katia on February 2, 2004, at 2:52:44
In reply to Hi Karen Kay, posted by Eve1 on February 1, 2004, at 22:34:19
Why do you believe that you have bipolar-like symptoms? What are they? How do you know your blood count goes down? I've often experienced flu-like symptoms on ADs. But that was before I got the BP dx.
talk to us - we're here to support one another.
Katia
Posted by katia on February 2, 2004, at 3:01:42
In reply to Re: BP freakin', posted by fluffy on January 16, 2004, at 17:27:36
Hey Fluffy!
How're ya doing?
I've actually been doing fantasically! I can't believe how well I do OFF of meds. I think that maybe I've been cured of BP! I'm not being thoughtless in that either. i think maybe I was put too much into a box/label with that dx. I think for sure it exists, but I think it can pass too. I feel so good. All I take is Seroquel and fish oil. I sleep fine. I feel happy. I feel like I'm a part of this world instead of apart from this world. It's amazing. I'm not sure meds were the answer for me! I'm doing brilliantly without them!I had another session with that psychic (remember in Oct. I had one with her). She said that Iwas overly medicated and that if I take meds then I need to take a minimal amount. My system is sensitive.
For the past few weeks all I've been doing is looking for a house to buy. it's so depressing because 300K doesn't get you anything but a termite infested fixer upper (and there were SWARMS of people today looking at such a place). I'm still very hopeful. I'll find something for me. BTW, my psychic is in TX- Dallas.
Where are you?
How are you?
I think about you lots and BArbara and Karen Kay.
But things have died down a bit no?
it's ok b/c i've been so absorbed with my own life.
hope to hear from yas...
Katia
Posted by Karen_kay on February 2, 2004, at 8:41:31
In reply to Hi Karen Kay, posted by Eve1 on February 1, 2004, at 22:34:19
Well hello Partner! I don't have time to write much as I'm just up before class. But I'm so impressed with your post, how could I not get back? :)
Why do you believe you have symptoms of Bipolar Disorder? Do you have syptoms of depression and mania or hypomania? Do you alternate between feeling depressed and feeling elated with racing thoughts or grandious ideas? This is something to discuss with your doctor. I know that when I was on SSRI's alone (without a MS) they caused me to become manic.
I'm sorry you are struggling right now. I really am. I wish none of us had to struggle with anything in our lives. I wish we had every wish handed right to us, and we could live out all of our dreams just as we want. But, unfortunetly, that isn't the way life works. So, with the struggling comes the payoff. But, I like to think that at least we struggle for some reason, I hope at least.
I'll write more later, PROMISE! I just have to get ready for a stupid German class, where they speak in a language I'll never begin to understand and ask me questions I'll never-ever know the answers to! Oh, bother! Will you go for me, pretty please?? You'd think I'd have the hang of it by now, but I swear it's all Greek to me... :)
Posted by Karen_kay on February 2, 2004, at 16:52:14
In reply to Re: BP freakin' » fluffy, posted by katia on February 2, 2004, at 3:01:42
Heya!!! I have a sister named Barbara!! Strange the way the world works sometimes...
I'm thinking of discontinuing Topamax.... I fear I'm getting dumb, and I'm so dumb in fact that I'v just noticed how dumb I am :( I can't spell, I can't communicate very well... I used to be the first person done with tests and now I just don't have enough time to complete the blasted things....
I'm thinking of free-balling it.... No meds... What do you think??? Can I do it??? I'm talking to my therapist about it tomorrow (did I spell that right??) We'll see...
Posted by katia on February 2, 2004, at 17:22:10
In reply to Re: BP freakin' » katia, posted by Karen_kay on February 2, 2004, at 16:52:14
Hi karen,
Have you felt like this all the time on Topamax? Or you're just realizing you've been dumb all this time? :-)
I'd definitely talk about it with your therapist.
I've only been on seroquel for sleep and about 12 grams of fish oil a day for about three weeks now. And I feel very good. I think I'd be dangerously close to more than hypomania and then crashing if it wasn't for the seroquel regulating my sleep. I definitely need it because I'm very awake these days...I'm also in the process of buying a house/townhouse (looking for one) and that's exciting. I've got Trileptal here in case I need to go on something new. I'm not going on it yet. I want to see how I do on only the above meds. I feel a shift in energy for sure, a good one. But I get a bit manicky sometimes (racing thoughts - shards of energy flying around in my brain - but I'm not going over the edge and I haven't crashed yet, so I'm wondering if I am cycling or have just leveled out for a bit.
Tomorrow I start Antabuse. It's my decision. I want to eliminate drinking altogether from my life. Ironically enough, I haven't been craving it either - like I"m satisfied on nothing but a hot bath!
How long have you been on Topamax?
Katia
Posted by Karen_kay on February 3, 2004, at 8:46:03
In reply to Re: BP freakin' » Karen_kay, posted by katia on February 2, 2004, at 17:22:10
Hiya! I've been on Topamax since last Summer, the beginning of anyway. It has helped me so very much, I can't even express how much it has helped me. But, I really get the feeling that I'm dumb now. And I didn't used to be.... Oh, what to do, what to do????
I've just noticed that it's taking be 50 minutes to finish tests, when normally it would take me 15. And my grades have suffered, as well as motivation, due to the fact that concepts just aren't "clicking" like they used to. And my writing skills aren't what they used to be either. And I can't spell for the life of me. Now, I'm not claiming I was ever a spelling Bee champ or anything, but I have a hard time spelling simple words like "beginning"... Come on now, that's just not right!!!! I have a dictionary at my side 24/7......
I'm seriously considering taking a holiday... My therapist even suggested it.... I can't have this kind of mess while I'm in school, as I have a partial scholarship and loans as well.... AND I REFUSE TO TRY DEPAKOTE.... I'll not gain 80 lbs.... Maybe I'm just being impulsive.. I'm sure I'll stick it out. Just having another moment of doubt. Isn't there a full moon coming? I am a moon child you know.....
Oh, I miss hypomania so much. I miss the motivation to accomplish something with my life.. Oh, to be you for one day and get my work done... Can we switch? Just for a week, promise...
Posted by katia on February 3, 2004, at 15:06:29
In reply to Re: BP freakin' » katia, posted by Karen_kay on February 3, 2004, at 8:46:03
Hi,
I'm not sure if this is hypomania (maybe a teensy bit). It could be just a new and improved me coming through after years of hell.I would give Depakote a try if I were you. I just was scared of the PCOS possibility. I didn't gain any weight on it.
Cognitive abilities are as important as feeling well mood-wise. If Topamax is giving you this then it may be time to change.
good luck!
Katia
Posted by Eve1 on February 3, 2004, at 15:12:37
In reply to Re: Hi Karen Kay » Eve1, posted by katia on February 2, 2004, at 2:52:44
I have phases of deep depression and mania. Now like you mention the mania part that involves being up all night thinking creative ideas one after the other till morning started a few years after using antidepressants. But the other part of mania "irritable, harmful to myself has always been part of me". Since very young I could remember getting angry at others and hurting myself, I did not really want to be like that. About the white blood count, it happend the first time 6 years ago after being on Prozac for 2 years. One night I got a very high fever of 104.5 that would not go down with anything I took, I was sick for 7 days. I went to the ER, there they found the blood problem. At first they did not know what was causing it, everything past thru our minds. Until on doctor ordered that Prozac would not be given to me, the next morning my white blood cell count was almost normal. Eventually the drug manufactures send a letter to my Psy. confirming that to some individuals this is a posible adverse reaction. Now for the past 3 years I was taking Celexa "which is in the same family of drugs" and for those 3 years I always had aches and pains, similar to the flu but not as bad. During these three years I took pain medicine every other day. I know this is a long story. Maybe next time I'll finish it. I just started on the Topomax 25mg 2x a day. I'm worry that it might not work. I'll keep you posted. Thank you for your support.
From:Eve1
Posted by Karen_kay on February 4, 2004, at 12:51:56
In reply to Re: BP freakin' » Karen_kay, posted by katia on February 3, 2004, at 15:06:29
So, what are you on now exactly? Oh, I long for the days of hypomania :( I'm thinking that I can handle the "brain-slowness" I'm sure that's a technical term somewhere :) that I'm getting from topamax. I'm still able to concentrate and get stuff done, it just takes longer. I'm sure in a few days, I'll change my mind. Then in a few more days, I'll change my mind again.;.. I'm like that you know..
So, how are you doing? How's the house hunting going? You could always buy me one while you're at it :) I'm always looking for a sugar daddy/mommy. I'm not choosy and I make good company...
I'm SOOO glad the "new and improved" you is coming out! Like a shining star, I can't wait to see!!!
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