Posted by IsoM on February 9, 2002, at 12:33:43
In reply to Re: Provigil- Adrafinil » IsoM, posted by Rick on February 9, 2002, at 2:46:51
> > "...That's exactly I feel, too. Although I can understand how some people could prefer brevity."
Great! Now that we understand each other, I won't be afraid to (I call) 'blither' on & when I'm looking for info from you, I'll expect lots! :-)
> > "...According to a 2000 in vitro study, the only liver enzyme significantly *inhibited* by modafinil was CYP2C19. This happens to be one of the primary enzymes Celexa needs for elimination. So adrafinil MAY (3 Beer, please note the "MAY") be increasing your blood levels of Celexa. If that's happening, it could be good or bad depending on whether "more Celexa" would be theraputically helpful vs. simply increasing side effects. That's why, when someone takes Provigil to fight AD-induced fatigue or apathy, it MAY not do the trick as effectively with Celexa as with other ADs. But there's a great deal of inter-individual variability, e.g. the interaction would be more significant for someone who has lower base levels of CYP2C19."
I checked for CYP interactions with a drug software program & read the same thing. No side-effects that I've ever noticed with Celexa, but I have a gut-feeling the improvement comes from the adrafinil alone.
> > "...This seems to be evidence that you're probably NOT having an interaction effect. When I've stopped Provigil temporarily, I likewise feel a gadual decline in benefits, but they're usually gone within a few days. (Importantly though, there's still some residual benefit for my social phobia. Provigil-driven confidence, assertiveness, and social immersion have resulted in some lasting improvements in mindset and behavior.)"
I've always believed that even if a person needs to change their thinking patterns due to depression, or in your case, social phobia, that meds make it possible. Trying to do it without meds is like trying to exercise & strengthen a limb that's still broken & hasn't been set.
> > "...That's a nice, positive report! Once someone posting here tried to tell that a Klonopin/Provigil couldn't really be helping my social phobia because of that one fuzzy GABA-reduction study in rodents. Well even if the 25% reduction really occured in ME, and occured at a *relevant* area of the brain (and I doubt it would based on what I've read), the only thing that's important is that I'm doing better than ever with what should be a safe combo! (I have complete blood labs, including liver panel, at least once a year just to make sure everything looks OK there.)"The thing is GABA is an inhibitory neurotransmitter, but that doesn't mean it has a blanket inhibiting effect throughout the brain. Our neurotransmitters have very selective sites that they can either inhibit or excite both at the same time. Brain chemistry is incredibly complicated. To pretend we understand how it works is presumptious beyond compare. All I know is that adrafinil/modafinil 'seems' to increase general brain metabolism. Myabe this is why it has so many postive benefits with such few side-effects?
> > "...I thinks at this point I'll have to write off Provigil as a memory boster. But it could very well have that effect for others."
What a disappointment! Have you looked into piracetam or the other *racetams along with choline supplementation? Elizabeth brought it to my attention. It seems to have an effect on acetylcholine & more so in the hippocampus, associated with memory. Depending on how much my memory is improved with adrafinil, I'd be curious to check into it myself.
The flip side to having a good memory is the case of "S". This poor Russian man *couldn't* forget anything. Every trivial memory was indeligibly imprinted in his memory. It made it impossible for him to have a normal life. He ended up touring, demonstrating his ability to large audiences as a living. He said the only way he could erase a memory was to mentally write it on paper & then to mentally burn the paper. The famous Russian neurologist, Luria, studied him & wrote a book about him. It's been translated into English.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0674576225/drbobsvirte00-20
Luria was the inspiration for Dr. Oliver Sacks. You've probably heard of him - his books are worth reading.> > "...That's not dumb at all, IsoM! Thanks for the idea! I have to keep telling myself, "OK, so it worked! Now get over it and move on. Pay attention!"
I'm glad you like the idea. It worked very well with me at university when I went back. Perhaps because of ADHD, I can multi-task pretty well. I found that if I (1) listened to the prof carefully, (2) wrote notes at the same time, & (3) colour-coded & underlined in my text books while (4) making references in the margin of my notes to what page of the text the info came from, it really helped. I suppose my hyperfocus at such times also helped along with a real interest in the subjects - I love learning. It's recreation for me.
Tell me what you think of the study on adrafinil that was written. To me, it's the most understandable & intelligent of all the write-ups I've read on it yet.
poster:IsoM
thread:93083
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20020208/msgs/93422.html